Explain to me why the Dreamcast deserves it's crazy fan base

[szycag]

It was a system that ended an era, that's what the charm is and why even people you wouldn't expect to be talking about it are. GTA3 and Halo quickly followed and gaming was never the same, for better or worse. It was the last stand for japanese style arcade gaming, at least so far as that being the main dominating trend. Before 2001 Japan still basically owned the console market as far as triple A titles. Dreamcast also had the best sports games before PS2 caught up. Gaming just went through a huge sea change at the turn of the century and Dreamcast is what it is, a stopgap... before it's time, almost beside time. Any sort of gamer can see that. It didn't even fizzle out just sort of imploded and I think a lot of the fan hysteria comes from that too, a lot of people wanted Sega to press on anyways instead of raising the white flag.

Beat-em-ups (not Vs. fighters) are usually what gets me to hook up my DC again actually. Dynamite Cop (Deka 2) and Zombie Revenge are TERRIBLE and AWESOME. You really can't find that type of experience on other consoles because it died with Dreamcast.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Beat-em-ups (not Vs. fighters) are usually what gets me to hook up my DC again actually. Dynamite Cop (Deka 2) and Zombie Revenge are TERRIBLE and AWESOME. You really can't find that type of experience on other consoles because it died with Dreamcast.

You think so? Not only Dynamite Deka got remade for the PS2, no less, but generally the last gen wasn't exactly devoid of such games (The Bouncer, God Hand, Crimson Tears, The Red Star, Mortal Kombat: Shaolin Monks - each one of them did something right, I'm tellin' ya).

[Mortificator]

Isn't The Oneechanbara basically Zombie's Revenge with tits?

[Jeneki]

Isn't The Oneechanbara basically Zombie's Revenge with tits?

That's all it takes to get a Best Hits release on 360 in Japan.

[louisg]

Dynamite Deka 1 is where it's at It's too bad those good PS2 Sega Ages games didn't come out here :/ Someday I will need to get some imports going on my PS2.

I also second Zombie Revenge as terrible-but-great, especially with the rebalanced Dreamcast modes which make it much more playable.

[Nico87]

The Dreamcast was the last true bona-fide otaku machine.

Please explain to me how the Dreamcast was more otaku than the GameCube.

Anyway -

Shenmue
Skies of Arcadia
Power Stone 1+2
De La Jet Set Radio
Crazy Taxi
Elemental Gimmick Gear
Doki Doki Idol Star Seeker
Radirgy
Under Defeat
Best arcade ports on a console (100 points)

beats

Gradius V
Thunder Force VI
Espgaluda
Mushihimesama
Final Fantasy X & XII
zzzzzzzzzzzzmore average RPG's
Inferior arcade ports (-100 points)

Only pros about the PS2 was DQ VIII, Okami, and Atlus.

[louisg]

Please explain to me how the Dreamcast was more otaku than the GameCube.

Oh man, there's a machine that should've done better. It's a shame the 3rd party support fell off so quickly; I loved that system's design, everything from the performance, the size, the controller, and the price. It never quite had the sheer number of cool games that the DC did IMO, though I really enjoyed a handful of them.

How are we defining otaku? 'cause, if we're saying it's "crazy obsessed loner", then a telnet client dialing into a furry MUD takes the cake

[Nico87]

Please explain to me how the Dreamcast was more otaku than the GameCube.

Oh man, there's a machine that should've done better. It's a shame the 3rd party support fell off so quickly; I loved that system's design, everything from the performance, the size, the controller, and the price. It never quite had the sheer number of cool games that the DC did IMO, though I really enjoyed a handful of them.

How are we defining otaku? 'cause, if we're saying it's "crazy obsessed loner", then a telnet client dialing into a furry MUD takes the cake

Indeed. Got a brand new NTSC-J GameCube on its way from Play-Asia with FedEx. It's only $99 and I had some coupons too, so it was $140 shipped with FedEx to Norway!

[PROMETHEUS]

And the Playstation's controller was, and still is, an execrable piece of junk. It's such a misshapen piece of crap that I just won't bother getting one, even though some games interest me.

Piss. The DualShock is a better controller than at least the GameCube controller, the Dreamcast controller, the N64 controller, the Xbox Controller/S (this is your "misshapen piece of crap"), and the Xbox 360 controller. The only oddity I've ever found are the strange triggers in the Sixaxis and the DualShock 3.

100% agreed. I don't understand how could someone call it a piece of junk. Weak analog stick ? Shitty DPad ?
Lightweight feel ??? (yeah it's lightweight... that's a good thing of course). And you say the XBOX 360 controller is better, skykid ? I find it pretty obvious that the DPad on the xbox 360 controller is REALLY bad, otherwise this huge controller is basically the same as a Dualshock with worse triggers. Sounds like you just hate Playstation for some reason and really want to criticize its controller !

[neorichieb1971]

There are more PS controllers in the world than any other. So it must be doing something right.

[louisg]

There are more PS controllers in the world than any other. So it must be doing something right.

And that's why I always blast Ke$ha while watching Titanic, so I can enjoy the finest music in the world while watching the best movie ever made!

(and I do it while rolling in my Hummer)

[greg]

Please explain to me how the Dreamcast was more otaku than the GameCube.

The GameCube was a child's toy, geared more towards kids. Yeah, I own one, but it's just not the same as a Dreamcast. It's not like the Dreamcast had a tons of RPGs, but there were more than the GC had. I can't think of any Gamecube game that had the same type of zealous fanbase that Sakura Taisen had in Japan. How many audio drama CDs and musicals and voice actress concerts have there been from a Zelda game? At the time, we were all flocking to the DC because it was the console for shmups. (Shmups=highly excitable fanbase.) I didn't get a PS2 until '06, after Cave started building up a decent library on that system. Also, how many dating sims did the GC have? None, I think. The GC has one Super Robot Taisen game, but does it have a Suchi Pai game? Don't think so. And lastly, as it's been said before, the DC was the home for so many awesome arcade-perfect ports. The GC can't claim that fame. I define a real otaku console as catering to the real otaku crowd and giving games that rabid fanbases feed on.

[Nico87]

Real otaku crowd should crowd around the million anime games released for the GC. I agree though, the DC had loads of dating sims and visnovs.

[greg]

Real otaku crowd should crowd around the million anime games released for the GC.

Uh, Bleach? Naruto? I guess I haven't followed that. I can't think of many. There are prolly way more anime-related games for the PS1/PS2 than either the GC or DC, but I don't think I can ever say "Sony loves me" like I can say for Sega and Nintendo. That's why I'm rabid about the DC more than the other consoles. But to be honest, I haven't powered either of my DCs up in quite a while. They're packed away in anticipation for a move out of our house in September that fell through.

[Nico87]

Real otaku crowd should crowd around the million anime games released for the GC.

Uh, Bleach? Naruto? I guess I haven't followed that. I can't think of many. There are prolly way more anime-related games for the PS1/PS2 than either the GC or DC, but I don't think I can ever say "Sony loves me" like I can say for Sega and Nintendo. That's why I'm rabid about the DC more than the other consoles. But to be honest, I haven't powered either of my DCs up in quite a while. They're packed away in anticipation for a move out of our house in September that fell through.

Same kinda. I bought too many games at the same time and it kinda burnt me out. Completed Jet Set Radio, Elemental Gimmick Gear and Super Hero Retsuden though!

[RoninBuddha]

otaku machine? no mention of PCFX

i kid.

[Nico87]

otaku machine? no mention of PCFX

i kid.

Hah, you win.

[Koa Zo]

Coincidentally, I just unpacked my Dreamcast from a couple years of storage, in anticipation of recieving Fast Striker.

The first games I played this week were Yu Suzuki Gameworks, and rush Rush Rally Racing. Then last night I played the first loop of Zero Gunner 2. Perhaps it is partially nostalgia, but I instanly had the impression that I was using a first class gaming machine..

The shape, design and build of the console is very satisfying. The stock controller is somewhat unique in the way your hand solidly holds it. The accessories were all very well integrated into the product line, and their function and compatibility is clearly marked on all corresponding games. The VMU and rumble packs are very well integrated into many games, and thr mmemory manager of the console and the VMUs is very user friendly.
The compatibility and sensible button configurations of the arcade joysticks are consistent and well integrated with games that use digital control. The ASCii stick optical joysticks are the best controlers I have ever used (yes, even much better than the ASCii PS2 optical sticks)

And then there is the library of games. Many unique and extraordinarily fun games.
While Im not proclaiming Best Console Ever (that honor goes to PC-Engine, haha) I realized once again that if I ever have to sell my game collection that Dreamcast will be one of the last to go.

[Paradigm]

When It came to the DC, I liked it a lot.

Just about every game i hated.

lol.

It just had a lot of great games and very little crap, as cools pointed out. I have very fond memories of when the DC first came out and still play it to this day.

[neorichieb1971]

That could be taken out of context.

I liked the system for what was onscreen. Hated the pad and the fact that no decent 3rd parties made anything for it. Namely, Konami, Square, EA etc etc.

In retrospect though I like it a lot less than I did in the early days. Sometimes when a new console is released you have expectations and the ambition of the company in mind. I found the DC never hit a lot of my expectations by the end of its era. Almost all its ground breaking days were in the first 12 months. After that it got wishy washy for me and I regularly went back to playing PS1 and N64 games. At this moment in time I have only 7 or 8 games for the system. 2 or 3 are shooters the rest are games i'd never play again and of course mr driller.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Are you guys sure that DC got more arcade-perfect conversions than PS2? As I see it, a handful of Sega Ages volumes alone tips the scales prominently in favour of the latter (okay, some games I'm thinking about are not exactly coin-op games).
Granted, no other arcade system based on a home console was as successful as NAOMI (from what I know).

There are prolly way more anime-related games for the PS1/PS2 than either the GC or DC, but I don't think I can ever say "Sony loves me" like I can say for Sega and Nintendo.

If you're into mecha stuff, check out Another Century's Episode 3: The Final. Just sayin'.

Hated the pad and the fact that no decent 3rd parties made anything for it. Namely, Konami, Square, EA etc etc.

Capcom can't be accused of not supporting the DC (with conversions first and foremost, but still).

[Pixel_Outlaw]

Why would an inanimate object deserve anything? Believe it or not, the Dreamcast as cool as it is doesn't actually know that its fans exist.

...The Vectrex on the other hand just might.

[neorichieb1971]

Capcom dabbled in everything though. The DC wasn't an exception. Capcom did 3DO (Street fighter 2X).

I think Code Veronica was the best selling game on the system. Which makes me wonder why more adventure type games didn't come out on the system.

The funny thing about the DC is that Sega NEVER LISTENED. Fans that would have bought the games begged for Shenmue 3, they begged for Sega Rally 3, Scud Race and many others and they just didn't get released. I heard Core Design made a Scud Race track but it was a demo and never released.

I wonder what Sega was doing in all that time.

Memorable sega games for me were -

HOTD2
Crazy Taxi
Shenmue 1 and 2

I think they are the only games which I thought hit that certain peak quality aspect from Sega.

[drunkninja24]

Well, the DC was already dead when Shenmue II was released....so of course they never released Shenmue III on it. Now just coming out with the damn game in general, yeah.

[neorichieb1971]

You must admit though that DC owners wanted a Panzer Dragoon, they wanted a Daytona (around launch), they wanted so much.

When they did release stuff it was like Sega Rally 2 with Windows CE


edit : I remember writing to Edge magazine after they announced Sega were making an F355 cabinet for the arcades. I wrote to them and they published my letter. My letter said "Why are Sega making a naomi x 3 setup and leaving DC customers with a drought of software".

F355 came out in the end but basically my point was that the DC wasn't delivering and Sega were going all hardcore on the arcade side without thinking about its DC owners.

[Vyxx]

The Dreamcast was the last true bona-fide otaku machine.

Please explain to me how the Dreamcast was more otaku than the GameCube.

Anyway -

Shenmue
Skies of Arcadia
Power Stone 1+2
De La Jet Set Radio
Crazy Taxi
Elemental Gimmick Gear
Doki Doki Idol Star Seeker
Radirgy
Under Defeat
Best arcade ports on a console (100 points)

beats

Gradius V
Thunder Force VI
Espgaluda
Mushihimesama
Final Fantasy X & XII
zzzzzzzzzzzzmore average RPG's
Inferior arcade ports (-100 points)

Only pros about the PS2 was DQ VIII, Okami, and Atlus.

Lol'n

[BulletMagnet]

Why would an inanimate object deserve anything? Believe it or not, the Dreamcast as cool as it is doesn't actually know that its fans exist.

IT'S THINKING.

[Specineff]

Namely, Konami, Square, EA etc etc.

Glad you brought this up.

Bernie Stolar mentioned that Trip "Arrogant Asshole" Hawkins came to him and told him they wanted to develop their sports games for the DC. Stolar, wanting to secure as many licensees as possible, said it was cool. But then Mr. Hawkins (In a manner not very unlike how they got the exclusive NFL license) told him that they wanted to be the only sports developer and publisher on the DC. (Rumor has it Hawkins also wanted to get a blowjob-receiving clause included in the deal.). Such a shameless request getting in the way of the NFL 2K series developed by the newest studio he had bought, Stolar said it wouldn't be fair if he gave EA any special treatment and to play by the rules like everyone else. Hawkins reportedly threw a fit, grabbed his giant lollipop, and rode his tricycle back to cry on Sony's skirt and have his sissy boy's curls redone.

Just imagine EA taking forever to release an NFL-based game and no other publisher being able to cover that market due to such a deal. Oh, wait...

[GaijinPunch]

I think they are the only games which I thought hit that certain peak quality aspect from Sega.

Jet Set Radio / De La Jet Set Radio really got me. As per earlier in this thread, I play them both to this day and still love them. I've not played a lot of other DC games recently, but I do rate quite a lot. I should get the two Crazy Taxi games as I've never touched them. PSO, of course, gets a mention.

I will say this: the DC was the last system in which with every purchase I felt like I was supporting a company/system I liked. Even if I got a turd, I just shrugged it off.

[neorichieb1971]

I missed JSR unfortunately. I picked it up in the shop a few times but something told me not to buy it.

I heard some of the sports titles were amazing but i'm not sporting on consoles either.

I did buy Samba.. It was shortlived but I enjoyed that crazy game.