DDP-DOJ....not so Meh?

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LUNardei
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Post by LUNardei »

Metal Gear Okt wrote: The most ships you can set is 5 in arcade mode. So, if i clear it with 6, that's still 2 credits. If i clear it with 5, however, that's still technically a 1cc.
Yes, but not comparable to the others :)
What I'm saying is that I see that as an accomplishment by itself. For me, I don't need to put in the effort to go from 5 to 3 to feel satisfied.
Ok, finally understood. It's a personal goal, or something like this. Thanks for the patience :wink:
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Post by 8 1/2 »

AH, I'm sorry, but I have to call bullshit here. You don't just GET five lives in arcade mode. You have to earn extra lives through score and by discovering the secrets of the game. Are you cracking 30 million? You would have to in order to get both extra lives. Do you know about how to get the secret one in level 4?

Do what you want, but I think it's sort of a waste of time to dick around with a game like that, and then to consider it cleared when really it's not.

I don't mean this to sound like a personal attack. If you enjoy the game playing this way that's fine, but it seems like some of the depth is being sucked out by your methods... not to mention a real sense of accomplishment that you don't have to qualify.
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Rob
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Post by Rob »

Are you changing any other options than lives? Just curious.
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Post by cfalcon »

I never really understood why it was a "One credit clear" and not a "Three lives clear" anyway, given that the definition of credit is up to the local arcade owner. I mean, I know it's supposed to be "default number of lives for this machine", but someone who clears a 3-life game in two lives is, IMO, rocking the house even more than someone who has to use all three.

Just seems odd, given that you can't compare a DoDonPachi 1cc to an Ikaruga 1cc anyway (so it's in no way a game portable unit), so why go through the effort of making the term generic? Just saying how many lives it took seems like you could make better comparisons anyway.

Hmm. There is the score...
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Post by LUNardei »

Where is the problem? Play a game with the defaults settings and with one credit, one coin. The result is a 1CC comparable with others.
No matter how lifes tha game gives you at the start or during the game.

Is a no miss player better than a 3 miss? Obviously! We can say this because we can compare the two performances (same settings and same game).
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SAM
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Post by SAM »

cfalcon wrote:I never really understood why it was a "One credit clear" and not a "Three lives clear" anyway, given that the definition of credit is up to the local arcade owner. I mean, I know it's supposed to be "default number of lives for this machine", but someone who clears a 3-life game in two lives is, IMO, rocking the house even more than someone who has to use all three.
I guess the point is when you want to compare skill of a certain game between two players, you would needs ruler, and the most common ruler is the scores a player can get in a single game (i.e. 1cc) under the default setting *Meow*.
cfalcon wrote:I never really understood why it was a "One credit clear" and not a "Three lives clear" anyway...
"One credit clear" and not equal to "Three lives clear", since most games would earns extends life (i.e. extra lifes) when a player scrores reaches a certain amount. *Meow* Which means a player can begin the game with 3 lifes and earns 2 more during play and end up having a total of 5 lifes in a 1cc game.*Meow*

If it is "Three lives clear", that means either the meachine is set to "no extend" (not the default setting) or the player is not allow to loss more than 3 life within the game even he/she has earn extra lifes during play. *Meow*
cfalcon wrote:...but someone who clears a 3-life game in two lives is, IMO, rocking the house even more than someone who has to use all three.
A play whom can clear a game in two lifes is definately better than someone using all 3 lifes *Meow*. In fact most game would award bonus scrores reminding lifes and bombs a player has when he/she clear the game *Meow*. And thus this difference in skill reflected in the player final scrores *Meow*.

Moreover, in some recent games *Meow*. The scoring system would awards a player more scores if he/she can stay alife longer *Meow*. e.g. In sns the point you get form coins would increase when you holding more coins *Meow*. Once you are hited, you drop all coins you are holding *Meow*.

So when someone said he/she can 1cc a game, he/she is puting forward a statment claiming he/she to be at a certain level of skill in that game *Meow*. This is what that statment means, at least for those "1cc" people (including me the "1cc" cat) understanding *Meow*.

If you clear a game in non-default settings, you should states what setting you have changed *Meow*.

In this case, fpbrush should said "I claer it in 5 life under Normal differculty" to aviod misunderstanding *Meow*. Anyway he have clearfily that point later, why all you people still auguring *Meow*?

In my own opinion, player can free to change the default setting as he/she see fit *Meow*. Not all of us have the skill to enable us to play shooter games at default differculty *Meow*.

I myself is playing Gradius V at easy*Meow*. I can only reach as far as 1-6 in Easy, but only 1-3 in Normal *Meow*. If I clear the game in Easy, I would tell people that "I can clear the Gradius V in Easy" *Meow*. If I said I can "1cc" Gradius V, would means I can get through loop 1 under "Normal" in default setting *Meow*.

By the way, in some games a player would have the oppontrunity scores more in higher differculty *Meow*. e.g. A player would have more bullet to eat in Ikruga in Hard and in Easy *Meow*.
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Post by cfalcon »

Yea, you two are right. The addition of extra lives means that the default unit should be a game at one credit and default settings. My method would still work, but it would lose simplicity.

Also, could we get someone on this board who's partially dog or something and barks every sentence? Cause that would make for a pretty good conversation with SAM.

Or maybe he would just chase him around the forum.
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Rob
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Post by Rob »

Is this a joke of some sort?
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Post by 8 1/2 »

Rob wrote:Is this a joke of some sort?
I b*rking hope so.
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Post by Metal Gear Okt »

Rob wrote:Are you changing any other options than lives? Just curious.
Nope. Look, I'm not looking to make a big deal out of this, really. Some people just got a bit accusatory when i said "i beat doj in 2 credits", and I explained how.
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Post by TVG »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:Right now I'm about where you guys are after two weeks.
now, even randorama doesnt put up bullshits like this, dont pretend "you werent making a big deal out of it"

for you info, ive gone to stage 4 in 1 credit (default lives of course..) in about 2 days. most of people probably could, what you do after you press the start button for a credit doesnt count, you get bombs with each live etc which makes a difference, it only makes sense to count and compare yourself to others in default settings.
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Post by shmup-o »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:
Rob wrote:Are you changing any other options than lives? Just curious.
Nope. Look, I'm not looking to make a big deal out of this, really. Some people just got a bit accusatory when i said "i beat doj in 2 credits", and I explained how.
Are you playing on Easy as well?
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Post by Metal Gear Okt »

Heh. Cleared it on Normal with 4 ships last night.
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Post by Danny »

eeerrr... kinda off topic here but I finaly got around to buying a mint condition DoDonPachi for my beloved Sega Saturn today after I saw the game go for a reasonable price on Ebay. Even though I've been playing the game on MAME for quite some considerable time now, I'm really excited to play this on my Saturn when it arrives! :)
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Post by captain ahar »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:Right now I'm about where you guys are after two weeks.
didn't even see this before. just to let you know; saying shit like this is a guaranteed way to not make friends, along with the 1cc clear nonsense.
I have no sig whatsoever.
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Metal Gear Okt
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Post by Metal Gear Okt »

Look, I apologize. I'm not trying to start trouble here.
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Post by EOJ »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:Heh. Cleared it on Normal with 4 ships last night.
That's two credits, you've said this before. Post again when you beat it on one credit (default 3 lives).
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Post by LUNardei »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:Heh. Cleared it on Normal with 4 ships last night.
In a so little time?
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Post by LUNardei »

[1] MrMonkeyMan - 189,171,760 - A-E - 1-5 - 2155 Hit

[2] The vagrant - 118,090,610 - A-E - 1-5 - 1185 Hit

[3] 8 1/2 - 109,050,700 - A-E - 1-5 - 1130 Hit
I can't see a ALL here, for example. So a ALL should be very, very, very, [...] very hard to do.
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Post by Rob »

Scoring and survival are not the same thing. I've cleared the first round, but I only had about 50 million points.
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Post by LUNardei »

Rob wrote:Scoring and survival are not the same thing. I've cleared the first round, but I only had about 50 million points.
Mmm, ok! I don't really know so much the game, so teachings are welcome.
In how much time? Not 2 weeks I think!
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Post by SAM »

LUNardei wrote:
[1] MrMonkeyMan - 189,171,760 - A-E - 1-5 - 2155 Hit

[2] The vagrant - 118,090,610 - A-E - 1-5 - 1185 Hit

[3] 8 1/2 - 109,050,700 - A-E - 1-5 - 1130 Hit
I can't see a ALL here, for example. So a ALL should be very, very, very, [...] very hard to do.
Well "ALL" in DOJ means getting into the 2nd loopans clear it as well with the same Credit. *Meow* Just fulfilling the requirement to get into the 2nd Loop is hard enough. *Meow* Not the mension the 2nd Loop's Stages is hard as hell. *Meow* You can feel it yourself using pritice mode. *Meow*
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Post by LUNardei »

* bau *

Uhhh, you're right.
So these 1-5 means "first loop cleared but second loop not reached"?

* woff *
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Post by 8 1/2 »

Nope. I go down in flames in 1-5. I've never cleared it, though I certainly hope to some day. I suppose I could start practicing with Shotia and just bomb my way to the end, but I've just never felt the urge. I score best with Exy, and I like to play for score mostly, so if I clear the game it's going to come with that ship. I'm just an average player, below average really in most respects, and it's taken me a long time to get to a place where I could consistently get to stage 5.
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Post by ForteMP3 »

I horribly suck at DOJ, but my god, after playing it, I immediately fell in love with it. The graphics are beautiful, the music is pretty good (Not as good as DDP in my opinion, but it works) and the bosses...WOW.

Stage 1-5 was pretty ingenious too, with some mini boss versions of old DDP bosses.
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Post by japtor »

So these 1-5 means "first loop cleared but second loop not reached"?
i think theyre all just to level 5. if they cleared itd be all-1 or 1-all or something like that (then replace the 1 with a 2 for 2nd loop clear).

and yeah, score != survival, as demonstrated by my score on the chart. got to 1-5, got 33 million.

is there a difference between the dolls other than shot/laser and bomb capacity? ive been playing with exy because i use both shot and laser a lot, and dont use bombs much.
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Post by Metal Gear Okt »

The big difference for me is the shot/laser decrease. For Exy, when you die, each one goes down by a level. For Leinyan, your shot goes to minimum(!). I'm not sure about Shotia.
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Post by LUNardei »

japtor wrote:i think theyre all just to level 5. if they cleared itd be all-1 or 1-all or something like that (then replace the 1 with a 2 for 2nd loop clear).
Ok, perfect :wink:
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Post by BulletMagnet »

Metal Gear Okt wrote:The big difference for me is the shot/laser decrease. For Exy, when you die, each one goes down by a level. For Leinyan, your shot goes to minimum(!). I'm not sure about Shotia.
With Shotia, your shot level only decreases by one, but your lasrer is knocked down to minimum. Shotia and Leinyan are pretty much the equivalent of choosing "Shot" or "Laser" types in the previous DDP, in that respect anyway.
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Post by dave4shmups »

I don't understand why people say this game looks like crap in Yoko; I played it in Yoko, and it looked fine to me.

Also, IMO, there's nothing wrong with credit-feeding any shmup to the end the first time you play it; in fact it can give you some valuable experience and knowledge as to what the stages are like-which is pretty important for a game like this.

I'd have to agree that the chaining in DDP made a lot more sense and was a lot easier to pick up then the chaining in DOJ.

And Metal Gear Okt, you don't need to apologize when someone on this forum acts like a scolding mom and jumps in your shit for no reason. Unless the mods on this site take issue with something you've posted, you've done nothing wrong.
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