Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

[BIL]

An interesting watch. Echoing Baton, I'm not into speedrunning per se... but like pouring water on a grease fire, a little falsificare turns it into something entirely more amusing (and pathetic ).

[Perikles]

one of the most curious ones i was surprised to see people not challenging was his counter stop in blazing lazers/gunhed, which afaik is not a thing that can happen (please prove me wrong if this is not true, but i know some of the bosses have time-outs).

You can milk the eyeball turret mid-boss in stage 4 ad infinitum, thus counterstopping Gunhed is definitely possible, you don't even need to be physically present.

[Blinge]

zomg, was there any salty drama around these? >:9

That RWhiteGoose guy makes entertaining rambles on the hotbed of 'Degenerate' savages known as the goldeneye elite.

The cheated Frigate run: https://youtu.be/WpaXr5HvKOU?t=45m33s
Exposed at 52 minute mark.

And this guy's best video where he talks about degeneracy in the community https://youtu.be/T2rSIuEalJk

[kitten]

one of the most curious ones i was surprised to see people not challenging was his counter stop in blazing lazers/gunhed, which afaik is not a thing that can happen (please prove me wrong if this is not true, but i know some of the bosses have time-outs).

You can milk the eyeball turret mid-boss in stage 4 ad infinitum, thus counterstopping Gunhed is definitely possible, you don't even need to be physically present.

ty perikles

[BIL]

It's been too long for me to know if they ever got their act together, but TG's shooter coverage was a real hoot back in the day. Pretty sure even I was the inadvertent Western record holder (and therefore ULTIMATE WORLD CHAMPEEN) in a couple games...

Fucking nine lives and max bombs for Giga Wing 2 bcos its JUST 2 X-TREEM

That RWhiteGoose guy makes entertaining rambles on the hotbed of 'Degenerate' savages known as the goldeneye elite.

Ah yes, that name leapt out at me. Did a bit of light browsing elsewhere - I was worried he was the guy who made that hyperbolically dick-swinging Streets video. Always found him quite endearing. "YEE MUHFUCKA, YEEEEE"

edit: "The most degenerate act man has ever come up with..."

Anyway, that's enough pro e-sports fuckery for me.

[Blinge]

I was worried he was the guy who made that hyperbolically dick-swinging Streets video.

Right when he tries to backboost me!? THE DOUBLE

[BIL]

That goose countdown video is killing me btw. Alan Partridge-esque delivery.

*cut to sink full of unwashed dishes*

[WelshMegalodon]

Still playing Ninja Ryukenden. The farthest I've gotten on one credit is 5-3, though I've made it 6-2 and even 6-3 on a second credit. (That last room with the pouncing Gollums... what the fuck?)

Many thanks to Squire Grooktook for teaching me it was better to rush the evil sword-throwing scarecrow here and for proving it was possible to take out both shooting men with the firewheel in 5-3 (though the timing is far too strict for that strategy to be reliable - thanks to __SKYe for showing me you could reliably fell both without a subweapon).

And while I wouldn't do it myself, thanks to kitten for showing me that it was possible to climb the ladder in 5-2 without getting hit by the bird.

I think FinalBaton's trick about crouching to deal with birds has been the most helpful, though. That and the importance of the neutral jump.

Finally, a big thanks to BIL for demonstrating that all I had to do to avoid the football player after the infamous pit jump in 6-2 was to... walk right and fall.

Aside from a handful of choke points, most of the game is pretty accessible - I think a big part of what makes people consider it balls-hard is that, unlike many other games, the enemies like to stay on you after they've hit you. A lot.

Is it ever worth collecting extra lives? None of you appear to be doing it, and I wasn't even aware they existed in the game before looking at Edmond's run.

[kitten]

Still playing Ninja Ryukenden. The farthest I've gotten on one credit is 5-3, though I've made it 6-2 and even 6-3 on a second credit. (That last room with the pouncing Gollums... what the fuck?)

iirc if you walk straight forward, you'll go under all 3 of the surprise gollums :B keep that in mind before being tempted by that health up!

And while I wouldn't do it myself, thanks to kitten for showing me that it was possible to climb the ladder in 5-2 without getting hit by the bird.

you can also get him to fly off-screen to the left with some careful positioning! i never got that down, so i just do the little pause flip.

Is it ever worth collecting extra lives in this game? None of you appear to be doing it, and I wasn't even aware they existed before looking at Edmond's run.

i sometimes grab the one in 4-2, and i guess if you're trying to for 1cc and not nomiss, it's worth getting the one in 5-2 (5-3? i forget), too. gotta backtrack on an upper path to grab it, but it's pretty safe.

- - - - -

in other news, got nomiss recordings done for mitsume ga tooru and x-men mutant apocalypse! i'm proud of the mutant apocalypse one - there's a few mistakes (the most embarrassing right at the beginning, when i stubbornly and stupidly try to optic blast a person doing a three round burst after every round lmao), but i feel i shred a lot of it. idk if anyone else here has a recording up for that one, but i consider it pretty informative that the game can be played super slick! last boss is a tedious nightmare, but i only get hit once.

the mitsume ga tooru one is a little longer than i'd like, but i didn't have time to practice any of the boss quick kills. they seem to be largely unintended, for the most part, but they would have shaved entire minutes off this run.

[WelshMegalodon]

iirc if you walk straight forward, you'll go under all 3 of the surprise gollums :B keep that in mind before being tempted by that health up!

You are a savior. Thanks for the tip!

EDIT: Wow, it really works!

EDIT 2:

Spoiler

2cc'ed to Jaquio.

EDIT 3:

If you want a bit of fun at the cost of some HP, just

Spoiler

walk straight off the edge - as long as you're holding [left], the eagle will whack you out of the pit onto the safe floor every time.

I always do this now, feels too good not to.

Somehow I managed to miss this. Unbelievable.

By the way, it's probably been said before, but with everyone's collective help, I've deduced the safest strategy for the infamous 6-2 pit drop:

Spoiler

Move slowly to the right and you can actually make the cross-throwing ghoul disappear, just like the orange-garbed enemy in 5-3! (I see now that Vanguard did exactly this in his run, but I forgot to watch that one when I was playing.) From there it's just a matter of ducking under the bird that spawns a la FinalBaton, leaping onto the empty platform, then immediately dropping down to avoid the football player like BIL. Super easy.

EDIT 4 1/12: Made it to 6-3 on one credit, died, continued, and died to Jaquio.

EDIT 5: 1CC'ed to Jaquio, although I lost all four lives in the process.

[Jonny2x4]

With all this talk about speedruns, I personally never cared much for them with a few exceptions. However, there was one point I had an interest in high scores for arcade games. Particularly there was a Japanese archive of scores that were ever published by Gamest and Arcadia, along with a list of game centers where they were achieved. I wish I remember which site it was though.

Anyone, I did an attempt at Rush 'n Attack on the Nintendo DS via the compilation Konami released for the platform. I always get killed off around Stage 3 and 4.

[mycophobia]

I got to 6-2 on one credit, but the jetpack dudes remain a sticking point. I know what to do there, it's just getting the execution down. Also the second room of 6-3 with the two suspended platforms is hard to get down with any kind of consistency. I'm also dying a lot on that really annoying cliff jump on 5-2, the one where you have to cling to the wall then jump to the other wall, and then jump to the bottom platform.

I've credit fed to Jaquio a couple of times. I kind of get the gist of it from watching replays but like any other section in this game it'll just take practice. Looks like I just need to dodge the two projectiles until the timing is right for me to jump up and hit him, but it's hard to recognize when that is. It's also hard to be that patient :p

[FinalBaton]

It's also hard to be that patient :p

Yet it is the key :]

[drauch]

I savestated Jaquio for such a long time, never really coming close unless I just did something totally stupid. Then it finally just *clicked*, and he eventually became a piece of cake--a piece of cake that can still doom you if you lose your cool!

If you go back a few pages (maybe quite a few now, how often this thread gets updated), there's some great tips that all the kind folks here gave me on when to attack him, and yeah, patience is key!

[BIL]

Still playing Ninja Ryukenden. The farthest I've gotten on one credit is 5-3, though I've made it 6-2 and even 6-3 on a second credit. (That last room with the pouncing Gollums... what the fuck?)

iirc if you walk straight forward, you'll go under all 3 of the surprise gollums :B keep that in mind before being tempted by that health up!

Actually, the HP restore is in a candle well before the gollum drop, easily accessible with the terrain forming a staircase. It's a time freeze that's located in the dropzone.

And while I wouldn't do it myself, thanks to kitten for showing me that it was possible to climb the ladder in 5-2 without getting hit by the bird.

you can also get him to fly off-screen to the left with some careful positioning! i never got that down, so i just do the little pause flip.

Although you can certainly defend yourself if you end up on the ladder with birdy intact, it's entirely possible (and preferable imo) to just kill him from the ledge. No ranged weapon needed! You can Jumpslash him while leaping for the ladder too IIRC.

The former approach is a prime example of the game's weaponised camera frame / Gain Ground System™. It kills respawn points! Birdy might appear to have a sweet respawn deal there, but my superior positioning puts the kibosh on that, and then I stick a shuriken in his fuckin' eye. Boof! Bird all gone!

Is it ever worth collecting extra lives in this game? None of you appear to be doing it, and I wasn't even aware they existed before looking at Edmond's run.

I liek the sound it makes Somewhere between a goofy *bloop* and a metallic whirr!

[FinalBaton]

You can hit the candle that contains the freeze item from a distance, using the diagonal flame thingy.

IIRC you can accomplish this WITHOUT triggering the golums. just slowly edge your way, hit that (2nd) candle as far away as possible using the flame, then once the freeze powerup is on the ground, run like hell and grab it. golums will then appear but they won't have time to touch you before you reach the freeze item.
I've messed that up in my recorded run, but it can definitely be done. I've done it countless times before.

It's yet another one of the myriads of little moments the developpers included, where there's 1 very precise way to go through what appears like a raw fucking deal completely unharmed, provided you know the game well.

Man, what a great game.

[kitten]

Actually, the HP restore is in a candle well before the gollum drop, easily accessible with the terrain forming a natural staircase. It's a time freeze that's located in the dropzone.

i remembered and went to check after posting :[ i forget what is in the dang candles so, so badly and i think it's really evident in my play. this was a huge deal i had with the original castlevania, too, but ninja gaiden is a lot more demanding. i feel like this game would improve immensely if it had 3's transparent orbs.

- - - - -

also, plays are up!

x-men: mutant apocalypse nomiss

mitsume ga tooru nomiss

i suggest the mutant apocalypse one, i think it makes the game look fun & fast :B my only big regret is not mixing it up a little with wolverine's uppercut, i think i forgot it was even a move throughout my entire play. it only does as much damage as his downward thrust but leaves you way more open, so it's not often super useful, but i could have been working it in. i at least use psylocke's a bit! i don't skip the opening or ending and flip through the text in the game at a readable pace for the sake of the recording - just skip ahead a little each time it pops up if it's boring.

might also be useful to flip through the mitsume ga tooru for a few things - my play in it isn't that bad so much as the game is just slow. 40 minutes long counting the opening and ending and i skip most of the money! yeesh, this game is only 5 stages.

[BIL]

Also the second room of 6-3 with the two suspended platforms is hard to get down with any kind of consistency.

The trick there is icy minimalism. Jump onto the first platform, spawning the ledge guarder and the bird. The instant your landing zone is clear, make the jump, kill the guard, then kill the bird.

Sounds obvious, and simple, but the scene is designed so that any hesitation or extraneous movement will create an almighty clusterfuck. Hesitate on the jump, and the bird will reach you. Back up, and Comedy Igor Duo will spawn (this'll almost certainly happen if the bird gets to you). Either situation is going to put you at death's door via the pit, and completely fuck up your mood.

As long as you're quick about spotting your jump opening, the bird won't reach you. In my run I actually take a bit more time than I needed, and still make it through just fine. If I'd kept Jumpslash, like I do these days, it'd have been even easier. Tardiness and retreat are the big threats here.

I'm also dying a lot on that really annoying cliff jump on 5-2, the one where you have to cling to the wall then jump to the other wall, and then jump to the bottom platform.

There's a really easy workaround to that bit - I won't spoil, but Vanguard's run demonstrates it.

[Vanguard]

I'm more surprised though that you would elevate Dragon Fighter to the level of Shatterhand and Kage. It's by far the worst Natsume game I've played on NES/FC (probably even worse than that Jetsons game), and I don't really see a lot of redeeming qualities in it.

What the heck are you saying? Dragon Fighter is awesome! It's really simple and straightforward, but the execution of every single element is dead on. Lightning-fast pacing, simple, varied, dangerous enemies, and an exceptionally good player moveset.

The Dragon Fighter sword attack might be my favorite melee attack on the NES. It kills most enemies with one or two hits, its attack speed is very fast, though not to the point where you need to mash, its animation gives you a good idea of its hitbox, with just a little extra leeway, and even the sound effect is just right.

Then there's the charge attack. It's slow, but its power makes up for that. It's safer than the sword, but the game cleverly incentivizes you to use the sword anyway, because that's the only way to fill your dragon meter. I really think that if the developers had messed that one thing up, they'd have destroyed the entire game, but they correctly identified that the most fun and stylish way to play is to mostly use the sword and they ensured that this was also the most effective way to play. In high level play, the charged shot is still useful for softening tough enemies or thinning out crowds so you can rush in and finish the survivors with your sword.

Last is the dragon which can trivialize most obstacles in exchange for consuming your super meter. Shredding a boss in seconds feels like a great reward for playing well in the stage. There are some cool little things about the dragon, like how there's no activation cost. Quickly switching in and out is very affordable if you need to snipe a single enemy or if your jump won't quite dodge that projectile. You also can't activate dragon form during mercy invincibility, so it's no free ticket out of trouble you've gotten yourself into - a great way to encourage the same sort of responsible play that the Castlevania series demands! The dragon mechanic just enhances the entire game by adding a layer of resource management and offering some much-needed choice in how to approach the Dragon Fighter's linear, straightforward levels.

Those three forms of attack give you a huge amount of versatility. It all comes together to form a game where the most effective way to play is the most fun way to play, and your reward for mastery is the ability to relentlessly tear through everything in your path without slowing down. I know a lot of this stuff is really basic, but what makes Dragon Fighter so good is its perfect grasp of the fundamentals.

I generally dread genre shifts, but Dragon Fighter's final shmup stage works pretty well. It's easy, but I like to think of it as a victory lap of sorts. It's no less graceful than any of the Contra series's genre shifts, anyway. Really the only outstanding flaw I can think of is that the healing items from enemies makes things a bit too forgiving and can reward degenerate tactics, and even then it's no worse than what you see in Megaman games.

That's all just for normal mode, which alone earns Dragon Fighter a place among the best games on the NES. However, Dragon Fighter also has one of the most effective and well-considered hard modes of any platformer. It's miles ahead of your typical 2x enemy HP and damage job. First, enemies fire suicide bullets upon being killed in your dragon form which really perfects the balance between your three methods of attack. The dragon is still your strongest option offensively, but the extra flak flying around makes it far more engaging. The second and most significant change is that hard mode prevents enemies from ever dropping healing items. The sort of careful and precise play that someone might engage in for style in normal mode becomes a basic requirement for survival. What's also cool is that the healing between stages isn't a full heal, so hard mode has a very arcade-like sense of consequence. It's entirely possible that a mistake made on the first stage will still hurt you on the last.

For me, Dragon Fighter's in the top 5 NES games.

I've credit fed to Jaquio a couple of times. I kind of get the gist of it from watching replays but like any other section in this game it'll just take practice. Looks like I just need to dodge the two projectiles until the timing is right for me to jump up and hit him, but it's hard to recognize when that is. It's also hard to be that patient :p

The two most important tips for Jaquio are: don't let him touch you, his contact damage is triple what his fireballs do, and don't try to land a free counterhit during your mercy invincibility because that always backfires.


Also, I think it would be better to make a separate thread for discussing gamer frauds. There certainly seems to be enough material to support one.

[BIL]

Another thing I'd add, about Jaquio - don't think of it as dodging his fireballs, then attacking. Rather, try to sweep past them, land your hit, then return to the safety of the ground in one seamless attack. It's hard to put into words, but you'll notice in my run that I'm typically incorporating evasion and attack thus.

This requires familiarity with how he and his projectiles move, of course, but with the timing of both being so regular, I think it's a fairly simple groove to grasp. Openings are frequent but brief, and attacking late will not end well - even if you manage to hit him, you don't want to be high up once the new fireballs reach escape velocity (hitting him as they spawn, then falling to the floor, OTOH, is a sound move). Each hit needs time for both entry and escape. Learning to proactively move through the fireballs might free up the vital split-seconds you need.

You'll notice I lose half my lifebar near the end, recklessly avenging a meaningless hit. This is what will happen if you're erratic! If you get hit, retreat to the floor until the flames die down and get back into the groove. It's a fight based on groove and aggressive zoning, a peanut butter/chocolate combination I'll never tire of.

This is the approach I recommend for Gun.Smoke (AC)'s infamously harrowing bosses, incidentally. You can't focus on crowd-clearing, then hitting the boss during his vulnerable phase, then returning to the crowd. While you're focused on one element, the other will get away from you. Rather, you need to sweep the field and stick the boss as seamlessly as possible. Difference being, Gun.Smoke's screenloads of blood-crazed zako rarely allow the luxury of Jaquio's predictable rhythm... but the principle of incorporated movement and attack is the same.

FUN FACT: Just like in my MASTER OF THE KNIFING Creature+Igor fight, I end up facing the wrong way at a critical point, which results in things absolutely going to shit! (I even do the classic "WTF? Dammit!" pause!) But Jaquio's at death's door by then, so I just bulldoze through on reserve HP. Both runs (and many others) were done on the same shitty first-gen 360 pad. Fucking thing liked to do that, whenever I wanted a neutral [down]... in CV while crouching, in NG while using the quick jump sword exploit.

i remembered and went to check after posting :[ i forget what is in the dang candles so, so badly and i think it's really evident in my play. this was a huge deal i had with the original castlevania, too, but ninja gaiden is a lot more demanding. i feel like this game would improve immensely if it had 3's transparent orbs.

Same - it's hard not to conclude NG1 would play a lot more spontaneously if its innately high speed wasn't at odds with constant blind candles. In both NG1 and NG2, it's really only in the past year that I've made an effort to learn what's in what... but it's more like I just memorise where the subweapons are, so I don't accidentally lose my current pick.

While I'd absolutely refuse to change any of the game's controversial spawning policies (I think they create a deadly emphasis on gained/lost ground, unique even within its own series), I'd be okay with an arrange mode adding visible powerup drops.

Now I wonder how much of both CV and NG's blind drops was deliberate design. There's definitely a few "punisher" drops in the former series - the ones I most readily recall are CV4, which loves putting the dagger in places where it'll fall right onto Simon. I don't get the feeling NG did this, though with the much higher game speed, accidents tend to create themselves!

Also, I think it would be better to make a separate thread for discussing gamer frauds. There certainly seems to be enough material to support one.

I'd definitely prefer to keep any ongoing discussion of the matter to a new thread. That shit is toxic.

[Sumez]

Is it ever worth collecting extra lives? None of you appear to be doing it, and I wasn't even aware they existed in the game before looking at Edmond's run.

When going for your first 1CC I don't see why not? It's part of the game design. Just don't abuse the fact that they respawn infinitely if you switch rooms.
I tend to always go for 1up items just because they are there. It's fun.

[kitten]

i am trying war of the gems again with the added perspective of having played mutant apocalypse, now, and i wouldn't be surprised to learn if there were significant staff change-ups with this game - of course, i'd be happy to learn anything about who the staff was on mutant apocalypse other than the musicians, who were only revealed years after the fact because of a compilation album, i think? it feels very different despite having wolverine with his moveset completely intact from the previous game, and much worse for it.

that said, it's not as bad as i once pegged it, and there's some decent play to be had. have yet to finish it, though! got stuck on a level i could revive indefinitely on, and decided to just do a fresh restart on another day (perhaps tomorrow). there's a lot of gimmicks to stages that don't add much to them, enemies attacking you from offscreen, anklebiters that are below many character's punching range, etc. iron man seems to be a bit of a beast with his superb aerial control and little grenade and is definitely a favored character, but the boss of the stage i was in forces you to fight him in a small corridor while he teleports all over the damn place and mixes up projectiles.

the only thing that felt cheap about mutant apocalypse was the juggernaut, who i felt could counterattack a little too quickly without making his openings particularly obvious (not to mention he's got some misleading hitboxing on the absurd range of his uppercut & charge). war of the gems comparatively feels as if it reeks of cheapness in both play and visuals! having many of the enemies be recolored & very lightly edited versions of your player characters just feels really bizarrely lazy. hulk's sprite looks like he was drawn as the bald enemy frankenstein monster before being drawn as the hulk, and holy heck do you eventually start fighting a lot of really stupid mutant wolverines and mad max iron men.

it's deeply flawed, but maybe worth the time to get it down! can't think of a better time than now-ish, but i might end up shelving this one again.

[Sumez]

Mutant Apocalypse is still high on my wish list. For some reason that game just isn't available anywhere on eBay without astronomical shipping costs.

*sigh* gonna give Dragon Fighter another chance some time soon I guess. I honestly just felt the game was extremely lacking, minimalistic in the boring sense, and the dragon power ridiculously unbalanced.

[BIL]

If you revisit DF, go straight in on Hard imo (AAAA, BBBB, AB AB AB AB @ title screen). It's pretty much tailored to address the slight slack you mention.

DF HARD

Spoiler

df normal

Spoiler

The beauty is in the kill™

If you don't dig Hard though, it's a safe bet the game's not for you.

Fun fact, Wild Guns re-used the same cheat for its stage select (enter @ character select to skip Carson City, repeat at Stage Select to go to Last Duel).

[Bloodreign]

Kitten, your Mitsume Ga Tooru link is actually exactly the same as your first link, X-Men Mutant Apocalypse.

Correct link to the goodness of this Famicom gem:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLYcgqYK-mQ

[mycophobia]

Thanks for the tips yall.

[kitten]

Kitten, your Mitsume Ga Tooru link is actually exactly the same as your first link

whoops! ty for that, i went and edited the post.

[Bloodreign]

whoops! ty for that, i went and edited the post.

No problem.

Gave it a watch, you make the game look easy, I know it's not considered hard, but it's given me trouble in the past.

The shop system kind of reminds me of Matendouji/Conquest of the Crystal Palace, how the shopkeeper stands out in the stages, except in Tooru, she's animated while standing. Of course she doesn't throw you out the shop if you try to buy stuff you don't have the money for 3 times.

[Sumez]

That shop keeper is the single most important reason to get the US version of the game instead of the Famicom.

Mitsume Ga Tooru is a pretty easy game, but you'll die quite a few times on the first playthrough due to some strange jumps, confusing bosses, etc.
I would have loved to see a hard mode in that game.

[kitten]

Gave it a watch, you make the game look easy, I know it's not considered hard, but it's given me trouble in the past.

the biggest thing that i think makes it appear harder than it is is how patient you're forced to be with some of the bosses. many of them go on unpleasantly long and kind of bait you into thinking you're doing something wrong and attacking more aggressively. the 2nd boss, in particular, feels like he has twice the health he should with his invulnerability phases. it kind of baffles me he wasn't a later boss, he's much harder than anything other than the last one. there's a couple of tricky bits with the platforming, too - the very last room in which those blocks rise into the ceiling feels cruel, and ended the run just previous to the recording, making me start over. sometimes you accidentally walk back onto one and almost kill yourself, you can see me do it in the video right here.



watch how after i land on the block 2nd from the right, i try to fall down the gap by going back in the other direction, but it instead just walks me across and onto the higher block. i'm willing to bet with it just being another pixel or two higher, i would have fallen between them, as i anticipated, but it instead put me within just a hair of instant death. probably the only part of the game i would call unfair - that did kill me on the previous run! if i had delayed moving back to the right for even a single frame, would i have fallen through the gap, as i thought? there's no other instance in the game where you can cross a block gap like that that i can think of, and you usually slip between them when there's a height difference. you're just not given time to parse!
ah, gif'ing my poorly interlaced video almost makes me feel like i'm an animating an old magazine screenshot

That shop keeper is the single most important reason to get the US version of the game instead of the Famicom.

for matendouji? dang it, i already bought the fc game :O oh well, got it real cheap in a bundle from a friend. what's the difference, exactly?

- - - - - - - - - -

also! beat war of the gems, today. it never really gets better, though there's thankfully not another sluggish underwater stage. miiiiight get this one down to a nomiss and record it, not sure. sometimes it feels like you're just going to eat a death due to some mean bs. there's this recurring enemy named EVIL PUCK that is too short for a lot of attacks and sometimes grabs you for an entire third of your life bar that is utterly infuriating. it is simply not as refined as mutant apocalypse, but i've had this cart since i was a kid and never even gotten past the halfway point, so i'm very happy to finally clear this game.

Spoiler

hulk looks weirdly dignified in his character select and his portrait & text for when you beat a stage makes him look like he's got some intelligence and composure. thennnnn he looks like a psychopath, in game. i swear they drew him as a sprite they planned to only use an enemy before deciding he would be a playable character.

anyway, buy war of the gems if you want to spend twice as much and get a game half as good as mutant apocalypse, i guess?