DoDonPachi Resurrection - Steam Edition

[drunkninja24]

Maybe I'm crazy, but I love this game. The diversity of modes is fantastic. If vanilla dfk isn't doing it for me, I'll score chase in ketsuipachi or go wild in arrange a, or kill myself in black label.

It's such a great package.

They seriously need proper bug testing though. The slowdown is dumb. I assume since this is a PC game they'll patch it relatively quickly?

It really is an excellent package and game, just the issues with the arrange modes that drains it.

And from what Nick said earlier, I wouldn't expect a patch anytime soon unfortunately, but we'll see.

[drunkninja24]

Alright, so a quick gameplay related question I can't seem to find a definitive answer for

What are the requirements to get the hidden route in Black Label outside of using Power? I've been at it for like an hour using B-Bomb and I feel as if I'm doing what I should be (at least for 1.5) and it never comes up. Is the strategy markedly different in Black Label?

[MaXXX]

Make sure you have a full hyper gauge when you destroy the last silo

[defected78]

Surely the options hud needs patching.

[blackrabite]

Make sure you have a full hyper gauge when you destroy the last silo

re 1.5: It is still imperative that the player destroys the three victim silos as opposed to the tanks, right? I am learnin' myself. Got my 1-ALL last night, so now I want to practice Ura routes to target Tsujou loops and basic scoring!

Also, the only way to get knocked out of Ura route is to lose a life during a stage, right? Does it knock you out immediately, like, next applicable midboss? Or does it not change anything until you begin the next stage?

My goal order is to learn Ura route -> bees -> consistent scoring of first loop -> survival of Tsujou loop

I am debating whether I want to try switching styles... Strong is obviously more forgiving than Power, but Power seems to encourage the Score to Survive mentality. My concern is that I will struggle making any kind of progress once I hit second loop without bombs. If I keep rank under control, will B-Power be able to blast through tough parts of Tsujou? I know Power is great for scoring, but for an amateur to clear...?

I guess I figure now wouldn't be a bad point to switch styles. Thank you for the input.

[Kiken]

re 1.5: It is still imperative that the player destroys the three victim silos as opposed to the tanks, right? I am learnin' myself. Got my 1-ALL last night, so now I want to practice Ura routes to target Tsujou loops and basic scoring!

You have to prevent the tanks from running over the silos. Either destroy the silo before it can be run over or destroy the tank before it reaches the silo.

Also, the only way to get knocked out of Ura route is to lose a life during a stage, right? Does it knock you out immediately, like, next applicable midboss? Or does it not change anything until you begin the next stage?

If you die during one of the Ura-route mid-bosses, you'll be knocked out of the Ura-route on the next stage.

[CloudyMusic]

My understanding is that a 2-ALL (either flavor) is much harder with Power due to the lack of bombs. If you're shooting primarily for the 2-ALL, Strong is definitely going to be the easiest path. (Or Bomb, I guess, if you're looking for an extra challenge.)

[blackrabite]

If you die during one of the Ura-route mid-bosses, you'll be knocked out of the Ura-route on the next stage.

Gotcha! I die before midboss, it knocks me out that stage. I die during or after, I am knocked out beginning next stage unless I pick up all bees in the current one.

My understanding is that a 2-ALL (either flavor) is much harder with Power due to the lack of bombs. If you're shooting primarily for the 2-ALL, Strong is definitely going to be the easiest path. (Or Bomb, I guess, if you're looking for an extra challenge.)

Cool, that makes sense. To put it all together:
B-Strong sets me up closer to 2-ALL, but certain scoring strategies for either loop are not accessible.
B-Power is good for targeting higher scoring, but is significantly more difficult to survive with.
In terms of survival: the advantages of Power's hypers - easier to build, better at canceling in higher hyper ranks - does not offset the availability of bombs.

[drunkninja24]

Ah, okay, so just to be sure I'm clear: getting to Ura route in BL with Bomb style is the same as in 1.5? Do you have to have full bomb stock or something (since your bombs/hypers are shared so you'll always have a hyper ready unless you use them all right at the start)?

[MaXXX]

I think you just need the full hyper meter. You'll want to charge up into red mode so your gauge fills faster

[qmish]

Fun to read how dfk is casual when i die already 3 times on 1st stage on original etc.

Not my day maybe or i still as shitnewbie as i was from the beginning or i need bigger monitor and tate or whatever

i just gonna give up on "cave danmaku" except DOJ (doj is pinnacle for me, classic of classics, i cant hate it) and some other favs

Because really.. FWIW while it was Cave's Futari that invited me to shmups genre about 4 years ago (didnt play them at all before that), i m getting already tired of all that small hitbox vs. several hundred of bullets bullshit. Really makes me feel like proctologist instead of giving feel of destroying stuff. At the same time i'm falling in love with Psikyo's, Taito's and Triangle Service's games. Whatever.

or maybe i need more years of experience with non-danmaku stgs as u old folks probably have. Like, i got an impression, that every new bullethell game was created with a thought in mind that player already played everything that was released years before.

[d3vak]

i just gonna give up on "cave danmaku" except DOJ (doj is pinnacle for me, classic of classics, i cant hate it) and some other favs

Isn't DOJ way harder than DFK?

[MaXXX]

i just gonna give up on "cave danmaku" except DOJ (doj is pinnacle for me, classic of classics, i cant hate it) and some other favs

Isn't DOJ way harder than DFK?

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=56114

Apparently a Power Ura 2ALL is harder than Black Label DOJ.

[blackrabite]

Not my day maybe or i still as shitnewbie as i was from the beginning or i need bigger monitor and tate or wh

Oh man oh man, you are hearing DFK is casual from people who can, like, 2-ALL a multitude of games. A lot of that comes from how the difficulty is relatively low compared to the ramp up in stage 5, which, combined with autobomb, can afford you a comparatively easy clear.

If you don't like your setup, definitely change it: it'll just keep at the back of your mind if you're dissatisfied. That being said, the same principles for getting clears in other CAVE titles still applies to DFK: find out where you're eating dirt and determine whether you could reposition for it, hyper through it, or need to bomb it.

B-Strong or C-Strong are recommended ships for getting clears due to strong fire power, wide shot arc, and bombs. If you aren't set on a ship/style yet, definitely give those two a go! Hyper rank resets between stages on the first loop, so you have a lot of room to play around with those.

I think you are correct re: how most danmaku consider the veterans moreso than the prospective newcomer, but Daifukkatsu was kind of a reaction to Dai-ou-jou: more resources, more chain timer, less bomb bonus. There are some awesome threads on this forum that elaborate on tips for getting that clear, but motivation is always going to be the most important thing!

[drunkninja24]

Fun to read how dfk is casual when i die already 3 times on 1st stage on original etc.

Not my day maybe or i still as shitnewbie as i was from the beginning or i need bigger monitor and tate or whatever

i just gonna give up on "cave danmaku" except DOJ (doj is pinnacle for me, classic of classics, i cant hate it) and some other favs

Because really.. FWIW while it was Cave's Futari that invited me to shmups genre about 4 years ago (didnt play them at all before that), i m getting already tired of all that small hitbox vs. several hundred of bullets bullshit. Really makes me feel like proctologist instead of giving feel of destroying stuff. At the same time i'm falling in love with Psikyo's, Taito's and Triangle Service's games. Whatever.

or maybe i need more years of experience with non-danmaku stgs as u old folks probably have. Like, i got an impression, that every new bullethell game was created with a thought in mind that player already played everything that was released years before.

umm...are you playing on power? Cause otherwise there should be no reason to die 3 times on stage 1 lol

[qmish]

Oh, well.

Thanks for not letting me dive into self-pityness and quick judgements. As for DOJ vs DFK, i was talking about visual fidelity on screen. DOJ only goes very crazy for eyesight starting Stage 4 where you have those "waves" from left/right sides multiplied by what gets from frontal and those cannons on railways etc. So i was talking about that you dont really often fall in situation where you need to kill your eyes to watch that tiny pixel on your ship vs. crazy waves of bullets with tiny hitboxes OH NO U DIDNT GO THROUGH as much as in DFK where its since ST1 everything is overwhelming and you cant see a thing. As for actual what is harder or not, i can't comment on that of course unless i achieve some more progress.

are you playing on power

Power, not bombs, yeah. I admit i must go and re-read explanation on mechanics though as i mindlessly switch to boost mode because i like that huge laser that intercept enemies lasers .

[blackrabite]

Power, not bombs, yeah. I admit i must go and re-read explanation on mechanics though as i mindlessly switch to boost mode because i like that huge laser that intercept enemies lasers .

Right on, well, lessee: you mentioned you played some Mushi Futari back in the day; DFK doesn't have nearly the same focus on bullet-canceling from killing your enemies, so don't let fire power seduce your style selection from that angle.

Also, of all the ship/style pairings, only Bomb's laser (outside of hyper mode) is too weak to completely refute strong enemy lasers. While Power can, Strong can too, and it has the ability to utilize bomb stock. All Strong really gives up over Bomb is some movement speed, and even then it still moves faster than Power[boost].

When it comes to weaving in between bullets, things tend to be diciest when you're caught unaware. If you spend your time back-and-center, tank lines appearing from both sides are going to corner you with bullet streams. Sweeping from one side or the other helps, and figuring out the best position/movement is circumstantial to the stage and its trappings.

edit: forgot to mention: hypers really are a fun way to tell the game to fuck off when you're starting out. They give you the opportunity to shove the game's bullet patterns up its ass; but later, the game tests you, baits them out, and returns the favor. So yeah, try to find some of the hidden bees to keep your hyper meter healthy and ready to go!

[MaXXX]

Can anyone give me some tips for Stage 5 in Power style? If I hyper all the hard parts I'm drowning in Danger lasers before long

[Van_Artic]

Can anyone give me some tips for Stage 5 in Power style? If I hyper all the hard parts I'm drowning in Danger lasers before long

keep in mind that the more you hyper, the more danger lasers will spawn so you need to hold back a lot and learn to deal with the bullets without relying too much on it

also which part specifically? the first set of laser walls at the start should be hypered, they have way too much hp to be destroyed normally (and consequently they nerfed them in Black Label)

then you hyper the first midboss to get a speedkill; then whatever problem the laser wheels are giving you, try to develop a route, they're not that hard to avoid, switching to normal shot and moving around while holding laser can drive off the bullets in between to give you some space to squeeze into

[Blem]

Oh, well.

Thanks for not letting me dive into self-pityness and quick judgements. As for DOJ vs DFK, i was talking about visual fidelity on screen. DOJ only goes very crazy for eyesight starting Stage 4 where you have those "waves" from left/right sides multiplied by what gets from frontal and those cannons on railways etc. So i was talking about that you dont really often fall in situation where you need to kill your eyes to watch that tiny pixel on your ship vs. crazy waves of bullets with tiny hitboxes OH NO U DIDNT GO THROUGH as much as in DFK where its since ST1 everything is overwhelming and you cant see a thing. As for actual what is harder or not, i can't comment on that of course unless i achieve some more progress.
.

Learning where to look is a skill by itself. I tend to only take quick glances up at the enemies/patterns and mostly focus on finding empty space. If there's no bullets in a spot and no bullets moving towards it, it must be safe.

I don't know if that strategy will get you any high scores or 2-alls but it's working for me.

Plus this is DFK so you can hyper or bomb a lot of the scary stuff.

[MaXXX]

I usually hyper the midboss and the popcorn rush afterwards. Then I hyper through the laser wheels but still end up dying sometimes due to bullets from behind or flying into the wheels. After that isn't as hard so I just hyper if I get into trouble.

I probably just need to practice the stage some more

[blackrabite]

Hmm, so I was trying out Ura route Stage 1 & Stage 2 to get used to some basic scoring strats in those and had the following difficulties. Y'all mind helpin' me iron them out? I'm using B-Strong.

Stage 1
problem: was having difficulty getting Ura midboss to spawn. If I just focus on killing the tanks and not hypering for hit, I can get it to spawn. But, I'd prefer to crank up the counter a bit by killing the silos and canceling the tanks' bullets.

Stage 2
prob #1: keeping the midboss alive long enough to try and milk the laser orbs. I already have +1 to hyper rank due to opening the stage with one, and I need to hyper late enough into its attacks that I am still in hyper mode when the boss times out. B-Strong's laser hits like a truck though...

prob #2: positioning for best laser orb milking? would it be between a pair of them as high up on the screen as possible so I can follow them downward?

Thanks for the help!

[drunkninja24]

I think you just need the full hyper meter. You'll want to charge up into red mode so your gauge fills faster

Yeah, this definitely isn't it from playing more last night had max red, all hypers in stock, took out the silos before the tanks ran over them....and nothing. There has to be some aspect I'm missing but I can't for the life of me figure out what, I've watched vids of bomb/strong that got ura route in BL and can't determine what they do differently

[Glick]

Can't help too much on Stage 1. You just need to be fast at refilling the hyper guage (hint: laser aura the small tanks) so it's full by the time you hit the 3rd silo.

For the stage 2 midboss, you just need to tap your shot. Get used to rhythmic tapping, just enough to maintain your chain and cancel the bullets. You'd be surprised at how little it takes to cancel those bullets as Power. When the lasers come out, tap your laser VERY briefly to force them back. Repeat this process a bit.

For the final laser orb milking part, it's best to watch some superplays. However, this is extremely random. Shoot for milking close together dual orbs that are farthest from the screen edge. It's pretty RNG whether or not you will get 7k hits or up to 9k+.

[Sasupoika]

I kinda want invidual boards for power/bomb/stronk for combined A,B&C - considering different scoring potentials ( especially in BL ).

[blackrabite]

Can't help too much on Stage 1. You just need to be fast at refilling the hyper guage (hint: laser aura the small tanks) so it's full by the time you hit the 3rd silo.

Oooh before hitting the third silo...! I thought it just had to be some time before the midboss would appear. That's a great detail; I'll try to create an easy route that gets a lot of aura damage up top so as to have that meter rebuilt.

For the stage 2 midboss, you just need to tap your shot. Get used to rhythmic tapping, just enough to maintain your chain and cancel the bullets. You'd be surprised at how little it takes to cancel those bullets as Power. When the lasers come out, tap your laser VERY briefly to force them back. Repeat this process a bit.

Aaaah, gotcha, I am B-Strong as opposed to Power, so I have been struggling with canceling them w/o dropping chain (too slow) or killing boss (too fast). It's trickier than it looks.

Thank you!

[Cagar]

-

[blackrabite]

I again recommend using Bomb style, it makes chaining much more sensible. Things don't die too fast or so easily.
It's basically just Strong without being OP

Wow, yeah. Huh, didn't quite realize Bomb had such a chance to shine from Strong's shadow:
"I keep killing xyz too fast!" use bomb kill slower
"I have to hyper too many places to keep my chain!" use bomb kill slower
"Things kill me when I use bomb because they get a chance to shoot at me!" use bomb learn to play

All three styles are pretty compelling, actually. Thanks for your response!

[Blem]

I already have +1 to hyper rank due to opening the stage with one,

try hypering right before you kill the stage 1 boss
you'll start stage 2 in a hyper and your rank will go back down after it ends

[blackrabite]

I already have +1 to hyper rank due to opening the stage with one,

try hypering right before you kill the stage 1 boss
you'll start stage 2 in a hyper and your rank will go back down after it ends

I'll give it another go! My experience with it last time was that I wasn't able to chain the beginning bullets I was cancelling very well as Strong style, but I didn't give that method a lot of effort. I'll try it again when I practice today. Thank you for the suggestion.