OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)

[Omnigamer]

There should be no difference in functionality if TX_MODE is set to DVI on newer boards. Anyway, pretty much all NES & SNES 240p related audio/video stability issues come down to their jittery sync as described here.

Changing the TX mode didn't have any effect in this case. I'm aware of some of the difficulties with SNES sync, but these symptoms are pretty far from anything I've experienced in the past year that I've been using SNES with OSSC. It just doesn't make much sense to me how one unit can be experiencing complete sync loss (including LED blink) at specific scenes when another unit with identical settings doesn't even flinch at them. NES signals doesn't exhibit the same symptoms, for what it's worth.

One of the people reporting these issues is getting a sync strike soon; if it's an issue of especially poor sync/cables, it should help us debug. Beyond that, there's not much more I can check while remote.

[paulb_nl]

Unless you have tested both OSSC revisions in the same environment with the same equipment and cables you cannot say it is because of the different revisions.

Losing sync on specific scenes with SNES is usually on a 1-CHIP with composite video/luma sync cable. Analog sync Vth needs to be increased to fix that. The older SNES 3-chip revisions are not affected.

Longer resync times can be caused by having more equipment between the OSSC output and display.

[Omnigamer]

As far as configurations that I know have been tested...

-Modded SNES Jr via both RGB SCART and component output mod (presumably a 1CHIP)
-Original "heavy" SNES
-Sync-on-luma and (likely) CV sync SCART cables in conjunction with both of the above
-Output direct to monitor via HDMI (does not get long resyncs)
-Output direct to SC501 capture device via HDMI

The same activity occurs regardless of which configuration is used. There isn't any more equipment in the chain, and even if there were I doubt it would cause something as significant as the literal half-minute resyncs that are being reported. Since the long resyncs are on the capture side it may have to do with drivers, but again it is strange that just SNES output would be exhibiting this and not NES or any other standard console.

[BuckoA51]

I've heard nothing of this on e-mail or the support forums.

[fafangus]

LG OLED 4K 55B7C quick tests

Vids taken with my bridge - I still can't manage it, still a lot to learn for me to be a top cameraman/photograph :p - so scuse me, the quality isn't bringing justice to the LG screen

SFC - with a little backporch setup, to give line X5 the fullscreen they deserves ^^
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suymH1FagOM

AES
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7Ooyyp08pQ

Crystal clear picture, fullscreen, brillant colors, deep black, beautifull scanlines...A dream

[Xyga]

Nice! He he, what I like with OLED is that even in average quality videos the instant pixel response really stands out.

[eric90000]

LG OLED 4K 55B7C quick tests

Vids taken with my bridge - I still can't manage it, still a lot to learn for me to be a top cameraman/photograph :p - so scuse me, the quality isn't bringing justice to the LG screen

SFC - with a little backporch setup, to give line X5 the fullscreen they deserves ^^
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suymH1FagOM

AES
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7Ooyyp08pQ

Crystal clear picture, fullscreen, brillant colors, deep black, beautifull scanlines...A dream

Wow, that really does look great. What settings did you adjust on the OSSC?

[Harrumph]

SFC - with a little backporch setup, to give line X5 the fullscreen they deserves ^^

For generic Lx5, I’ve programmed two profiles so that I can more quickly switch between games that display important graphics at top vs bottom of screen. E.g. Super Castlevania has high graphic elements, while Super Mario World is low.

[fafangus]

Yes it's a great great panel ^^

I use line X5, the settings I change is 4:3 (Neo Geo/Snes) or 320X240 optim (MD to crop borders, and playing with sampler options), I don't realy investigate in that much for now, I'm pretty happy with the results.

I will do more tests on my others systems when I'll get the time

Yes the save slot option is very usefull, mostly if you've got plenty of systems :p

[ApolloBoy]

Anyone use an Audio Authority 1362 with their OSSC? Just bought one on eBay so I can finally use composite and S-vid consoles on my new setup and I was curious as to how it performs.

Looking at the manual I'm *guessing* that it'll do framerate conversion, meaning it'll introduce frame drops and/or frame repeating, causing stuttering/jerkiness of the signal. If i'm right about that, i wouldn't use that device myself..

Got it last week and I just recently found a proper PSU for it, so I went and did some minor testing. It seems to work fairly well with my Japanese SMS through composite, the picture quality isn't as bad as I thought and it plays nice with the OSSC which is great. I haven't tried out S-video yet but I've got my modded Duo-R with me so I'll give that a shot next. I'd love to try out my modded C64 and Atari 7800 which have fairly nonstandard S-vid signals but they're not on me now so no dice.

[BuckoA51]

If it's VGA out though it has to be at least line-doubling those signals itself, which kinda defeats the point of the OSSC

[ApolloBoy]

which kinda defeats the point of the OSSC

Not when most of your consoles use RGB and your TV doesn’t have a VGA input. If there were RGB mods for the 7800, C64 and VIC-20 I never would’ve bought this.

[BuckoA51]

Yes but what you need is a passive transcoder like Extron, Sony YR series, etc, not another scaler.

[jaffa225man]

I'm pretty new to this stuff, but I am becoming familiar enough with the OSSC and the 256x240 optimal timing tweaker. Thanks Marqs, it is a brilliant device that just works (and quite well)! I'm trying to get the best picture possible with my original (3-chip) North American SNES on the OSSC's Line4X mode, and have been able to completely remove H. samplerate bands, but have not had any luck removing what appears to be V. samplerate bands. As you probably know, there is no control for setting V. samplerate (or at least I haven't found it). The bands appear stationary because I can't set the vertical samplerate close to what is optimal, and I would presumably need a vertical phase adjustment control too. Here are a couple images with the 240p Test Suite displaying the checkerboard pattern. During gaming I hadn't noticed this, but the 240p Test Suite has now made it obvious so I hope it can be corrected without too much work. If not, I'll be perfectly happy to live with it.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Thanks!

[Guspaz]

It does seem like a good and cheap cvbs/svid to RGBS converter would be useful, it's one of the weaknesses of the OSSC that if a console doesn't output RGB or YPbPr, it can't be used with the OSSC.

Bucko, did you ever crack open that expensive Lindy converter to see what chips it uses? Maybe somebody could design a better circuit around the chip and sell it at a more reasonable price. Or maybe something like the TVP5146 or TVP5150 could be paired with a three-channel DAC?

[Chocograph]

What's the input lag on your OLED sets? I'm using a 720p lcd tv from 2008 with 16ms but usually I game on a 1440p 144hz 4ms monitor.

[kel]

I'm pretty new to this stuff, but I am becoming familiar enough with the OSSC and the 256x240 optimal timing tweaker. Thanks Marqs, it is a brilliant device that just works (and quite well)! I'm trying to get the best picture possible with my original (3-chip) North American SNES on the OSSC's Line4X mode, and have been able to completely remove H. samplerate bands, but have not had any luck removing what appears to be V. samplerate bands. As you probably know, there is no control for setting V. samplerate (or at least I haven't found it). The bands appear stationary because I can't set the vertical samplerate close to what is optimal, and I would presumably need a vertical phase adjustment control too. Here are a couple images with the 240p Test Suite displaying the checkerboard pattern. During gaming I hadn't noticed this, but the 240p Test Suite has now made it obvious so I hope it can be corrected without too much work. If not, I'll be perfectly happy to live with it.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Thanks!

That looks like scaling artifacts to me, if that's the right term. I get similar artifacts if I use the zoom setting on the DVDO edge to get rid of the black bars at the top and bottom but with no zooming and no overscan on the TV they are completely gone. Do you have overscan turned on? If not then try line x3 instead, maybe your TV will find it easier to scale than line x4.

[ApolloBoy]

It does seem like a good and cheap cvbs/svid to RGBS converter would be useful, it's one of the weaknesses of the OSSC that if a console doesn't output RGB or YPbPr, it can't be used with the OSSC.

My hope is that composite video and S-video get implemented into the OSSC someday (or someone makes an add-on board at the very least), it was one of my biggest hangups when I was debating getting an OSSC and still kind of is now. I would've picked up a transcoder but they seem to be expensive and hard to find so I resorted to buying the AA 1362.

Also on an unrelated note has anyone tried to add a dedicated audio input for the AV1 input? I usually prefer to wire my audio separately and some of my homemade SCART cables aren't wired for audio, so having a way to pipe in audio for AV1 would be great.

[fafangus]

What's the input lag on your OLED sets? I'm using a 720p lcd tv from 2008 with 16ms but usually I game on a 1440p 144hz 4ms monitor.

I believe my LG's got 21ms of input lag

[nmalinoski]

It does seem like a good and cheap cvbs/svid to RGBS converter would be useful, it's one of the weaknesses of the OSSC that if a console doesn't output RGB or YPbPr, it can't be used with the OSSC.

My hope is that composite video and S-video get implemented into the OSSC someday (or someone makes an add-on board at the very least)...

I think a standalone RGB decoder would have more universal utility than integrating that functionality into the OSSC, especially for those who already have an OSSC.

Personally, I'd like to see a discrete device with S-Video, CVBS, and RF inputs (Or separate devices for each if auto-switching isn't feasible), with audio, that would decode to either RGBS or YPbPr. Not only would something like this work directly with the OSSC, but it could be paired with component or SCART switches (If compact enough, could slot multiple in to a gscartsw; could possibly daisy-chain power with the switch), and it could be used to provide legacy connections to modern/recent TVs that have component/SCART but lack S-Video and/or analog tuner.

Devices like these simply aren't available anymore, and it can be hit-or-miss whether the internals properly handle 240p. It took me quite a while to find my Kramer FC-4044, which is visually noisy (It really needs the LPF in the OSSC), and its rackmount form factor is bulky for a living room setting.

[H6rdc0re]

What's the input lag on your OLED sets? I'm using a 720p lcd tv from 2008 with 16ms but usually I game on a 1440p 144hz 4ms monitor.

That's pixel response time not latency. In best case scenario that monitor has 18ms input lag but probably higher. Some 2017 high-end TV models are just as quick as dedicated gaming monitors in terms of input lag.

[BuckoA51]

Bucko, did you ever crack open that expensive Lindy converter to see what chips it uses?

No, returned it. Still perusing the possibility of getting some kind of converter made though.

[nissling]

That's pixel response time not latency. In best case scenario that monitor has 18ms input lag but probably higher. Some 2017 high-end TV models are just as quick as dedicated gaming monitors in terms of input lag.

Just try the Leo Bodnar with a 144hz-monitor and you'll see how low the latency is. 4ms sounds perfectly reasonable actually.

[Xyga]

What's the input lag on your OLED sets? I'm using a 720p lcd tv from 2008 with 16ms but usually I game on a 1440p 144hz 4ms monitor.

That's pixel response time not latency. In best case scenario that monitor has 18ms input lag but probably higher. Some 2017 high-end TV models are just as quick as dedicated gaming monitors in terms of input lag.

Actually we don't know that here. 16ms and 4ms could be quoting either response times or actual lag figures.
Today people casually drop lag figures in milliseconds and there's no way to know if they're doing a mistake like confusing with response, or giving actual measurements they've made themselves or found somewhere in a review.
Many modern monitors have close to no input lag and most gaming models offer virtually zero, which means at the top of the screen/beginning of the frame. At 60Hz a monitor will draw the frame in 16,67ms and half that at 120 etc. Most reviewers (like Rtings) and people in discussions quote the lag at the middle of the screen/frame, which is the input + half the frame assuming 60Hz sample and hold. More serious monitors reviewers quote the top/beginning of the frame that naturally gives tighter reading, but a huge majority of the people who talk about display lag have yet to understand what's actualy being discussed and even just notice the discrepancies.

@nissling: yup, top-of-the line AHVA gaming monitors measure at about 4ms (top) and that's just at 60Hz and taking into account the faint response delay. At 120 and up they have virtually no measurable lag to speak of.

[Chocograph]

Asus 27" LED FreeSync MG279Q It's this one anyway.

[naz]

Hello,

Yesterday I bought my first oled tv, an lg 55b7 (OSSC is on the way). Right now I´m a bit worry regarding connecting it to the wifi, has there been cases where an OS updated has reduced the compatibility with the OSSC or added more input lag???

Another question, I keep reading that black bars (when playing on 4:3) might cause burning. This does not make sense to me because if the bars are black, then the pixels are off and can´t possible burn anything. Am I missing something???


Regards!


Edit: TV is on the 03.60.16 OS version and has an option to allow or deny automatic updates, so there shouldn´t be any troubles.

[Thomago]

if the bars are black, then the pixels are off and can´t possible burn anything. Am I missing something???

You are right, black bars can't possibly cause burn-in. However, everything else can, so you run the risk of getting increased OLED degradation in the middle of your screen, which will sooner or later (hopefully later) lead to obvious inhomgeneity.
Btw, that's why Plasmas usually had an option to make black bars grey.

[Xyga]

Btw, that's why Plasmas usually had an option to make black bars grey.

As do some video processors for convenience. I wonder if the OSSC coud do that too?

[TillDawn]

Hello,

Yesterday I bought my first oled tv, an lg 55b7 (OSSC is on the way). Right now I´m a bit worry regarding connecting it to the wifi, has there been cases where an OS updated has reduced the compatibility with the OSSC or added more input lag???

Another question, I keep reading that black bars (when playing on 4:3) might cause burning. This does not make sense to me because if the bars are black, then the pixels are off and can´t possible burn anything. Am I missing something???


Regards!


Edit: TV is on the 03.60.16 OS version and has an option to allow or deny automatic updates, so there shouldn´t be any troubles.

I have the same model and seem to remember that someone said that an update broke 5x on the OSSC. However, I always left the auto-update active and I am on the latest firmware; no problem so far with the OSSC.

Apart from that: congrats on the TV. The picture is insane (not only in combination with an OSSC), in my opinion. One of the best purchases I have made in the last years. I can highly recommend it, although it is not cheap.

[Triple Lei]

if the bars are black, then the pixels are off and can´t possible burn anything. Am I missing something???

You are right, black bars can't possibly cause burn-in. However, everything else can, so you run the risk of getting increased OLED degradation in the middle of your screen, which will sooner or later (hopefully later) lead to obvious inhomgeneity.
Btw, that's why Plasmas usually had an option to make black bars grey.

Huh, I didn't know that. I always thought that option in the DVDO Edge was such a dumb idea too.

Well, I guess gray pillarboxes could help me center the picture in some games with the OSSC...