Prelude to the Apocalypse

[Opus131]

So there's no argument about the degradation of blacks in the US. Cool - thanks for clearing that up.

How does adding that there's a degradation of whites in the US negate the fact there's a degradation of blacks in the US?

Either way, the argument was whether there were things in American society then that were superior to American society today, despite the existence of certain social ills or things that what were worse than society now in the main. I'd say there were.

[orange808]

“For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.”
-Charles Schumer

Nothing is going to change

[GaijinPunch]

How does adding that there's a degradation of whites in the US negate the fact there's a degradation of blacks in the US?

Why would you have an argument against A when the exact same thing holds true for B?

I'd say there were.

Cool.

[Opus131]

I never made an argument against anyone. The point i was making is society now isn't automatically superior to society then in every respect merely because we have corrected some of the ills of society then, and this was in response to your question about whether we wanted to set back the clock to the 50s, to which some of us answered that the 50s weren't all bad, and in fact they were actually better in various ways. And in order to make my point more cogent, i used the objective superiority of black culture then compared to black culture now as an example.

[Opus131]

whites are simply superior musicians

Speaking of white people and music, i got red pilled to leftists when i first started to encounter this kind of crap, way back before i was ever political:

http://www.cc.com/video-clips/i8vzpl/st ... ite-people

Really? White people do not come up with the good music? Nothing but polka and Gregorian Chant, with nothing in between?

I used to be a fan of the show Whose Line Is It Anyway and this guy was a regular there which is how i got exposed to this. And this is exactly the attitude that bred this contempt many of us have for the left. Whenever you say something about white people that would have been extremely racist if it were about black people, then there is a problem. "But white people rule everything!". Even if that were true (ask the white bum in the street whether he rules over anything), it doesn't change anything, because racism is racism.

And this video really encapsulates what has happened in this last campaign:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsBP2sbhjCA

This is how the left has behaved this past decades. Is it any wonder then that now they are meeting with such a growing backlash? SJWs didn't just come out of nowhere you know. This stuff has been long in the making.

[Lord Satori]

Should a thread be locked when it gets to the point that it's led by one person?

[GaijinPunch]

This is how the left has behaved this past decades.

And all the perfect little angels on the right...

[Blinge]

Should a thread be locked when it gets to the point that it's one person furiously beating off

Fixd

It's all the same crap to me. Dumb, low bro, decadent. I really don't get this type of music at all.

That's b/c you had an operation to remove the one artistic bone in your body, and spend your weekends trying to get over those crushes on your relatives.

Game, set and REKT

Just give in to sweet temptation Opus, gotta keep them bloodlines pure eh?

[EmperorIng]

The existence of certain social ills do not preclude a society being great in other respects. Conversely, the fact we have now "moved forward" from a certain point view doesn't mean we haven't regressed in many other ways.

For shits & giggles... what might those ways be?

Well I mean, this stuff is obvious: family dissolution is higher than it probably has been since the Depression or before, and lack of familial support can almost certainly correlate to rises in crime and gang affiliations in cities, and (but not limited to) drug abuse and suicide in less populated centers. Not to mention the surveillance state, declining civic engagement, declining religious communities, and so on. There was a decent article in the Atlantic not too long ago about how women's societies, which were once some of the most potent civil societies in the country, have steadily died off since the 50s. Likewise, male confraternities have seen their membership hollow out.

Essentially, despite the constant screeching of the loudest of loud college "SJWs" about equality and building a more loving society, we've also somehow chipped away at the primary instruments of social cohesion to a low point hereunto unseen in the American polity, with no "progress" made in substituting these things.

And by contrast "making America great again" and the concrete example of what that stands for is a warranted change?

Well that's a false equivalency. Or unfair contrast. Or something. I'm not exactly on board with Confederate pride (though I think this is a great issue for analysis and discussion; goes far beyond "southerners r racist lul"), or using "political correctness" as a deflection for just being a racist shithead. Or any other myriad ways DJT shows himself to be ignorant about everything outside of his own skull.

But that doesn't make bogus arguments for the forced legal recognition of "gender identity," or slave reparations, or declaring euthanasia a legal right (vs. a choice) as examples of "warranted change" and merely part of the "march of progress."

Liberals, probably thanks to feverish readings of Marx or Hegel, tend to trust in teleology more than anything else. Maybe it's because I got my history degree, but I am skeptical enough to believe that there is no "march" towards anything resembling utopia. It makes for irritating argumentation when your opponent believes that your views are merely out-of-date "dustbin of history" stuff.

Nothing is ever certain. Remember when the fall of the Soviet Union was declared as the "end of history" (actual phrase used) and the ultimate and unending triumph of liberal capitalism? That was only 25 years ago!!!

Gets my vote, the 50's was the peak of the American dream.

Largely because it was the most "redistributionist" era in our history, thanks to strong and widespread organized labor, a top federal tax rate of 90 percent, expansions of social programs, rolling back of corporate welfare, and huge investments in education and infrastructure, among other things. And that was under a Republican administration.

Though I'm sure there are a few here who will insist that all of that was just a coincidence, and that the real reason things were so great then is because it was socially acceptable to use racial slurs and pinch your secretary.

Though much of this is true, I think there's a certain historical perspective lost on both parties' idolization of the 50s and 60s: it was at that time when the rest of the industrialized world was reduced to a smoldering crater, leaving the United States as the last man standing. Accordingly, manufacturing boomed, wages were high because demand was high. The other economy of note, the USSR, was able to keep its citizens busy only because of its dual programs (or is it pogroms) of building empty cities in the middle of Siberia and employing citizens to ethnically cleanse nomad tribes out in the tundra.

Being the sole super-economy and its concomitant benefits worked for roughly a generation until the rest of the world recovered from being obliterated in a succession of disastrous total wars. Naturally with the rest of the world now doing quite fine, it's hard to find a method that would meaningfully restore those conditions - if those conditions weren't just a fluke of circumstance to being with.

but I agree with Opus that advocating for something different, just because it's different, is more often than not folly.
people saying "we need change" regardless of whether or not that change is worth considering

Trump voters must be the ultimate progressives.

They don't know what kind of change they've summoned - just change. Mystery change. I hear variations of this "we need change" line from people making 100K+ a year.

They might just have so much change that they'll grow sick of change. Believe me. I like to think of Trump voters in the Midwest, among other things, as lodging the ultimate protest vote (without thinking that Trump would actually be elected) - kinda like how system11 judged a close Remain win for Brexit a while back as the ideal outcome.

days and months renamed, streets renamed, and total governmental and societal overhaul.

Amusing or not side note about the re-re-renaming business: "Witness the politicization of a mountaintop".

Any good progressive will tell you that nothing is off-limits for being politicized (even if it doesn't need to be)! I usually abstract these particular "naming" issues too much to take a firm stance one side or the other - other than noting this case as a blatant attempt at reasserting proper "white" hegemony over the landscape. I just explain history, I don't make it!

[Burningvigor]

Oh god I felt like puking after watching this Media reaction to trump winning. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtJvYdX4GKM

These fuckwits are the ones brainwashing kids into being little cry baby libtards. I'm so annoyed because I use to believe in stupid media bullshit when I was younger too.


"Get your abortions now" "It's the end of the world!" I keep losing faith in humanity.


Oh and those who think there isn't a media bias just watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-FdtkdlKzI

Never trust the media.

Thanks for the correction. I rarely make that mistake...

[Lord Satori]

*there

[quash]

https://youtu.be/WQgE_jzIlBY

Looks like she's been cut off from the stem cell injections now that she's no longer worth the investment.

[GaijinPunch]

Well I mean, this stuff is obvious: family dissolution is higher than it probably has been since the Depression or before, and lack of familial support can almost certainly correlate to rises in crime and gang affiliations in cities, and (but not limited to) drug abuse and suicide in less populated centers. Not to mention the surveillance state, declining civic engagement, declining religious communities, and so on. There was a decent article in the Atlantic not too long ago about how women's societies, which were once some of the most potent civil societies in the country, have steadily died off since the 50s. Likewise, male confraternities have seen their membership hollow out.

Some fair points. However, there's a ton of shit that can be correlated to the rise in crime -- violence, anyway. But, crime is down compared to the 80's during the crack epidemic. Some cities just haven't fully recovered (Chicago, anyone?). I think to look at something as encompassing as crime, we have to look at a bigger picture. I'm not going to jump behind the surveillance state in the least, but I think that is a byproduct of technology, not social changes. I would actually argue that we're surveyed less (or can actually have an argument at all) with all of this shit happening now, as opposed to whether the technology was there during the cold war.

And by contrast "making America great again" and the concrete example of what that stands for is a warranted change?

Well that's a false equivalency. Or unfair contrast. Or something. I'm not exactly on board with Confederate pride (though I think this is a great issue for analysis and discussion; goes far beyond "southerners r racist lul"), or using "political correctness" as a deflection for just being a racist shithead. Or any other myriad ways DJT shows himself to be ignorant about everything outside of his own skull.

I was talking more about the numbers involved. Yes, there's a ton of social aspects, but employment and the economy in general (and as such, most people's attitudes about the future) are several fold better than when Obama first took office. Like... a complete turnaround. So what's not great about that? Why was it great before? Did any one person change that or is that just the way it goes in society?

[BryanM]

and as such, most people's attitudes about the future

Most people's attitude about the future is that it's going to be shit.

Median income for families has flatlined. Inflation continues at its happy steady pace. Healthcare costs still increase above inflation. Outsourcing and productivity ensures no savior will be coming from the private sector. Especially considering this is how the private sector envisions its version of utopia.

It's a fucking miracle Hillary did as well as she did with her campaign of "this is fine" and "it's my turn, you little fucks."



I am okay with the events that are unfolding currently.

[BryanM]

Even the dog has woken up to reality this year. Meritocratic capitalists should try doing so, as well.

[GaijinPunch]

I would imagine it would max at somewhere around 40% (people are generally pessimists). But look at that downward trend from 2009 onward... that seems pretty spot on considering the market took it up the ass, and it took until about 2012/13 for people's 401k's to get back up to close to where they were before. My statements were mainly pointed at the differences between the shit storm we were in compared to what we're in now. I know it's by no means perfect, but the stock market / job market / etc are in far better places. The first sign of that: people actually fucking hiring. Sign two: Nobody writing articles in major publications saying, "does the shitty economy have you down?" I know it's not all hams and plaque, but the rhetoric saying that Obama destroyed the US is just tired. The rhetoric that Trump will "fix it" (whatever it may be) is laughable.

[BryanM]

The downward trend there is actually a rebound from people optimistic about Barack Obama, realizing he isn't FDR or Bernie Sanders, and that things were going to remain shitty. I'll zoom a bit out so you can see how this metric has fluctuated over time.



It's true delusion has some influence on this number (the unity after 9-11 was a fucking joke), but it is an actual factor with how elections turn out. People have no hope, in a 2 to 1 ratio. They don't care about 401k's. Most of them don't have one or even know what they are.

The democratic party folded to an angry rutabaga that pretended to care about (some) people, which the Mi-Go known as Romney and the ghoul known as Clinton weren't able to do.

people are generally pessimists

As you can see, there are times when they actually feel good about things. They can tell if they're personally doing the same or worse from last year.

What's really incredible is if you look at this same question put to other countries like New Zealand, the result is basically the opposite. People there actually have fuckin' hope.

There's nothing innately defective in the people of the USA, aside from our shitty political spectrum that just let Stormfront get a foothold in the government.

[Burningvigor]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FtNbNOWta4

Nice to see brainwashing has a course in California public schools now. Glad my tax money goes into this....

But in all honesty, this is no different from a typical teacher preaching how the tolerant loving liberals are the Saints and the republicans are the evil that are out to get you. *sigh*

It really should be a crime for any teacher to push their political beliefs on to kids. Maybe we should just abolish public schools since no matter how much money you put in, the kids haven't been improving at all. Just the teachers and unions filling their fat pockets with tax payers money.

[Rob]

It really should be a crime for any teacher to push their political beliefs on to kids. Maybe we should just abolish public schools since no matter how much money you put in, the kids haven't been improving at all. Just the teachers and unions filling their fat pockets with tax payers money.

As your video says, it's an elective. Who cares? And you aren't in support of day prisons for children? Crazy as hell.

[BryanM]

Notable non-neocon (proven, because quash says so and he rolled his eyes on the internet) Donald Trump spends day with miscellaneous neo-cons and war criminals.

[Giest118]

So guys, how long 'til the death camps? Think Trump'll go for that in his first term, or will he wait on that one until his second term, when he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore?

[GaijinPunch]

The downward trend there is actually a rebound from people optimistic about Barack Obama, realizing he isn't FDR or Bernie Sanders, and that things were going to remain shitty. I'll zoom a bit out so you can see how this metric has fluctuated over time.

You say tomato. I remember all this.. people moaning the economy wasn't fixed like a year or so after. Nonetheless, he is finishing his 2nd term at what... 54% approval rating? That is pretty fucking high.

Note: I can't see the other graphic. imgur blocked at da job.

What's really incredible is if you look at this same question put to other countries like New Zealand, the result is basically the opposite. People there actually have fuckin' hope.

Only ever looked at polls in Japan (as I can relate). Abysmal answers to the same questions, and w/ good reason. They're still feeling the effects of their housing crash in the 90's. We've recovered from ours in 2008 and then some. All relative -- keep those chins up, people!

[Bananamatic]

where do I sign up for the right wing death squads?

[Mischief Maker]

So guys, how long 'til the death camps? Think Trump'll go for that in his first term, or will he wait on that one until his second term, when he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore?

I wonder if he'll overtake Bush jr's total vacation days logged?

(879 over 8 years, or about 110 vacation days annually. Nice work if you can steal it).

[Burningvigor]

So guys, how long 'til the death camps? Think Trump'll go for that in his first term, or will he wait on that one until his second term, when he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore?

I wonder if he'll overtake Bush jr's total vacation days logged?

(879 over 8 years, or about 110 vacation days annually. Nice work if you can steal it).

He said he's only going to be paid 1$ a year so eh. If he does, it'll be just on his dime.

Can you believe the media is even criticizing him for only taking 1 dollar a year as president? Man are they that much of a psycho? Also saying his lack of transparency by having dinner with his family without notifying or allowing the press to be there.

Yeah media keep acting like retards the american people are waking up to your corruption.

[BulletMagnet]

He said he's only going to be paid 1$ a year so eh. If he does, it'll be just on his dime.

I don't think who picks up the tab is even the main issue at hand here.

[GaijinPunch]

So guys, how long 'til the death camps? Think Trump'll go for that in his first term, or will he wait on that one until his second term, when he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore?

I wonder if he'll overtake Bush jr's total vacation days logged?

(879 over 8 years, or about 110 vacation days annually. Nice work if you can steal it).

He said he's only going to be paid 1$ a year so eh. If he does, it'll be just on his dime.

His true pay is not putting his businesses/assets into a blind trust, but having his kids "man the ship" for him. He can make about $400k in two seconds with that kind of conflict of interest.

[Stevens]

Just the teachers and unions filling their fat pockets with tax payers money.

I can't speak for the union end but you know most teachers make shit right?

[Skykid]

So guys, how long 'til the death camps? Think Trump'll go for that in his first term, or will he wait on that one until his second term, when he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore?

I wonder if he'll overtake Bush jr's total vacation days logged?

(879 over 8 years, or about 110 vacation days annually. Nice work if you can steal it).

Now watch this drive.

[quash]

Notable non-neocon (proven, because quash says so and he rolled his eyes on the internet) Donald Trump spends day with miscellaneous neo-cons and war criminals.

Well come on, it's not like there's Democrats lining up to work with him. He has to play the hand he's dealt. The media is already flipping shit over Bannon, he can't stuff his entire cabinet with non-establishment types.

Bernie would run into the same issue, and you know it.