Recommendations for a good scart to component box?

[neorichieb1971]

hdretrovision.com

I don't know why people keep buying converter boxes when someone have made cables ESPECIALLY to do that exact job.


They are out of stock but will get more in, but are currently building adapters for the Genesis cable which include PS1 and Saturn. A dreamcast component cable is in the works as well.


But yeah, keep on buying converter boxes because that makes much more sense.

[accaris]

hdretrovision.com

But yeah, keep on buying converter boxes because that makes much more sense.

If you want to do anything besides SNES and Genesis you want a transcoder. There's no ETA on HDRetrovision's adapters, or how much they'll cost.
At the end of the day, with HDRetrovision you'll probably spend the same amount of money and walk away with a proprietary solution with limited options for expansion and customization.

[bobrocks95]

I would reccomend he csy 2100. (Not the black box clone) It can be found easier on U.K. eBay than the US.

It comes pre calibrated out of the box and supports variable voltage and refresh rate. 120-230v 50/60

Mine costed a little bit (180 bucks used) and I had to solder my own pc cord inside of the euro power plug.

But after messing around with the 240p suite and my pots inside the knockoff (for weeks) I politely gave it away to someone I didn't know very well.

I think if I had a grey point calibration tool like they use on projectors and movie theaters I may able to overcome it. Until then I would advise staying away from the black box knockoff.

Also I stopped using my CRT and have been using the X MINI but it still looks great just not quite as sharp.

Reason being the 240p image has to be interger scaled anyways by your TV set coming from your component scaler so it defeats the purpose of component as it can never be fead native resolution from your component scaler like the XRGB can handle.

I have yet to try Marqs doubler but somehow slipped the cracks as an early adopter.

I really would reccomend the CSY for most mid era 4:3 crt sets and they generally support component and 240p progressive scan natively with no noticeable lag because of no need for your tvs scaling

Ouch, $180 seems awfully steep. I would think you could get another big name brand unit like a Kramer or an Audio Authority for less than that. Or the community-made board posted about recently. I've also heard about some slight warping at the top of the screen with even authentic CSY units- have you noticed this at all? It's like a dip down at one of the top corners.

hdretrovision.com

I don't know why people keep buying converter boxes when someone have made cables ESPECIALLY to do that exact job.


They are out of stock but will get more in, but are currently building adapters for the Genesis cable which include PS1 and Saturn. A dreamcast component cable is in the works as well.


But yeah, keep on buying converter boxes because that makes much more sense.

There's stuff "in the works" all the time. Call me when they have a cable that's actually out for every RGB/RGB-modable system, anything below that bar means you'd have to buy a converter at some point anyway. Add to that the fact that I've never found a decent RCA component switch since it was never a professional standard like DSub-15 or BNC RGB.

[Guspaz]

A SCART component box isn't going to directly handle every RGB console anyhow, you're going to need custom SCART cables for each one. HDR's approach of producing adapters for the cables is cheaper, if anything. Another batch is planned, with improvements for displays that have sync jitter issues, but that doesn't do any good for somebody who is looking for a solution right now. The HDR cables work great (I've got one of each), but there are also several affordable solutions available right now. The Shinybow is available brand new, and the Fusion box, for example.

[bobrocks95]

A SCART component box isn't going to directly handle every RGB console anyhow, you're going to need custom SCART cables for each one. HDR's approach of producing adapters for the cables is cheaper, if anything. Another batch is planned, with improvements for displays that have sync jitter issues, but that doesn't do any good for somebody who is looking for a solution right now. The HDR cables work great (I've got one of each), but there are also several affordable solutions available right now. The Shinybow is available brand new, and the Fusion box, for example.

I'm definitely rooting for them, they fill a hole in the market and seem to be providing a quality product. It's just very far from a complete solution right now, and as you've said, there are several solutions available and HDR doesn't offer enough cables for somebody looking right now. It's nowhere near close enough to say that buying a converter box doesn't make any sense.

[tjstogy]

The company that made (now discontinued) the real CSY 2100's is called "Cypress" and they are based in Taiwan. I spoke to an authorized Cypress dealer based in Australia who has about 10 left. The cost shipped to the US is $119 including tax and shipping (his discounted rate). His email is [email protected] if anyone is interested in buying a real one. Here is more info: http://www.cypconverters.com.au/video-p ... -2100.html

Beyond that- the Shinybow is less expensive and without any firm data showing one is better than the next it's tough to make the right call. I like the fact that the Shinybow has audio already installed- and for me that would be a necessity and would require a modification to the CSY 2100 to operate for my setup. Maybe someone can make a proper comparison, including the Fusion by the shmups member...

I would reccomend he csy 2100. (Not the black box clone) It can be found easier on U.K. eBay than the US.

It comes pre calibrated out of the box and supports variable voltage and refresh rate. 120-230v 50/60

Mine costed a little bit (180 bucks used) and I had to solder my own pc cord inside of the euro power plug.

[Shoryukev]

hdretrovision stuff

People have already mentioned that HDR haven't made cables available for the systems we are all using yet, but there's a different reason I went with a SCART to component box instead.

I have a 14" PVM and it only accepts RGB...no component. Since I've been using the PVM for awhile, I already own several SCART cables along with a BNC breakout cable. Now that my main gaming setup uses a large consumer CRT with component video input instead, I didn't want to start over from zero (and lose a few systems as previously mentioned). If my situation for gaming changes again, there's a much better chance that I will get better results using SCART down the road. Here's a couple scenarios;

1) I move and no longer have room for a CRT and have to go with a framemeister
2) I want to add arcade boards via a supergun
3) I am finally able to find an NEC XM29 monitor (I already own this cable anyways)

I commend HDR for coming up with a plug and play solution for high quality retro gaming on a CRT (and have told many friends to go buy their stuff), but for the enthusiast that is really into the nuts and bolts of everything it just isn't the best solution yet. One thing I will say positive about HDR's approach is that component video switchers are generally cheaper than SCART switches.

[SmokeMonster]

I've used the CSY-2100 clone (CVS-287) for years as my transcoder of choice, for when I can't enjoy my PVMs. It has zero video noise and looks stunning, depending of course on the capabilities of the TV it's connected to. I've done the common mods to mine, such as removing/bypassing the voltage regulator and adding audio in/out. I use a nice PSU, calibrated its colors, and I even recapped mine. I use fully shielded/grounded cables with all of my consoles, which is important for any of these devices.

That said, for most people the Fusion or Shinybow are much better choices since they're ready to go out of the box, and most importantly, have audio support. If i did it over again, I'd go with the Fusion, since it's exactly the kind of product I like to support.

Edit: Actually, after looking into the Fusion box a little more, I'm going to buy one.

[Hoagtech]

I've also heard about some slight warping at the top of the screen with even authentic CSY units- have you noticed this at all? It's like a dip down at one of the top corners.

No I haven't. Only crawling dots and border colors on certain consoles because of the overscan material depending on the system.

I gave up on the knockoff after feeling satisfied with pot adjustments. Then I fired the game up side by side to a pc monitor running the same game in an emulator and was disgusted by what I thought was "good".

The CSY looked just like my lcd monitor on my lcd tv out of box. It was worth it at the time.

[SmokeMonster]

Yeah, any of these devices will look poor on an lcd since they rely on the TV'S built-in scaler. They should be used to connect scart rgb to CRTs with component inputs, if quality is desired. Crawling dots are scaler artifacts probably caused by the lcd's scaler. On CRTs, the CSY clone is perfect, but I agree that it looks terrible plugged in to lcds. They simply aren't capable of scaling 240p properly.

[Fusion916]

Hey SmokeMonster I replied to your PM however for some reason at least the messages says its stuck in my outbox, did you get it?

[d0s]

hdretrovision.com

I don't know why people keep buying converter boxes when someone have made cables ESPECIALLY to do that exact job.


They are out of stock but will get more in, but are currently building adapters for the Genesis cable which include PS1 and Saturn. A dreamcast component cable is in the works as well.


But yeah, keep on buying converter boxes because that makes much more sense.

Do you understand the value of having a box that can turn ANY 240/480 RGB signal into YUV? Versus spending $55 per cable? If no SCART cable exists for whatever thing I want to use it with (pretty unlikely) I can build one easily and cheaply. This isn't the first forum I've seen someone come in talking up these cables when people are talking about converter boxes with this exact kind of confrontational attitude/argument and I'm starting to wonder...

[FinalBaton]

Do you understand the value of having a box that can turn ANY 240/480 RGB signal into YUV? Versus spending $55 per cable? If no SCART cable exists for whatever thing I want to use it with (pretty unlikely) I can build one easily and cheaply. This isn't the first forum I've seen someone come in talking up these cables when people are talking about converter boxes with this exact kind of confrontational attitude/argument and I'm starting to wonder...

Same. I find that behaviour very odd...
It's like : if you like their cables that's fine, but don't look down on my setup (RGB to YUV converter) and shit on it. Why would you even do that? This just baffles me

A converter box is a good, versatile solution that definitely has it's advantages.

[accaris]

This is an out-of-the-box phone picture of the Shinybow connected to an iScan Pro. Looks great to me, colors look natural, maybe a little brightness tweaking on the TV and it's good to go.

[FinalBaton]

accaris, it looks really nice I think!

[mvsfan]

theres 2 points on the bottom of the board that are almost right next to each other that you can connect for csync.

Its literally less than an inch of wire you need.

theres no need to add a bunch of wire on a 1-chip-03 going from the multiout to the video encoder.



for component, I used to reccomend the csy2100 clones for scart to component but not anymore.

Viletims NESRGB component add-on board Looks WAY better. you can use it in some systems besides the NES/2600 RGB systems.

It works great in the snes. you just need to grab luma off of the multiout or video encoder.

[holaplaneta]

for component, I used to reccomend the csy2100 clones for scart to component but not anymore.

What do you recommend now for SCART to Component converters?

[tjstogy]

I wish someone would compare actual data on these scart to component boxes, and vs component out on the consoles... there must be a "best" way to play these systems on a consumer grade tv thru component.

[SmokeMonster]

Even if someone did such comparisons, they wouldn't be of much use. The scart-to-component boxes are transcoders, that simply pass an RGB signal to component without scaling or filters, thus outputting the same resolution as the source. Their effectiveness relies entirely on the quality of your display's built-in scaler. If your TV handles 240p poorly, then even a 100% perfect component 240p signal will look poor. If however it's 240p component passed to a nice 240p CRT, it can look stunning.

[mvsfan]

The csy2100 clones come poorly adjusted. the colors arent right when you get them. i found that out later after spending a lot of time adjusting it when i first got it.

I decided to try a component add on board one day, for a NESRGB i built, and i realized how much better it looked than the same exact nes running through scart to the csy2100 clone. color is better and more defined. and its a bit clearer.

as far as reccomending other scart to component boxes, I dont have any experience with them.

I will say though that i am happy with my GBS8200 Scart to VGA converter.
It does a decent job getting old consoles working on Flatscreens that have a VGA port, when they dont support 240p.

I would however like to find a way to get it to automatically default to RGBS when i power it up. I dont use any of the other modes.

I like to cut power to it when im not using it because the board just sits on my bench i dont have a case for it yet.

and every time i turn it on, its in a mode that my TV doesnt support.

odd enough, that mode causes the TV to turn itself off unless i change it first.

[Einzelherz]

I picked up a Shinybow SB-2840 last week and it's pretty great. I haven't color checked it yet with my colorimeter but by eye it is definitely better? More consistent than the clones on my hd plasma.

[SmokeMonster]

Yes, you definitely have to open up the 2100 clones and calibrate their color. It's a one time adjustment though. I never experienced any signal noise with mine. I would definitely expect Tim's board to be of better quality though, since it's designed specifically for the application. I wish we had nice component transcoder options like Tim's for every console.

In terms of recommended Scart RGB-to-component transcoder boxes, the best performance-to-price option for most people would be the Fusion Box or Shinybow, since they're calibrated and ready to use.

[Hoagtech]

I picked up a Shinybow SB-2840 last week and it's pretty great. I haven't color checked it yet with my colorimeter but by eye it is definitely better? More consistent than the clones on my hd plasma.

How do you like the shinybow?

I was hoping there is a better digital output option available so I could convert to 1080p output through the Micro.

But I always wondered how the SB handled lag and scroll

[orange808]

I picked up a Shinybow SB-2840 last week and it's pretty great. I haven't color checked it yet with my colorimeter but by eye it is definitely better? More consistent than the clones on my hd plasma.

How do you like the shinybow?

I was hoping there is a better digital output option available so I could convert to 1080p output through the Micro.

But I always wondered how the SB handled lag and scroll

The Shinybow is very nice. It outputs the signal it receives and there's no frame rate conversion that could cause studdering. Both the NES and SNES work just fine.

The output is bright and pleasing to the eye. We don't have native SCART ports here in the states, so seeing RGB on a consumer television here is a revelation for most people.

In practice, the output from the Shinybow looks every bit as good as chaining SCART through an Extron RGB and through the FC-14. (The Shinybow does not provide the image adjustments that the Extrom RGB provides, but you don't need them.)

Highly recommended.

[tjstogy]

What would be the proper method to test one of these transcoders to determine if the input is the same as the output in terms of proper color?

Sure they all work, but they aren't all perfect. We obsess over a ton of things in this community and this one seems to be a pretty big oversight.

[FinalBaton]

What would be the proper method to test one of these transcoders to determine if the input is the same as the output in terms of proper color?

Sure they all work, but they aren't all perfect. We obsess over a ton of things in this community and this one seems to be a pretty big oversight.

Agreed. I also hope someone will do some rigorous testing on those

[tjstogy]

Whomever volunteers to test these using a colorimeter, etc... I think fusion should lend one of his boxes to test. Saying this because I wouldn't want the cost of these units to deter someone well equipped from proper testing. I'm sure someone would lend their shinybow, csy, etc for a short test to help the community as well (id hope). I certainly would if I owned one...

[Einzelherz]

What would be the proper method to test one of these transcoders to determine if the input is the same as the output in terms of proper color?

Sure they all work, but they aren't all perfect. We obsess over a ton of things in this community and this one seems to be a pretty big oversight.

The only way to get a closest possible test is to have a system that can output both signals, which means a PS2. Sadly there is no test suite for the PS2 yet.

The way I have compared (and calibrated my CSY clone) in the past was RGB via Dreamcast vs Component via Wii. That's how I intended to check the Shinybow.

But in reality, we're mostly dealing with NTSC so you're going to have more variation between two screens than you will between the transcoded signals.

[orange808]

I think you can also put some faith in where some information comes from. For instance, the Shinybow appears to have passed Guspaz's eye test. That's not an easy thing to do.

[Guspaz]

To be honest, I'm not necessarily the best judge of that. The resulting images looked normal to me, but I didn't do an A/B comparison or anything. I would suggest that such a thing would still be worth doing.