Where did the concept of 1cc as a game philosophy originate?

[EmperorIng]

Don't forget that older games often had no continues at all. So it was 1CC or bust.

So i'm curious why they were added then? I mean I get that the developer wanted the player to be able to continue further to see parts of the game but it seems like the continue really messed with the perception of these games to people who didn't take a closer look.

For instance, me and a friend got super into Geometry Wars one summer and we played non-stop trying to one-up each others score. I think since this game doesn't let you continue it immediately drives this sense of finality to your score that anyone can understand.

Maybe I'm just nitpicking here but it seems to me like this one major reason for the misconception of the genre at large. The question is, though, is it wrong to blame the developers for not foreseeing this misconception pitfall? Or is it just easier for us to look at it in hindsight ala Hindsight is 20/20

They were added because most players, even back then, cared more about seeing the end of the game than actually performing well in the game. This became very much the case when you shift from games that are basically endless to games that have structures and stages. It's a natural outgrowth of the development of video games.

[Skykid]

I'm totally convinced the concept of continuing is as simple as generating more profit. It solves no other meaningful purpose.

[emphatic]

I'm totally convinced the concept of continuing is as simple as generating more profit. It solves no other meaningful purpose.

Tecmo even added a buy-in option for Rygar to "reduce lines to the machine". You'd start a 1P game, add more coins and a second player would be able to join at any time (when P1 would lose a life, as it's an alternating two player game). For Pinball machines, a second player can join as long as the first ball is in play.

Continues were used by some players back in the day to explore the end of the game.

[DestroyTheCore]

I actually feel bad for Ebi-Cen. 90% of the customers are hardcore players according to the owner, so the profit must diminish as these players improve.

[Iori Branford]

Going for high score is one reason.
Another thing is that arcade games aren't balanced for the free and infinite continues in MAME and in later arcade-to-home ports. Specifically there's no in-game penalty for continuing, because they probably figured having to pay money for the continue was enough. Often there's even a big boost like Max Power or clear all enemies to lure that next coin. So when they're free, they're effectively cheats for infinite lives and powerups, avoided by serious players seeking the original challenge of the game.

[ACSeraph]

I actually feel bad for Ebi-Cen. 90% of the customers are hardcore players according to the owner, so the profit must diminish as these players improve.

I dunno, It's probably better in the long run, since you know they will play credit after credit and keep coming back. Even though casuals are losing their 100yen every two minutes, they also won't still be playing the game a week later.

[DEL]

In the late 70s and 80s it was simply necessary to 1CC, to get the most out of the few coins in your pocket.
(I'm only repeating what other people here have already said).

[Jeneki]

I'm pretty sure adding more coins to continue predates having a game ending. Stuff like Lunar Lander, for example, where there's no ending but you can buy more fuel at any time.

[professor ganson]

Do the earliest arcade shooters like Space Invaders have an ending or do they loop indefinitely?

[Hagane]

Creditfeeding is simply missing the point of an arcade game. Arcade games are designed as a series of execution driven puzzles that you must solve. If you simply buy your way through you are missing most of what the developers put in the game.

By the way, for some reason 1CCs have some sort of hardcore mystical aura when in fact getting an 1CC generally requires less time than clearing your typical modern AAA game. Getting rid of that idea would do a lot of good to arcade games.

[Special World]

By the way, for some reason 1CCs have some sort of hardcore mystical aura when in fact getting an 1CC generally requires less time than clearing your typical modern AAA game.

Maybe for you, buddy.

[Pretas]

Toaplan removed checkpoints and added 2P cooperative play to Kyuukyoku Tiger when it was localized as Twin Cobra, specifically to cater to the "somewhat drunken fashion" in which most American arcade-goers played when compared to the Japanese.

[Hagane]

By the way, for some reason 1CCs have some sort of hardcore mystical aura when in fact getting an 1CC generally requires less time than clearing your typical modern AAA game.

Maybe for you, buddy.

For anyone, as long as they are willing to put their brain to use.

[ACSeraph]

^Unfortunately most people aren't playing games to challenge their minds. Even if they understood the "right" way to play arcade games they still wouldn't.

1CC's are respected because of the work, thought, and ability involved, not the time sink.

[Squire Grooktook]

Arcade games are designed as a series of execution driven puzzles that you must solve.

And (when rng is involved) reflex/improv challenges. Don't forget the best possible thing that can be programmed into any action game.

By the way, for some reason 1CCs have some sort of hardcore mystical aura when in fact getting an 1CC generally requires less time than clearing your typical modern AAA game. Getting rid of that idea would do a lot of good to arcade games.

It has taken me 30+ hours to get to just the last stage of some shmups on one credit (and that was with routes, planning, and "putting my brain to use"). Unless you're talking about epic rpg's with ten billion side quests or MMO's, than I find this claim dubious. Especially when survival difficulty (and individual player skill) can vastly vary between examples.

Also that "mystical hardcore aura" is probably less about time and more about nerves and consistency. There's a big difference between:

-a relatively difficult execution challenge in Super Meatboy or whatever that can only sets you back a few seconds and can be attempted again and again in your sleep until you clear it on luck, with nothing of value lost.

And

-A moderately difficult series of execution challenges stretched out over 30 minutes or more, with complete reset to the beginning if you fail even one.

It's much, much, much more stressful (and exciting, hence the fun factor) to clear a long ass gauntlet of difficult challenges. That's why 1cc's will always have that "mystical hardcore aura". They punish you for failure, and punishment is almost always "hardcore" and seen as a big no-no for games attempting to reach mass appeal (with some exceptions). They will always be nerve wracking and intimidating, and that's because they were designed that way.

[Hagane]

For most casuals a 1CC is a matter of spending time, not thought or ability. The requirements for a basic 1CC are attainable for anyone for less time that what you would spend grinding on a mindless RPG - but the suppossed harcoredness of arcade games puts people away from them.

Squire: Save for a few genuinely hard games that are very tough form the start (something like a Futari Ultra), most arcade games are very doable once you get some basic info. Without that info, most people get a wrong impression on these games and believe they require much more than they actually do.

WIth modern mainsteam gaming being so braindead, the harderst part about clearing arcade games when you are a beginner is getting the right mindset to deal with them. I know because I've been there not too far ago, I'm no super hardcore player and I can clear games without tearing my hair apart.

[Squire Grooktook]

Squire: Save for a few genuinely hard games that are very tough form the start (something like a Futari Ultra), most arcade games are very doable once you get some basic info. Without that info, most people get a wrong impression on these games and believe they require much more than they actually do.

That is true. They are definitely not unattainable for most gamers who I would consider of an "average" skill level. That being said, keep in mind it's very relative due to differences in fundamental skill for many players: Even using the correct routes and strategies, not having practiced and built up fundamental skills for games in general can result in the most basic things being more inconsistent and time consuming. I can say this from experience, and for other genres as well.

And again, the need for consistency at all is something that puts arcade games fundamentally above almost all other genres of games in terms of completion challenge IMHO. Even an "easy" 1cc like Contra 1 Nes is above almost everything "consolized" like Mega Man or Dark Souls due to the fact that you need to actually execute a series of challenges in a row instead of a bite sized retry-able segment. I don't know if that would make it longer (probably not for Dark Souls, but I could definitely see it for most Mega Man titles), but I understand the trepidation on the part of newer players.

For most casuals a 1CC is a matter of spending time, not thought or ability. The requirements for a basic 1CC are attainable for anyone for less time that what you would spend grinding on a mindless RPG - but the suppossed harcoredness of arcade games puts people away from them.

While I can agree they aren't as time consuming as rpg's (which are what, 80-100+ hours), I'd say most 1cc's are longer than the 3-5 hour joyrides that most people think of when they sneeringly talk about AAA joyrides. Most shmups generally take me at least 10 hours or so, though I do tend to aim for my level of incompetence when choosing a game to set my sights on.

[Special World]

I play scrolling shooters all the time, and I'd have an incredibly hard time clearing anything harder than Futari Black Original in under 40 hours. I would have to be specifically searching for easy 1CCs to make that sort of progress. Skill level is not an absolute given, not even for somebody like myself who has been playing shmups for years and videogames for practically my whole life. If you take somebody who hasn't developed any shooter skills and ask them to 1CC Dodonpachi, Crimzon Clover, or Mars Matrix, and they're not going to be able to do it no matter how much information you have them absorb.

[EmperorIng]

Toaplan removed checkpoints and added 2P cooperative play to Kyuukyoku Tiger when it was localized as Twin Cobra, specifically to cater to the "somewhat drunken fashion" in which most American arcade-goers played when compared to the Japanese.

These actions also drastically improved the game as well. These improvements were taken a step further when Raiden came along and blew Twin Cobra out of the water. Progression is good when it trims off the fat.

[Blinge]

Toaplan removed checkpoints and added 2P cooperative play to Kyuukyoku Tiger when it was localized as Twin Cobra, specifically to cater to the "somewhat drunken fashion" in which most American arcade-goers played when compared to the Japanese.

"somewhat drunken fashion"

[Lord Satori]

It came from scrubs who wanted to play the entire game without spending more than one quarter because their real sticklers with money. Scoring high was only a perk.

[mastermx]

If you take somebody who hasn't developed any shooter skills and ask them to 1CC Dodonpachi, Crimzon Clover, or Mars Matrix, and they're not going to be able to do it no matter how much information you have them absorb.

This. Clearing a shmup takes longer than finishing an Rpg. I'm talking about shmups like CCWI, Ikaruga, DOJ, Ketsui. Shmups are a huge time sink. But that is a good thing. You've paid for something, might as well be enjoyable for a long time.

[Jeneki]

I would say the length of time to 1cc depends heavily on your style of play. Someone who plays one credit from start to finish, always starting over at the end of each credit, is going to take longer than someone using savestates to concentrate their time on just the problematic sections.

Over the last month I've been learning Pulstar veeeeeery slowly, by starting over each credit. From the stage 2 boss and onward, each new section has another "must know what not to do" moment and checkpoint recovery is so brutal is may as well be a 1-life game. So I get to learn the game in tiny little ten-second clumps that I might get to see on each play. Now, if I were to jump off the MVS and onto MAME, saving at each part so I can just play that part until I get it right, it would likely speed things up quite a bit.

[Despatche]

oh hey totally missed this topic. this post was meant to be longer but whatever

Maybe I'm just nitpicking here but it seems to me like this one major reason for the misconception of the genre at large. The question is, though, is it wrong to blame the developers for not foreseeing this misconception pitfall? Or is it just easier for us to look at it in hindsight ala Hindsight is 20/20

sadly people put up a huge wall between games like geometry wars and games that give the illusion of "progression" (stage-based). if there's a sense of progression, they will adamantly demand to see that progression... and then they will never touch the game again, because they never realize that the progression isn't the point. people have been brainwashed to believe that there are no correct ways to play any given game, when there very much so are; when you attempt to tell this to them, they will then say that they prefer the status quo

i maintain that the only way to solve this is to somehow reintroduce these underlying concepts altogether... put a big ranking button right in the main menu, put a big tutorial/manual button in that same menu that goes into length about scoring and makes clear how important it is to overall gameplay, remove continues altogether and direct people to an excellent stage select whenever they game over (it's the same thing for those who care too), so on and so forth. ikaruga and newer touhou come so close to all of this

I play scrolling shooters all the time, and I'd have an incredibly hard time clearing anything harder than Futari Black Original in under 40 hours. I would have to be specifically searching for easy 1CCs to make that sort of progress. Skill level is not an absolute given, not even for somebody like myself who has been playing shmups for years and videogames for practically my whole life. If you take somebody who hasn't developed any shooter skills and ask them to 1CC Dodonpachi, Crimzon Clover, or Mars Matrix, and they're not going to be able to do it no matter how much information you have them absorb.

most "shooter skills" are actually entirely driven by mindset, they aren't physical skills. provided you're actually approaching ddp, cc, or mm as games and not as the quasi-experiences and time wasters that most people see them as, these are skills that jump out at you as you learn and play

this goes beyond shmups. what needs to happen is that people need to completely rethink what "game" means, and whether it's really a good idea to have two very different types of entertainment compete with each other and be given the same term

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I've seen some arcade games that had a continue screen appear like on Bally/Disney's Tron upright & even on Namco's Dig Dug upright...this was back in 1982. So yes, the continue screen option was available to be used at the discretion of the arcade operator/owner to keep bringing in the money if it was selectable via dip-switch setting during the Golden Age of Arcades era (the early 1980s). The grizzled early '80s arcade gamers already know about this little known arcade factoid.

On the 20th Anniversary Edition of Galaga/Ms. Pac-Man Jamma PCB, if you continued, your score remained intact & wouldn't revert back to zero.

It's possible/doable to 1CC a game of Atari Games' Klax in about two to two & a half hours (with the appropriate warping, of course) but that's easier said than done due to the randomness of the colored tiles that the CPU throws at you. Not to mention the law of diminishing returns of trying to attempt a serious 1CC session & messing up big time in the process (but if you're "in the zone," that issue won't matter anyways). It's the "Fast Tile Waves" that you have to complete quickly as possible or end up running out of room because of a random incorrect colored tile messing up a potential Klax configuration -- they certainly do keep you on your toes (not to mention a typical Klax 1CC session is longer than many arcade shmup 1CCs easily including the Sega ST-V RSG arcade port 1CC as well).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[pegboy]

I pretty much figured out the "concept" of a 1CC on my own, without even realizing it was a thing. I remember playing Gradius V and the longer you play it the more continues you unlock. Now I was like, wtf is this, I'm not really "beating" the game if I have infinite continues and can't possibly lose. Anyone could sit there for an hour and "beat" Gradius V this way, dying 1000 times and you still "beat it". I thought it was a joke.

This led me to try and beat the game on the default number of continues, and then, eventually without continuing at all. I lurked this forum for a long time and realized the "real way" to play these games and haven't looked back.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Toaplan removed checkpoints and added 2P cooperative play to Kyuukyoku Tiger when it was localized as Twin Cobra, specifically to cater to the "somewhat drunken fashion" in which most American arcade-goers played when compared to the Japanese.

These actions also drastically improved the game as well. These improvements were taken a step further when Raiden came along and blew Twin Cobra out of the water. Progression is good when it trims off the fat.

It was quite something to play doubles on a Taito manufactured Twin Cobra Jamma PCB at the local arcades back in 1987. Trying it out for the first time back then, the difficulty factor was quite high but the continue screen enticed me to insert more tokens to see what further stages awaited my friend & I. Of course, given the fickle nature of arcade shmups during that particular Silver Age of Arcades era, TC didn't stay inside the generic Dynamo cab for very long before being converted into another different game.

Even Konami's A-Jax which made a limited appearance at American arcades in 1987 as well, it featured a robust arcade operator's screen options including built-in support to run inside an existing old-school arcade cocktail table styled cab if so desired (with the game screen being flipped 180 degrees for both player 1 & 2 if playing alternating turns if playing doubles on it).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[FerociousSwan]

I think offering achievements for a 1CC and/or specific scoring goals is the one of the few ways to motivate console players enough that they'll try.

This is exactly how I got into the 1CC thing, or at least attempting it!
One of the few positives that came out of achievement hunting for me, I know a few others who were converted because of this too ... Before that I never even knew games could be completed on 1 credit, such as the Metal Slugs and the DonPachi's for example!

[BryanM]

The cruelest is when you get to the final stage and, suddenly, it doesn't let you continue any longer. What does the dragon in Rastan look like? I have no idea. Can't practice that stage when you have to grind through the entire game just to begin to learn it.

[ratikal]

I pretty much figured out the "concept" of a 1CC on my own, without even realizing it was a thing. I remember playing Gradius V and the longer you play it the more continues you unlock. Now I was like, wtf is this, I'm not really "beating" the game if I have infinite continues and can't possibly lose. Anyone could sit there for an hour and "beat" Gradius V this way, dying 1000 times and you still "beat it". I thought it was a joke.

This led me to try and beat the game on the default number of continues, and then, eventually without continuing at all. I lurked this forum for a long time and realized the "real way" to play these games and haven't looked back.

I learned the concept similar as you did. I got Gunstar Heroes on the Wii Virtual Console and noticed my score went down to 0 whenever I had to continue. So I started playing in a way that would get me a 1cc.