Milestone hate?

[Kollision]

heresy, heresy everywhere!!!!

[stryc9]

Milestone fan here. I like all their games except Chaos field. And that fighting game with princesses in it.

Yep, it's all about the scoring in these games, if their systems don't appeal to you then it's time to move on to something else. Personally I find them quite addictive, especially the Radilgy series (I think Noa is my favourite, and I like Classic mode on Massive as well).

I like the antiseptic aesthetic in Milestone's shooters, with Karous and Illvelo probably best visually. The soundtracks are off-kilter and suit the atmosphere nicely.

These are unusual games, and ones I wouldn't have thought would have grabbed me particularly, but here we are.

[qmish]

Yeah, their weakest game (chaos field) has their best soundtrack. Irony

[Kollision]

am I alone in preferring Chaos Field over all others?

[Cagar]

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[Squire Grooktook]

"Dull", "not fun", and "boring" are not valid reasons to dislike like a game, because they are the end results of what causes you to not like a game, not the causes themselves. You might find a game dull because it's too static or too repetitive, but just saying it's dull without explanation doesn't actually mean or communicate anything of value besides "I don't like it". You're essentially saying "I don't like it because I dislike it".

The question is, what makes the game's dull or not fun? StrikersGuy could only say "the scoring is bland", but never actually explained why it's bland or what makes it feel bland or even what bland means to him in the context of an stg. In fact, I've yet to see a detailed argument from anyone criticizing these games.

I think the Kimura thing was a joke also.

[pestro87]

am I alone in preferring Chaos Field over all others?

I like Chaos Field a lot actually (although, I wouldn't say that I like it more than some of their other offerings). I find the game to be refreshingly different with great scoring mechanics! The boss milking in particular is the highlight of the game for me.

[Kollision]

Maybe that's why I like it so much too.
It's different, in fact very different from pretty much anything out there.
And dat music. <3

[Cagar]

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[M.Knight]

am I alone in preferring Chaos Field over all others?

I can't say I like Chaos Field more than Radirgy, Illvelo or Karous, but I still enjoy it. Because of the focus on bosses, it is only after I tried to properly chain them that I started to become fond of it.
On top of that, as there are no popcorn enemies (Original mode notwithstanding), the weapons' destructive power is not as exciting as in the other Milestone games who have this immediate appeal.

Come to think of it, even if you ditch the scoring and all that, one of the things I like in Milestone games is that you have focused/close-range weapons that make the destruction of enemies a more involving process. You don't stay at the bottom of the screen keeping your finger on the trigger until bullet sprayer #31337 who may not even be in your field of vision disappears, you actually move up to its face and slash it, or (in Illvelo) accurately position your modules on top of it before unleashing your fire.
This aspect is a bit lacking in Chaos Field so that's why it is defintely more enjoyable if you go for score. I mean, even more than other Milestone shmups IMO.

Oh, and CF's soundtrack is really ace. Coccus and Human's Figure and my personal highlights, though Back in to the machine is closely behind. That latter track would have been better IMO without the slower-paced part, which is why I prefer its Non-stop Mix.

[Squire Grooktook]

"Dull", "not fun", and "boring" are not valid reasons to dislike like a game, because they are the end results of what causes you to not like a game, not the causes themselves. You might find a game dull because it's too static or too repetitive, but just saying it's dull without explanation doesn't actually mean or communicate anything of value besides "I don't like it". You're essentially saying "I don't like it because I dislike it".

The question is, what makes the game's dull or not fun? StrikersGuy could only say "the scoring is bland", but never actually explained why it's bland or what makes it feel bland or even what bland means to him in the context of an stg. In fact, I've yet to see a detailed argument from anyone criticizing these games.

I think the Kimura thing was a joke also.

It doesn't matter what the underlying reasons behind the "not fun" are, it's still just as valid even if it's not accurate. Many people can't even come up with why they feel that way about things, heck, even I can't in some scenarios.

And it certainly isn't "random"

It's not valid in terms of discussion or argument though. You can dislike it for whatever reason you want, random or not, but it makes for a poor and boring discussion to just say "it's bad because it's so bad and it sucks".

[d0s]

"Dull", "not fun", and "boring" are not valid reasons to dislike like a game,

Come on man I was with you for a lot of the discussion in the SDOJ thread but these are totally valid reasons to personally not like a game. I just think people shouldn't be dicks about stuff they don't like, or be dicks to people who like something they don't, but saying "I'm not into this, I find it dull" with no assholeishness/trolling implied is totally fine.

[qmish]

Calling Radirgy's music "bland" hurts my feeling, that's it!

[Squire Grooktook]

"Dull", "not fun", and "boring" are not valid reasons to dislike like a game,

Come on man I was with you for a lot of the discussion in the SDOJ thread but these are totally valid reasons to personally not like a game.

Maybe I should rephrase that: it's not a valid criticism, and thus makes for a dull, not fun, and boring discussion .

[d0s]

"Dull", "not fun", and "boring" are not valid reasons to dislike like a game,

Come on man I was with you for a lot of the discussion in the SDOJ thread but these are totally valid reasons to personally not like a game.

Maybe I should rephrase that: it's not a valid criticism, and thus makes for a dull, not fun, and boring discussion .

OK yeah I guess I'm with you there, I just think if the intent isn't like... to antagonize people it's OK to post opinions like that on a forum where we're not exactly writing dissertations on these games

[Squire Grooktook]

Yeah. I'm fine with friendly and respectful discussion. Even random "I like"/"I don't like" votes are fine if delivered maturely. If you act like a kid about it though, you're gonna get called on it. Fact of life.

[Cagar]

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[Squire Grooktook]

You cannot treat opinions you disagree with as 'non-valid',

I know, and if I said as much earlier, it was a miscommunication. An opinion can be based on factually incorrect information though (ie "the stage 3 boss has a safe spot where you can sit completely still for the entire fight" "no it doesn't, you're thinking of the sequel dumbass"). Otherwise, in the realm of feelings and preferences, any video game preference is as valid as any other.

But if you're going to be a troll about it, you're gonna get called on the fact that you can't say or verbalize anything insightful or communicative on the subject.

"I find the game feels like shit" - fair enough. Would be nice if we learned why, but it's fine still. No problem.

"the game is shit" (implied objectivity) - ah okay, mr. smartypants. What makes it shit? Please enlighten us. Oh you can't? Alright then, I guess that in the absence of proof your feelings are just as valid as mine and the game is not inherently "shit".

I know you've got a thing about subjectivity right now, but just let it go. I've acknowledged and said many times that taste in games are subjective and whatever you like is fine. But at the same time, I see nothing wrong with putting trolls under the spotlight.

You know what would be even more poor and boring discussion? One where people don't even say anything unless they're sperglords willing to dig deep in the subject.

Ah, so you think an entire thread of this would be interesting or fun?

Person 1: "I like game"
Person 2: "I hate game xd"
Person 3: "I love game"
Person 4: "I like game lol"
Person 5: "I like game"
Person 6: "I don't like game"
/thread

I think that would be incredibly boring. Wouldn't go to a forum if discussions would be like that. That's not even a discussion, that's a poll.

IMO, you don't have to be a "sperglord" but to be fruitful and entertaining to most people you at least need to have a willingness to try and communicate and converse your feelings with someone. If you're just going to be a bad troll, and say something is shit to rile people up (repeatedly, across multiple threads!), you're just shitting up the thread. And you're gonna get called on it. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

[Cagar]

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[Squire Grooktook]

"the game is shit" (implied objectivity) - ah okay, mr. smartypants. What makes it shit? Please enlighten us. Oh you can't? Alright then, I guess that in the absence of proof your feelings are just as valid as mine and the game is not inherently "shit".

There is no implied objectivity. The whole thing is subjective, you should be smart enough to understand that whenever someone says that "a game is shit", he isn't making a 'full logical argument', but just a statement from his perspective.

That's not always true though! Plenty of people here believe that games are objective and completely quantifiable (I've had several arguments on this topic with Skykid already). In fact, a few times I've seen certain people telling others that they outright shouldn't enjoy certain games, or that they shouldn't play them in a certain way. In that kind of atmosphere, it's not hard to mistake someone's intentions with a post.

Also, the reason I might assume someone believes their opinion to be more then a taste is because of context and tone. When someone takes a trollish, consescending tone, the chances increase that they think there's something inherently wrong with what they are mocking. When they bring it up 5 times in a row, the chances increase further. When it gets to that, they're starting to get annoying and it's time to put them in the interrogation chair

Of course, if you remember, Strikers and I came to an understanding and acknowledged eachother. So there's nothing more to worry about on that topic.

[NTSC-J]

Squire, my heart goes out to any girl that tries to break up with you.

[Squire Grooktook]

As if anyone would ever want to break up with me

But yeah, I probably really overdid it here. I'll be dropping this one.

[qmish]

You know what's ugly? Deathsmiles graphics, while having some lovable designs though.

[Van_Artic]

i love milestone games tbh
colorful, music hits me in the right spots and not too hard
if sakura flamingo archives was treated better i woulda bought it

[Kollision]

if sakura flamingo archives was treated better i woulda bought it

I got it and I think it's an amazing compilation, even with all the minor problems

[stryc9]

Yeah, I got Sakura Flamingo Archives too, good to have all the games in one place. The lack of tate doesn't worry me but the audio issues with Illvelo are a bit of a game killer. Even with sound effects set to 0 they still drown out the music, which is off-putting and annoying. That new mode where you can use all the ships from the various games is also affected. You basically can't have the volume on at all playing these, the FX just drive you crazy!

The rest of the games you can manually adjust the volume to acceptable levels, but it's a shame the game I was most looking forward to (Illvelo) is kind of unplayable as a result.

[cj iwakura]

Where? Bring me their heads. Radilgy is one of the most charming games I've ever played, just oozes style.

[Despatche]

I just think people shouldn't be dicks about stuff they don't like, or be dicks to people who like something they don't, but saying "I'm not into this, I find it dull" with no assholeishness/trolling implied is totally fine.

Literally noone actually does this. People absolutely shit on everything they don't like and call it "normal discourse". It's shit is what it is.

If they simply don't like a game, they need to just say that. If they legitimately believe something's poorly designed, they need to just say that! Instead people just wanna troll all day and act like they aren't trolling.

[Strider77]

I think Radirgy is visually hideous.... reeks of amateurish fail on that end. No amount of glow sticks, blue hair, "drum & bass" or baggy pants can save it.

Those 3 pics above perfectly illustrate this in my eyes..... cheap photo's with minimal photo-shopping that a 5 year old could do.

They (or Radirgy in general) remind me of those crappy MLP fan art pics you see splattered all over the place on facebook. The kind that winds up being turned into a shitty meme.

[Kollision]

beauty is in the eye of the beholder
style, on the other hand....