Save Shmups forum from mediocrity

[CptRansom]

The STGT always brings us all together too.

I know on the Racketboy forums they have the "Together Retro" feature where they pick one game and everyone tries it out and talks about it. Monthly I think it changes?

I think that's a cool thing we could do here - pick one game and have everyone post scores, strategies, reviews, etc.

Boo yay no?

Fuck yeah, that'd be awesome. Shmups Forum Game of the Month.

I never heard any sort of reputation about this forum when I signed up. I was just getting into STGs and figured I'd try to talk to people.

Elitist asshattery just makes me laugh. Some people never learned that the best thing to do to bullies is just fucking ignore them. When certain people start spouting shit to get a rise out of you, and you get all up in arms about it and start arguing, you're giving them exactly what they want: attention. This forum is the only place where the trolls and shitposters continue to get attention LONG AFTER everyone has figured out that they're just trolls and shitposters. I don't get it.

Getting rid of Off-Topic is a horrible idea. This is one of the few sites that isn't blocked at work for me, dammit. Don't take my Off-Topic lurking away between classes. Besides, Off-Topic got me into some Roguelikes and they're a blast. Permabanning everyone who steps out of line is a horrible idea... but I do support a three-strikes system: warn/mod edit > temp. ban > permaban. Right now, there are virtually NO consequences unless you go ridiculously over the line (I mean, TLB posted how many topics about loleggs before he finally got a temporary ban? He was obviously TRYING for it, and it still took forever!); however, the wrong thing to do would be the complete opposite.

Whatever, this shit is too long. I'm all for a Game of the Month idea. If others are behind it, I'll even start a thread for discussion/voting on the first game and I'll even maintain the scoreboard (until I get bored and pass it along to whomever wants it).

EDIT: Fuck it, I'll start it anyways. I never start threads. This should be good times.

[Skykid]

I'd argue that a far bigger problem than this recent rise of new players who give a fuck about learning to play are guys like you, who barely even care about learning to play and just tell guys like me and Cagar who do care how badly we need to get a life or get laid.

I'll applaud anyone who has achieved something, but no-one likes wankers re-iterating that other people "barely even care about learning to play," if they don't have similar goals. That's exactly the divisive crap I'm talking about.

At the moment I'm playing through Space Adventure Cobra on the Sega CD. It's got no shmupping in it. I like variety in my gaming. Doesn't mean I won't knuckle down to shmup, set and achieve a goal when I feel like it.

10 hours practice a day is also massively unhealthy: I have no idea how you can legitimately expect people to even consider following such a preposterous lead.

The buck doesn't start and stop with your childishness. Swanning around shooting off your mouth and insinuating members like Icarus have 'mediocre' scores isn't going to do you any favours either. Frankly, your attitude toward this community is appalling, and I don't think anyone should applaud you for achieving that WR when you finally get it.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

At first I was miffed about the other thread but i'm glad if it brings ppl out of the woodwork. I respect honesty more than snide remarks and apathy.

Maybe Chat isn't working in its current form. Ie joke threads and serious threads together in one subsection? EDIT I dont know how it is for other "casuals" but I tend to stay out of threads like the SDOJ thread and Stragegy, ie places where the more able players talk. All see is fellow shitposting and the odd snide remark from more hardcore players

I think many of us don't always play shmups but make it a routine to visit the forum and post in offtopic and chat. Maybe if I and similar posters kept out of chat debate and only use it to ask questions would be for the better. Ok so there wouldn't be that many ppl posting but other sections seem to be healthy so I expect it would recover eventually. (I hope)

[Ghegs]

The irony here is that this call for the shmups community comes from someone whose post ratio is ~75% in Off Topic.

That's a good indicator that off topic is the best section of the forum these days. The threads tend to have some purpose, whether discussing ponies or politics.

Yet those threads are hardly devoid of drama either. I'd say just about as much drama starts there as in Shmups Chat. The two subforums' post counts are rather similar, so that's to be expected.

I see Off Topic as more of a distraction, though TransatlanticFoe makes a good point regarding it. I've often wondered what it would be like if we did indeed close it down, or change it to "Other Games" or some such. Might make for an interesting experiment, if nothing else. That would naturally cause a significant drop in the overall new post count for the forums, but I think I'd be okay with that. If there's nothing relevant and interesting to say (relating to the forums' main subject), why say anything? I don't post in Off Topic much, it's not what I come here for. Of course I follow the threads since it's my job 'n all. When I do post there, it's usually about other games.

As for the status of moderation, we have been trying to be a bit more proactive about that. Warnings are issued more often and temp/fullbans aren't as rare as you might think. Sometimes we just don't mark a person as banned to avoid the "Ding dong the witch is dead" -type of threads that would ensue which would just lead to more drama.

(I mean, TLB posted how many topics about loleggs before he finally got a temporary ban? He was obviously TRYING for it, and it still took forever!)

He posted all those threads within a span of 20 minutes or so. I tempbanned him as soon as I noticed it, but I'm not online 24/7 after all.

Also, I fully support the idea of Game of the Month.

[Paradigm]

I'll applaud anyone who has achieved something

I don't think anyone should applaud you for achieving that WR when you finally get it.

[xbl0x180]

BWAAAaAh

[CptRansom]

(I mean, TLB posted how many topics about loleggs before he finally got a temporary ban? He was obviously TRYING for it, and it still took forever!)

He posted all those threads within a span of 20 minutes or so. I tempbanned him soon as I noticed it, but I'm not online 24/7 after all.

Oh, I didn't know they were all that close together. My bad!

[Cagar]

-

[TransatlanticFoe]

+1 for a game of the month.

[Giest118]

This thread and half of the threads I've seen since I've joined, which was very recently.

[dan76]

How about altering the front page of the forum so that Hi-scores is at the top, then Strategy, then Shmups Chat followed by the rest. Because there's so much garbage in shmups chat it should be demoted (!) and not be the main focus of the forum.

Doing this alone would make the place seem a bit more legitimate and certainly more encouraging to new members. Generally the strategy thread is shitpost free.

[Klatrymadon]

That could be a good idea. Hi-Scores and Strategy are the most productive and encouraging sections of the forum by some distance.

[remedial_gash]

I am shit at shmups by most people on here's standards, I've lurked for about three months when I was looking for a guide to ddp doj - the last shmup I bought was UN squadron (92?)... but a bit of mame fiddling has made me appreciate the genre far more than I ever thought I could. I'm looking into buyin a JP 360 and have suddenly acquired a penchant for looking at little pink blobs.. fuck!

I only registered to post in this thread, but will try and contribute more.

Anyway, I really enjoy the bitching, in fights, and all the other crap that goes on. it is what it is, and for my (tiny) money it would be ruined by more enthusiastic moderation.

Every fucker and his dog is trying to make the internet a place for the skinned fuckwits, why make their job easier?

Gash
x

[moozooh]

Damn, just realized I'd forgotten to make an actual contribution to the thread. Let's have some fun, shall we?

If I remember right, the problem is formulated as following: "this place has become increasingly diluted by derision", there's "divisive crap", "every thread of late seems to instantly devolve into banality, finger pointing and shitposting". "We're on the same side". Right? Well, let's see if you put money where your mouth is.

I don't entirely blame the newer contingent, but they are becoming increasingly responsible for a glut of inane contributions.

(deleted finger-pointing)

...banal and idiotic tone...

...membership culling...

My, how wonderfully undivisive and welcoming! This thread has devolved into finger-pointing right at the opening post! Blame is shifted to other people right off the bat, though, because it's always somebody else at fault. Some good points are made by other people, including a very insightful and level-headed post by none other than Gus who was called out in the opening post. But that's all ignored until the like-minded friend chimes in:

People are sheep and they need herding.

...fair share of fuckwits...

Obviously he gets an instant pat on the back for introducing "useful perspective" in this thread, which it totally lacked until then. I thought you disliked elitists? At the same time, the first half of Gus's post gets ignored entirely, while the second gets attacked—mostly for things that aren't even there in the post.

Certainly if you had a shred of intelligence you would see how completely unhelpful all of it was to your cause, and how you were a huge part of the problem yourself. Alas, since you're so self-righteous and opinionated, I doubt you would see it this way. Btw, you know who else shares this general outlook? Icycalm. You haven't reached his level of delusion and elitist hypocrisy yet, but you're coming dangerously close.

[Skykid]

How about altering the front page of the forum so that Hi-scores is at the top, then Strategy, then Shmups Chat followed by the rest. Because there's so much garbage in shmups chat it should be demoted (!) and not be the main focus of the forum.

Doing this alone would make the place seem a bit more legitimate and certainly more encouraging to new members. Generally the strategy thread is shitpost free.

I think that's a really good idea.

I'll applaud anyone who has achieved something

I don't think anyone should applaud you for achieving that WR when you finally get it.

Gus has earned the exception.

Damn, just realized I'd forgotten to make an actual contribution to the thread. Let's have some fun, shall we?

You shouldn't have bothered, your input is becoming increasingly flaccid of late.

[CptRansom]

You shouldn't have bothered, your input is becoming increasingly flaccid of late.

That was kind of a dick move.

[moozooh]

Q.E.D.

[Skykid]

You shouldn't have bothered, your input is becoming increasingly flaccid of late.

That was kind of a dick move.

Haha (in danger of turning thread into double entendres and euphemisms: image posts incoming.)

[NzzpNzzp]

You shouldn't have bothered, your input is becoming increasingly flaccid of late.

Gus posts in theads to say people are shit.
You make a thread just to talk about how shit you find various posters.

Let's face it, you're worse than he is.

[Skykid]

Let's face it, you're worse than he is.

Oh I'm the worst. I'm the devil.

[NzzpNzzp]

See? You're a terrible poster and you know it. You don't care about whether the forum is bad or not, you just made this thread to try and pretend you're a concerned upstanding guy so you'd look good. Nobody's fooled, bro.

[Skykid]

See? You're a terrible poster and you know it. You don't care about whether the forum is bad or not, you just made this thread to try and pretend you're a concerned upstanding guy so you'd look good. Nobody's fooled, bro.

Trying to talk reason here is futile. I opened the thread because I thought it was something worth discussing.

A few hours later and I've got moozooh telling me I'm an unintelligent elitist prick for agreeing with someone who shares the same opinion (because that's weird right?), you telling me I'm a terrible poster for opening the dialog in the first place - with no regard to whether or not it was with genuine purpose - and Gus managing to shoehorn in a little about people not giving enough of a fuck about scoring (again.)

I mean it's just unwinnable. The only good that came out of this thread is that it proved the point of the opening post in the first place, which isn't ideal but I'll take it.

:shrugs:

[daliscar]

How postmodern that a thread about how threads are deteriorating is itself deteriorating.
In the English-speaking world it's clear that Shmups Forum is the place for STG discussion but I've seen it described as "full of snobs" and "a pit of vipers" on other forums.
Surely in the forum rules it is prohibited to be personally abusive but the amount of aggressive name calling and time wasting from longterm members surprises me and this thread has become a beautiful self-referential example of this.
At the moment this forum seems to be a weird combination of informed discussion and useful information and opinions shared amongst those who love STG about new releases, strategy , hardware etc on the one hand and lots of childish webrage on the other,
Surely this should be the place where those who love doujin, touhou, CAVE, PCB ,arcade and console STG, survival and score play can all mix and learn from each other

[Skykid]

^ That's a perfect ending. Lock pls.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

How postmodern that a thread about how threads are deteriorating is itself deteriorating.
In the English-speaking world it's clear that Shmups Forum is the place for STG discussion but I've seen it described as "full of snobs" and "a pit of vipers" on other forums.

I would say that was how things were in the past. There were much more elistist sentiment in the past, however that was partly in itself a healthy thing coming from the old guard when it was driving newer players to improve. Then they left or abandoned Chat any (healthy) elistist sentiment vanished too. 2010 or 11 was the worst for infighting and trolling however.

gah why am I adding to this thread.

[ebarrett]

[Aliquantic]

I wonder just how much of the current... less than productive activity on the forums is simply down to boredom and lack of news or much to talk about (see the SDOJ thread and its predecessors). My personal impression is that bad posts aren't the problem by themselves, it's just that there's few interesting posts now due to a lack of subject material.

(This is also not an interesting or relevant post)

[Sapz]

I think the amount of inherently 'bad posts' is actually a pretty small number; however, a single one can turn into a few pages if people start some argument about it irrelevant to the thread's original purpose. I feel if no-one gave them the time of day, they'd firstly stop bothering people since they're not really diluting the thread anymore, and secondly there wouldn't be incentive to make antagonistic posts in the first place. For example, I'm pretty sure most mentions of 'fucking casuals' in posts are there because, somehow, people still respond to this.

Not really looking to get involved in the ongoing debate here, just my two cents.

[NzzpNzzp]

Trying to talk reason here is futile. I opened the thread because I thought it was something worth discussing.

Yeah, see, you say that, but then when people talk about how maybe your posting style is bad too, you just blow them off with one liners. If you want everyone else to improve you should be willing to improve yourself.

[Skykid]

Trying to talk reason here is futile. I opened the thread because I thought it was something worth discussing.

Yeah, see, you say that, but then when people talk about how maybe your posting style is bad too, you just blow them off with one liners. If you want everyone else to improve you should be willing to improve yourself.

I blow people off with one liners who decide to turn a thread about one subject into a thread about me, and I'll do it again. I saw nothing of value or purpose in moozooh's post: he came back to "have some fun" as he said; fun that involved several paragraphs of vitriol rather than any useful insight.

I'm not sure why you keep labouring the point? This is a thread about forum contribution, it's not about me and whether or not my "posting style is bad".

If I don't post anything you consider of value, that's fine, you're entitled to the opinion.

To avoid yet another unrelated shmups chat fistfight, how about allowing the thread back OT for its last few moments of life.