Mega Man Miscellanies

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

Arranged or not X3 is definitely one of the weaker Mega Man OSTs. Thankfully Gravity Beetle's theme still retains it's awesomeness; It was pretty much the only noteworthy track outside of the intro and Zero music. On a related note, here's a guitar-arranged melody that will make you want to slap Capcom's music team.

[Moniker]

Yeah I just played through the SNES version of X3. Nothing struck me as being bad but I don't really remember anything good either. I did notice that the loops were rather short, though. X4's was better but not by a lot. I guess I don't dig the X soundtracks as much. I've been slowly making my way through MM8 and the soundtrack always catches my attention for being just awesome in general.

On a non-music-related note, what the hell is up with X5? You beat the intro stage and suddenly are assaulted with limited retries, only 4 necessary levels, a choice of 3 character/armors and an annoying helper voice. Hopefully with some game time it'll start to make sense.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

I've been slowly making my way through MM8 and everything about the game catches my attention for being just awesome in general.

Fixed. And no, I have no idea what's up with X5 even after watching MM super player HideofBeast go into immense detail about it. The only thing I'll give it is that the end game areas are much better and more climactic than X4's. X6 still takes the cake for me as best overall, even though the original did such a superb job at laying down the foundation and everything.

[njiska]

Ugh. Played through 7 of the robot masters today and I can honestly say the not only is the music not all that great, the pause between looping CD tracks is annoying as all hell. On top of that the game hasn't been all that fun. Some Mavericks have weak patterns and Byte was just a complete fucker to fight. Bit was ok, but byte was way to challenging when i fought him and dealt way too much damage to be fun. Of the 3 i've played so far X is still on top.

[Moniker]

Some Mavericks have weak patterns and Byte was just a complete fucker to fight. Bit was ok, but byte was way to challenging when i fought him and dealt way too much damage to be fun. Of the 3 i've played so far X is still on top.

That's odd, I had no trouble at all w/ bit & byte. They both went down pretty swiftly once I divined their weapon vulnerabilities. One was ice and the other was drill, if memory serves. Sigma freaking ruined my life for a good 2 hours, though, until I remembered my technique for tough fights in MM10: playing it once or twice without fighting back at all will improve your dodging immensely.

Anywho, X4 is pretty awesome and very different from X3 in terms of level design, so you might have more fun with it. It's definitely different from the first 3, though. I've started replaying it as Zero and the difference in playstyle is very cool. I've given up on X5. First MM game I've ever flat out quit. Played one or two inoffensive levels, and then the gimmicks just got to me. I can put up with 1 or 2 levels that I don't particularly like, but not 4. Though, like as not, I'll probably force my way through it eventually.

Swapped it out for MMZ1. Finally got into a good groove with that one. Crystal farming isn't fantastic, but you really don't need to do all that much of it if you just want to progress. I'm at ~7 missions completed with only one health upgrade (and the useless but cheap ladder speed upgrade).

[njiska]

Some Mavericks have weak patterns and Byte was just a complete fucker to fight. Bit was ok, but byte was way to challenging when i fought him and dealt way too much damage to be fun. Of the 3 i've played so far X is still on top.

That's odd, I had no trouble at all w/ bit & byte. They both went down pretty swiftly once I divined their weapon vulnerabilities. One was ice and the other was drill, if memory serves. Sigma freaking ruined my life for a good 2 hours, though, until I remembered my technique for tough fights in MM10: playing it once or twice without fighting back at all will improve your dodging immensely.

Bit was a breeze with the Frost Shield, but my problem with byte was when he fired the repulser-thingy at the wall. I had a really hard time dodging his rush at that point and kept getting grabbed and thrown into the ceiling.

[Moniker]

Alright! Beat Mega Man Zero! Thanks for the encouraging advice, folks. Although my exaltation is tempered by the grade of F I received in the end.

Ended up using 3 health upgrades and 2 subtanks. Didn't cash in any of the one-use elves because I kept forgetting to download them. Certainly could have gotten by on less, but I didn't take the time to learn the final boss's patterns well enough to avoid getting damaged, so I just muscled through. My Z-saber didn't reach full power until the last boss. Quite an excellent game - ranks up there with the best of X, IMO, in spite of the lame rpg-progression stuff.

Also finally cracked 3M in Battle Garegga. Today's been a good gaming day.

[njiska]

Just finished Rockman & Forte. What a fucker. Fun game as Forte, but not exactly fun as Rock. Burner Man was cheap, King 2 was way too long and the second boss' fist attack was ridiculous; but otherwise it was an alright entry. Roll on 9 & 10 in my great marathon.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

Mega Man & Bass is the only game in the series I can't beat. Seriously, Bass is favored way too much.

[Moniker]

Finished up all the Zero games. Really really great entries, all of them. I think 3 was my favorite, so I'll have to replay that one for rank one of these days. All I've got left are MM7, 8, and MM&Bass. I don't like Bass's moveset as much as Megaman's, but I've been stonewalled on the game for so long that I guess I'll have to switch. I really wish down+jump executed Bass's dash, like in MM10.

[DragonInstall]

Beating MM & Forte with megaman was tough as shit. Great game though, and probably the most impressive snes game visually.

[njiska]

Beating MM & Forte with megaman was tough as shit. Great game though, and probably the most impressive snes game visually.

I'm going to go against the grain here and say that the difficulty skew between Mega Man and Bass is not as wide as it first seems. Having played through as both characters back to back I can say the differences are balanced out fairly well. Mega Man definitely has a harder time with the stages, but the Bass Buster and lack of health items can create some rather unique challenges, especially with the King bosses and Wily. A number of stages also feature separate paths that offer challenges more suited to each character. That said there are a number of sections that are just down right unfair.

King 2's second boss is probably the biggest problem in the game. For the most part the battle is really fun, but then the fists come out and you get left with an uncrossable gap. There is a life at the spawn point, so you can keep retrying, but it sucks to be in a position where you've nearly won the fight and then you're left with a ridiculously long jump from a low platform to a high one. Death comes and time is wasted. With Bass this can be avoided by Double Jumping and dash jumping, but Mega Man doesn't really have an option.

As for the visuals, you're right it is a gorgeous game. It also has one of the best soundtracks from the classic series. Shame that it was never released here in it's original form. The GBA port is alright, but the screen is way too small and it doesn't show nearly as much of the area as it should show. i would have liked to have seen it on the Anniversary Collection, but that release is such a giant can't piece of shit that it probably would have been a terrible port anyways.

Now all that's left for my Mega Marathon is 9 and 10 and I plan to beat both of those with all characters and on all difficulty settings. Should keep me busy over the holidays. Have to admit I never thought Marathoning a series would be such fun. Going to finish X4-6 after that.

Current Ranking:

1. Mega Man
2. Mega Man 2
3. Mega Man & Bass - Bass
4. Mega Man 7
5. Mega Man 5
6. Mega Man & Bass - Mega Man
7. Mega Man 3
8. Mega Man 6
9. Mega Man 8 - Saturn
10. Mega Man 4
11. Mega Man 8 - PSX

Edit: I'd love to know how the rest of you rate the series. It'd be cool to get some feed back on why you love the games you love.

Finished up all the Zero games. Really really great entries, all of them. I think 3 was my favorite, so I'll have to replay that one for rank one of these days. All I've got left are MM7, 8, and MM&Bass. I don't like Bass's moveset as much as Megaman's, but I've been stonewalled on the game for so long that I guess I'll have to switch. I really wish down+jump executed Bass's dash, like in MM10.

Congrats on finishing the Zero series. Hopefully I'll get around to doing the same in the new year. From the titles you have remaining I'd strong recommend you play 7 first. It's by far the most fun and has one of the hardest Wily Capsules in the series. Even if you get it's pattern down it's still a bastard to dodge and took me 3 E-Tanks to defeat. If you don't care about how the plot ties together I'd say hold off on 8 and play it last. The game just feels weird to play and is way, way to easy. if you can try playing the Saturn version so you can fight Cut Man and Wood Man.

As for Bass' moveset, you get used to it fast. His dash may not be executed in the same way as Mega Man's slide, but a double tap will work, just like it does in the X series. The bigger problem is getting used to the Bas Buster not being able to charge or shoot through walls. If you fight Cold Man first, which i did, expect a very long and drawn out battle. once you get used to Bass' play style he becomes a lot more fun to play and ends up being the more enjoyable run.

[Moniker]

Edit: I'd love to know how the rest of you rate the series. It'd be cool to get some feed back on why you love the games you love.

I think I'll just lump all the various offshoots together for fun.

• 1. Megaman 10
  2. Megaman 4
  3. Megaman X3
  4. Megaman 9
  5. Megaman 6
  6. Megaman 2
  7. Megaman X
  8. Megaman Zero 3
  9. Megaman Zero 2
  10. Megaman 3
  11. Megaman 5
  12. Megaman Zero 4
  13. Megaman Zero
  14. Megaman X4
  15. Megaman
  16. Megaman X2
  
  Classic series: 10>4>9>6>2>3>5>1
  X Series: X3>X>X4>X2
  Zero series: 3>2>4>1
  
  Haven't played/beaten: 7, 8, &Bass, X5-8

This is a list of favorites, but I really do like them all, even those towards the bottom of the list. The only ones I don't care to replay are X2 and Megaman 1, for absurd gimmickry and loose, slidey physics, respectively.

MM10 is just everything I love about Mega Man condensed into one package. You can play normal difficulty for MM1&3 levels of difficulty, or you can play as Protoman on easy, which is more comparable to MM5&6. The weapons tend to be weak in a general sense, but are really useful and awesome in their special cases. MM9 is almost as great for similar reasons, but can be unfair (lots of surprise spike pits). I'd say they're both probably the hardest games in the series.

MM4 is probably the least loved of the NES games, but it just strikes me as really well-balanced and put together. The weapons are great; anyone who only uses the buster is selling themselves short. This is the first entry where the level design is consistently great, and the physics are pitch-perfect.

X3 is still my favorite MMX game. Mostly due to superb level design, I think. Icing on the cake: little to no gimmickry, a search feature that isn't a colossal waste of gametime. X has the best special weapons, though, right behind MM8. The PSX games just don't feel like they handle quite right. A bit loose where all the other games are tight.

I was surprised to find how good the Zero games are. The main gameplay difference is the loss of boss weapons, but they correspondingly made the buster and saber so tight that you don't really miss them. I was critical of the whole cyber-elf thing at first, but reflecting now, it's a pretty neat way of implementing dynamic difficulty.

Of the ones I haven't finished, I find X5 so bad that I can't even bring myself to finish more than one level. MM8 is both great and terrible. The weapon set is easily the best of the entire franchise, but the hoverboard and shmup segments really piss me off. The music is up there w/ MM2. Zero 4 also had surprisingly good music. X6 I'm still wrestling with. The control feels off but the levels have been pretty decent.

[njiska]

I think I'll just lump all the various offshoots together for fun.

• 1. Megaman 10
  2. Megaman 4
  3. Megaman X3
  4. Megaman 9
  5. Megaman 6
  6. Megaman 2
  7. Megaman X
  8. Megaman Zero 3
  9. Megaman Zero 2
  10. Megaman 3
  11. Megaman 5
  12. Megaman Zero 4
  13. Megaman Zero
  14. Megaman X4
  15. Megaman
  16. Megaman X2
  
  Classic series: 10>4>9>6>2>3>5>1
  X Series: X3>X>X4>X2
  Zero series: 3>2>4>1
  
  Haven't played/beaten: 7, 8, &Bass, X5-8

9 and 10 are truly great games, but as i haven't completed them I've left them off my list. 10 has by far the best final boss level reveal in the entire series. Man do i love that every time i see it.

As for MM4, I personally thought it was the most bullshit of all the originals. Granted it has some incredible music, especially Bright Man's stage, but the Masters are just down right annoying. Toad Man is way too simple and Dive Man is an annoying asshole (i hate bosses that favour running into you). And the biggest offender is the castle stages. They're designed with a lot of tedium, not challenge. I hate dying at the stage boss, going back to the mid-point and then crossing 11 pits that all have enemies pop out of them, slowing you down. Guess that goes to show you how drastically different an experience two players can have.

I can agree with you that the original Mega Man's physics fell a bit off and you do kind of slide, but i put it in my top spot simply because it is the most legitimately difficult of the Classic series. I know it seems pretty cheap at times, but after I beat it I went back and took a good hard look at it. Instead of finding the cheap deaths i though i was experiencing the first time, I realized that it was I who was failing, not the game. There's a special feeling of accomplishment that comes from legitimately beating Mega Man, especially the Boss Rush, and no other game in the series has given me that much of a rush.

[ED-057]

The only ones I don't care to replay are X2 ... for absurd gimmickry

What is this absurd gimmickry of which you speak? I haven`t played any of these games in a while, but the only thing I remember about X2 that seemed kind of dumb was the reeeeeeeally long pit that you have to jump over in one stage to get an item. I consider X2 to be the best one I`ve played though.

X3 was cool for having so many upgrades, particularly the double dash, but the game loses all challenge when you actually obtain all the upgrades. Even with minimal upgrades, most of the bosses don`t put up a fight just as long as you are using the weapon that they are vulnerable to. It`s enough to make a person long for boss AI in early Megaman games which seemed to be "jump around randomly while firing aimed shots," 'cuz at least then you had to dodge. And the music isn`t as good. And there is a lack of underwater stages It does have more replay value though, for instance try beating it with Zero`s saber but without any buster upgrade.

X2>X>X3>X4
5>4>6>3>2>1

The first three have no charge shot And they`re actually hard and need some memorization. Maybe the other ones need memorization too but it`s not an issue since I already cleared them like 20 times each.

[njiska]

The only ones I don't care to replay are X2 ... for absurd gimmickry

What is this absurd gimmickry of which you speak? I haven`t played any of these games in a while, but the only thing I remember about X2 that seemed kind of dumb was the reeeeeeeally long pit that you have to jump over in one stage to get an item. I consider X2 to be the best one I`ve played though.

Maybe he means the whole "defeat the X-Hunter Leaders" thing. Was kinda gimmicky to have to fight them in random locations for Zero parts. Not that Bit, Byte and Vile don't serve more or less the same function in X3.

I'm surprised to see X4 getting so little love. I played through it yesterday as X and while it is stupidly easy if you do the correct order, some of the Mavericks are the best in the series. I've never felt more joy in any X game than I did battling Magma Dragoon with nothing more than an X-Buster and one heart tank. He's got a great move set and puts up a hell of a good fight. It takes some work to get his pattern down and even then it's still a challenge. Plus who doesn't love a boss that throws Hadoukens and Shoryukens?

For me the X series is X>X4>X2>X3. I did not care for the X3 Sigma fight at all.

[Moniker]

I don't really mind the randomly placed X-Hunters thing. They don't really get in the way if you're not out to get them and they add to the replay value. I mean more the stage level design. I suppose the gimmickry isn't so much absurd as it is poorly integrated, IMO. I don't care for the constant screen-shaking in Wheel Gator's stage, the rising lava gimmick in the Fire Stag stage, the motorcycle stuff in Overdrive Ostrich, or the Darius fish thing in the underwater stage. I suppose it's a matter of preference, but I just don't find these sections very fun. I like nice and simple megaman style running and shooting.

X4 has probably the best final boss of all - the dual alien/computer Sigma. My only reservation is that the controls just don't feel all that tight compared to the SNES games. I'm not sure why this is the case, since MM8 handles perfectly. Although it does seem better than X5&X6, just from memory. I didn't feel too strongly either way about X3's Sigma fight. It seems really cheap until you learn to just take your time. I agree that X3's music is lackluster. Although I can't say that I'm particularly fond of any MMX soundtracks save maybe the first one. Not that they're bad, they just didn't leave much of an impression. I think what I like about X3 so much is the game is pretty transparent w/ upgrades. W/ megaman I like tight, linear levels. Perhaps this is why I can't motivate myself to finish ZX 1&2.

Just finished MM8. Not sure I'd throw it on the very top like njiska, but it's definitely an excellent installment. I'd probably rank it equal with Megaman 6 on my list. The only thing I didn't like were the hoverboard sequences (jump! jump! ... slide! slide!). The shmup sections were a bit meh, but they don't really hurt the game. I was kind of disappointed that two thirds of Wily's castle were comprised of hoverboard and shmup. Everything else is freaking gravy, though. Control, music, weapons, and even the stage gimmicks (like Clown Man's, and the Indy-themed level) are top notch. I even like the robot master soundbytes. They add just enough flavor without getting too campy.

I'm gonna have to give MM1 another shot since you guys ranked it so highly. I played through Gutsman and Iceman's stages last night and while the inertia does still annoy me, the maturity of design was much better than I remembered. Still hate the boss corridors with annoying enemies, though.

[drunkninja24]

Welp, check out the "new and improved" HD trailer for Megaman X on iPhone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbht_bSvKcs

Just......wow.

[Moniker]

A lot of people seem to take issue with the art design in the MMX iOS port. I think it looks fine. I can't imagine it will control well, though. If it were just L,R, auto-charge and jump, it might have a chance. But throw in dash/dash+jump? I dunno. Don't have an iThing in any case.

[njiska]

A lot of people seem to take issue with the art design in the MMX iOS port.

Allow me to be one of them. X just looks completely wrong. Almost like the bastard son of X and the original mega man. My biggest issue though is that the animations appear to have been significantly scaled back. So few frames to X's run.

[Moniker]

Pretty decent japanese MM flash game. http://king-soukutu.com/flash/rokko.html

Borrows a lot of level design from the original games, but there are a few pretty cool surprises in there. Difficulty about on par w/ MM5.

Can't wait until people get over the nostalgia factor of passwords in MM clones.

[scrilla4rella]

Sorry for the derail but can someone sum up the reasons why the charge shot, introduced in MM4, changed the gameplay of subsequent MM games for the worse. This argument seems to come up quite often, it's also espoused by Kenji Inafune, but I'm not familiar enough with the Mega Man games to know exactly why this is, or is not the case. Can somebody please give me a quick primer on the debate.

[Moniker]

Sorry for the derail but can someone sum up the reasons why the charge shot, introduced in MM4, changed the gameplay of subsequent MM games for the worse. This argument seems to come up quite often, it's also espoused by Kenji Inafune, but I'm not familiar enough with the Mega Man games to know exactly why this is, or is not the case. Can somebody please give me a quick primer on the debate.

The general argument is that the charge shot trumps all the other weapons in the game. The pea shooter was made less powerful - IIRC 25% less - which makes it less viable. Enemy invincibility time, esp that of bosses, was also given a boost, further nerfing quickshots. It also tends to be equally or more powerful than the boss weapons, which discourages experimentation with them - one of the most compelling parts of the game.

I personally think the charge shot is fine. You still use the pea shooter as follow-up shots, quick shots, or when you can't be as exact (mid bosses that move up and down, e.g.). It's also not impractical to play a pea-shooter only game if you so wish. The only title where I don't make much use of the boss weapons is MM5 (many would disagree), but the other games give you plenty of reasons to use them in preference to the charge shot.

So in the classic series I don't think there's any problem with it. It's only in later MMX games that your charge shot becomes so powerful that it isn't necessary to try out boss weapons during stages. That said, X1 has one of the best sets of boss weapons in the franchise, and people foolishly tend to ignore it.

[Casper<3]

Hey thread, what does every one think of X6?

[njiska]

Sorry for the derail but can someone sum up the reasons why the charge shot, introduced in MM4, changed the gameplay of subsequent MM games for the worse. This argument seems to come up quite often, it's also espoused by Kenji Inafune, but I'm not familiar enough with the Mega Man games to know exactly why this is, or is not the case. Can somebody please give me a quick primer on the debate.

The general argument is that the charge shot trumps all the other weapons in the game. The pea shooter was made less powerful - IIRC 25% less - which makes it less viable. Enemy invincibility time, esp that of bosses, was also given a boost, further nerfing quickshots. It also tends to be equally or more powerful than the boss weapons, which discourages experimentation with them - one of the most compelling parts of the game.

I personally think the charge shot is fine. You still use the pea shooter as follow-up shots, quick shots, or when you can't be as exact (mid bosses that move up and down, e.g.). It's also not impractical to play a pea-shooter only game if you so wish. The only title where I don't make much use of the boss weapons is MM5 (many would disagree), but the other games give you plenty of reasons to use them in preference to the charge shot.

So in the classic series I don't think there's any problem with it. It's only in later MMX games that your charge shot becomes so powerful that it isn't necessary to try out boss weapons during stages. That said, X1 has one of the best sets of boss weapons in the franchise, and people foolishly tend to ignore it.

I agree completely. I've never had an issue with the introduction of the charge shot, but that may be because i tend to stick to the Arm Cannon 90% of the time anyways. The only change that I'd say it made for the worse was slowing down gameplay. Now instead of rushing through you get moments of stop-charge-fire-progress-repeat and it does get tiresome after a while.

I don't quite buy the argument that you don't use boss weapons because the charge shot is as powerful or more powerful. It's the boss weapons special properties that make them interesting, not the power. Metal Blades is strong, but the main reason i use it is to aim in angled directions.

Hey thread, what does every one think of X6?

I'll let you know in two weeks. I've been doing a Mega Man X marathon, but I've only completed up to X4. From what I've seen I'm not expecting to enjoy it, especially the battle with Gate.

While we're asking questions;what the hell is the point of Dynamo in X5? He just sort of shows up for no reason and then leaves after your second fight. Doesn't even appear in the final stages.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

Dynamo is just one of several gimmicks that Capcom threw into X5 without a second thought. However, I'm cool with him cause his design is actually pretty nice and his theme music is the best of the game. People who hate charge shots are retarded nostalgiafags or something, nothing but good has come along with it. Also, X8 lets you fight the bosses with quickshots if you're so inclined. Their health bars have a set period to when they start flashing, so you can throw anything you like but their own weakness at them until then.

[scrilla4rella]

Sorry for the derail but can someone sum up the reasons why the charge shot, introduced in MM4, changed the gameplay of subsequent MM games for the worse. This argument seems to come up quite often, it's also espoused by Kenji Inafune, but I'm not familiar enough with the Mega Man games to know exactly why this is, or is not the case. Can somebody please give me a quick primer on the debate.

The general argument is that the charge shot trumps all the other weapons in the game. The pea shooter was made less powerful - IIRC 25% less - which makes it less viable. Enemy invincibility time, esp that of bosses, was also given a boost, further nerfing quickshots. It also tends to be equally or more powerful than the boss weapons, which discourages experimentation with them - one of the most compelling parts of the game.

I personally think the charge shot is fine. You still use the pea shooter as follow-up shots, quick shots, or when you can't be as exact (mid bosses that move up and down, e.g.). It's also not impractical to play a pea-shooter only game if you so wish. The only title where I don't make much use of the boss weapons is MM5 (many would disagree), but the other games give you plenty of reasons to use them in preference to the charge shot.

So in the classic series I don't think there's any problem with it. It's only in later MMX games that your charge shot becomes so powerful that it isn't necessary to try out boss weapons during stages. That said, X1 has one of the best sets of boss weapons in the franchise, and people foolishly tend to ignore it.

Thanks for that. Yeah, no one ever complains about the charge shot in X but for some reason in the original series it's bad. hmmm.
I just bought a bunch of Rockman games for my Famicom and for some reason I've started with 4. After that that I'm moving onto 3 but I hear that's one of the hardest ones. Fun stuff

[Casper<3]

So has anyone besides me even played X6?

I think it's one of the worst in the series, plagued with too many cheap deaths that require memorization. MM series has always been reaction based to me and that is what makes it fun.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

I am a lazy faggot who can't be fucked dedicating more than one playthrough to learning a Mega Man game. Enjoying an extra bit of challenge in your games is in poor taste.

[Moniker]

So has anyone besides me even played X6?

I think it's one of the worst in the series, plagued with too many cheap deaths that require memorization. MM series has always been reaction based to me and that is what makes it fun.

I've just started it so the jury's still out, but I've played through 3 stages and they weren't very offensive (acid rain, ice, and weapons factory). The weapons factory seemed way insane at first but after taking a deep breath it starts to make sense. Haven't run into any of what I'd call cheap/unfair deaths yet. To some extent memorization is required, but that's par for the course in classic MM if not MMX.

@ChainsawGuitarSP - While I agree with the general basis of your sentiment, I'd appreciate some ixnaying on the word "faggot," as it's hateful and unworthy. "Fag" is preferred, if you must. </request, not a demand>