Cinemateq Picture Optimizer - are they any good?

[Fudoh]

What a journey!

I don't really understand why the setup is working with sync set to RGBs (it shouldn't), but hell, point is it's working now

[fagin]

What a journey!

I don't really understand why the setup is working with sync set to RGBs (it shouldn't), but hell, point is it's working now

The whole thing doesn't make much sense if I am honest. The chip not needing any power and the slg led doesn't even light up, but it all still works.

[fagin]

Comparison images:

[blizzz]

How would I build my own sync inverter for the CPO? Would it be enough to buy two of these DSub15 Connectors (one male and one female) and connect everything directly except Pin 13 and 14 which would require the 74HC04 on Pin 1, 3 (in) and 2, 4 (out)? Would I still need to connect Vcc and GND and could I just take the +5V which should be on Pin 9?

The total cost for everything is less than 2-3€, which to me sounds better than spending 30-50€ on an Extron interface + BNC cables and stuff. But I'm a total noob when it comes to soldering cables, so I might have overlooked some obvious flaws in this idea.

[fagin]

That sounds fine to me.... All I did was butcher an existing VGA lead I had.

I can't remember if I kept the GND connected for the IC, but you can easily check that yourself (by trying it both ways). Whatever you do, don't power the IC..... that's what caused me all the issues (if you read back).

[blizzz]

My idea was to take a SO14 IC and put it into the plug. Wow, that was a bad idea. All those tiny cables will give me nightmares and I highly doubt that it'll work in the end. I don't have the nerves to do the other end of the cable yet.



Edit: Finished it but it doesn't work. Monitor goes into standby (no signal) for any video source. But at least it looks really nice
(the small IC is the one I used in the cable)

[blizzz]

fagin, I need your help. I completely rewired the cable, but it still doesn't work with the IC. If I remove the hexinverter it displays a picture, but with it it's just black and my monitor goes into standby. Do you think that I need a TI one? I'm using this one at the moment...

I'm also unsure about the Film Mode. Force SM gives me a really great picture but with interlacing, all other modes give me a softer image. Is there a way to get pure linedoubling that's as sharp as the Force SM mode?



Edit: I noticed that the LED of the SLG3000 lights up a little with my cable.

Edit2: I can use the GBS-8220 as a scan inverter, but the quality of the video decreases slightly. It's still way better than using the GBS-8220 for upscaling though. I also tried a different 74HC04 but it's the same black screen as before.

Edit3: Using a 5V power supply gives me a "signal out of range" error on the monitor. But now the led on the SLG3000 lights up correctly.

[fagin]

Remove the +5v from the IC and try it again.

[blizzz]

I tried it without +5V, with Pin9 and an external power supply. Neither works.
On which Pin is the sync when I'm using RGBs?

[blizzz]

I have no idea what I just did, but it's working now. All I did was switching all output modes.

It's kinda random though, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and I have to switch output modes again. It also works on RGsB sometimes. The picture is a bit unstable in the horizontal direction, could be my subpar wiring skills or the 74HC04.

[fagin]

IIRC I only inverted the H sync and left the V sync as is (disconnected power to IC and used RGBs as the output from the CPO).

[blizzz]

When I connect H sync alone it doesn't work, unless I touch pin13 (gnd) with my hand, but even then it's without scanlines. If I connect H+V sync without +5V and GND I get randomly "input out of range" or a picture which is a bit shaky but otherwise fine. Once I got a picture it stays, so turning the CPO on/off multiple times until it displays something works. But it's still weird. Connecting GND results in my monitor going to sleep.

Edit: Fixed the shaking with a different IC, but it's still random whether it turns on or not.

[fagin]

This is such a simple circuit it should just work!! I never found this to be the case in reality though. If you can get hold of a TI version , it would be worth trying.

[blizzz]

I found another issue with my CPO when I set the output to YUV. It looks like the luminance (?) of the next frame is mixed into the current frame. Could this be caused by my cable or is it just how the CPO works?

Here's what it looks like


This is the cable I'm using (only R,G,B connected to my capture card)

[blizzz]

Does anyone know the differences between the Picture Optimizer Plus and Plus II? I can't find any info for the first one. I've got an offer for one, but if it can't change sync polarity it's of no use to me.

[fagin]

I can't find anything specifically, but found a post on the AV forums that was about a firmware update. It said it was the same update for all POP series, so I would assume they are very similar.

Have you seen a picture of it? Has it got the built in screen on the front? If it has I would be inclined to think it has the polarity switching.

[blizzz]

It looks the same like the POP II, just without the II on the front. I guess there's only one way to find out...

[emphatic]

Wow, just won one on eBay!

[blizzz]

Oh well, the guy with the POP wants that I send him the money via mail which is extremely unsafe and not even allowed by postal regulations here. Guess that option is dead for me.

Wow, just won one on eBay!

Grats, I assume you got the one for 30€ plus shipping? That's a really great price, hope you'll have fun with it. For 240p games I use Force VT and TV mode off.

[emphatic]

Wow, just won one on eBay!

Grats, I assume you got the one for 30€ plus shipping? That's a really great price, hope you'll have fun with it. For 240p games I use Force VT and TV mode off.

Yes, from Germany. If Google translate is good enough, then the the one I got is "as new". I'm going to use it exclusively with a supergun for playing horizontal PCB's on my Plasma feeding it through an SLG3000. Hopefully I can figure out a good setting. The remote is included as well.

[blizzz]

I'm going to use it exclusively with a supergun for playing horizontal PCB's on my Plasma feeding it through an SLG3000.

Read back in this thread a bit... The PO outputs the wrong sync polarity (-/+) for the SLG3000. You'll have to build your own sync inverter (which I never quite managed to do correctly) or use an Extron RGB Interface that can change -/+ to +/+.

[emphatic]

Wasn't that rectified by just using a custom resolution in the end though? And wasn't the issue with reversed polarity that the SLG3000 didn't get power from the sync line? I could just use a +5V from my supergun's PSU to power it if that's the case. Let's see if fagin can clear this up.

BTW, were you the other bidder on the CPO I won?

[fagin]

The PO unlike the POP does not allow you to adjust the polarity of the sync. Without altering the polarity on the sync, the PO will not work with a SLG.

[emphatic]

Ah. Well, I'll have to look into that when I've received the thing.

[emphatic]

I'm still awaiting my package from Germany. Meanwhile, would someone be kind and post the settings for the best custom resolution here so i don't have to get as many new grey hairs when it's here? Or is it the "industry standard" 480p modeline that Fudoh posted?

Also, what's the model name of the TI circuit that fagin used so I can try to find one on eBay? The 74HC04? Do I wire it up like this but without powering it? http://www.twobits.com/sync.html

[blizzz]

I think simple line-doubling works best.

Yes, the 74HC04 is the right one and it does something without power. It only seems to work for V sync, so I never got it working with RGBHV, only RGBS.

[emphatic]

Picked this up from the post office today, manual wasn't included and i never found a menu to tweak the custom modes. How and where, please?

[fagin]

You don't need to tweak for custom modes. Simply linedouble!

[emphatic]

Ah, that's what I tried. Cheers!

[Antiriad]

Hi!
I'm new here and not much expert about upscaling, so I'm sorry if I'll repeat something yet solved but I need some clarifications, I hope you can help me.

I've just won on Ebay a Cinemateq Picture Optimizer Plus 2 (CPO+2) and I would like to use it with a SLG-3000 exclusively on a Sony Playstation 2 source.

This is the setup I would like to set:

PS2 > Component (or RGB?) > CPO+2 > VGA > SLG-3000 > VGA > TV HD

Will it work?
It's better Component cable or SCART RGB for the connection between PS2 and CPO+2?
Plain, which are the best/required basic settings on CPO+2 for this setup?

I really thank you for your support and your patience.