Anyone else totally suck

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:56 am

Ganelon wrote:People don't suck at shooters; they just don't spend enough time playing them. Have you been playing your shooters as much as you your RPGs (20-40 hours)? If not, don't expect to be 1CCing left and right. But then, that may or may not kill your enjoyment; that pleasure should be your foremost priority.

I've spent hundreds (200-300 or so) of hours on Dodonpachi and still can't clear the first loop without using at least a few bombs

I suck at shooters, but still love them =)

stuminator · Post by **stuminator** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:02 pm

Arvandor wrote:I suck at shooters, but still love them =)

Haven't you 1CC'd Mars Matrix and Ikaruga? I wouldn't really consider that sucking.

lgb · Post by **lgb** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:39 pm

I suck, I suppose. Can't keep a focus for longer than five minutes unless I'm in "the zone". Wish I was in that zone more often.

gennss · Post by **gennss** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:23 am

I suck, i haven't 1cc'd anything... I find ikaruga to be tough as nails.

Machinehead · Post by **Machinehead** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:52 am

down right horrible, and to add to it I havn't played any in a couple months. Gradius is kicking my ass!

SockPuppetHyren · Post by **SockPuppetHyren** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:16 am

I suck, a lot. I only 1CC'd one game, and that was because the framerate was wonky.

kccttzj · Post by **kccttzj** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 4:14 am

You know... I think if I could 1CC Raiden II, I wouldn't think I sucked at shmups. =P I can't though, and I do suck, a lot. I enjoy playing them regardless though =P

escadrille · Post by **escadrille** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 4:37 am

By competitive standards, I totally suck. I mean, I make modest progress the more I work on a title, but I'm never going to 2nd loop anything.

Still, I enjoy myself.

TLB · Post by **TLB** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:32 am

As I predicted, we all suck but love the games =D

Well, except SOME of us...who know who they are >.> =P

Anyway. Instead of being ambiguous and vague, I'll say, yes, I suck at shmups but love 'em anyway. I've got 2 1CCs, however they're on Robotech: The Macross Saga for GBA (barely even a shmup; health bars and the whole magilla) and Star Soldier Vanishing Earth for N64. And SSVE is ridiculously easy. Like, super-easy stupid chaining system, with extends all over the place. I beat the last boss on my first time past Stage 4 with 4 lives left. Yeah. Easy. Not to mention the idiot infinite reflect barrier, activated by moving from left to right sharply. Yeah. Idiotic. But yeah. After like 30 hours of Gradius V and a credit-feed to unlock weapon edit, I can get to Stage 4 with Type 1 and Spread Bombs. Haven't played it in a week or two, though. Been getting owned at Gunbird 2. Which owns me. Hard. I love spending so much money on stuff that owns me. It's so fun =D

But really, practicing and discussing strategies is the way to do it. Also, really try to be /aware/ of what you're doing when you play. I have a super attention/concentration problem =P

BryanM · Post by **BryanM** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:20 am

What kind of depresses me is there's a lady I know of who practices drawing a lot, and her stuff isn't as good as the stuff I can doodle out in MSPaint. It actually breaks my heart.

I don't understand it; I know there are a lot of ways I could put in the effort to improve, that the potential (of competency) is there. So why doesn't her years of effort show results?

It's too unfair.

Arvandor wrote:I've spent hundreds (200-300 or so) of hours on Dodonpachi and still can't clear the first loop without using at least a few bombs

Hey Arvandor I'm up there with Dangun Feveron and I haven't 1CC'ed it yet. Maybe next year, eh?

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:46 am

I'm afraid I can't speak on the aspect of art. I don't know art very well, don't associate with the "artsy" cliche, and in general don't have any particular fondness for art. So whether the skills needed in art can be improved in the same or different way from those needed in video gaming, I don't know. I am sure though that if she continuously drew one particular picture through several years, then her ability to draw that picture would be far greater.

Arvandor wrote: I've spent hundreds (200-300 or so) of hours on Dodonpachi and still can't clear the first loop without using at least a few bombs

I suck at shooters, but still love them =)

Aw, come on

, I wouldn't call that sucking. So there may be a couple of bullet patterns that you still have to bomb. Still, you are able to 1CC the game nevertheless. That's a great milestone to set; 200 hours, even though it seems so long, still isn't anywhere near enough to make you a master of any popular competitive game.

Anyway, around when were you able to 1CC the game? 50 hours? 100 hours? 150 hours? Also, I'd imagine you know most of the chaining strategies within the stages so that you have a very respectable score here. It's not enough to compete with the top JP players, who I have no doubt played many times more, but at your length of play, it seems reasonable enough and you'd still be considered among the best players in the west.

So again, I don't see folks sucking. I just see them not putting in the harsh time investment necessary to really excel and/or underestimating how long it really takes for a person to be exceptional at a game. But while we're at it, maybe asking folks how long it roughly/exactly took to 1CC their games or obtain their scores would be worthwhile so that we can settle this once and for all.

wiNteR · Post by **wiNteR** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:19 am

Modes of practice can really make a big difference as has been discussed before on this forum. However, I think sometimes just playing these games attentively and without any stress can really help. Also, I almost never do well if I am tired. I guess the most important thing is to have fun and not stress over performance too much.

I played about 20 credits of GradiusV (over a week) after a lot of stage select practice. Reached 1-7 but got frustrated with all the failed runs and the option hunters which weren't present in the stage select. After about a month just tried it for fun and cleared the first loop on second attempt.

Same story with Progear. I played it for 10-12 days playing couple of hours each day. But I wasn't getting anywhere. Got too many bad runs and barely reached 1-5 once. I even tried save state practice but the ratio of bad runs just put me off and I decided to leave the game for some time. Two weeks later I tried the game again and got to stage5 boss on very first try. After a couple of tries I cleared the first loop. The only thing I did different was that I was paying more attention to the game instead of stressing over past runs.

With Raiden-3 I decided not to use any stage select nor any credit feeding for practice. Heck I also decided not to restart any messed up runs. So each run I played to the end without any restart. Played couple of credits each day. After about 70 credits I managed to reach the last boss. However, since I wasn't using any credit feeding got really stumped on that boss because I couldn't get familiar with patterns. Heck few times I would manage to no miss till the last boss and still mess up with 4 lives in stock. Must have taken me around another 60-70 credits just to clear that stupid boss.

MR_Soren · Post by **MR_Soren** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:11 pm

Also, I almost never do well if I am tired. I guess the most important thing is to have fun and not stress over performance too much.

In STGT08, my best runs were usually on Saturday morning after sleeping in and playing 1-3 credits.

Playing more than that generally results in my score getting worse as my eyes and mind get tired and I start getting stressed about needing to perform better.

Lordstar · Post by **Lordstar** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:37 pm

+1 for the suck!

MadScientist · Post by **MadScientist** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:27 pm

Just got back into playing shmups on MAME recently after growing tired of the current crop of games. Played some of my old favourites (Salamander, Gradius etc...) and some that I'd never played before (DDP, Blazing Star etc...). Found this place to see how my scores compared... and discovered that I sucked. I thought getting over 30 mill on Raiden Fighters Jet was pretty good on my part, but it would still be pretty low down the table here. Need more practice I guess...

Michaelm · Post by **Michaelm** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:38 pm

I just let the game beat me

FIL · Post by **FIL** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:54 pm

Its the taking part that counts.

Never_Scurred · Post by **Never_Scurred** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:09 pm

I am a beast at shmups. My uncle interns for CAVE and did the playtesting for DDP and DOJ so he sends me tips and routes so I can beat the games faster.

Acid King · Post by **Acid King** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:09 pm

I don't think I suck, per se. I feel like I can put up decent scores, relative to other players on this board atleast, in a handful of games and I can reliably 1cc Batrider and Bakraid on Normal when not going for score. My problem is that I usually hit a wall and just get tired of playing the game. Some games I can go back to and keep playing, like Batrider, others I just get bored of. I was close to a clear in ESP Ra.De. but got tired of it and traded it.

ZOM · Post by **ZOM** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:14 pm

Add another bad player to the list.

I suck major balls at STGs, only 1CC I have are

Cyber Core (PCE)
Dragon Spirit (PCE)
Dragon Saber (PCE)
BWR Plus (heaven, no accel)

MadScientist · Post by **MadScientist** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:37 pm

The only 1cc I can remember off the top of my head was Armalyte on the C64. Loooong time ago.

I can usually get to level 3 or 4 on 1 credit without too much effort but Cyvern is kicking my ass. I spent hours playing that the other day and couldn't get past level 2. That boss is a nightmare.

Zeroblade · Post by **Zeroblade** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:18 pm

I'd like to think I'm far worse than anyone else on this entire board:

1cc's:

Giga Wing (Arcade - Stuck)
Gradius V (PS2 - Type 1) - made it to second loop 3rd stage

...and that's it. I've yet to reach the fourth stage on DDP DOJ, the final boss in Mushihime-sama, or the fifth stage in ESPGaluda. And let's just not talk about Ibara. Raiden III, I believe I got to the last boss, then got promptly owned.

MadScientist · Post by **MadScientist** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:35 pm

Well, that's an entire loop further than me in Gradius V. I only got it a few days ago though.

Haven't beaten level 4 on Giga Wing yet...

I rarely set out to completely master a game though. I probably have attention deficit disorder or something.

Ruldra · Post by **Ruldra** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 10:19 pm

@Zeroblade:

Gradius V is a pretty tough 1cc, you should be proud of it. As for the Cave games you mentioned, they are hard even for good shmups players, so don't worry too much about it. You'll need some dedication to clear them.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:13 pm

I thought I sucked, but now not so much. I'm very happy with my progress in the genre, even if that doesn't mean 1CC's left right and centre. I've got a few, but nothing to write home about (and none with really impressive scores.)

More than any other type of game, I find getting your head around shmups is an education. It might take 40 hours to get through an RPG, but understanding shmups takes years. Then one day, when you've sampled a vast variety of shmups, you come back to one you got owned at years back and suddenly the patterns are clearer, and less overwhelming.

Case in point is DDP DOJ. Before, I thought it was impossible to finish. Now, with the PCB, I'm loving it so bad it hurts.

Zeroblade wrote:I'd like to think I'm far worse than anyone else on this entire board:

1cc's:

Giga Wing (Arcade - Stuck)
Gradius V (PS2 - Type 1) - made it to second loop 3rd stage

...and that's it. I've yet to reach the fourth stage on DDP DOJ, the final boss in Mushihime-sama, or the fifth stage in ESPGaluda. And let's just not talk about Ibara. Raiden III, I believe I got to the last boss, then got promptly owned.

This is so weird for me btw!

I'd love to 1cc Gradius V or Giga Wing, but they're rock. However, I'm reaching the 4th stage on DDP DOJ after less than a week and only 1/2 hrs play per day and 1cc'd Mushi original.

With you on Ibara tho. It's another word for 'hell'.

captpain · Post by **captpain** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 5:58 am

MR_Soren wrote:
Also, I almost never do well if I am tired. I guess the most important thing is to have fun and not stress over performance too much.
In STGT08, my best runs were usually on Saturday morning after sleeping in and playing 1-3 credits.

Playing more than that generally results in my score getting worse as my eyes and mind get tired and I start getting stressed about needing to perform better.

I don't have very many 1ccs, but I've always made them (and close-to-1ccs, of which I have many) after either waking up from naps, or after waking up in the morning. I have also always been drinking coffee.

MadScientist · Post by **MadScientist** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:36 am

Woaaarrggghh!!! It's 2:30am and I've finally beaten the 2nd level boss on Cyvern. I suck slightly less now.

Apart from Dangun Feveron and Sengeki 'let's puke tons of tiny fast bullets straight at your ship' Striker, I can't think of too many other games where I can't clear the first two levels.

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:08 am

stuminator wrote:Haven't you 1CC'd Mars Matrix and Ikaruga? I wouldn't really consider that sucking.

Dodonpachi kicks my ass so hard it's easy to forget past accomplishments =P

Ganelon wrote:Anyway, around when were you able to 1CC the game? 50 hours? 100 hours? 150 hours?

I honestly don't remember... I think my very clear of the first loop was about... 60-80 hours? Somewhere in that ballpark. I might have been able to do it sooner, but I was very stubborn about not using bombs, and ended up wasting them on deaths. "Look, a nasty configuration of bullet wall... I can make it! I can make it! I canBOOM!...... damnit."

Also, I'd imagine you know most of the chaining strategies within the stages so that you have a very respectable score here.

I can score fine on the first 3 stages, I can THEORETICALLY full-chain the 4th stage, but I almost always screw up. I almost always break in stage 5 just before the hard part, where I usually end up dying at least once anyways. And stage 6? Haha, forget it =P

It's not enough to compete with the top JP players

No westerner in his right mind would concern himself with trying to compete with the JP psychos... err... players. I seem to do very mediocre in the STGT though =/

Maybe saying I suck was a bit strong, but I am sure as hell not very good. I bet most of the people who think they suck could roflstomp my DDP score if they put as much time into the game as I have. The trick is that very few have =P

Edit: One more bit

Ganelon wrote:So there may be a couple of bullet patterns that you still have to bomb.

Actually bullet patterns I'm generally fine with (except for a couple from the stage 6 boss). It's the bullet NOT-patterns in the actual stages that generally get me killed. Random fire from popcorn. Especially in stage 5.

captpain · Post by **captpain** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 2:17 am

Arvandor wrote:[very stubborn about not using bombs, and ended up wasting them on deaths. "Look, a nasty configuration of bullet wall... I can make it! I can make it! I canBOOM!...... damnit."

This has been my biggest obstacle in DDP recently. I can 1cc the game every time I play it if I just bomb, but it's really hard to convince myself that I should when you get huge-ass multipliers for not doing so. Blagh

jonny5 · Post by **jonny5** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:03 am

captpain wrote:
Arvandor wrote:[very stubborn about not using bombs, and ended up wasting them on deaths. "Look, a nasty configuration of bullet wall... I can make it! I can make it! I canBOOM!...... damnit."

this is my biggest problem.....i hate bombing....i rather die than bomb usually...even when i should bomb.....

i dont suck...i just dont bomb

if i bombed occasionally i would get further.....but i would feel less manly for doing so