Gun Frontier vs Battle Garegga

This is the main shmups forum. Chat about shmups in here - keep it on-topic please!
User avatar
Frederik
Posts: 2554
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:14 pm

Post by Frederik »

MikeB wrote:Good point ;)

Having said that most of those latter day CPS-2 shooters are only borderline 'retro' but they still said 'OK'
Yeah, "Retro" is a pretty fuzzy term. For instance, are games only retro up to the 16-bit era? If DOOM is retro, is Quake 1 retro too? What will be considered retro ten years from now?

From what I can tell, it roughly includes sprite based games. On the other hand, someone might be a fan of the Castlevania series, so he might enjoy Rondo of Blood for the PCE as well as the first NES game, and up to the most recent Dracula X Chronicles. So is he a retro gamer? Not really, since he´s playing a modern game on a modern console with polygon graphics, but with classic 2D gameplay.

I see what this concept appeals too, and I sure as hell would rather buy "Retro gamer" than the "Official Playstation Magazine", and the goal of bringing older games back into memory is very noble - but the term "retro" sounds a bit like "playing old games for the sake of it". I mean, nobody who buys a Beatles record or, say, Kate Bushs "Hounds Of Love" is considered a "retro music" fan (aside from those 10 CD TV-advertised collections, but in that case, it really isn´t about quality, but rather the concept of "bringing back the good old times").

I really enjoyed this old UKResistance article, it´s obviously satire with some grains of truth in it.
http://www.ukresistance.co.uk/issue10.html

And to add something, I believe this whole retro shirts and NES belts stuff has a pretty ironic taste to it. Do those people really have their NES plugged in and play Duck Hunt? I don´t know.

As whole, I feel that the term "retro" is another label that might fit to some, but includes some misleading assumptions. (But I agree that we can be glad that there are magazines that not only look at the newest bloom-drenched million budget games, unlike ten years ago. And if games like Grid Wars and Everyday Shooter enjoy remarkable success, classic gameplay seems to have a renaissance sooner or later.)
User avatar
rolins
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:28 pm
Location: Nevada

Re: !

Post by rolins »

zinger wrote: ***Battle Garegga***

Director
Kazuyuki Nakashima
Programming 68000 Side
Shinobu Yagawa
Yasunari Watanabe
Programming Z80 Side
Yuichi Ochiai
Graphics
Shinsuke Yamakawa
Mitsuakira Tatsuta
Sound effects
Manabu Namiki (Santaruru)
Test players
Mr. Daigoro, Marika F.

And what Twiddle hinted at. Gun Frontier seem to have totally randomized game mechanics, while Battle Garegga is very well balanced.
Out of curiosity is Yuichi Ochiai and Yuichi Toyama the same person?

EDIT: nevermind found out they're not the same person.
Randorama
Posts: 4079
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 10:25 pm
Contact:

Re: !

Post by Randorama »

DEL wrote:If Rando was around he'd give you a perfect answer.
The main programmer behind Garegga (Shinobu Yagawa) was a great fan of Gun Frontier. Gun Frontier, in turn, is loosely inspired to the homonimous series by Leiji Matsumoto but also to Miyazaki's works (the main plans are identical to plane piloted by Nausicaa's tribesmen).

I think Icarus may have collected some of the parallels and homages I found in the works, in the ST.
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."

I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
User avatar
icycalm
Banned User
Posts: 1081
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:15 pm
Location: Hellas/Nippon
Contact:

Post by icycalm »

I think that the label 'retro' is the second stupidest word in videogames. The first is gameplay and the third is playbility. The fourth is shmups.

Also, Rando, I would have posted a comment on your blog if I wasn't asked to register an account. I mean what the hell.
Image
User avatar
Sonic R
Posts: 1404
Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:33 pm
Location: Detroit, MI
Contact:

Post by Sonic R »

icycalm wrote:I think that the label 'retro' is the second stupidest word in videogames…
I think 'retro' is a stupid word in general. It is most worst when referring to: music, video games, toys, and cars.
Randorama
Posts: 4079
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 10:25 pm
Contact:

Post by Randorama »

icycalm wrote:I think that the label 'retro' is the second stupidest word in videogames. The first is gameplay and the third is playbility. The fourth is shmups.

Also, Rando, I would have posted a comment on your blog if I wasn't asked to register an account. I mean what the hell.
Sorry about that, at the moment I am completely out of blogging, videogaming and sleeping, I didn't even know...if it's about historical details on games, I'd be useless now. I had some infos on production teams, sources of inspiration, but I would need to find them again and they were not 100% reliable, also.

In general, I would think that some homages are obvious: the power-up system from Gun Frontier, for instance. Another example: the first stage is a close rendition of the miners' valley from Laputa (where Pazu flees from the pirates and the secret service).

In general, anyone with a good knowledge of Japanese culture and Language could be able to spot the various references. Right now I am completelely useless on this, I am afraid :?
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."

I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
MikeB
Posts: 152
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 2:20 pm
Contact:

Post by MikeB »

Hey Rando.. long time no see ;)

Hope you didn't mind me using your Slap Fight review on DAM..
User avatar
Frederik
Posts: 2554
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:14 pm

Post by Frederik »

Sonic R wrote:
icycalm wrote:I think that the label 'retro' is the second stupidest word in videogames…
I think 'retro' is a stupid word in general. It is most worst when referring to: music, video games, toys, and cars.
The first time I encountered the word "level" in a RPG context I was pretty confused. "Whoa, Secret Of Mana has 70 levels. That´s a really huge game!"
Post Reply