Xbox 360: Mushihimesama Futari 1.5 (November 2009)

[Illyrian]

That's a look that says "I know you're watching, and there's nothing you can do to stop me now..."

oh my godddd

Shit just got real...

[Skykid]

Man, what shit endings. They were better in Japanese when I couldn't understand them.

[dunpeal2064]

Man, what shit endings. They were better in Japanese when I couldn't understand them.

No joke. I just made shit up.

Reco: "I finally saved you from that fat bitch"
Palm: "yeah, now I can call you mommy."
Reco: wtf, I didn't want a kid, I'm only 15. Time to eat to make up for my sadness
Palm: ... my plan has worked. Now I shall have another fat mother to feast upon

[moozooh]

Palm: "yeah, now I can call you mommy."

I'm sure there has to be some "Have a go at my breast!" somewhere around...

[finisherr]

Okay, I can finally No Miss/No Bomb Stages 1 & 2 of God Mode. Somehow I hit a wall at Stage 3, yet AGAIN. Happens every mode it seems. Once I reach the midboss, everything gets really dicey. We'll see how things pan out. Will I give up? Tune in next time.

[Chaos Phoenixma]

There is absolutely no shame in bombing on the stage 3 midboss on Ultra/God. It's already amazing you can get that far without bombing.

I do need to get back to this game on all modes(except Ultra) sometime.

[finisherr]

There is absolutely no shame in bombing on the stage 3 midboss on Ultra/God. It's already amazing you can get that far without bombing.

I do need to get back to this game on all modes(except Ultra) sometime.

I think that Stage 3 midboss will become a standard Bomb location. Those patterns are pretty dense and fast as hell. Not worth trying to No Bomb. I am trying to conserve as many bombs as I can for Stages 4 and 5, as those totally wreck me every time. I think if I can figure out how to No Miss/No Bomb the first half pretty consistently, I might eventually have a fighting chance.

I actually bomb on the Stage 2 midboss as well. I'm not sure that you can actually No Bomb it. Every time I get close he disappears before I can finish him off. So, I guess I lied when I said I No Bomb Stage 2.

[finisherr]

Also, don't feel bad about Ultra. Gus is like, the only poster that can play Ultra decently. Maybe Sapz too? I dunno, that mode just seems too punishing.

[Cagar]

-

[finisherr]

I don't like how route-based futari is. It's like DOJ.
I should clear Maniac next, but the scoring system doesn't make me want to play. And there's no way you could hit extends without paying a lot attention to it

Dude, give Maniac a chance, but not 1.5. Play Black Label. The scoring system in Black Label Maniac and Black Label God is probably the most accessible for Cave. At first, it might not seem like it makes that much sense, but you realize that it's all about establishing a rhythm.

Here is What I do for Maniac:

1. Shoot with the regular shot until you get a fat little enemy and pop it with the laser. The thing is, in Maniac Mode there are so many enemies that you don't have to pay attention to the bar being in the red all too much. As long as you keep shooting enemies, your bar will more often then not be in the red. So, shoot with regular shot and wait for a little fatty and pop it with the laser (while the bar is still in the red, but honestly, it will likely be in the red anyway)

2. Oh shit, that big number in the left hand corner of the screen (if first player) is getting really high. So high that it actually stops climbing. At this point, you want to keep playing until you see a super fatty, one that will shoot a cazilion bullets at you (and most likely cancel a lot of bullets when you pop it). Let this super fatty shoot a bunch of bullets at you and dodge as best as you can without shooting anything. Just chill and dodge. Then, pop it with the laser when you feel comfortable doing so. This allows you to cash in on that big number you built up and rake in a bunch of points. This strategy is the same for boss fights.

3. When you get better at the game, you can start to get more up close and personal and point blank your enemies. I'm pretty sure that helps your score. Don't get too aggressive though, cause you'll just die a lot from being a psycho.

In all honesty, the basics of scoring in Maniac and God is all about this. When you know where all of those bullet canceling enemies are that shoot a million bullets, you cash in by chilling, then shooting laser. It becomes kind of a rhythm. Once you get in the flow of things, basic scoring becomes second nature and you can easily get both extends.

Also, Futari is in no way as rigid as DDP. You don't have to memorize tight lines to get those extends. In fact, in Futari Black Label Maniac, you can pretty much play loose cannon style, just as long as you keep that rhythm. If you're going for a super play type high score then sure, you'll likely have to memorize a super tight line that works for you, but...i'm not that ambitious.

Hope this changes your mind.

[Gus]

I don't like how route-based futari is. It's like DOJ.
I should clear Maniac next, but the scoring system doesn't make me want to play. And there's no way you could hit extends without paying a lot attention to it

You really should try out Ultra. If you're a fan of stuff like DFK BL Strong and DOJ and dislike Maniac's scoring system I think you'd feel right at home with Ultra's brutal difficulty and simple scoring.

I think Ultra's stage difficulty is really exaggerated. It's not easy or anything but it's still very doable if you try hard enough. I think the main reason for its reputation is the Larsa fight and the 2 TLBs that follow which are indeed very difficult as you're basically required to no miss the game to have a serious chance at clearing but thankfully unlike certain other games those fights have little effect on your overall score and it's completely possible to get the counterstop before even reaching that fight.

[finisherr]

I've been playing this with the voice sounds off. Way more enjoyable.

[burgerkingdiamond]

There is absolutely no shame in bombing on the stage 3 midboss on Ultra/God. It's already amazing you can get that far without bombing.

I do need to get back to this game on all modes(except Ultra) sometime.

I think that Stage 3 midboss will become a standard Bomb location. Those patterns are pretty dense and fast as hell. Not worth trying to No Bomb. I am trying to conserve as many bombs as I can for Stages 4 and 5, as those totally wreck me every time. I think if I can figure out how to No Miss/No Bomb the first half pretty consistently, I might eventually have a fighting chance.

I actually bomb on the Stage 2 midboss as well. I'm not sure that you can actually No Bomb it. Every time I get close he disappears before I can finish him off. So, I guess I lied when I said I No Bomb Stage 2.

I just started putting some time into God mode. You can no bomb the second mid boss no problem. I'm using Reco, normal with A-shot. One thing to note is the those grey spheres have tiny hitboxes compared to their apparent size. So they're not that hard to dodge.

[Gus]

Not that anyone cares but unless you're trying to no-miss the game with 6 bombs like ZAP did it's more profitable to just use 2 bombs on the stage 2 mid-boss while pointblanking it. The extra bullet cancel enemies that appear from killing it ASAP offer more scoring potential than just killing it normally.

[Cagar]

-

[Gus]

What's wrong with Ultra?

Just watch this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13455198

If the game still looks lame then idk what to tell you.

[Illyrian]

Well yeah? Futariball Maniac and Godmode are the two best modes out of all six, you need to get the BL version.

The only mode of the 3 that is better in 1.5 imo is original.

BL maniac and god's scoring systems are the most satisfying of any CAVE game I think

[Cagar]

-

[burgerkingdiamond]

What's wrong with Ultra?

Just watch this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13455198

If the game still looks lame then idk what to tell you.

Well yeah, it doesn't LOOK lame, but it feels lame. Difficulty is all messed up (stage 3 is way harder than stage 5, in every difficulty), patterns & enemies are fast-tapping(c) & memorizing, no real reflex-based dodging. Also, pad-controls suck hard. I don't even want to learn ultra, it's so difficult that you have no free hands while clearing it. Of course there are stupid bullet cancel tricks like in that video, but they're just as memory based as survival routes with no real skill or reflexes.

dude you don't know what you're talking about. If you want something more based on fast reflexes go play something by Psykio. Stage 3 is not harder than Stage 5. If you think playing with a pad sucks then get a stick.

[burgerkingdiamond]

Not that anyone cares but unless you're trying to no-miss the game with 6 bombs like ZAP did it's more profitable to just use 2 bombs on the stage 2 mid-boss while pointblanking it. The extra bullet cancel enemies that appear from killing it ASAP offer more scoring potential than just killing it normally.

I didn't realize that. I haven't watched any superplays so I'm not scoring very well and I don't know about those sorts of tricks.

My high score so far was just above 400M (I got to about the end of stage 3). I'm just going at it solo by my own methods.

[Gus]

Difficulty is all messed up (stage 3 is way harder than stage 5, in every difficulty),

Defintiely not in Ultra.

patterns & enemies are fast-tapping(c) & memorizing, no real reflex-based dodging.

Again, not in Ultra. Stage 2 icebergs, Stage 4 moths, various bits of Stage 5, and especially all forms of Larsa are very reflex based. Also just writing something off simply because it's memorization based is dumb. The difficulty is in the precision that's required. 2nd half of Stage 3 is pretty much all memo but not even I could NMNB it with much consistency.

Also, pad-controls suck hard.

I did all my runs on the official wireless d-pad.

I don't even want to learn ultra, it's so difficult that you have no free hands while clearing it.

I have no idea what this means.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

Not that anyone cares but unless you're trying to no-miss the game with 6 bombs like ZAP did it's more profitable to just use 2 bombs on the stage 2 mid-boss while pointblanking it.

Does this also apply to Black Label? I'm guessing not due to the massive counterdrop for bombing, but I don't have any real experience with BL yet (I'm still trying to get not shit at 1.5 O at least, used to slower bullet shmups so I'm having to adjust to the speed increases when your counter gets up there). Also, does this apply to any of the other midbosses?

(stage 3 is way harder than stage 5, in every difficulty)

...wasn't someone complaining about this before, too? I still think it's a silly claim in Original, just get used to aggressively taking out the woodlice, the boss isn't overly difficult with one of the stronger shot types either.

There's absolutely no way I can handle Ultra with my skills right now, but it's definitely a difficulty I want to work up to clearing. Looks so satisfying to get good at.

[burgerkingdiamond]

Bareknuckleroo

I believe Gus was replying to my statement about God mode. Which is the highest difficulty of Black Label.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I figured I'd doublecheck because the

Not that anyone cares

sort of made it ambiguous...

Even if he was talking about God Mode, it'd be nice to know if there's any other cases of speedkilling midbosses where it's more profitable. I can just try it out on each one manually I guess.

[Gus]

Yeah, what I said only applies to God mode with Reco. In that mode pointblanking shot with a 10k counter drives your counter up so fast it completely negates the loss from bombing. You just need to make sure to bunch up Reco's options around the target. Also I'm pretty sure that's the only point in the game where bombing can benefit your score.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

Does that mean BL Reco is potentially the better scorer of the two due to how each option on an enemy while pointblanking causes gem leeching (in addition to having a screen clearing shot)? It sounds like Palm doesn't have a comparable scoring advantage like this.

[Illyrian]

Yes. Palm's primary advantage is his speed when autoshotting. It's easier for him to get in, and get back out again.

Reco's options are just incredibly helpful for scoring, especially with a 10k stage counter as Gus mentioned.

[Gus]

Well Palm can still do the point blanking, it just won't drive up his counter as fast. ZAP did a really good job of improvising it in his replay to where I didn't really any spots where would have scored much better if he were using Reco but yeah, Reco does has a slight advantage. The end game bonus for BL pretty much goes like this

10m x (Lives) x (Bombs) x (2, assuming Spiritual Larsa is defeated)

In his world record Palm run ZAP defeated Spiritual Larsa with a score of 6.3 billion and the stage and end game bonuses were enough to push him up to 7.07 billion. For comparison NAK finished his Reco run with 7.01 billion with 4 lives and 3 bombs. Assuming he suicided at the end of the Spiritual Larsa fight that would mean he got a 240m end game bonus and very little stage bonus so he likely did finish with a higher score than ZAP did before the end game bonuses kicked in.

That isn't to say Palm is useless in Black Label. Maniac doesn't have the 10k counter thing so pointblanking doesn't play as big a role in scoring and Palm's strengths of having more control over killing things and better speeds for dodging shine through. I don't have much experience with the mode but he also seems to have a good bit more potential in Original as Darurun got 3.9 billion while finishing with only 2 lives and 2 bombs while the Reco world record guy got 3.8 billion with (I think) 5 lives and 5 bombs.

[Cuilan]

So I finally decided to buy the BL DLC since it was on sale. Futari BL would be awesome were it not for all the point-blanking.

[Illyrian]

You can hit all the score extends and have a lot of fun without pointblanking in Futariball, you know man?