Guwange 360

[brokenhalo]

At the moment we do not have any plans to put [ESPrade]out on any platform.

I could easily see a solid Arrange mode for that game too that does away with the boss milking...

rather unimaginative on my part, but i'd like to see it with a galuda style arrange.

speaking of which, I wonder if Guwange XBLA will still be counter-stoppable, as it'd be quite interesting to see some high-level competition on the leaderboards.

i'm sure that will be fixed. the question is will the few people capable of counterstopping it bother to play this port.

[Avatar Ignis]

I still think it's the wrong Cave game to premiere on the service though.

Which game do you think would be better? If any mushihimesama futari would be the best since there was such a buzz about it having "the hardest boss ever". But i think guwange has such a nice and haunting atmosphere coupled with several oddities for the genre (walking, shikigami controlling to name a few) that it can get a few devout followers.

[Estebang]

Wouldn't Ibara or Espgaluda 1 really be the ideal games with which to premiere Cave's XBLA support, since they're not MAME-supported? Even people who refused to buy stuff like Final Fight Double Impact because of emulation would have no choice but to put down the money to play the games (PS2 emulation aside, but it's extremely finicky and requires a hefty PC).

[Square King]

But i think guwange has such a nice and haunting atmosphere coupled with several oddities for the genre (walking, shikigami controlling to name a few) that it can get a few devout followers.

Don't forget the catspider, that bitch of a level 3 boss.

[krokodil_final]

Guwange was voted and it's great. I know some guys (They're not into shmups) who will buy this because of the setting. But yes, next please a game which is not on Mame. Ibara Kuro is something I want really bad.

[bcass]

Guwange was voted

Only voted by the Japanese, who happen to be the minority Xbox 360 market.

[Phellan Wolf]

I'd rather have Ibara Kuro over Ibara and on disc better than on XBLA since I am not very friendly of digital content.
IMO Guwange it is a very fair approach for Cave to appeal new gamers even if it is an old one. But what amaze me if true is their next game, if what people saw in the last Matsurin was real, I mean Dangun Fever On. Is it really a good idea??? I like the game but I don't think so since Dangun is one of their most nietzsche games.
However Esperade, with a new arrange mode will be a killer.

[Elixir]

Guwange was voted

Only voted by the Japanese, who happen to be the minority Xbox 360 market.

Perhaps you're forgetting the poll was international?

[TVG]

I asked myself why guwange, too.
It doesn't seem to be that interesting to play for score and japanese will max out the charts on day one. Don't really see the point. It could sell because of the setting tho, that's good. Fortunately dangun is next, that I like.

[bcass]

Guwange was voted

Only voted by the Japanese, who happen to be the minority Xbox 360 market.

Perhaps you're forgetting the poll was international?

The XBLA poll was not international. It wasn't made available on their English site. The only international poll Cave have held was for iPhone, which came later.

[bcass]

I asked myself why guwange, too.
It doesn't seem to be that interesting to play for score and japanese will max out the charts on day one. Don't really see the point. It could sell because of the setting tho, that's good. Fortunately dangun is next, that I like.

It's a shame that Cave don't log country like some other Xbox/XBLA titles. Outrun has little flags next to each score.

[Elixir]

The XBLA poll was not international. It wasn't made available on their English site. The only international poll Cave have held was for iPhone, which came later.

Oh right, it was not international. Whatever I still voted for Guwange anyway.

[Taylor]

Guwange was voted

Only voted by the Japanese, who happen to be the minority Xbox 360 market.

They're still the majority shmup market.

[bcass]

That might have something to do with the fact that almost all retail shmups don't get released outside that country. If the DeathSmiles NA sales estimates are to be believed, the NA release outsold the JPN release. Even if the EUR release sells dismally, those sales combined with the NA sales will easily outnumber JPN sales. Also, we don't have sufficient data for downloadable titles. For all we know, the vast majority of download sales might be coming from non-JPN countries.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

plus its worth remebering that a good portion of the Jap DS sales will be from outside Japan anyway so (i hope) it should be clear to Cave where their main market is.

[NR777]

Dangun is one of their most nietzsche games.
.

Dangun ist der ubermensch?

[Thjodbjorn]

Dangun is one of their most nietzsche games.
.

Dangun ist der ubermensch?

That made my day.

[Shuurin]

That might have something to do with the fact that almost all retail shmups don't get released outside that country. If the DeathSmiles NA sales estimates are to be believed, the NA release outsold the JPN release. Even if the EUR release sells dismally, those sales combined with the NA sales will easily outnumber JPN sales. Also, we don't have sufficient data for downloadable titles. For all we know, the vast majority of download sales might be coming from non-JPN countries.

I think to make that statement worth its own weight is if Cave did all the publishing for all regions and priced them equally in all regions. Which just isn't the case. Deathsmiles SE was around the 7,000~8,000 yen region when it was first released which Cave themselves developed and published. Then a Platinum Collection edition hit for 3,800 yen.

The retail for the US one was $40 in this economy is still a discount when compared to the JP Platinum Collection version. Higher sales numbers in the US and possibly Europe doesn't exactly = more profit for Cave when directly compared to their sales in Japan.

Now the information we don't know and have no real way to find out. What sort of deal was struck with Aksys and the Euro localizing company? How much does Cave earn back per US/EU version of the game? The localizing companies have got to put bread on their table too. So I think at best Cave either gets a small amount of each disc sold or they (localizing companies) bought the entire rights to the game for a price and any number of discs sold in their region is their profit alone. So it is very hard to say if Cave is making more money internationally than in Japan.

With XBLA I think the profit will be easier for Cave to keep no mater who buys regardless of region. As Akeda was quoted with saying in an interview on this thread, that there is less of a risk for them as its cheaper to put the games up on XBLA than to print 50k games discs + boxes and sit on maybe 10k of them. Hence the much more modest $10 price for Guwange.

[Jockel]

Dangun is one of their most nietzsche games.
.

Dangun ist der ubermensch?

Gehst du zu einer Frau, vergiss die Peitsche nicht!

[NR777]

Dangun is one of their most nietzsche games.
.

Dangun ist der ubermensch?

Gehst du zu einer Frau, vergiss die Peitsche nicht!

I won't forget.

[bcass]

That might have something to do with the fact that almost all retail shmups don't get released outside that country. If the DeathSmiles NA sales estimates are to be believed, the NA release outsold the JPN release. Even if the EUR release sells dismally, those sales combined with the NA sales will easily outnumber JPN sales. Also, we don't have sufficient data for downloadable titles. For all we know, the vast majority of download sales might be coming from non-JPN countries.

I think to make that statement worth its own weight is if Cave did all the publishing for all regions and priced them equally in all regions. Which just isn't the case. Deathsmiles SE was around the 7,000~8,000 yen region when it was first released which Cave themselves developed and published. Then a Platinum Collection edition hit for 3,800 yen.

The retail for the US one was $40 in this economy is still a discount when compared to the JP Platinum Collection version. Higher sales numbers in the US and possibly Europe doesn't exactly = more profit for Cave when directly compared to their sales in Japan.

Now the information we don't know and have no real way to find out. What sort of deal was struck with Aksys and the Euro localizing company? How much does Cave earn back per US/EU version of the game? The localizing companies have got to put bread on their table too. So I think at best Cave either gets a small amount of each disc sold or they (localizing companies) bought the entire rights to the game for a price and any number of discs sold in their region is their profit alone. So it is very hard to say if Cave is making more money internationally than in Japan.

With XBLA I think the profit will be easier for Cave to keep no mater who buys regardless of region. As Akeda was quoted with saying in an interview on this thread, that there is less of a risk for them as its cheaper to put the games up on XBLA than to print 50k games discs + boxes and sit on maybe 10k of them. Hence the much more modest $10 price for Guwange.

Errrm, profit is irrelevant. It's not what we were discussing. We were discussing that the US sales outnumbered JPN sales, which means Japan, in this instance, is the minority market, not the majority market, as stated by Taylor. Of course, we can only compare one game right now, as far as Cave are concerned, because they have only localised one game so far.

[StarCreator]

Errrm, profit is irrelevant. It's not what we were discussing. We were discussing that the US sales outnumbered JPN sales, which means Japan, in this instance, is the minority market, not the majority market, as stated by Taylor. Of course, we can only compare one game right now, as far as Cave are concerned, because they have only localised one game so far.

I don't know about you, but if I were running a company, profit would be the only thing I'd care about. The sales numbers seem pretty meaningless to me, especially if the higher sales number is worth less than half per sale than the lower.

Plus, we're dealing with a country that has more than its fair share of individuals and companies that are xenophobic to the point that they will make completely absurd decisions regarding other countries.

[Shuurin]

Errrm, profit is irrelevant. It's not what we were discussing. We were discussing that the US sales outnumbered JPN sales, which means Japan, in this instance, is the minority market, not the majority market, as stated by Taylor. Of course, we can only compare one game right now, as far as Cave are concerned, because they have only localised one game so far.

Profit when talking business is never irrelevant. What are you insane? Cave is not a game company solely to put a smile on your face. They are one part passion and two parts profit. They would have closed their doors long ago if they listened to numbers over profit. In other words discussing solely numbers without taking into account the bigger picture is bad business. Saying Cave should pay more attention to the West because we bought a little more of their product than the Japanese at a rate of less than half of the original retail price is simply absurd.

[bcass]

This is all my original posts were responding to:

"They're still the majority shmup market."

In the case of DeathSmiles, that statement isn't true.

You may now continue with the separate, no doubt highly fascinating, conversation about profits, amongst yourselves...

[Shuurin]

This is all my original posts were responding to:

"They're still the majority shmup market."

In the case of DeathSmiles, that statement isn't true.

And I was saying a bit more winded that in the case of Deathsmiles Japan is still the majority shmup market. Taylor's statement is valid.

[originalz]

Japan is still the main market because they can sell their games for 7000+ yen and get decent sales. Try to price a game like that for $70+ and see if the numbers are still higher.

[Danza]

In Australia new release games sometimes go for $120 AUD. This is less frequent now, but still.. and we are basically on parity with the greenback.

It is considerably cheaper for me to buy imports than purchase games locally. Anyway, sorry about the digression.

[evil_ash_xero]

Japan is still the main market because they can sell their games for 7000+ yen and get decent sales. Try to price a game like that for $70+ and see if the numbers are still higher.

That's a good point.

[bcass]

This is all my original posts were responding to:

"They're still the majority shmup market."

In the case of DeathSmiles, that statement isn't true.

And I was saying a bit more winded that in the case of Deathsmiles Japan is still the majority shmup market. Taylor's statement is valid.

Have you seen the US sales estimates? Also, do you know how many of those JPN sales went to non-Japanese buyers? When Taylor uses the word "majority" he is obviously referring to units, not profit.

[THE]

Also, do you know how many of those JPN sales went to non-Japanese buyers?

Maybe 2000 units. Much more than that is very doubt able, as importing for the x360 was pain in the ass back then and even now people still make a lot of drama on buying a jpn. x360...