An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

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fernan1234
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by fernan1234 »

SMLMcKenzie wrote: Wed Jan 22, 2025 10:08 am I would be very interested in seeing some screenshots from games. Is there much difference between this mod and the buttersoft / Torapu mod in design? Do you have any more information about the new kit that is being developed?
I just posted some pics in this imgur album: https://imgur.com/a/G72fN4Y

These are shots of a CRT so it's not quite the same as looking at it in person. It is a very sharp, 900TVL CRT for what it's worth.

I included shots of the Star Fox menu that seemed to have overshoot. Not seeing it here but you can take a look for yourself.

The design for this mod by MM seems cleaner, there are pics here: https://mikejmoffitt.com/pages/shvc-rgb/index.html

As for the new one in development, not really much info other than it supporting more board revisions: https://x.com/Kaede_MoEdayo/status/1881285934542647434
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by evil_ash_xero »

That does look quite good.
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Josh128
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by Josh128 »

fernan1234 wrote: Sat Jan 25, 2025 3:49 pm
SMLMcKenzie wrote: Wed Jan 22, 2025 10:08 am I would be very interested in seeing some screenshots from games. Is there much difference between this mod and the buttersoft / Torapu mod in design? Do you have any more information about the new kit that is being developed?
I just posted some pics in this imgur album: https://imgur.com/a/G72fN4Y

These are shots of a CRT so it's not quite the same as looking at it in person. It is a very sharp, 900TVL CRT for what it's worth.

I included shots of the Star Fox menu that seemed to have overshoot. Not seeing it here but you can take a look for yourself.

The design for this mod by MM seems cleaner, there are pics here: https://mikejmoffitt.com/pages/shvc-rgb/index.html

As for the new one in development, not really much info other than it supporting more board revisions: https://x.com/Kaede_MoEdayo/status/1881285934542647434
Do you have a link to PCB/kit to order? BTW, your CRT looks impeccable. SVGA caliber geometry.
fernan1234
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by fernan1234 »

Josh128 wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 2:45 pm Do you have a link to PCB/kit to order? BTW, your CRT looks impeccable. SVGA caliber geometry.
Unfortunately I don't know of anyone selling ready-made kits. I bought a pre-modded console from the guy who is developing the new mod kit that I linked earlier. He only seems to offer it in pre-modded consoles at the moment. Not sure if he plans to share details about the kit later. This week he was working on adjusting the mod on a GPM board, and now he seems to be working on an APU, which appears to offer the best results. It does seem to give results virtually on par with a 1Chip: https://x.com/Kaede_MoEdayo/status/1885539600091001111

Would be interesting to compare this with Voultar's kit at some point.

And thanks, that CRT is a JVC DT-V, basically an SVGA tube in a multiformat-capable chassis and it is relatively easy to get really nice geometry on it.
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by evil_ash_xero »

fernan1234 wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 3:23 pm
It does seem to give results virtually on par with a 1Chip: https://x.com/Kaede_MoEdayo/status/1885539600091001111

The modded console actually looks sharper than the 1Chip, if I am translating that Japanese correctly. The right picture's letters are sharper.
I'm very curious how Voultar's chip looks. I'm waiting for his to go on sale, where you don't have to get them modded by him.
I don't know how long that will be, though.
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Josh128
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by Josh128 »

evil_ash_xero wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2025 1:51 pm
fernan1234 wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 3:23 pm
It does seem to give results virtually on par with a 1Chip: https://x.com/Kaede_MoEdayo/status/1885539600091001111

The modded console actually looks sharper than the 1Chip, if I am translating that Japanese correctly. The right picture's letters are sharper.
I'm very curious how Voultar's chip looks. I'm waiting for his to go on sale, where you don't have to get them modded by him.
I don't know how long that will be, though.
That comparison is very sus if the left image is supposed to be a 1 chip. My dirty modded mini/Jr should be roughly equivalent to a one chip and its virtually perfect. Something is wrong there.
fernan1234
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by fernan1234 »

Josh128 wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2025 11:02 pm That comparison is very sus if the left image is supposed to be a 1 chip. My dirty modded mini/Jr should be roughly equivalent to a one chip and its virtually perfect. Something is wrong there.
It seems like his scaler and capture setup is not ideal. He does have a Retrotink 5X, but may not have optimal settings. So these comparisons at best can give you a sense of the difference the mods are making.
SMLMcKenzie
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by SMLMcKenzie »

Looks like the price of Voultar's edge enhancer is going up. Can't imagine what the cost of the DIY version will be whenever that releases.

https://www.timeextension.com/news/2025 ... aming-gear

Right now you can put together the Torapu / Buttersoft version for about £30 for three mod chips ( minimum order of 3 PCB's) so £10 each if you sell two on.
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LDigital
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by LDigital »

How do I get one? I can’t find info on it at all. Does the torapu/buttersoft work on gpm-02?
SMLMcKenzie
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by SMLMcKenzie »

You need to make it yourself but if you are reasonably decent at soldering it's not too hard. Info on how to build it is here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/snes/comments/ ... t1_mc5jjuk

I have been using my Torapu/Buttersoft modded Super Famicom for over a month and I am extremely happy with the results. I honestly don't think you can get that much better picture quality out of a 2 chip SNES. There are some supposed image anomaly's using the mod but during regular gameplay, not pixel peeping, I have not once seen any issues. It is the best SNES mod available right now for DIY installers.
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unmaker
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by unmaker »

I used the torapu/buttersoft mod for years and I was happy with the results during that time. A while back I swapped it out for mikejmoffitt's v1.2 3-CHIP sharpening board which is based on yoshiyukiblade's circuit discussed here:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=70196

After comparing both I can say that mikejmoffitt's board is the better of the two and IMO the best option currently available. It doesn't have the non-linear issue that the torapu mod has and it can have an output that is basically on par with a 1-CHIP. There is a caveat though. In order to get 1-CHIP levels of the sharpness, the installed board needs to have its sharpness compensation values adjusted. Ideally this is done on a per console basis since the amount of blur varies from console to console, even with the same motherboard revision. This is actually one of the benefits of yoshiyukiblade's circuit. Since the sharpness is adjustable, each console can have its sharpness optimized, regardless of how blurry the stock output is. This has been my experience after having now installed 9 of these boards.

To better illustrate this I'll post some oscilloscope plots since the blur can be measured using an oscilloscope. I'll also include an accompanying lossless capture for each. These captures were taken using a RetroTINK-4K into a Datapath-E1S capture card.

Here's how the blur of a stock SHVC-CPU-01 looks:

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And here's a SNES Jr. which has been RGB bypassed using borti4938's board:

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Now take a look at the rise and fall times of each. A stock 3-CHIP has roughly a rise time of 100ns and a fall time of 250ns. The SNES Jr. (which is basically a 1-CHIP) has rise and fall times that are roughly 20ns. The much faster rise and fall times of a 1-CHIP yields a much sharper output. In short, we can say that the faster the rise and fall times are, the sharper the output.

Now here's the same SHVC-CPU-01 console with mikejmoffitt's board installed:

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The rise and fall times have been sped up, roughly cut in half. This is noticeable in the capture as well where we can see the blur is significantly reduced. Depending on your setup, with say a CRT or a scaler with generic settings applied, this last bit of blur won't be so noticeable.

Now here's the same console after the sharpness compensation values have been optimized:

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The rise and fall times have been sped up even further and they're now on par with the SNES Jr./1-CHIP. That remaining blur on Mega Man is now all but gone. If you look closely you can see there is a tiny amount of blur left but that's splitting hairs. I don't think anyone sitting a normal gaming distance away from their display would be able to notice it.

Here's the same SHVC-CPU-01 console with the torapu/buttersoft board installed for comparison:

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The output with this mod has really fast fall times but slow rise times. As I understand, this combination of fast fall times with slow rise times means it's non-linear. This creates more of a filter effect over the blur rather than reversing the blur like the yoshiyukiblade circuit does. The output looks similar to using the OSSC's Reverse LPF feature.

I still think the torapu/buttersoft mod is a decent option despite it being non-linear. It's inexpensive if you DIY, easy to install, and easily reversible if you decide to go with another option in the future. But if I had to pick between the two, I would definitely go with mikejmoffitt's board.
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bobrocks95
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by bobrocks95 »

Great post with very high-quality captures.

Are these "sharpness compensation values" part of the mikejmoffit board itself? I'd switch back to a 3-chip if they can look like that. Is it applicable to all color transitions without overshoot or are there some small drawbacks to it?
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SMLMcKenzie
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by SMLMcKenzie »

Is it not the case that the mike moffit mod is only compatible with one revision of SNES motherboard? There are also efforts ongoing on the console mods.org discord to improve the Torapu / buttersoft mod.

No doubt the moffit board looks great though.
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Re: An actual SNES mod to sharpen the pixels of 2-CHIP consoles?

Post by yoshiyukiblade »

@unmaker
Great comparison screenshots and scope plots. It's crazy that people still struggle with proper capture in 2025 lol. So it's nice to see a competent analysis between the available options. I'm also glad to see mods out in the wild based on the research I did. The noise level and blur compensation looks better than what I've seen on my own console. Not sure if mikejmoffitt did some additional work to help with that, or if it's a difference between PPU revisions.

I have a GPM-02 board with PPU2 Rev C. The SHVC-CPU-01 probably has Rev A or even no revision (I think they exist?). It looks like there was a die size reduction between them. Not sure if it was a true "die shrink" because the logic blocks look pretty similar in size. The layout just looks more compact with little open space. I always wondered if the smaller die size meant longer lead frames and thus more capacitance/inductance, making it more difficult to compensate. External digital signals entering the chip and internal switching can couple to the analog section more strongly due to the smaller area as well.

I overlapped two die shots, resizing and aligning them with the DAC section. The DAC looks virtually the same in both revisions.
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@bobrocks95
Sharpness is compensated with a simple capacitor. Increasing the capacitance value will sharpen it more, until it becomes unstable (starts ringing and oscillating if pushed too far).

I've been out of the game for a while now due to life changes, but I'm starting to get the itch to mod again.
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