NESRGB New Firmware Palette Updates:

[FBX]

Same here: I prefer the untouched olive / no bum in saturation way.

But you're going to end with something so close to NESCAP that it's perhaps best to keep it the way it is now for diversity.

I've compared the two and my current wip is a little brighter a tad more vivid, but they are virtually identical hue-wise. One thing I found interesting is both our captures agree on the flesh tones, whereas they seem pulled more towards yellow on the NES Classic.

[xadox]

+1 for 100% raw capture palette. No saturation adjustments, no slight color corrections, no nothing. If that is how Nintendo intended it to be when they originally designed the NES, then that is how it shall be done. Honestly how many other games use that olive color anyway? It can't be much.

It's interesting because when I first started this project, everyone whined about those olive colors. "Eww Mario's got a green mustache" and "What's with Metroid's title screen having that green tint on the ground?". People swore the raw capture hue just didn't look right, but now that there's confirmation from both the NES Classic and RGBSources own direct capture, it seems everyone is okay with it now?

I think there will always be two fronts. Finaly it is your decision
I doesn't matter any way you did a great job!

[yxkalle]

Corrected browns look better to me.

[blizzz]

Why not release two versions. One with corrected browns and one that's accurate.

I'm thinking about getting an RGB mod for christmas and my current favorites for the palettes would be: NESCAP, Unsaturated WIP with corrected browns, Hybrid

Edit: I realized that there's no way to make your own palette selection.

[FinalBaton]

I think Unsaturated V6 looks better than Unsaturated Final.

Is V6 the one that's on the latest firmware update? That's the one I'm interested in

[austin532]

Why not release two versions. One with corrected browns and one that's accurate.

Because he has to pay Tim a nice chunk of change for each palette update. I think...

If not than I would also prefer two different palettes.

[FBX]

Funnily enough I was thinking last night about offering both versions. The new wip looks virtually identical to NESCAP, but just a slight hair more vivid. Here's a side-by-side look at the two on Contra's title screen (NESCAP left, Nostalgia right):



As you can see, the hues came out identically, but mine is just a hair more vivid (which I don't mind at all). FYI the Framemeister color settings for this ended up being 24-5-0-24, A/D 128, RGB set to Auto (to force YPbPr output), range set to full.

At any rate, I'm going to call the two offerings "Nostalgia" and "Nostalgia-Gold" to denote the difference between raw and corrected olive colors.

So the two firmwares I'm looking at would be:

PC-10 >>> Nostalgia >>> Nostalgia-Gold

PC-10 >>> NES Classic >>> Unsaturated-Final


That would cover everyone's bases I think.

[austin532]

So what's the difference between Nostalgia Gold and Unsaturated Final if they both have the corrected olive color?

[blizzz]

Imo a perfect palette selection would be:

• Accurate interpretation of the composite colors
• "Optimized" version of the composite colors (corrected olives)
• Vivid palette with blue sky in Mario etc

I'm also a bit confused about the difference between Nostalgia Gold and Unsaturated Final. And is the Playchoice 10 palette actually popular, or is it just included because it's an "official" palette? From what I've seen it is way too saturated, especially the yellow color. Wouldn't a palette like Hybrid be a better alternative to offer a vibrant option without overdoing it? Or maybe a hybrid between Hybrid and PC-10? lol

But from what I understand, the first option (PC-10, Nostalgia, Nostalgia-Gold) is basically what I want, right?

[FBX]

I'm also a bit confused about the difference between Nostalgia Gold and Unsaturated Final.

Unsaturated-Final is two notches more intense in saturation, which got a few complaints about looking a little too saturated. Nostalgia was made in response to that, and is designed to be more a 'neutral' capture.

Here's the difference between the two again:

[xadox]

I loose track of the different kind of palettes

IMO A raw one and a little bit more vivid one like the Hybrid would be great.

[jdawg131]

FYI the Framemeister color settings for this ended up being 24-5-0-24, A/D 128, RGB set to Auto (to force YPbPr output), range set to full.

Are those color settings Brightness, Gamma, Black, and Saturation? I only ask, because I can only modify Brightness, Gamma, and Black. Saturation is grayed out.

[PascalP]

I personally prefer the corrected olive colors.
But if you end up going for pure raw, I think my best bet is to stay on the Unsaturated-V6 palette then?

Or is it also possible to replace another palette with one of yours, so that I could switch between;
Unsaturated-V6 (with corrected colors) -> Unsaturated-WIP (with raw colors) -> Playchoice 10

[austin532]

So when testing out different games I noticed something interesting. There is a huge difference in the background of Woodman's stage. It appears greenish with NESCAP and brownish with Unsaturated Final.

[FBX]

So when testing out different games I noticed something interesting. There is a huge difference in the background of Woodman's stage. It appears greenish with NESCAP and brownish with Unsaturated Final.

We've already discussed this. It's the dark olive correction, which is in both Unsaturated-Final and Nostalgia-Gold. Nostalgia sports the unmodified color. Here's the comparison between the two:

[FBX]

FYI the Framemeister color settings for this ended up being 24-5-0-24, A/D 128, RGB set to Auto (to force YPbPr output), range set to full.

Are those color settings Brightness, Gamma, Black, and Saturation? I only ask, because I can only modify Brightness, Gamma, and Black. Saturation is grayed out.

Because you're trying to adjust it from an RGB input. Try it via the Video input on the front. Remember that the NES can only do composite video.

[blizzz]

My suggestion would be: Nostalgia + Nostalgia-Gold + Hybrid

About the other palettes:
PC-10: The over-saturated yellow makes it look very unappealing to me.
FCUX (improved): Not bad for a very vivid option, but it's just a bit too far. Hybrid is a better compromise between the colorful emulator look and the original.
NES Classic: Looks a bit darker and more yellowish than Nostalgia-Gold. Nostalgia-Gold looks more consistent to me.
Unsaturated-Final: Saturation wise this seems to be quite similar to Hybrid, but color wise it's just a more intense Nostalgia-Gold. Hybrid has the slightly "fixed" blue sky in Mario and since this set already has Nostalgia-Gold I think Hybrid is the better choice.

If you're making a second option then I'd go with PC-10 + Nostalgia + Unsaturated-Final.

[xadox]

Nostalgia + Nostalgia-Gold + Hybrid
+1

Never used PC-10 so far.

[FBX]

In thinking on it myself, Nostalgia-gold seems redundant. Unsaturated-Final already fills the eye-candy niche, so I might as well stick with it.

So maybe something like the following offerings:

PC-10 >>> Nostalgia >>> Unsaturated-Final

NES Classic >>> Nostalgia >>> Unsaturated-Final

All bases are covered, and people can simply choose whether they want the PC-10 palette or NES Classic. Speaking of which, my NES Classic will arriving this evening. I can hardly wait to dig into that sucker's palette, although I have noticed from RGBSource's direct capture of it that the noise mask adds in about a 20 to 25 point grey wash on all hues. For example, the dark green that should be 0-70-0 ends up being 24-68-24. That's kind of

[xadox]

Is there an easy way generating the POF file by self with individual palettes?
Or is only etim able to generate the file?

[Ikaruga11]

I trust you guys will do the best job.

[Triple Lei]

Gee, I wanted the two official ones:

1. PC-10
2. NES Classic
3. the latest "uncorrected" palette

On a side note, I just ordered some of those NESRGB JTAG Adapters from OSH Park. Had I known they were that cheap ($2.40 for three shipped!) I would've made an account there much sooner.

[FBX]

Gee, I wanted the two official ones:

1. PC-10
2. NES Classic
3. the latest "uncorrected" palette

On a side note, I just ordered some of those NESRGB JTAG Adapters from OSH Park. Had I known they were that cheap ($2.40 for three shipped!) I would've made an account there much sooner.

You really want PC-10?

If I can talk/pay Tim into, I'll ask if he would do 3 firmware options to cover everyone.

Anyway, I'll write back in the morning with progress on the NES Classic (due to arrive this evening). I've got a raid night in Warcraft (yeah I know I got suckered back into it), so it will take me until morning to get something cohesive going.

[Elrinth]

Gee, I wanted the two official ones:

1. PC-10
2. NES Classic
3. the latest "uncorrected" palette

On a side note, I just ordered some of those NESRGB JTAG Adapters from OSH Park. Had I known they were that cheap ($2.40 for three shipped!) I would've made an account there much sooner.

Jebus christ. Thanx for the tips Triple Lei! I ordered aswell... $2.40 for 3 shipped to sweden.. yay. not sure why I needed three tho. but oh well, the more the merrier right?
Personally, I can be without the PC-10, now that u guys made these new wonderful palettes!

[thebeautifulones]

My vote:
PC-10
Classic NES
Unsaturated Final

Thanks for all the hard work, FBX.

[austin532]

So both the NESCAP and Unsaturated V6 are raw captures but they are different with the olive color. Which one is correct?

[nakedarthur]

Sorry, might be a dumb question but do the OSH Jtag adapters come populated with the connector and pins or do you have to do that yourself?

[Tatsuya79]

So both the NESCAP and Unsaturated V6 are raw captures but they are different with the olive color. Which one is correct?

The greenish brown of Nescap (and Nostalgia) is similar to what the NES delivered.

The brown with less green / more red of Unsaturated is the "ideal color" that should be right between those two tints in the palette that are dark green and dark brown.
But that's different from the real NES.

[FBX]

Update:

NES Classic arrived and I've already been hard at work capturing gameplay to rip the palette. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the colors are not washed out at all in Pixel Perfect mode, and I'm getting vibrant and beautiful colors thus far! I don't know why RGBSource's rip came out so grey-washed, because that's not showing up at all on my end. Perhaps he ripped from a different screen mode like CRT?

At any rate, here's a teaser wip of stage 2 in Castlevania from the NES Classic:



I'll be back at it all through the night after raid.

[austin532]

FBX, do you have the Nostalgia palette ready for download yet? I'd like to compare it to NESCAP.