Gunstar Super Heroes -- on GBA, screens inside!

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:08 am

Alien Soldier is worth any price you have to pay to get it. It is simply put the best game on Megadrive, and one of the greatest games ever made IMO.
Apparently it's gonna be on the Treasure Sega Ages collection though, so you don't have to subsist on dry toast for a month cuz you shelled out for the Jpn MD version (which is what I had to do...

).

Moogs · Post by **Moogs** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:09 pm

I thought the overhead shooting level was an homage to Thunder Blade, which would explain why it is the way it is. It's better than that Flicky level.

Cos I hate Flicky.

PepsimanVsJoe · Post by **PepsimanVsJoe** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:08 pm

Nope, I don't like it.

Disappointing to say the least.

Xexyz · Post by **Xexyz** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:29 pm

Yup, a Thunder Blade homage it was. I found it worse than the Flicky homage. Why did Treasure insist on making these homages to old Sega games? If they were left out and/or replaced by regular Gunstar action levels I don't think Sega would have had a problem.

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:08 pm

Xexyz wrote:Yup, a Thunder Blade homage it was. I found it worse than the Flicky homage. Why did Treasure insist on making these homages to old Sega games? If they were left out and/or replaced by regular Gunstar action levels I don't think Sega would have had a problem.

Silly homages like this drive me nuts. That's why I can barely stand to play Nintendo licensed games these days. Quit jerking off over your old franchises.

Dylan1CC · Post by **Dylan1CC** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 12:25 am

Seven Force wrote:Alien Soldier is worth any price you have to pay to get it. It is simply put the best game on Megadrive, and one of the greatest games ever made IMO.
Apparently it's gonna be on the Treasure Sega Ages collection though, so you don't have to subsist on dry toast for a month cuz you shelled out for the Jpn MD version (which is what I had to do... ).

Maybe I'll save money, the only way I will buy it is if they also include the original version unlike the other Sega Ages remakes.

Last night and today I played they heck out of Black's boss alley game. My faves are the Blob, the moving turrent battle, and luring the evil teddy bear in front of the big mack truck.

Black's spider mech is just evil. Can't beat him so far. One strategy I use that works half well is using a fully charged homing lazer which brings him down a bit, but then he starts shooting little homing missles and I buy it.

Any suggestions?

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 6:02 am

Andi wrote:
Xexyz wrote:Yup, a Thunder Blade homage it was. I found it worse than the Flicky homage. Why did Treasure insist on making these homages to old Sega games? If they were left out and/or replaced by regular Gunstar action levels I don't think Sega would have had a problem.
Silly homages like this drive me nuts. That's why I can barely stand to play Nintendo licensed games these days. Quit jerking off over your old franchises.

Huh? Nintendo usually gets their homages right, especially in Wario Ware games. It's not like Treasure purposely put the homages in to mess the game up. If those homages were replaced by the original Gunstar levels, there would be even more complaining about how the game is too much like the original Gunstar.

Dylan1CC, from what I heard about the Gunstar collection, it seems very likely they will be ports. SEGA took over from D3.

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:58 pm

BrianC wrote:Huh? Nintendo usually gets their homages right, especially in Wario Ware games. It's not like Treasure purposely put the homages in to mess the game up. If those homages were replaced by the original Gunstar levels, there would be even more complaining about how the game is too much like the original Gunstar.

Gets them right? I just think that degree of patting one's self on the back is pathetic, regardless of how it affects game play. And of course Treasure didn't put the homage levels in to "purposely mess up the game", no company would do that. However, they do detract from the game as a whole. So Treasure's intentions are really a moot point.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 5:24 pm

Andi wrote:
BrianC wrote:Huh? Nintendo usually gets their homages right, especially in Wario Ware games. It's not like Treasure purposely put the homages in to mess the game up. If those homages were replaced by the original Gunstar levels, there would be even more complaining about how the game is too much like the original Gunstar.
Gets them right? I just think that degree of patting one's self on the back is pathetic, regardless of how it affects game play. And of course Treasure didn't put the homage levels in to "purposely mess up the game", no company would do that. However, they do detract from the game as a whole. So Treasure's intentions are really a moot point.

I think the degree that Nintendo gets bashed for promoting their franchises is pathetic. Yes, there are a few disappointing pokemon spinoffs and a couple disappointing games like Yoshi's Story and Super Mario Sunshine (though I like it, I do think it could have been much better), but their Zelda games are usually top quality and most of the Mario spinoffs turned out good. Zelda Four Swords for GCN is a very well done game and a clever idea (multiplayer Zelda). Some games with franchise characters from Nintendo have very original gameplay like Kirby Canvus Curse, but they STILL get labelled as rehashes just becuase they use characters from one of their franchises.

Homages to older games isn't the same as "selling out". It doesn't always mean that companies are "patting themseleves on the back". It's often a clever nod to previous games. They also don't have to be from the same company that makes the games. IMO, if done right, homages can help improve a game. Seriously, the Wario Ware homages fit into the plot and gameplay of the game and only serve to make it better.

Just becuase you don't care for how Nintendo promotes their games doesn't mean they don't get any of their homages right. Wario Ware takes bits and pieces from previous Nintendo games and uses them in very clever ways. Mario vs. Donkey Kong is a clever homage to Donkey Kong '94 and that game is different enough from the original to stand on its own.

Anyway, not everyone dislikes the homages in Gunstar Super Heroes (haven't played yet so I don't have an opinion of them), but if the Thunder Blade section had a smaller hitbox, would you still be complaining?

Dylan1CC · Post by **Dylan1CC** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:31 pm

re: the Nintendo/homage/"rehash thread: What BrianC said.

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:26 am

Dylan1CC wrote: Black's spider mech is just evil. Can't beat him so far. One strategy I use that works half well is using a fully charged homing lazer which brings him down a bit, but then he starts shooting little homing missles and I buy it.

Any suggestions?

Slide to the left as soon as the left spider leg gets up, then use the first weapon choice (I'm playing as Red, haven't used Blue yet) to shoot Black. Black will then move to the opposite side of his spider mech, but still use the same sliding method when the mech's left leg moves up. There will be columns of fire as his main attack of choice, but they're pretty easy to memorize and dodge.

When Black's HP is at 100, he will start rolling around the area counter-clockwise. There are two methods I use: you can either take the riskier method by using an uppercut jump that can hurt Black and get behind him at the same time while shooting at him with weapon choice #1, or you can do short kick jumps that will eventually get you behind Black so that you can use the guided laser weapon.

Choice #2 takes a while longer than Choice #1 on taking Black down, but it's safer (I died a few more times using choice #1; sometimes Black's mech would touch Red and I'd get hurt instead of uppercutting him).

Hope that helps out.

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:52 am

Does the file crusher do anything? I keep playing it, always drop back out at the bottom and can't get it to say "clear". Is there a secret exit or something?

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:05 pm

well learnt a few things.

Need rapid reload

theres a GBA-GC adaptor! to play em on TV???? please confirm! if so will the DS work 2?

I loved gunstar and alien soldier, but is this gsh just a remake of gunstar heroes or a new game entirely?

How many minutes would it take to beat if you knew what your doing>?

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 4:15 pm

BrianC wrote:Anyway, not everyone dislikes the homages in Gunstar Super Heroes (haven't played yet so I don't have an opinion of them), but if the Thunder Blade section had a smaller hitbox, would you still be complaining?

The biggest problem is that I would much rather being playing a side-scrolling Gunstar-style level that fits with the rest of the game instead of a top down shooter segment that was just been shoehorned in.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:26 pm

Diabollokus wrote:well learnt a few things.

Need rapid reload

theres a GBA-GC adaptor! to play em on TV???? please confirm! if so will the DS work 2?

I loved gunstar and alien soldier, but is this gsh just a remake of gunstar heroes or a new game entirely?

How many minutes would it take to beat if you knew what your doing>?

The official Nintendo Gameboy Player has been around for awhile and also plays GB/GBC games. There's another adapter, but I doubt that it's as good as the Gameboy Player. From what I heard, Gunstar Super Heroes is a semi-remake with new levels.

oxtsu · Post by **oxtsu** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:50 pm

Andi wrote:
BrianC wrote:Anyway, not everyone dislikes the homages in Gunstar Super Heroes (haven't played yet so I don't have an opinion of them), but if the Thunder Blade section had a smaller hitbox, would you still be complaining?
The biggest problem is that I would much rather being playing a side-scrolling Gunstar-style level that fits with the rest of the game instead of a top down shooter segment that was just been shoehorned in.

I don't know why you guys are calling that section a homage to Thunderblade (which is a 3D-like on-rails shooter, IIRC). It's more like a cross between Rayforce and Zero Gunner, for kids. I thought it was shit at first because the field is so cramped, but it's actually pretty nice once you figure out how to destroy the enemies quickly and use the ship rotation mechanic.

Moogs · Post by **Moogs** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:28 am

oxtsu wrote:
Andi wrote:
BrianC wrote:Anyway, not everyone dislikes the homages in Gunstar Super Heroes (haven't played yet so I don't have an opinion of them), but if the Thunder Blade section had a smaller hitbox, would you still be complaining?
The biggest problem is that I would much rather being playing a side-scrolling Gunstar-style level that fits with the rest of the game instead of a top down shooter segment that was just been shoehorned in.
I don't know why you guys are calling that section a homage to Thunderblade (which is a 3D-like on-rails shooter, IIRC). It's more like a cross between Rayforce and Zero Gunner, for kids. I thought it was shit at first because the field is so cramped, but it's actually pretty nice once you figure out how to destroy the enemies quickly and use the ship rotation mechanic.

Thunder Blade had overhead view levels.

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:01 am

Beat the game tonight. Final boss fight was, well, underwhelming. Some backstory gaps were put to rest, while others were actually left open -- I have a feeling I need to beat the game on Hard to get all the answers now.

Action-packed and gorgeous, but I had a big feeling of "been there, done that" all the while playing it. Damned shame too, maybe if it was marketed as what it is (remake) I'd be less disappointed.

As for that Thunder Blade level, yeah, it was shit. Only good thing about it was seeing the huge airship rise from the water, and that was after all the action.

I've got a huge hankering to play Galaxy Force now.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:32 am

I thought the scenes on top of the ships were the worst. You can't actually get killed during those since everything does less than 10 damage.

jp · Post by jp » Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:55 pm

I beat it with Red and Blue today (got it Friday). My thoughts:

Good. Not as good as the original though. It felt more like a remix than a true sequel. It had some improvements, some changes that were neither good or bad, and some things that were just somewhat uncalled for (i.e. the Afterburner levels... boring).

The final boss fight... meh. I guess I'm thankful it didn't do hardly any damage because God knows the fight against Seven Force towards the end would typically bring me down (Pink, Orange, and Black are stupid easy). So going into the final fight with 15-45 HP wasn't really a bad thing given how pitiful all but one of the final bosses attacks were.

Overall: Good game. Very fun handheld. Personally, I would have actually been happier with just a port of Gunstar Heroes to the GBA though.

Moogs · Post by **Moogs** » Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:17 pm

There's nothing Treasure could have done to please everyone with Gunstar Super Heroes. It's faced with criticism for being a remake of the original, but if it had been s straight port, then it would catch hell for not offering anything new. Had they made it a real sequel -- meaning all new characters, levels, weapons, etc. -- then there would be all this nonsense about how they changed too much.

It's Gunstar Heroes. It's classic Treasure gameplay (yes, even the wonky tribute levels; every Treasure game has moments that just don't make any damn sense). Just be thankful they didn't attempt to do this in 3D.

GateofThunderforceIII · Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:49 am

Hell, I love it, remake or not. It's classic Treasure stuff and I'm glad it's another Gunstar game. Would you nitpickers rather it be a Treasure made motherfucking Madden, or a G*ddamn Gran Theft Auto, or a son of a bitching FPS piece of shit? Come on, learn to appreciate it...

UnscathedFlyingObject · Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:05 am

People either get bitchy or they get the short end of the stick. Learning to appreciate gameplay gimmicks that're obviously flawed is telling Treasure to keep feeding us the same crap. Can you honestly say you like the Afterburner levels or the poorly done shmups levels? Don't you feel they should be replaced with run and gun action scenes? Start getting bitchy towards Treasure to make a difference.

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:03 pm

UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:People either get bitchy or they get the short end of the stick. Learning to appreciate gameplay gimmicks that're obviously flawed is telling Treasure to keep feeding us the same crap. Can you honestly say you like the Afterburner levels or the poorly done shmups levels? Don't you feel they should be replaced with run and gun action scenes? Start getting bitchy towards Treasure to make a difference.

Excellent point. The reason that "motherfucking Madden" exists is that not enough people complained that they were getting crap. Granted, none of us are bitching to Treasure directly and trying to make a difference.

All games have room for improvement.

Moogs · Post by **Moogs** » Mon Nov 07, 2005 5:13 pm

The Afterburner/Galaxy Force levels don't bother me, the Thunder Blade and Flicky levels do.

But like I said, there's a moment in every Treasure game that just makes me go WHAT THE FUCK? WHY?! (Silhouette Mirage was full of these moments), and the aforementioned pair of Sega homages do exactly that. As much as I adore Treasure, they're not infallible. It's fine to hold them on such a high pedestal, but attacking them for offering another example of a game from a dying genre seems a bit wrong.

Then again, maybe I'm taking it easy on them because I'm so starved for new 2D games. Eh..

Regardless, Gunstar Super Heroes is good stuff.

Stormowl · Post by **Stormowl** » Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:40 pm

i like it. my only complaint is that the last boss (golden silver) is a total pushover.

Dylan1CC · Post by **Dylan1CC** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:28 am

I beat the game last week with Red, the finale with Golden Silver was a little quick (as Stormowl said) but the final level itself was amazing (and it had a horizontal shmup level which = sweetness).

I just have one question now: I was paging through an older issue of Nintendo Power last night and it had a pic of the game in their "most wanted" section. In the pic, either Red or Blue is on a stage facing a green dragon with an audience in the background. Is this still in the game somewhere hidden or was it cut?

edit: NM, I just found out it was an Altered Beast homage that was cut out of the game.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:29 am

My import copy finally came in today. That is all I have to say for now. Ha. Ha. Ha.

Moogs · Post by **Moogs** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 3:23 am

Dylan1CC wrote:edit: NM, I just found out it was an Altered Beast homage that was cut out of the game.

There was mention of a Golden Axe homage, too.

Not that Altered Beast or Golden Axe are good games on their own, but homages would have been nice.

Better than that Flicky BULLSHIT!!

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:04 am

Does anyone even LIKE Thunder Blade? Besides dave. I actually liked the Afterburner sequences, especially that last one where you're going inside the space ship thing. Then I realized that the damage done to you is completely minimal, as UFO said, and that took the fun out of that.

I heard playing on Hard unlocks more of the story, I figure that's reason enough for me to play it again.

shmups.system11.org

Gunstar Super Heroes -- on GBA, screens inside!

Ehhhhhhhhhh