Less danmaku/lolita shmups plz

evil_ash_xero · Post by **evil_ash_xero** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:30 am

Delete

Shumps4Free · Post by **Shumps4Free** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:34 am

Gunbird 2 is a pretty nice shmup, it might be my favorite. Valpiro FTW.

Raizen1984 · Post by **Raizen1984** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:34 am

evil_ash_xero wrote:This is fucking stupid. I'm even getting private messages about this. I mean, what the hell?

Obviously, this is really soft spot for some people here. I think this is going a bit beyond shmupping...

OK, the loli thing is girly. It just is. I don't have problems with Mushihime-Sama visually(it's not loli, but just girly), but I only like it in small doses. I just think companies are going overboard with it. Every game either has girly shit in it, or it has lolis. And well, it just sucks. It's trend that unfortunately has taken over the majority of shmup output. And if you're man(which most of you are), and if you're even sorta straight, you just don't really care for this stuff. I don't think this is rocket science.

But most of the people that really seem to like it seem to like stuff that crosses into the sexual. OK, I don't care about cultural differences or whatever, if you like seeing 5 years old kissing or being sexual..that's not a "cultural difference". It's just..uh..I mean, what the fuck? Do I really have to explain myself here? I mean, Japanese porn has a HUGE rape fetish. Rape isn't a good thing, right? Well, if they like it, maybe it's just a cultural difference, and we as westerners are just thick headed perhaps? Please.

Here's a nifty little video from Japan http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rzub9D_UVfg
This is a very popular loli show. Yes, it's cartoons. It's not real people. But it is cartoons of middle school girls trying to seduce their teacher, and being represented in a VERY sexual manner. It is not "cute". Some people just need to get their head out of the fucking ground. It's cartoon pedo fantasies. Accept it for what it is. Quit trying to make it out to be something else. It's THAT simple. Hell, the little conversation going on in YouTube there kinda mirrors this one. Well, at least anime hasn't been taken over by this shit(on the whole), where as the shmup genre has been hijacked by this junk.

Honestly, I don't care, but don't get all defensive when someone points out that hey, it's fucked up. It is fucked up. It just is. I like fucked up shit too, but i'm not going to be like "YOU have the problem!". No, I have the problem, because i'm fucked up, and i'll keep my mouth shut about it because they're right. I'm not going to try and justify it.

I wouldn't have even posted this, but i'm getting messages and shit over this, and it just boggles my mind. Oh well.

I have nothing to add to this thread, but I agree 100% with everything in this post.

Momijitsuki · Post by **Momijitsuki** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:09 am

evil_ash_xero wrote: Here's a nifty little video from Japan http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rzub9D_UVfg
This is a very popular loli show. Yes, it's cartoons. It's not real people. But it is cartoons of middle school girls trying to seduce their teacher, and being represented in a VERY sexual manner. It is not "cute". Some people just need to get their head out of the fucking ground. It's cartoon pedo fantasies. Accept it for what it is. Quit trying to make it out to be something else. It's THAT simple. Hell, the little conversation going on in YouTube there kinda mirrors this one. Well, at least anime hasn't been taken over by this shit(on the whole), where as the shmup genre has been hijacked by this junk.

actually they're elementary school girls, and only one is trying to seduce the teacher

The actual series of Kodomo no Jikan (not the OVA that you linked to, which really sucked) actually has a very heavyhearted and well-executed story, which was unfortunately laced with the oversexualized content to appeal to the otaku so they'd actually watch the series. Of course, you wouldn't know that because I'm sure you haven't even watched more than thirty seconds of it before you judged it, like so many other ignorant viewers who spew their bullshit about it when they really have no idea what's going on.

That's like me saying 'oh, Ketsui is shit' even though I've never played it before, but I'm saying it anyway because I heard someone else say it. It's stupid and you know it.

Furthermore, everything you said in that post was just more circumlocutory bullshit. The bottom line is: "if you don't like something, don't fucking watch/play it". It's that fucking simple, and yet you still still carry on as if you actually have some sort of point to make within your whining.

Honestly, I don't care, but don't get all defensive when someone points out that hey, it's fucked up. It is fucked up. It just is. I like fucked up shit too, but i'm not going to be like "YOU have the problem!". No, I have the problem, because i'm fucked up, and i'll keep my mouth shut about it because they're right. I'm not going to try and justify it.

Yeah, hi? That's EXACTLY what you're doing. Is the sexualization of children, even fictional ones, wrong? Of course it is. But what you're doing is pointing fingers and saying 'YOU have the problem!' to us as if anyone who views or plays such a thing is a dirty pedophile, when saying such a thing is incredibly ignorant.

I really have nothing else to say, as you're probably only going to retaliate and make yourself look even more ignorant and foolish by trying to win an argument that you act like you need to win. If you can't open your mind a bit and simply debate a topic instead of insulting it just because you don't agree with it, you'll never be any less ignorant for it.

Fuck this, I'm done. It's not worth getting mad over when the topic's incredibly petty to begin with. I'm not posting in here any more.

I leave you with this. It's a perfect example of how you're acting. Enjoy.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:17 am

coming so hard

SockPuppetHyren · Post by **SockPuppetHyren** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:21 am

evil_ash_xero wrote: but i'm getting messages and shit over this, and it just boggles my mind.

Welp, in your post, you used a bunch of stereotypes as if they were law. Generally missed the point of a lot of posts in this thread, which was "we're sick of people whining about this over and over again". You missed the OTHER point about most "loli" shooters having none of the content you're complaining about at all, and is often used as a buzz word for sensation's sake. Then you end with a fictional morality rant. You're sure going to be popular with stuff like that.

Also, just for your information, Japan has one of the lower rape rates in the world. Funny, ain't it?

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:26 am

lowest reported.

keyword: reported.

Udderdude · Post by **Udderdude** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:32 am

Twiddle wrote:
coming so hard

Is it sad that I knew exactly what air disaster this was just from the picture?

Elixir · Post by **Elixir** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:43 am

evil_ash_xero wrote:If you want to jerk off to drawings off a 5 year old girl holding a teadybear with a phallic looking lolipop in her mouth, I think that would be a bit worse. Well, I would THINK so anyway. I'm sure some will disagree.

It's perfectly acceptable if they're both over 18 though, right?

MathU · Post by **MathU** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:44 am

Icarus wrote:I'm sort of surprised, and yet not surprised, at the amount of people who refuse to play a game purely because of its graphical content.
And here I thought people played shooting games for the game systems. Shame, really.

And yet just look at all the Cave fanboys here.

SockPuppetHyren · Post by **SockPuppetHyren** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:46 am

Twiddle wrote:lowest reported.

keyword: reported.

Ah! Good point. I shall do more research!

escadrille · Post by **escadrille** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:52 am

Udderdude wrote: Is it sad that I knew exactly what air disaster this was just from the picture?

I thought it was a scene from some Michael Bay movie.

Momijitsuki wrote:Furthermore, everything you said in that post was just more circumlocutory bullshit. The bottom line is: "if you don't like something, don't fucking watch/play it". It's that fucking simple, and yet you still still carry on as if you actually have some sort of point to make within your whining.

Here's the deal: Nobody is going to stop you from watching whatever lame perv cartoons you like, but you're going to have to deal with people telling you that you're into some weak shit. "Whining" is when you try to justify it.

SockPuppetHyren wrote:Also, just for your information, Japan has one of the lower rape rates in the world. Funny, ain't it?

The implication here being that the rapists are too busy watching hentai DVDs to hit the streets and do some analog sexual assault.

evil_ash_xero · Post by **evil_ash_xero** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:46 am

I certainly didn't mean anything personal to anyone I debated with, so don't really take it that way.

But this is getting too heated, and not in my nature.

I'm done here. You guys try to get this back on track.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:30 am

And yet just look at all the Cave fanboys here.

people act as if being a fanboy is bad. that depends on your deffinition of it I guess.

really... even if you don't find cave games to be the best shooters out there... clearly they make some pretty great shooters. they might not be your cup of tea if you dislike bullet hell. but alot of them look good, play well and some don't even have a cutesy theme even if those are the older title.

treasure games are cutesy and some like those.

being of fan of something is ok you know, even if others will point the finger at you and yell fanboy. hell I could say everyone on here is a shooter fanboy.

does it really matter.... some like raizing, some like cave, others like whatever. I like shooters period... I like Battle Garrega, Mushi, Gradius 5, Border Down, ESP galuda, DDP, Under Defeat, RSG, Strikers 1945, Thunder Force... blah blah blah.

I like alot of different shooters... I don't like them all equally but that's the way people work. but I am very thankful we get them as high quality as we have from cave. not every one of their games was the end all be all of art selection for me but none of them made me think what a turd this is when compared to crap like trigger heart ect.

this thread is a odd rant...

evil_ash_xero · Post by **evil_ash_xero** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:33 am

Strider77 wrote:
And yet just look at all the Cave fanboys here.
people act as if being a fanboy is bad. that depends on your deffinition of it I guess.

really... even if you don't find cave games to be the best shooters out there... clearly they make some pretty great shooters. they might not be your cup of tea if you dislike bullet hell. but alot of them look good, play well and some don't even have a cutesy theme even if those are the older title.

treasure games are cutesy and some like those.

being of fan of something is ok you know, even if others will point the finger at you and yell fanboy. hell I could say everyone on here is a shooter fanboy.

does it really matter.... some like raizing, some like cave, others like whatever. I like shooters period... I like Battle Garrega, Mushi, Gradius 5, Border Down, ESP galuda, DDP, Under Defeat, RSG, Strikers 1945, Thunder Force... blah blah blah.

I like alot of different shooters... I don't like them all equally but that's the way people work. but I am very thankful we get them as high quality as we have from cave. not every one of their games was the end all be all of art selection for me but none of them made me think what a turd this is when compared to crap like trigger heart ect.

this thread is a odd rant...

I will pop in to say that Triggerheart really does look like shit.

ncp · Post by **ncp** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:35 am

edit: evil_ash_xero deleted the post I was responding to so I guess there's no reason to leave the response. But I think you lost all credibility when you say "Hey, I love porno", considering REAL GIRLS GETTING PAID TO HAVE SEX WITH STRANGERS is a lot worse than fictional drawings of girls having sex, in my book at least.

also the whole thread should be deleted, make it so, mods

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:48 am

sluts and sex sale in every media form... I'm use to it.

gray117 · Post by **gray117** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:07 am

I think that the real problem is that the development of shmups is so small and precious. If a couple of titles have a go at rather a loli-ish theme then the fans of other aesthetics are simply left without a new game... Being in a niche is a difficult thing.

... thats not to say that there won't be enjoyment to be had out of a good system, but that the non-loli fans are going to feel somewhat out in the cold.

I must say that for my own tastes the 'balance' across the market seems a bit over done in the loli direction ... but then again what if someone like cave produced a non loli game after say deathsmiles ii - could just that single game from an important developer restore the balance? ... I suspect that this testifies to the unfortunately small market in which shmups exist...

lgb · Post by **lgb** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:31 pm

I'm sort of surprised, and yet not surprised, at the amount of people who refuse to play a game purely because of its graphical content.
And here I thought people played shooting games for the game systems. Shame, really.

sounds less like they aren't playing it and more like they're playing it and bitching the whole way

Taylor · Post by **Taylor** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:41 pm

gray117 wrote:I must say that for my own tastes the 'balance' across the market seems a bit over done in the loli direction ... but then again what if someone like cave produced a non loli game after say deathsmiles ii - could just that single game from an important developer restore the balance? ... I suspect that this testifies to the unfortunately small market in which shmups exist...

Yes, I know I can't.

CStarFlare · Post by **CStarFlare** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:29 pm

Momijitsuki wrote:That's EXACTLY what you're doing. Is the sexualization of children, even fictional ones, wrong? Of course it is.

how old are sakura and tomoyo

Momijitsuki · Post by **Momijitsuki** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:44 pm

CStarFlare wrote:
Momijitsuki wrote:That's EXACTLY what you're doing. Is the sexualization of children, even fictional ones, wrong? Of course it is.

how old are sakura and tomoyo

10-12, depending on what part of the storyline you refer to.

I never said I cared that much. It's not like they're doing anything explicit, anyway. Now, if they were doing something other than simply kissing, I'd find it questionable. At this point, you're just being nitpicky.

Elixir · Post by **Elixir** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:11 pm

I think the point is that you're saying it's wrong to sexually depict kids and then you parade around the forums with some ecchi sig.

bucklemyshoe · Post by **bucklemyshoe** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:11 pm

I don't know what games you guys are playing but none of the lolis in my shmups are having sex with anyone or doing anything suggestive for that matter.

I find it odd that some one would go out of their way to find a means to play these types of games and make such a big deal about some artwork.

I mean by definition Rei Ayanami of Evangelion is a Loli and is shown nude in quite a few different scenes of the show. Over 10 years later, no one is making complaints about a "too much loli in my mech show"

Elixir · Post by **Elixir** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:18 pm

BUT BOY DID IT SPAWN A LOT OF FUCKING DOUJINSHI

TMR · Post by **TMR** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:08 am

bucklemyshoe wrote:I don't know what games you guys are playing but none of the lolis in my shmups are having sex with anyone or doing anything suggestive for that matter.

That's been worrying me too, either i'm being hopelessly naive or we're all playing different games... i think someone mentioned Gunbird 2 previously, i swear i've not seen anything sexual in there; it's possible that i've become desensitised but i'm sure i'd at least have noticed!

Momijitsuki · Post by **Momijitsuki** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:12 am

Elixir wrote:I think the point is that you're saying it's wrong to sexually depict kids and then you parade around the forums with some ecchi sig.

I'd say calling it 'ecchi' is subjective.

Raizen1984 · Post by **Raizen1984** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:17 am

Momijitsuki wrote:
I'd say calling it 'ecchi' is subjective.

It's a picture of Sakura and Tomoyo tongue wrestling each other. Don't be dumb.

Momijitsuki · Post by **Momijitsuki** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:22 am

Raizen1984 wrote:
Momijitsuki wrote:
I'd say calling it 'ecchi' is subjective.
It's a picture of Sakura and Tomoyo tongue wrestling each other. Don't be dumb.

*psst* I wasn't being entirely serious. Note the '

'

Of course it's ecchi. But like I said, I really don't care.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:28 am

Not sure what's scarier. Having the sig or knowing the characters.

You guys should love this.