Best shmup that you DIDN'T like/enjoy

[IlMrm]

I hate almost every single Psikyo shooter out there!

Same thing in almost every single shooter with a really fucking hard bullet patterns. What makes things even worse is that the first four levels are totally different, which makes guys like me never learn the bullet patterns. The Striker series, Gunbird, Dragon Blaze, and Samurai Aces and Tengai, god I just hate them!

The only series I enjoy playing was the Zero Gunner games, and that's it. Psikyo lovers, how the hell you can play the same thing over and over again?

Before Psikyo became Psikyo, they where with Video Systems, and made the Aero Fighters (Sonic Wings) series. I love those games so much, and the bullet patterns were great!

Some of the Aero Fighters patterns are fast and in your face too.

I love Psikyo. Nothing like a good challenge.

[5parrowhawk]

Well, actually I do quite enjoy Ikaruga and RSG, even though they kick my butt.

The ones I'm not crazy about are DDP and Psyvariar 2. Psyvariar's buzz-for-invincibility mechanic, and the boss-milking, just seem kind of perverse.

And to the guy who mentioned PCB: Youmu is not difficult. Also, it's perfectly possible to manipulate the Cherry Point system to suit your needs. (Example: I usually try to bring up a border sometime during Alice's penultimate SC, just for insurance.)

[Triple Lei]

Hm... all the stuff on sale in the forums made me want to hook up my Matt (tm) Supergun, so I'm going to have to reverse my opinion:

Armed Police Batrider friggin' rocks! It's a nice breather from Dodonpachi: DOJ and I'm not in the mood for more must-memorize Psikyo bullet patterns just yet. And when I got around to playing around with those codes and secrets...


So now, as for the topic, I'm going to have to so say Ikaruga, though I still respect it tons and plan to give it a proper 1CC someday. I just think it's the opposite of DOJ:

Ikaruga's memorization seems like a requirement to playing the game well and enjoyably. In my case I memorized enough to get a respectable chain in Stage 1 (what with the zig-zag, single shots, and "rows" at the end) and a decent chain in Stage 2, reaching the first boss in Stage 5 before I had to actually commit myself to memorizing the game again. I didn't feel like it.

DOJ on the other hand seems to throw the memorization at you as an incentive to higher scoring; I personally loved chiseling my strategies to perfection. No one's forcing you to chain, and the game is still friggin' fun without it.

I'm a little... what's the word... "disturbed?" at how there is a "BEST" way of clearing the stages in Ikaruga. There's a DVD that shows gameplay so advanced, I can't help but get the feeling I'm playing a stupid, inferior way whenever I play by my means (max stage chains are my proof), forcing me to try something else like dot eating... until the "BEST" way of dot eating is found.

DOJ of course offers tons of different ways of playing; even if you don't choose to chain there's lots of fun with Hypers... right?

Also, the training modes in DOJ are leagues better than the one in (Gamecube version) Ikaruga.

[ROBOTRON]

I don't like 99% of Cave shooters...I don't see what the hype is all about.

[Tychom]

Ikaruga. I don't find it exciting, thrilling, exhilerating or whatever. Just plodding and methodical. No fun.

[ROBOTRON]

Ikaruga. I don't find it exciting, thrilling, exhilerating or whatever. Just plodding and methodical. No fun.

AGREED.

Pretty to look at...and thats about it.

[Valgar]

ESP Ra.De., gameplay is poor.

[captain ahar]

ESP Ra.De., gameplay is poor.

heh. valgar, i was expecting you to psychically stab the last few posters.

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Every R-Type game. I love Pulstar though oddly enough.

Every Psyiko game except Sengoku Blade(and not because of the boobies...honest)

MUSHA is the only Compile shooter I like. Space Megaforce is a repetitive mess.

I never could get into Rayforce.

Despite Darius 1 being one of the only arcade shooters I've ever one-lifed, I don't think too highly of it. Metal Black I absolutely hate.

Radiant Silvergun is a broken mess of a game. Combine the methodical pacing of R-Type with an even more stringent and forced version of Ikaruga as well the random occurences of Bullet hell spam. UGH. Excellent Audio/visuals though.

19?? series gets boring fast. I love Varth though, even if it is around 30 stages long(the hell?)

[Fenrir]

Ikaruga. I don't find it exciting, thrilling, exhilerating or whatever. Just plodding and methodical. No fun.

AGREED.

Pretty to look at...and thats about it.

I know what you're talking about, but in my opinion the game was intended to be like that - it's a somewhat dramatic game, and I think the 'drama' of the storyline well reflects the sleek and dramatic gameplay. Surely its goal is not to be exhilarating. And I find it absolutely thrilling.

As for me, I didn't find Axelay playable at all - it's nice to look at but the game is simply unfair to me.

And darius twins. Too "small", if you get my drift. And relaxing. I don't want to feel relaxed while I play a shmup

[Valgar]

ESP Ra.De., gameplay is poor.

heh. valgar, i was expecting you to psychically stab the last few posters.

I take mental notes.

[DeSangre]

And I find it absolutely thrilling.

You like to be thrilled by movies, it seems.

[PlasmaDancer]

Ikaruga. I'm determined to have once last try at enjoying it, but I always feel like I'm forcing myself....I love the instinctiveness and spontaneity of shmups, and it's really hard to adjust to this instead. I still feel slightly annoyed that I haven't 'got' the concept behind it yet, so I'll give it one more go at some point.

There are some other games that I'm undecided on at the moment, but that's more to do with lack of dedicated playing than anything else...Mushihimesama is one example. At the time it was released in Japan I was concentrating on Espgaluda (and a bit of Ketsui), and Mushi didn't grip me enough from a few plays to drop the other two. However, I can see that it's a good game, and I agree with Rob here:

Sorry, there's no value in an opinion of a game where the core design is ignored. Otherwise it's just did the game "feel" cool? That's useless to me and anyone who can't get out of the habit of seeing the games for their entire package.

My thoughts exactly, as although there are a few games that I've quickly dismissed simply because the 'feel' isn't there (Trizeal etc.), I won't attempt to offer an in-depth opinion on anything I haven't played in some depth. That might be one explanation why I've been a bit quiet in this part of the forum so far, and the reason why I'll play Mushi (and Souky, another I'm undecided on) properly before it goes on the 'dislike' pile.

[Ceph]

Interesting how many of us don't enjoy Ikaruga for being too methodical, strict and uninstinctive (while everyone is praising Ikaruga's visual style). Too bad the good folks at Treasure won't read this!!

[PsikyoPshumpPshooterP]

i didnt like

Esp Ra De
EspGaluda(this sucks more than Ra De)

[~Kid Icarus~]

I would like to jump on the "I can't see the bullets in Garggea" bandwagon and nominate that.

Also Gunbird 1/2 & the Strikers series. They're just so poorly presented and are practicly the same goddamn game over & over. From the little of it I played, I did like Dragon Blaze though.

So yeah, I pretty much just echoed what's been said about 5 billion times on this forum.

[Ed Oscuro]

Every R-Type game. I love Pulstar though oddly enough.

[Post clipped]

Wow, it's like...a verification of my own thoughts.

I really don't get a lot of the trendy new shmups, and I pretty much despise bullet spam. Takes the fun outta flying around and torching stuff when you're doing nothing but avoiding bullets. If I want to play a dodger, I'll do download sdm-kun again. Which I may well do.

For my money, the (early especially) Gradius and Thunder Cross games = best. Haven't gotten a chance to play any new shooters, though, as my classic games budget and my love of 3D action games strips me of cash effectively.

I also didn't much like Salamander 2. The music leading to Gigas is great, but for some reason I imagined the ship pushing through a heavy snowstorm to get to that boss...but no, and then the boss looks like crap. What the hell?

Yet I'm a big fan of Gradius on the Game Boy (not Interstellar Assault, which is good too - I mean the original!) Doesn't make sense.

[copy-paster]

Einhander.
Because this was made by "Final Fantasy guys" doesn't mean this is a good game. I don't find it thrilling or exciting like the web game review said, they're want the game like R-Type and the result was total fail.

I also didn't like Gigawing and Mars Matrix, the worst bullet hell shooters IMO.

And I didn't like some Ikaruga fans nowadays, why they're claimed this is hardest shmup ever? I'm sure they didn't know some Cave stuff and S.Yagawa games

[Kollision]

I wouldn't say the Shikigami games are awful or boring, but this particular series never really clicked with me as I hoped it would before I actually played it.

[o.pwuaioc]

I wouldn't say the Shikigami games are awful or boring, but this particular series never really clicked with me as I hoped it would before I actually played it.

I'll second this. I also can't get into Gunbird games, even though I'm a huge fan of Strikers. In general, fan service cute em ups don't really appeal to me.

I also didn't like the switch from 2D sprites. I love Thunder Force III and IV (and actually kinda like II, too), but Thunderforce V was very visually unappealing to me. Same with Einhander. I think those kind of games just look ugly, and a quarter of the reasons why I play shooters in the first place is for aesthetics.

[pokemon123]

9 year bump wow,

for me it's DDP and DOJ, the chaining is way to strict. Even with opinions i have no idea how people find these games for score fun but meh.

i'm also not a fan of bakraid but it's not a bad game though. Just think garegga and APB are way better.

[copy-paster]

Every R-Type game. I love Pulstar though oddly enough.

[Post clipped]

I also didn't much like Salamander 2. The music leading to Gigas is great, but for some reason I imagined the ship pushing through a heavy snowstorm to get to that boss...but no, and then the boss looks like crap. What the hell?

Yet I'm a big fan of Gradius on the Game Boy (not Interstellar Assault, which is good too - I mean the original!) Doesn't make sense.

It's strange that I actually liked Salamander 2 and Gradius 2 on gameboy, S2 keeps the atmosphere and removes all cheapness in the first game, and I thought the game was set to more enjoyable for newbies.

Gradius 2 on gameboy was one of the best and underrated in the series, some stuff like the "level transition" are brilliant for me, and the music was preety good IMO

[RHE]

Gradius 5

I never enjoyed this game and the cut scenes were annoying.

[BIL]

Summer Carnival '92 - Recca.
Final Carnival.

Nexzr Special was the last of the Naxat-published Summer Carnivals, after Spriggan ('91) and Recca+Alzadick ('92).

[Perikles]

Summer Carnival '92 - Recca.
Final Carnival.

Nexzr Special was the last of the Naxat-published Summer Carnivals, after Spriggan ('91) and Recca+Alzadick ('92).

I think you're trying to comprehend Kanonir tanczir's post all too literal, BIL. It seems very clear to me that he strives to transcend the profane boundaries of grammar, semantics and logic so as to create real art. It'd be even better if he would write full-fledged haikus (Nightmarish Recca - It's the final carnival - Over '92) but you take what you can get.

[BIL]

I did wonder, particularly after encountering the same phrase in a post about Gun Frontier. But we've got to think of the children and keep misinformation at bay, no matter the cost.

A night in summer carnival, instead of nightmare for half an hour is a pretty good aphorism on the nature of console v arcade shooting, I think. When nosy neighbours ask "why do you have SFC and PS2 versions of Gradius III you awful nerd?!" I'll simply link to that post!

[FRO]

Gradius 5

I never enjoyed this game and the cut scenes was annoying.

I'll agree on the cut scenes, they do break up the action a bit too much, but I find that game to be very enjoyable. The soundtrack is excellent, which helps, but it has that classic Gradius feel to it, which I enjoy. I also like the fact that the enemy layouts and positioning change with the different power-up configurations, so it adds a fair bit of replay value.

For me, it's most bullet hell shmups. I appreciate what they're trying to do, and I get the technical expertise that goes into creating them, but to me, it seems weird that my ship isn't the target, it's this tiny little block on the ship (or avatar). Even if I know where that weak point is, it throws me off, and I want to dodge everything, which doesn't work for those kinds of games. I'm used to old school twitchy shmups, where you had to weave in and out of small bits of bullet spray, and your entire craft was the hitbox. Fast action, made you think on your feet, lots of movement kinds of games. Some bullet hell games have you moving very little, because it's one wave of bullets after another, and you're just tapping the joystick or D-pad ever so slightly to keep your hitbox from being compromised. Add the "guard" mechanic some games have, or the buzz mechanic from stuff like Psyvariar (ugh), and I have a hard time getting into those games. I think that's why I have a love/hate relationship with Psykio games. They combined these two elements to great effect, so you get that fast action, but it's broken up somewhat by the occasional bullet spam. However, sometimes I have a harder time navigating that stuff, because a bullet curtain will almost certainly be followed by targeted bullets, and I usually end up walking right into something. Give me Gradius, R-Type, Thunder Force, and the like any day.

Having said that, I do enjoy some of the earlier stuff like DonPachi, and for some reason I like Chaos Field, maybe because some of that bullet spam can be countered with a melee weapon, similar to Brave Blade. That's a mechanic I wish was utilized more. Also, I like Ikaruga, even though I suck at it.

[Squire Grooktook]

and I want to dodge everything, which doesn't work for those kinds of games. I'm used to old school twitchy shmups, where you had to weave in and out of small bits of bullet spray, and your entire craft was the hitbox. Fast action, made you think on your feet, lots of movement kinds of games. Some bullet hell games have you moving very little, because it's one wave of bullets after another, and you're just tapping the joystick or D-pad ever so slightly to keep your hitbox from being compromised.

It depends on the bullet hell shooter. Some are more improvisement and movement focused then others. Cho Ren Sha 68k (moreso on hard) has a very tiny hitbox, but fast movement, "thinking on your feet", and dodging everything is probably more of a focus than any older shmup. The small hitbox actually encourages you to move faster and more, not less.

[ACSeraph]

I hate Pink Sweets 1.0 and 1.1

You are presented with all these awesome abilities your ship can use, and then severely punished for utilizing them. Doesn't make any sense to me at all.

However, Pink Sweets Arrange is fucking awesome. It's everything I wanted Vanilla to be.

---

Daifukkatsu (all versions)

I've tried countless times to get into this but I just can't.

---

Ikaruga

No idea why, but I love Dot Eater despite not enjoying the main game.

---

R-Type

All the things I hate from Darius II with none of the good. That atmosphere is incredible though...

[Squire Grooktook]

R-Type

All the things I hate from Darius II with none of the good. That atmosphere is incredible though...

Mind elaborating on this a little? R-Type is a pretty vanilla, forgiving game. I'm kind of surprised to hear a comparison to it with Darius 2.