Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

[Blinge]

Yeah i don't wanna use warps just gonna go through the levels straightforward like

all the stages seem manageable.. 7 seems horrendous though, the blind drop

[BIL]

Bro forget Saigon Ninja i still can't get through stage 3 of Mizubaku without dropping at least two lives!


Idk what it is, no mental discipline? or just crazy stuff happening all the time

Best approach imo is to pick a game, and make a project of clearing it, at whichever goal level you prefer. Sticking to one title is key.

OFC, this will rapidly become a miserable job of work, if it's not something you actually want to do, so make sure you're feelin' it. ;3

Yeah i don't wanna use warps just gonna go through the levels straightforward like

all the stages seem manageable.. 7 seems horrendous though, the blind drop

You mean the Ninja Pit? It's absolute kusoge, but by its nature, once memorised it becomes trivial. If I had to nomiss Saigo with a gun to my head, the pit would be an oasis of calm amidst roiling RNG hell.

Use the guide Burinju, in fact I recommend this for ALL prospective Saigo players; not merely as a "walkthrough" (though it very much is one), but a surgical excision of this kusoge canker from an otherwise 11/10 scrolling action game.

It's for the children, naw mean

Apologies if you meant Mizubaku, I've still not gotten around to that one. So much stuff in fine form, who could complain about delays mirite

[Blinge]

I did mean LIQUID CHILD yes, it's got a drop-down section where off screen enemies are firing up at you

[BIL]

Fuckin lousy Nihongos! Always tryna shove things up a man asshole! The Hard Gaming will GIVE YOU GAPE

[Stevens]

I haven't played it myself yet, but I have seen complete runs. I have a few complaints just based on what I've seen:

-not enough weapons
-no but really, not enough traditional chinese weapons (I believe traditional chinese martial arts have a fuckton of these)
-seriously, the knife weapon is some kind of tanto/wakizashi rather than a Dao
-game seems to take martial arts movie inspiration primarily from newer films, like The Raid and Kill Bill, rather than OG stuff. Outside of the red intro/practice area, I didn't see much that suggested Shaw Bros, Golden Harvest, etc.

If my complaints sound trivial, that's because they're just nitpicks. The gameplay looks good. I think it's a huge missed opportunity, though, to make a chinese beat em up in full 3d and not give us access to the three-sectional-staff, guandao, butterfly swords or jian. Hopefully they add more weapons with DLC. The weapons were one of the best aspects of ninja gaiden II.

Nope, those are all fair points. I will say that based on the engine the possibilities for dlc and a sequel are near limit less.

First patch will include easy/hard mode. Increasing the number of enemies per encounter and the overall number of encounters is far preferable to turning the enemies into sponges. The amount of damage it takes now to down mooks and super mooks feels rather perfect.

Maybe they went with more current movies cause safer? But there is a massive treasure trove of movies to pick from. Would dig some Five Elements Ninja action myself.

[Randorama]

I forgot this one, so quick comment (sorry Birru-fordo sensei!).

Sumez: Ah, agreed! I swear that one day I will credit-feed the game without falling asleep, in honour of Goscinny & Uderzo

Speaking of which:

I can recall that Knights of the Round gives an item if you use the tap attack to kill enemies, and chaining enemies of the same type gives you a multiplier (up to x4, so the fourth "tall man" you will give you will be 120x4=480 points, or something).

I believe that The Punisher can be counter-stopped by spending ages on (some) boss battles, too. The two Double Dragon titles gave you more points for attacks such as kicks (OK, imprecise one-sentence summary, I know).

If my memory is correct, most titles in the belt-scroller genre may at most offer more item drops under certain conditions, but your comment on the lack of score systems may be generalised to most titles belonging to this genre, I guess. Oh well, it's all about punching & kicking people and moving to the right, anyway!

[BIL]

You are forever welcome here Rando-dono

RE Technos punch/kick scoring, that reminds me of Spartan X, where it's the opposite - the shorter-ranged Punch gets more points than the generally safer Kick. You can also get extra points by taking out multiple enemies with one strike (the game's trademark "whip-around" mechanic is ideal for this). Pitch-perfect jumping attacks score more, too - can't recall if P/K vary similarly, but both are risky.

Nintendo's beautiful FC conversion preserves all these mechanics, albeit in an endless looper format (IIRC both FC and AC loop endlessly... might be wrong though, been a while). On that note, FC Game B mode is no joke - by the third loop, it's reached wicked pressure. IIRC I made it to the Magician before calling it a day, when I was deep-diving it a few years back.

"SAA... KOI!"


Game B / Loop 3 / Floor 2: all hell breakin' loose, book past the Dragons or die covered in snakes and buckshot.

Spoiler

...or on the emergent gameplay tip, hang around at the start and see if you can survive until timeout. ;3

Spoiler

While it's not scoring, per se, Double Dragon's lovably scruffy FC interpretation (directed by Kishimoto just like the AC ver, but could never be referred to as a port/conversion) uses the P/K scoring to allocate experience points. It's worth going for riskier PPP combos, early on, to unlock the full suite of moves early. As is the game's wont, there's an easy exploit - just keep bopping enemies on the nose without going for the kill to rack up points, among other even more scurrilous, glitchy methods - but no SouSetsuKen heir worth his salt would impugn so.

[Sima Tuna]

I haven't played it myself yet, but I have seen complete runs. I have a few complaints just based on what I've seen:

-not enough weapons
-no but really, not enough traditional chinese weapons (I believe traditional chinese martial arts have a fuckton of these)
-seriously, the knife weapon is some kind of tanto/wakizashi rather than a Dao
-game seems to take martial arts movie inspiration primarily from newer films, like The Raid and Kill Bill, rather than OG stuff. Outside of the red intro/practice area, I didn't see much that suggested Shaw Bros, Golden Harvest, etc.

If my complaints sound trivial, that's because they're just nitpicks. The gameplay looks good. I think it's a huge missed opportunity, though, to make a chinese beat em up in full 3d and not give us access to the three-sectional-staff, guandao, butterfly swords or jian. Hopefully they add more weapons with DLC. The weapons were one of the best aspects of ninja gaiden II.

Nope, those are all fair points. I will say that based on the engine the possibilities for dlc and a sequel are near limit less.

First patch will include easy/hard mode. Increasing the number of enemies per encounter and the overall number of encounters is far preferable to turning the enemies into sponges. The amount of damage it takes now to down mooks and super mooks feels rather perfect.

Maybe they went with more current movies cause safer? But there is a massive treasure trove of movies to pick from. Would dig some Five Elements Ninja action myself.

Yeah, there are a lot of movies they could have chosen to represent in the game. There are no "Venoms" films (five element ninja qualifies iirc), no Golden Harvest, Shaw Bros... But they took stuff directly from Kill Bill Vol 1, The Raid (1 and 2) and Oldboy, which aren't Chinese....

I could definitely see a scenario where this team takes the money and popularity generated from this game and puts it into a killer "Sifu 2" that has everything I could ever want. The name would even rhyme. See? They have to make it now.

Spoiler

Some crowded city streets mixed with large outdoor areas would be great. It's weird so much of this "traditional chinese martial arts game" takes place inside massive corporate buildings. Level 1 is a slumhouse, Level 2 is a club, 3 an art building, 4 a corporate building... It's always inside a huge building.

Also, I heard someone mention cosmetics for the game and it seems like such a no-brainer. Even if they just added palette swaps and hair dyes, it would help so much for those grinding out the game. It wouldn't take much work to recolor the same textures/models and release it as (free or very cheap) dlc.

[Bloodreign]

Not sure if Konami did any Tetris/Puyo-style games?

They did indeed, in the form of the obscure but quite prolific and mostly Japan-only Taisen Puzzle Dama series. The first was an arcade game, there was a Tokimeki Memorial themed arcade followup (this made it to Saturn and I think PS1) then a third arcade game in the vein of the first. The others were all Japanese console or mobile games, and included TwinBee & Pop n' themed releases

Interestingly, the series lasted from 1995 all the way up to 2011, and the second to last entry was Castlevania Puzzle: Encore of the Night for iOS in 2010, which we did get over here. It was one of the few things I could stand to play at length on my gen 1 iPad. I also have the two Saturn entries, and I had zero idea they were connected to Encore of the Night until very recently.

There's also the Taisen Tokkae Dama series, which plays about the same, but how you match similar colored balls is different as you have FULL control of moving every single ball around to try and make chains (instead of trying to place them them Puyo Puyo Puyo style, hoping and praying you can get them in the right place to start a long chain). Tokimeki Memorial has one, and there's a mode in Suzume Taisen Puzzle Dama on the N64 for Tokkae Dama, as well as playing Puzzle Dama on the same cart, and I believe you can compete against another player each using the same style, or both kinds mixed between the players.

[Blinge]

man any 2D action game where an enemy has the slightest amount of unpredictability.. like, they might do TWO things instead of just the same thing every time!?
I get fuk

The rock thrower guys in Stage 4 of Mizubaku are a good example. sometimes i blow through them without a second thought, other times they just tank me forever and jump while throwing a boulder, cutting off every available space i can move to before my inevitable flattening

edit: also the tree level is hell

[Randorama]

Semi-random post, if I may (I may not? Such is life...).

Metal Slug 3: zombified NPG's are "activated" by a lightning. Is this a reference to some other zombie movie/thing/etc.?
I was playing the game in a very casual manner, and I wondered if the idea is original to the game (and if a certain Isayama copied this very game...).

Vendetta/CF2: I agree with Birru-fordo-san that the game is a real gem in old school belt scrolling design.
I wanted to recover a 1-CC: 1-ALL, which should be already around 30 minutes or so.
Time is an implacable beast for everyone, but I generally enjoy periodically 1-CC'ing old titles as a light motivating result ("see? Easy Peasy, but I can still get it har...ehrm, done!").
I need to practice more the Rude Bros' battle (Fred's movements require practice, punkt).
If I get these guys right (i.e. no loss of life/lives), Faust gives me some trouble because...I cannot recall how to dodge the machinegun attack.
Birru: tips? I feel like I am clearly overlooking a very simple strategy
The extra stage...well, I need to practice Ohsugi+Rude Bros and avoid dropping lives.

(btw: didn't we have a thread only for this genre? Not that I wish to complain about having one discussion thread "for anything R2RKMF").

...and now for a wild tangent. I am trying to 1-CC Taito's Dead Connection, which probably is really borderline relevant here.
Is this an "arena shmup" or something? 30 years on, and I still haven't addressed this question

(legendary amount of rage-quits on this one: I don't think that I can spend more than 20 minutes without getting angry. I will write more at some later stage, if anyone cares).

[BIL]

Semi-random post, if I may (I may not? Such is life...).

Metal Slug 3: zombified NPG's are "activated" by a lightning. Is this a reference to some other zombie movie/thing/etc.?
I was playing the game in a very casual manner, and I wondered if the idea is original to the game (and if a certain Isayama copied this very game...).

I've always found this a wonderfully uncanny touch, too. Can't recall any inspirations, offhand, though the SnK (har! see what I did there ) resemblance is striking (oh god, I didn't even mean that one ).

Stage 2's zombies are a Mars People bioweapon (seemingly malfunctioning, given you fight only "normal" zombies later, until demolishing the cloning facility, when all hell breaks loose and it begins disgorging Super Zombies) - and the dread mothership RUGNAME is surely watching, somewhere above... perhaps it's a wordless nudge from Akio, Meeher and co, that it's no lightning bolt, but some alien transmission medium, reconfiguring the puke-primed subject into said monstrosities.

I like to think the ostensibly supernatural horror of stage 2 is a deliberate misdirect, from the "living dead," to the eerie lightning bolts, to HIYA's spookily tongue-in-cheek BGM. Then Nazca give a big hint at the boss fight (the wonderfully named Ten Commandments Of Moses), that the lone zako seen from st1's beach is far from the only remnant of MSX's climactic "I Wish To Believe In Love" still lurking about.

...they've a lovely little narrative, the Nazca Slugs, don't they? The shift from straight black-comedic satire ala Sturmtruppen to 1940s pulp is handled with surprising grace, imo... MS3's batshit-crazy Martian finale is as antiwar as the first game's grimly grounded pseudo-WWII affair (Final Mission of MS3, and Nazca themselves: "All About Love").

I need to practice more the Rude Bros' battle (Fred's movements require practice, punkt).
If I get these guys right (i.e. no loss of life/lives), Faust gives me some trouble because...I cannot recall how to dodge the machinegun attack.
Birru: tips? I feel like I am clearly overlooking a very simple strategy
The extra stage...well, I need to practice Ohsugi+Rude Bros and avoid dropping lives.

Freddy is legit the game's most dangerous attacker (well, outside of Faust's last stand, which is basically a "Gotcha bitch!" to make up for the abounding magnanimity elsewhere ). I find it best to lure he and Frank to the lower-left corner, early on (at full HP, even if you get smacked, you can recover with the food hidden behind the foreground table). Once there, I unload on Frank, aiming to clip Freddy collaterally. Frank hits hard too, but his defense is non-existent, so just wail away with PPP/KKK, or knock him down with PK, if it's clear Frank is coming in for a snipe. Tricky, but as long as I'm proactive, I consistently make it through.

Faust's machinegun is some bullshit, I don't know if it's possible to survive, should you not be in the pre-ordained safespot. >_< Fortunately it's a cinch. With Boomer, I just get at overlap range, and PPP "through" Faust, to the room's center. He'll go down fast, then scramble to the next side. As long as you're fast, you can simply repeat the same move for the kill.

Basically, get ready when you see his HP flagging, and be at the safespots well ahead of him, and you'll be fine.

The Boss Revenge's Rude+Ohsugi team is the game's deadliest scene, imo. My general tack is to unload on Fred with crates. Remember the bosses are all at ~50% HP (their "mysterious resurrection" the game mentions presumably involving copious amounts of crank ), and Fred is already quite fragile. Four solid hits should kill him. Much simpler from there - neither Frank nor Joe have any defense, and while the latter has good escape mobility, he's also easy to sidestep. Just don't get lassoed, which Frank will capitalise on devastatingly.

My typical Boss Revenge runs:

> Buzzsaw+Captain Caveman (that instakill will only happen about 50% of the time, but it's by far the easiest fight of the slate anyway; more detail here, CTRL+F "instakill")
> Rudes+Ohsugi
> Kurt+Faust (just the last bit, and very obsolete - I didn't know how to fight Kurt head-on, but I'd still consistently survive; a decent base to work better play into, imo)

(btw: didn't we have a thread only for this genre? Not that I wish to complain about having one discussion thread "for anything R2RKMF").

Yep! There's been quite a few in the last ~5yrs. I actually prefer this Final Fight thread, which branched off into more general territory (a game as bone-hard and definitive as FF is as good as any to build a genre thread around, imo) This is my second favourite. Sadly they never stick around long - a genre even more punishing than STGs, imo. I'm sure it'd be the reverse if this was Bmups.org

...and now for a wild tangent. I am trying to 1-CC Taito's Dead Connection, which probably is really borderline relevant here.
Is this an "arena shmup" or something? 30 years on, and I still haven't addressed this question

Cabal-esques (which I'd roughly file DC under) are A-OK here Basically, if it's

1] A badass action game (or a similarly immediate affair, ala the "coinop roguelike" Cave Noire)
2] Could be reasonably portrayed via Famicom (or similarly primal hardware)
3] Off-topic in Shmups Chat (or considered "borderline," ala the topdown push-scrollers Ikari & Kiki Kaikai)

then it's almost certainly fine here. At the end of the day, I'd rather people contribute than not. Paraphrasing Taito, good posting is not required, but is sincerely appreciated.

[Sima Tuna]

I wish there was a Bmups.org.

[BIL]

Have you tried Scrollboss? Only browsed casually, but it seems like a really cool site of similar vintage to Shmups (predating the current Reddit/wiki "bunch of jagoffs discuss X" zeitgeist).

(not to be too hard on Reddit/wiki, they're fine in a pinch, but I couldn't care less if they vanished tomorrow. I must have hardcore fellows! jagoffs abound online, much as they do IRL!)

EDIT: aww, dammit. I think their message board's down. Still, site's worth a look. Lots of affection ala good ol' shumps landing page.

---

EDIT2: Good motherfucking gravy! -_- This is what I'm talking about. Six months ago, I advised the august CONTRA WIKI that no, you are not limited to one bomb in AC Super Contra. They stack! ACROSS STAGES EVEN! You can carry all four (two per loop) into the brutally erratic and cruel final stage! It's great! Because AC Super is hard as a god damn boner - moreover, a bent boner, one that's suffered the all-too familiar mishap of its owner's ladyfriend landing her taint on it mid-coitus! Even a petite ~105lb woman will crack that poor wiener's engorged corpus cavernosa like a Slim Jim! Many big porno lads with nobs like babies' arms have testified to scenes of agony and truly astonishing bloodshed. I suspect the tedious, contact-minimal pistoning of their *coof* films is actually the culprit! To paraphrase Taito once more: Good technique IS required! You have opposable thumbs, lads, and a sophisticated brain wired for speech! Use them, for the love of Christ.

And remember the words of dear departed RegalSin! It's a push not a pump.

NWS YOU FOOLS

Spoiler

Mr. Bear, you've been lucky so far, but luck runs out. >_< Although with your lack of thumbs, and primitive brain, I'm guessing you were SOL to begin with.

Anyway, all this graphic detail to emphasise: The controls are bent to shitting hell and back, and the stage designs give no quarter on this front, going straight for the eyes throat and balls with armies of angry zako and one hulking midboss/setpiece after another! Liberating the alien-subverted FORT FIRESTORM from the possessed GX ARMY, who killed lovable famous character GENERAL HAL, will be the ultimate test for the legendary commando unit!

So six months later, you've amended the page, right lads?

*tumbleweeds.gif*

"Ha," I thought with a massive shit-eating grin, barely able to type as I shook with mirth at the incoming outrage, "now I try a new thing." Soon, I was quoting verbatim Jesse "The Body" Ventura's famous admonition from beloved B-classic Predator - that the admins were homosexuals of insufficient bite strength, owing to their abstinence of chaw! The remedying of which would bestow upon them the strong jaws and rock-hard erections that Jesse prefers of his fellows.

A fortnight on from my devastating act of cyber violence, I returned to teh scene of the crime!

*YOUR MESSAGE WAS BALEETED*

lol ok, sorry, that was a bit out of line. You have to understand; I have the maturity of a small boy, and still find the thought of five angry buff men fucking in the bushes to be hilarious. But you have fixed the AC Super bomb information, right? That's really important info. I was in despair, before fellow Contra PEG fortuitously informed me, at which point I attacked the beast with renewed vigour, and finally ended a years-long grudge match. I hope it'll help a few other hopelessly hard-bitten souls, similarly!

*tumbleweeds.gif*

Oh. Can I... can I just edit the info in, myself? I've literally never seen it anywhere in English, except here. PEG learned it from a Japanese player.

*THIS ARTICLE IS LOCKED*

Ah yeah, I forgot. That's why I had to post a message to begin with! Wow - the Contra Wiki is shite!

At least it told me about GENERAL HAL and the GX ARMY, though!

[Randorama]

Hmm...

As far as I know, Metal Slug takes a lot of inspiration from Miyazaki's works (of course: chapter 3, stage 1, straight out of episode 1 of Future Boy Conan).

I believe that someone at Nazca also knew Franco Bonvicini (aka "Bonvi") and his Sturmtruppen, though it should be a mystery about how they might have had access to this legend of (Italian) fumetti (...I guess you are however referring to the ultra-trashy but great B-movie from the '70s).
There is a way in which Morden's troops and vehicle echo Bonvi's way of drawing Wermacht troops and soldiers that is fairly suspicious, for someone my age and origins.
The whole "war is hell, but at least let's have a laugh about it" is also very Bonvi-style.
Fun fact: Bonvi inspired the design of a German officer in Hugo Pratt's Ballad of the Salted Sea, Corto Maltese's first story.

Said this, the bolt thing may probably originate in some manga/anime from 1-3 before the third title.
An unwritten rule of manga/anime/videogames citations is that they are recent, through you can connect them to some original idea (e.g., Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, which in turn goes back to the bible or something...). I remember the CLAMP collective calling this a "shiratori rule of homage" in some interview.
Roughly, "shiratori" is a game in which players must mention a word beginning with the last syllable of the previous word, mentioned by the previous player.
Or: "Don't cite the bible! Cite the last manga/anime that has the idea you lwanna use!".
Brief aside: SNK's game's citation in SnK (... ) hints at the fact that the author had completely different plans for the story. I digress, so I'll stop here.

Vendetta/CF2: All good, thanks a lot! I just need to clock more practice on these spots and a 1-CC 1-ALL should be fine.
Possible, never granted: that's how the genre works, of course.
Still, a solid portfolio of "titles that I can consistently 1-CC if I put my mind to it" is never a bad thing, a bit like doing your bed every morning.
I am half-tempted to bump one of the two relevant "bmups" threads - let me see if I have something to say that might be relevant.
The !"#¤#% comments on Dead Connection may wait a bit (I need to blow off steam, Titan-like), but I suspect that we could hijack the "single screen" thread.
Technically, it all happens on one screen (at a time), in this and the few other Cabal-esque titles

[BIL]

I believe that someone at Nazca also knew Franco Bonvicini (aka "Bonvi") and his Sturmtruppen, though it should be a mystery about how they might have had access to this legend of (Italian) fumetti (...I guess you are however referring to the ultra-trashy but great B-movie from the '70s).

I actually didn't know a movie existed - I'll have to try tracking it down, cheers. Years ago, I read an article comparing Nazca's work with Bonvi's - I should try to find that, too. I can't recall if it included any commentary from either party, but it was enough to forever associate them in my mind.

The whole "war is hell, but at least let's have a laugh about it" is also very Bonvi-style.

Exactly - knowing ultraviolence with a sort of compassionate fatalism, war treated as a tragic inevitability of humanity's existing paradigms. Totally unlike just about any other iconic Japanese run/gun I can recall, most of them being unironic Hollywood knockoffs, and/or willfully escapist. Not that either approach is a problem, far from it - but Slug's black farce is quite an outlier, much like the standout talents behind it.

Said this, the bolt thing may probably originate in some manga/anime from 1-3 before the third title.
An unwritten rule of manga/anime/videogames citations is that they are recent, through you can connect them to some original idea (e.g., Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, which in turn goes back to the bible or something...). I remember the CLAMP collective calling this a "shiratori rule of homage" in some interview.
Roughly, "shiratori" is a game in which players must mention a word beginning with the last syllable of the previous word, mentioned by the previous player.
Or: "Don't cite the bible! Cite the last manga/anime that has the idea you lwanna use!".

Now you mention it, the "lightning bolt = unhallowed life" thing is a stock horror device even older than Romero's zombies. I wonder if that's what they were going with, Frankenstein's creature being a kind of zombie, after all. (he said, indulging in a bit of classic Partridge )

That's an interesting concept, Shiratori homage...

Technically, it all happens on one screen (at a time), in this and the few other Cabal-esque titles

I like to think of those (and flipscreeners, ala MSX Contra) as collections of scrolls, small ones.

[Sima Tuna]

One of the most memorable parts of Metal Slug, for me, is that ending with the paper airplane. The juxtaposition of ultraviolence and comedy with a sort of wistful melancholy... Metal Slug is a magical series.

[Stevens]

I have finished my first play of Sifu. More thoughts:

I approached it with the mind set that each level was its own game. This helped a lot with the first two stages as I was able to keep my age low through the end of stage two.

First two stages are pretty dope. Stage three starts slow and then really ramps it up, 2nd half has some killer set pieces. Four and five are solid, but don't match what came before. My biggest gripe again is there are parts with lots of empty space, even the best martial arts films have downtime I guess?

Bosses. First is a great intro. Second expands on this and phase one of the third boss puts you in blender. Hardest phase overall. Four is ok and five in a switch kind of forces you to

Spoiler

break his posture via parries

. I actually beat the last boss my first go, but only cause I got there in my 30's.

I also wouldn't mind a warning like Sekiro for sweep attacks. I think, since most of the other mechanics are from that game, a visual warning on an incoming sweep would be nice.

What I do like is that stages 3 - 5 are designed in a way that after you finish the them you can access the bosses right from the start. Makes for a nice unofficial practice mode of sorts. Of course the flip side is you pass up most/all of the upgrade altars. That said game is designed to be cleared with a vanilla main character.

As far as moves go I really like the snap kick - lets you close distance - and the crotch punch. They have some great synergy with each other.

Its crying for an arena mode. Be surprised if they don't have one in the works.

Like a souls game (isn't there one of those coming out this week?) you eventually become the boss. It's awesome to run through and just smack the shit outta everyone.

I think the master type play through is all parts of every stage, no short cuts. Stage 3 would be my hurdle.

Definitely recommend.

[BIL]

One of the most memorable parts of Metal Slug, for me, is that ending with the paper airplane. The juxtaposition of ultraviolence and comedy with a sort of wistful melancholy... Metal Slug is a magical series.

Spellbinding, indeed. The praying girl. 3; 2P ver's a well-earned cheerier riff. Humans think about what you have done.mp3

One of my favourite details is, at the very end of 1P, when the plane's returned to its now-departed sender, if you look at the destroyed vehicles, they're a pair of Metal Slugs that weren't there before. A memento mori to the victors, of sorts, I like to think.

[Randorama]

I actually didn't know a movie existed - I'll have to try tracking it down, cheers. Years ago, I read an article comparing Nazca's work with Bonvi's - I should try to find that, too. I can't recall if it included any commentary from either party, but it was enough to forever associate them in my mind.

Italian '70s B-movie loosely based on the fumetto...it should not be for the faint of heart, but I remember it being very anti-establishment, if anything. Bonvi himself always played a completely over the top "persona" in public: at some point, he worked as the host of a short documentary series on war & comics, and he dressed first like a Wermacht commander and mixing Italian and German, and then like an SS colonel or something for the last episode (and no, he didn't get arrested).

I remember that he was actually making a ferocious parody of the Axis forces (while not sparing Allies, though) - as he was celebrating the Axis' "advancements in genocide technology" and "the infernal beauty of atomic bombs". Figuring out this fact, rather than thinking that he was completely insane, took me a couple of episodes (...I was 11).

He produced tons of stunning work (comics, books, some tv shows), while always mixing low-brow, gallows-oriented humour with brilliant and cultured commentary on society. He also created one of the creepiest comics ever: "Chronicles of the after-bomb", a satire of contemporary/1970's society via post-atomic fall-out, horrendously mutated remnants of society.

He was an absolute class act, like all great (& very eccentric) Italian artists.

Exactly - knowing ultraviolence with a sort of compassionate fatalism, war treated as a tragic inevitability of humanity's existing paradigms. Totally unlike just about any other iconic Japanese run/gun I can recall, most of them being unironic Hollywood knockoffs, and/or willfully escapist. Not that either approach is a problem, far from it - but Slug's black farce is quite an outlier, much like the standout talents behind it.

Yes, all other games in the genre were mostly Reaganomics-style '80s propaganda; hardly a context for ironic art (and for nostalgia, unless one has a few missing neurons and a perverse fetish for tank tops...).

The Nazca guys should have worked on Hammerin' Harry ("honest working class hero vs. the Trumpian plutocracy from Ginza!") and Undercover cops ("Post-apocalyptic coppers against the mutants!"), right? Even In The Hunt has its own moments (st. 4 and st. 5 cannot be taken too seriously...). Very post-ideology, flippantly ironic approach to design

Now you mention it, the "lightning bolt = unhallowed life" thing is a stock horror device even older than Romero's zombies. I wonder if that's what they were going with, Frankenstein's creature being a kind of zombie, after all. (he said, indulging in a bit of classic Partridge )

It probably goes back to some religious myth of creation (The golem? Wild guess), but being a very atheist person and a very lazy lad, I will leave open the problem for (re-)solution to anyone who knows better or is willing to fact-check

Planning a Cabal-oriented bump in another thread soon, promise!

[Sima Tuna]

In the Hunt is fantastically atmospheric in its own way. Some of the most detailed pixel art I have seen in my life, including Metal Slug games. I must also praise Nazca for not using checkpoints, thus allowing their games to be enjoyed/test driven (I think of credit feeding like test driving a car to get the feel of it) by scrubs such as myself. Some of the metal slugs are so brutal to 1cc that I don't think I will ever do it.

[Despatche]

I don't know who worked on Daiku no Gensan, but they did do Undercover Cops, yes. I also never looked into who did Nitropunks.

Play Nitropunks by the way, that game rocks. You'd never think Irem would make it, yet they did. Just like with Socket, I get the feeling it was supposed to get a sequel.

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

Enjoying Crime Fighters 2. It's hard to adjust to enemies being able to break out of basic strings and some of this game's other decidedly non-Capcom-style quirks, but the combat in this game is so energetic and razor's edge - not to mention well-presented - that it's fun to keep trying at it, anyway.

The one thing I really don't understand is how grapples work. It seems like you have to press punch or kick when inside enemies, at a certain finicky spot, that punch and kick both lead to different post-grab pummels, and that only grab can lead to actual throws - but I have no idea what triggers pummels versus the throw, and it's an important distinction given how important both are (the pummel seems to be your most powerful attack in a vacuum, and of course the throw is needed for repositioning). How do you control which attack you get?

-

Though it's not a sidescroller, I'm interested in Sifu lately just because I recently played through Platinum Games' Astral Chain and was left rather cold by it - not an unenjoyable game by any stretch, but nothing near the peaks of 3D action. Though the roguelike elements of Sifu (especially unlocking permanent upgrades between runs) don't really appeal to me, the combat looks like it has potential and the idea of a 3D action game of that sort that is dense enough to be run-based is an exciting one. I don't have a PS4 and I'm not sure my PC would be capable of running the game, but I'm definitely very curious about how it holds up.

[BIL]

99% of my time has been via Boomer, but I'm pretty sure throws work the same for everyone. Basically, you have:

1) a long throw, on [punch]
2) a grapple strike, on [punch]
3) a knee bash, on [kick]
4) a restraining hold, which annoyingly still happens even in 1P games (plus ca Technos )

Long throws can be reliably performed by overlapping the enemy and hitting [punch].

Spoiler

Grapple strikes, which do indeed to enormous damage (Hawk's is an instant kill on all but the toughest regular enemies), are trickier... after having a frustrating time going "through" the enemy and either getting regular PPP, or a long throw, I've had excellent luck treating them as flat-out rear grapples.

With Boomer, walk up behind a regular enemy and hit [punch] - you should see the headlock snap on. A huge help here is that floored enemies, unusually for a beltscroller, will wake up in stun - they're sitting ducks for a quick headlock execution, which reminds me of poor Chuck Norris's neck-broke sendoff at Bruce Lee's hands in Way Of The Dragon, now I think about it.

I'll have to whip up some GIFs, got a ton of clips saved of punks getting headlocked and put down in rapid succession. Feels good mayne.

Bosses seem a bit trickier to headlock, I'm guessing since they don't have the dizzy state of regular enemies for easy rear attack. You can consistently grapple them, though, with specific spacing - I would refer to Murphagator's videos, he has it down to a science. For now, I'm not going for headlocks on them. Worth noting that only Buzzsaw, Ohsugi, and Kurt can actually be grappled - all the others are completely impossible to grapple or throw. You can throw Fred Rude/Igor, but it seems more trouble than it's worth, currently.

Knee bash seems to work at a similar range to the long throw, IE it's executed at overlap from the front. Leads to a nut shot of dubious usefulness, buys a little time I guess, but I don't think you can actually hit the enemy while they're hopping up and down in agony. Booo, gimme that Dynamite Deka ruthlessness!

The rear restraining hold seems to happen if you walk into an enemy's back - just feather [punch] on approach, and you'll get the grapple instead.

Regarding P/K strings, one important thing about CF2: you can do vast amounts of damage via stomping, and your PK will reliably floor even bosses, let alone enemies. And as mentioned, beaten enemies will recover in stun, easy meat for a grapple sendoff. Basically, use P/K only from off-axis (Boomer's K chains have excellent verticality, very useful VS Missing Link), preferably on enemies that've been thrashed a little first.

Sorry if this is disorganised, running on fumes and must crash. I'm gonna see if I can nail down CF2 this week, but good gravy, rad stuff just keeps comin' down the pipeline. Blew all weekend on Dangerous Seed and my side gig, Nazca's formidably addictive Big Tournament Golf.

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

Thank you for the primer! Exactly the kind of thing I needed to help get more used to the game. Hopefully I'll be able to get some credits at least past the stage 3 boss with this.

[drauch]

Yeah, there are a lot of movies they could have chosen to represent in the game. There are no "Venoms" films (five element ninja qualifies iirc), no Golden Harvest, Shaw Bros... But they took stuff directly from Kill Bill Vol 1, The Raid (1 and 2) and Oldboy, which aren't Chinese....

I finally got a taste over the weekend. I prefer the more urban martial-arts 'cause they're like beat 'em ups, but I get it, 'cause there's hardly anything traditional in games outside of more fantastical Dynasty Warriors fare. I did at least like the intro training/'credits' montage that's very reminiscent to many classic martial-arts films.

Also fuuuck, this was a perfect reminder to finally pick up that Eureka Joseph Kuo boxset.

Had to refresh my memory who was in Five Element Ninjas besides Lo Mang. Guess it's not really considered one since it has less than three of the Venom Mob. But fawkkkk, stellar movie.

[BEAMLORD]

I've just spent a dirty weekend with Saigo no Nindo, and BIL's thoroughly instructive kamasutra-for-warriors guide. It's the gift that keeps on giving, as long as my ageing reflexes can implement its teachings as I labour on.
Have managed to reach stage 4 on a life, but that fucking marsh at stage 3 with those bo staff-twirling gentlemen is proving to be my current point of dismantlement.
I note there appears to be enough room in the life box for up to about 5 lives, but I get the feeling that extra lives ain't gonna be worth much once you've eaten one and powered down.
I'm playing the Arcade Archives release, but have a PC engine, and may pick up that port if it offers much else outside of the arcade version.

[BIL]

That's excellent progress! Stage 3 is the first real hurdle, and it's a mean one. Consistently surviving it is a big step forward.

For 3-2's Marsh, it's really all about controlling the Monks. The zako can be kept well at bay with even the base Katana, let alone two shadows and/or POW (its hitbox is deceptively generous). Them in hand, once you've got the knack of stopping a charging Monk dead in his tracks with quick bunnyhop, a lot of the area's initially crushing pressure (attacked from both sides on land and air, oh hell naw! ) will recede. It's actually kinda zen imo.

Respawns aren't the worst thing tbh - large enemy HP drops so steeply, even a base Tsuki can take down Ryuichis and Monks at safe distance with well-placed Grenades or rebound Kusarigama; plus, the latter's autoguard makes you hard for zako to kill, even if you're no longer shredding 'em and their projectiles en masse. Don't be intimidated even in 3-1; those bullets are quick, but you don't need to dodge 'em, or even strike them out of the air; they'll shatter on impact with a deft tap of [attack].

A key recovery skill is probably knowing where the nearest POW carriers are. This is something I didn't really address, good material for v2.0.

PCE Saigo is a lovely conversion from IREM, and does have a unique selling point in its PC Engine mode. Basically gives a you a few hitpoints to play with, though large enemies can still one-shot you. Quite possibly a good training supplement for AC runs.

It's not quite as accurate as it might've been, and it doesn't capture the AC endgame's bitterest extremes - but ala MD+SGX Daimakaimura, it's got the kind of quality where, had the AC ver never existed, it'd handily shoulder 90% of its rep. Stages 3 and 4 play beautifully on PCE, I actually kinda prefer the latter with its slightly peppier 60hz pace. Those are close enough that strategies formed on PCE will more or less port 1:1 to AC, and vice-versa.

The ol' arcade almost-perfect gold standard - really takes you back to the early 90s, when mags were losing their rags over these conversions. I partake minimally of nostalgia, as a personal rule - stuff is either worth revisiting or not, imo - but some things are sacred. ^__^

OMAKE#1 TG16 Ninja Spirit

Spoiler

OMAKE#2 Shadow of Teh Ninja

Spoiler

OMAKE#3 Highlander II Cameo

Spoiler

Now that's quality euphemistry! Gotta sell them R-rated decapitatathons to the kids somehow mirite
P... "precision cuts?"
TASTE MAH FOCKEN STEEL YA WEE FANNEH /shonCONREH

Spoiler

[BEAMLORD]

Cheers BIL, worldly and stamina-pumping input as always. Your posts rock. Looking forward to Saigo Guide v2.0, if it comes to be

[BIL]

Haha, cheers bud. Motto of Hard Gaming House Biruford: All we have to give you is a love that never dies

Aaand right on cue, ready to take a shot at the Crime Fighters 2 2ALL, my latest DS4's dpad underlay carked it. Hellz yeah though, got a bunch of good intel yesterday Ilpalazzo. You may well have figured a lot of this out already, but just in case, here's a summary. I'm thrilled with this game overall... razor-edge is a perfect descriptor, you're incredibly powerful by genre standards, able to outmaneuver enemies or send them to the floor with equal ease, but sleeping on just about any single enemy is to invite a comically brutal downfall. Super strong! Super dangerous!

I'd previously theorised that the rear restraining hold triggers automatically, if you walk into an enemy's back. Thankfully, it's nowhere so annoying. The restraining grab is actually the first phase of your grapple strike; it'll triggers when you tap [P] while in position. Tap [P] again to execute the grapple strike proper. I'm relieved at that - infinitely preferable to racing against unwanted restrains.

As with the knee bash, you get three hits, or if you need to break off use [PK] to blow the target away.

My #1 sparring buddy MR KUNGFU <333

Spoiler

They'll escape eventually, if not battered. As shown, you can actually snap on another throw, if you're deft enough. Not really practical, but a nice detail, and a good illustration of CF2's surprisingly consistent grapple engine.

As mentioned, grapple strikes do big damage, the tradeoff being absolutely no i-frames, opposite the long throw's total invincibility. Nice balance! As I suspected, the knee bash triggers at the same range as a long throw. Its purpose seems to be letting you grapple enemies while carrying a weapon... either that, or gambling on the seemingly random nut shot - which enemies actually can't be hit while staggered by, but it'll at least tee them up for a well-timed attack as they leave "MAH BAWLS!" state.

If you're agile and quick enough, it's very possible to snap on grapples during head-to-head combat; a reliable method is to bait an enemy's strike, slipping around to their back (there's a noticeable delay before most enemies can turn around, after whiffing thus). Gunmen are particularly vulnerable to this approach; their pistol whip is slow, and their shot is even slower.

By far the simplest method, in a 1P game where all eyes are on you, is to floor the target with whatever means you see fit (I like to break off P/K chains at two hits, with a swift PK knockdown), causing them to recover in stagger, a sitting duck.

---

There is a complication here. The above applies only to "normal" sized enemies - Greasers, Bombers, Clubbers, KungFus, Red Mohawks, Chain Wielders, and Gunmen, plus the very rare Dominatrix. This class of enemy is by far the game's most numerous.

The "heavyweight" trio - Fatmen, Trenchcoats and Linebackers (ad hoc naming in effect ) - all lack dizzy states; they also have nastily quick, high-priority throws, making overlap position unsafe. All of this goes for bosses, as well, who also tend to track your position pretty tightly.

So getting reliable grapple strikes, with no dizzy mechanic and limited rear attack options, is exponentially trickier than doing so on the rabble. Again, Murphagator's videos will demonstrate all there is to know, here; he keeps bosses locked down tight, snapping on grapples during their wakeups. (note again that Missing Link, Frank Rude and Faust, CF2's superheavies, cannot be grappled or thrown, at all). Knockdowns followed by extended stompings are my preferred method with thee guys

Noted a few other things, which I need to write down and/or GIF. I'm really tempted to make CF2 my second DBPS, but I just don't have the credibility right now. A happy problem to work on, with games this good. ^__^