Giest118 wrote:Special World wrote:I don't know what's worse, Cagar not understanding how individual taste works, or Giest calling everyone in the world faggots.
See: the really shitty modes of discourse that dominate games discussion and make the entire community look like a pack of idiots.
This was almost certainly a useful contribution to the discussion. Which is about DoDonPachi SaiDaiOuJou. Which was mentioned in your post. I can tell because you talked about it.
I'm joking.
But anyway, you want good discourse, I'll give it to you. As a serious, non-accusatory question: how many people complained when the powering up your shot and laser at the same time was equivocal to putting some robot chick into a swimsuit? A decent number of people? Right. Why is this? Because that concept is retarded. Cool. We all agree.
And yet, we're all still waiting for the chance to play this game for ourselves. Why is this? Because the game is rad. Thus do we prove that a great many people are willing to look past an insignificant aspect of the game's art design, even if it's retarded.
And it really is insignificant. What does it even do? You see it on the ship select screen for like a second, and the ending image is different. Damn son. That's, like, less than 1% of the game. And none of it is gameplay. This game is a loli porn game in the same way that Mass Effect is an orgy-based porn simulator.
Therefore and thusly is Cagar's confusion explained: it doesn't really change the game, and nobody really cares that much, and yet this crap is being complained about anyway.
Appealing for informed discourse in any forum where discourse has degenerated is
always useful. What happens when a trial gets out of hand? There's an appeal for order in the court.
As for "it doesn't really change the game, and nobody really cares that much," you could go back and forth either way. Yeah, we're gonna play the game anyways. We love Cave's games, and we've played them all to death, and no other developer is really doing the things they do in the way they do it.
But does change the game. I would much rather play a first person shooter with Platinum's style of whacked out humor than Epic's Gears of War series, where every character is a steroidal nothing in a game plagued by dull pallettes. Think about Super Mario Bros - maybe it's not your favorite platformer, but it's a genre great for a reason. Maybe it mostly came down to the mechanics, but you have to admit there's something whimsical and fun about the graphic and sound design.
Now imagine that the first Super Mario Bros was an ad for Robotussin. Instead of blocks you have lungs, and instead of coins you have cough drops. Mario is some sort of Leukocyte, seeking to rid Esophagus Kingdom of phlegm. Goombas, koopas, Bowser, they're all different shapes of phlegm. The background is that sickly teal you see on medicine bottles. There are robotussin ads all over the place.
Maybe that sounds like some really cool Lynchian-surreal parody to you. But what it sounds like to me is a bad game that I wouldn't have wanted to play in the '80s.
Essentially what you're saying is that artistry doesn't matter at all. The thing is its function. It doesn't matter if your little brother covers the case to your game in black sharpie, as long as it holds the game and you can tell which one it is. Who cares if that beautiful Espgaluda II case gets sharpied? What does it even matter?
You are arguing against artistry. You are saying that everything is its function. If your stance was commonly held and believed, the things we own and the things we play, the things we watch and the things we read would all be awful.
You could make the point that it's Cave's artistic priority to make the game they want to make. And that's true. But that doesn't mean people have to like their decision, and it doesn't make their decision a non-factor.
Anyways, you feel one way, I feel another. That's cool. You're entitled to your opinion. I would just prefer that people on the internet wouldn't act like they can't possibly understand how somebody would think differently than them, and I wish they wouldn't throw out slurs just because they can.
ED: cutting it down to more or less get to the point and be nice about it
