Help me figure out what [Game Series] to marathon next

[BIL]

that's just because it limits you to 5 continues, whereas the first 2 games were unlimited.

NG3 actually is the hardest of the three, if we're talking the US version. It was deliberately toughened up with brutal damage per hit to Ryu and meaner enemy/powerup placements. Ninja Ryukenden III is easier than the first two games (which are identical across regions). NG2 gives shit-tons of score extends making it an easier 1CC than NG1, which gives none.

Even the Japanese version of NG3 is by far the hardest to no-miss due to the semi-bullshit last stage. If you don't get and keep the invincibility subweapon, and the ammo to use it, you're going to run out of time. If you use it to blow through the spike rooms you can just about clear the stage and the traditional three-boss rush in time.

[burgerkingdiamond]

that's just because it limits you to 5 continues, whereas the first 2 games were unlimited.

NG3 actually is the hardest of the three, if we're talking the US version. It was deliberately toughened up with brutal damage per hit to Ryu and meaner enemy/powerup placements. Ninja Ryukenden III is easier than the first two games (which are identical across regions). NG2 gives shit-tons of score extends making it an easier 1CC than NG1, which gives none.

Even the Japanese version of NG3 is by far the hardest to no-miss due to the semi-bullshit last stage. If you don't get and keep the invincibility subweapon, and the ammo to use it, you're going to run out of time. If you use it to blow through the spike rooms you can just about clear the stage and the traditional three-boss rush in time.

I didn't know that the US version was different.

[njiska]

I would've guessed most of us here play these games like we play shmups. I wouldn't consider any game I used continues on as beaten, be it R-Type or Ninja Gaiden or Mario. I was actually under the impression njiska's marathons were done with this philosophy, but now I'm not sure if it ever came up.

It really depends on the game for me. With shumps it's a one credit affair, but with games like NG I don't care if I die and continue. Because the game makes you replay the area, you have to learn how to master it to progress. All the continues do is let you practice. When I did my Mega Man marathon I didn't do it with no continues, because that's not how those games are expected to be played. You're supposed to try and fail until you figure out the tricks. However once you beat the game once using continues, you know how to do it. I went back and 1cc'd a few of them just for fun. I'll do the same here if I end up playing games that can be 1cc'd.

Frankly for this marathon, because of the time investment required I don't want to spend 30 days working on one 30 minute game. That's just not fun to me. It's different with shmups where I want to master them and the motivation is there for a 1cc, but it's comply different for console games that weren't designed/balanced for 1 credit runs anyways. The only exception would be if I were to play a game like Contra: Shattered Soldier where you need to no-miss the first section and get S ranks just to see the last few stages.

Props on doing a marathon regardless. When I first got the Mega Man X Collection I tried going through all the games, but by the end of X3 I was already bored and wanted something else to play. Variety is the spice of gaming and all that.

That's a real shame because X4 is on par with the original X in terms of awesomeness. Mega ZX was a chore.

[BIL]

I didn't know that the US version was different.

Very - besides having unlimited continues the JP version even has passwords. There's a dev interview quoted on the game's Wikipedia page where they talk about the JP one being geared as an "NG for everyone" and the US version being toughened up due to a perceived Western affinity for hard games in the early 90s (hence that "TOUGH TO BEAT" blurb on NG3's box).

[Jaimers]

The Ys series.

That should keep you busy for a while.

[Ghegs]

Huh, surprising. After I was sufficiently indoctrinated to the 1CC mentality I've played all applicable games that way, regardless of the genre. Though I admit Mega Man games sort of get a break, mainly thanks to the password system.

When I did my Mega Man marathon I didn't do it with no continues, because that's not how those games are expected to be played.

Yet I would kind of disagree with this. Yes, they have the passwords and I do use them with Mega Man games while still feeling like I actually beat the game...but I wouldn't say a 1CC run of those is something totally unexpected and unintended by the devs, either. I think MM9 and 10 even have achievements relating to that. I don't know, somehow in my mind the MM games are just a bit different in this regard, normally all NES action-platformers fall under the "1CC or bust" -category for me.

Props on doing a marathon regardless. When I first got the Mega Man X Collection I tried going through all the games, but by the end of X3 I was already bored and wanted something else to play. Variety is the spice of gaming and all that.

That's a real shame because X4 is on par with the original X in terms of awesomeness. Mega ZX was a chore.

Oh, I did eventually play X4. Good stuff, yeah.

[njiska]

When I did my Mega Man marathon I didn't do it with no continues, because that's not how those games are expected to be played.

Yet I would kind of disagree with this. Yes, they have the passwords and I do use them with Mega Man games while still feeling like I actually beat the game...but I wouldn't say a 1CC run of those is something totally unexpected and unintended by the devs, either. I think MM9 and 10 even have achievements relating to that. I don't know, somehow in my mind the MM games are just a bit different in this regard, normally all NES action-platformers fall under the "1CC or bust" -category for me.

My argument has less to do with the password system and more to do with the fundamental rock-paper-scissors gameplay. The best part of Rockman is figuring out who's weak to what and the only way to do that is trial an error. That's why when you run out of lives the options are Continue or Stage Select. I don't think 1CC runs are impossible, but I see them as being a personal reward, rather than being the primary way the devs expect you to play; especially your first time through. The Achievements back this up as there are not only rewards for a 1CC, but also for not dying and not taking damage. These are all great skill rewards, but not the focus of completion.

And again like I said, if you can get through a Mega Man game using continues then you've learned all you need to know to be able to 1CC it. Almost to the point of a 1CC not being a challenge. In fact the only reason I don't have a MM2 1CC under my belt is because I get pissed off at two sections of Wily's Castle. The Item 1 Platforming section and the damn Turret Boss.

[Ruldra]

NG-I has one exploit where you can instakill all three final bosses if you're using continues. Pick the whirlwind weapon from 6-3, get to the final room, instakill the first boss, die, use a continue, get sent back to 6-1, pick whirlwind and use it on the second final boss (you don't fight the previous boss again), repeat the process on the last final boss. You can beat the game without learning how to manage them. This tactic is impossible to do if you're going for a 1cc.

Would that count as a clear to you?

[Ghegs]

The best part of Rockman is figuring out who's weak to what and the only way to do that is trial an error.

As a side note, this is actually my least favorite part of the games. "Well, managed to get a weapon. Now who does it work against? No, wasn't that guy...no, wasn't that guy...no, wasn't that guy...". It's much more interesting to me to just learn to fight the bosses with the megabuster. But that's neither here or there.

And again like I said, if you can get through a Mega Man game using continues then you've learned all you need to know to be able to 1CC it. Almost to the point of a 1CC not being a challenge.

Learned, sure, but execution is still the key. Just like how you can savestate-practice a shmup's stages and bosses all you want, but it's still all just practice until you do it all in a one run from start to finish. And keeping one's focus for the game's full length is certainly a part of the 1CC challenge. The 1CCC, if you will.

I'm not even really disagreeing about the MM games' intended way of play, I'm just playing the devil's advocate, sort of.

[njiska]

I'm not even really disagreeing about the MM games' intended way of play, I'm just playing the devil's advocate, sort of.

Completely fair opinion. I've always been of the belief that games are meant to be played how you personally enjoy them and screw what anyone else thinks. After all, this is all about having fun right?

[Daigohji]

Shadow Hearts would be a good series to marathon, since the first three games have ongoing continuity. You'll need:

- Koudelka (PS1). A little clunky, but it's an interesting mix of survival horror atmosphere and JPRG mechanics, with a little positioning-based strategy RPG flavour tossed into the battle system. It's also the only JRPG I know of that's set in Wales!
- Shadow Hearts (PS2). Again, eerily atmospheric, but with a much improved battle system and story. An early PS2 title that looks like it was developed with the PS1 in mind, but a solid entry regardless.
- Shadow Hearts: Covenant (PS2). Drops the horror atmosphere, replacing it with a goofy sense of humour and some great characters. Much better presentation, and a refined version of the previous game's excellent battle system. One of the best JRPGs ever made.

There's also Shadow Hearts: From the New World, which ditches the characters from the early games and has a more typical JRPG teenage protagonist. I haven't played this one, but it's apparently a step down from Covenant on most fronts.

[shmuppyLove]

- Shadow Hearts: Covenant (PS2)

I always meant to play this and never did. I haven't played any of the other SH games though, can I jump in with this one or will I be a bit lost?

Edit: wow, still pretty premium prices on eBay. $25 - 30 for disc only? Sheesh

[Daigohji]

- Shadow Hearts: Covenant (PS2)

I always meant to play this and never did. I haven't played any of the other SH games though, can I jump in with this one or will I be a bit lost?

Edit: wow, still pretty premium prices on eBay. $25 - 30 for disc only? Sheesh

You should be able to follow the story. It tends to be the characters who carry over between games rather than there being one ongoing plot, but there's one significant plot element in Covenant that will have more impact if you've played Shadow Hearts first. Then again, this element confused the hell out of me at first, as I didn't know that the first SH has two possible endings, and I got the one that Covenant doesn't consider canon.

[stryc9]

Regarding the use of continues and what Ghegs said, this is something I've been thinking about for a while.

I believe shmups have changed the way I perceive beating a game - these days, generally speaking I do not consider something truly cleared without a 1CC on the default settings (unless of course the title in question is unrealistically easy, in which case I bump up the difficulty and work with that).

However, I've gotta be realistic and accept the fact that there is a possibility that some console games have been designed to be beaten with a limited stock of credits in mind. I can't think offhand of any glaring examples of this, but I'm sure they are out there.

I guess it has to be by a case by case basis.

[burgerkingdiamond]

NG-I has one exploit where you can instakill all three final bosses if you're using continues. Pick the whirlwind weapon from 6-3, get to the final room, instakill the first boss, die, use a continue, get sent back to 6-1, pick whirlwind and use it on the second final boss (you don't fight the previous boss again), repeat the process on the last final boss. You can beat the game without learning how to manage them. This tactic is impossible to do if you're going for a 1cc.

Would that count as a clear to you?

you can instakill every boss in the game with that powerup. That's what really pisses me off about NG-1 speed runs.

My best speed run is around 22 mintues, but I don't use the exploit. On the other hand a speed run taking advantage of the whirlwind is like 12 minutes.

[cj iwakura]

I'd like to get RE0. The REmake for the GC is also excellent and really creepy. As is Code Veronica.

RE0 has the same problem dragging down RE5.

Babysitting bad AI.

Though the AI isn't quite as bad, since you can leave it behind.

[mrsmiley381]

Phantasy Star has a lot to play. There are even text adventures for the Sega Channel that got translations. Phantasy Star Universe gets good if you really have the patience.

Panzer Dragoon isn't a bad series to marathon, aside from Saga being balls-expensive. I lucked out getting it in an auction lot.

Sonic is fun to marathon. It's what I've been doing for the most part. Haven't touched '06 or the Storybook games yet though. Pray for me when I do.

Resident Evil is a solid choice so long as you stick to the main ones. Zero is good. The AI is fine, really.

Saints Row and Grand Theft Auto are surprisingly fun to marathon. Saints Row goes downhill in the third installment and San Andreas is one of the longest goddamn games ever, but you'll be entertained, for sure.

Castlevania starts hard and largely gets better and easier over time. Go nuts. I know I did for a few years straight.

Splatterhouse is a little brutal but pretty short overall. Damn fine series. I don't give a shit what the critics say.

That's what I can offer for now.

[Stormwatch]

What series to marathon? Well, duh... Marathon!

[Moniker]

May be a bit trite to recommend, but I'd say: Mario. Every game in the main series is fantastic and different. Not quite the replay value of MM, but the best platforming out there, and generally a good difficulty curve.

SMB1-3, Lost Levels, Land 1&2, World, 64, Sunshine, Galaxy 1&2, NSMB/Wii. Haven't played 3D land. The Wariolands & Yoshi's Islands for bonus.

More off the beaten path: Wonderboy and/or Monster World. Part of the coolness is seeing the series vascillate b/w arcade and rpg sensibilities. Most (all?) are available on VC.
SMS: Wb1 - arcade platforming, Wb2/Monster Land - arcade RPG platforming, Wb3-Dragon's Trap, Metroidvania
SMD: Wb3 Monster Lair - arcade platforming, Wb5 Monster World 3 - more linear metroidvania, Wb6 Monster World 4 - metroidvania.

Other good options that haven't been mentioned: Ghosts 'n Goblins, Fire Emblem, Doom/Hexen/Quake.

[njiska]

Updated thoughts. I'm going to pick the series I start next weekend.

Possible options:
Wild ARMs - My own curiosity maybe/maybe not
Suikoden - Never played it
Phantasy Star - I own Sonic Ultimate so this would be easy
Silent Hill - Huge fan, but only finished SH2. Love horror games
Odd World - Already own all four games, but never really played them. Could be an interesting look into Lorne Lanning.
Resident Evil - I've actually only beaten 1, 4, 5. Almost finished Zero and never came close to finishing 2,3, RE. I do hate 3 though.
Wonderboy - Never played any of these games. Think I do own one of them.
Panzer Dragoon - If my roommate gets a job this one is financially viable.

Not an option:
Mario - Already played quite a bit of the 2D games and I have no interest at all in the 3D ones. I've tried playing them all and I can't stand them. Even Galaxy.
Ghost n' Goblins - Not ready to commit to this one yet. Someday I will.
Doom/Hexen/Quake - Again, played them all.
Marathon - While I appreciate the irony, I do not have a Mac to play these on and I really want to play them on a real Mac. This marathon would also have to include Pathways into Darkness because, well, I love it.

Metal Gear - I've already played every game in the series aside from Peace Walker. This includes the MSX games. Good luck Daigohji!
Doom - Again, played them all. Haven't finished 3, but i may go back to it when Ultimate BFG is released.
Metroid - I've played a good deal of Super Metroid and Zero mission. Been casually working on Fusion. Not a series i'm interested in doing a straight run through.
Castlevania - I don't want to have to deal with the Axe Knight/Medusa corridor. That's as far as I've gotten in the first game and I don't have the patience to deal with it again. I'm also played the best parts of the rest of the series already.
Sonic - I've given this one real thought and was nearly going to do it, but then I played a little Sonic Adventure 2 and got mad at the Knuckles stages.
Streets of Rage - Again, played them all. Love them.
Jak and Daxter - Already played them all.

[BIL]

CV1 stage five axeknight + medusa corridor is good for your balls. I mean, your 2D sidescroller spatialising, object tracking and timing abilities. It's like in those old martial arts flicks where the grizzled sensei makes the young student carry logs on his back up a million flights of stairs, and the next day the guy is suddenly kicking the shit out of the local hoods. It'll make you a SIDESCROLLER KILLER. You'll be no-missing Metal Slug 3 next week guaranteed!

If you go with Silent Hill, heed Cstarflare's warning and stop after 4. Everything after ranges from "nice try bro" to "shit."

[njiska]

If you go with Silent Hill, heed Cstarflare's warning and stop at 4. Everything after ranges from "nice try bro" to "shit."

If I'm in for the good, I'm in for the bad. That's the rule. It's why i had to play through X6 nearly 3 times. If I go SH I can tolerate going through Homecoming, Downpour and Shattered Memories.

[BIL]

Hmm, godspeed then. There's some humour value in there at least. Wait until you get to Homecoming's "big twist," I burst out laughing in disgust.

[Ruldra]

CV1 stage five axeknight + medusa corridor is good for your balls. I mean, your 2D sidescroller spatialising, object tracking and timing abilities. It's like in those old martial arts flicks where the grizzled sensei makes the young student carry logs on his back up a million flights of stairs, and the next day the guy is suddenly kicking the shit out of the local hoods. It'll make you a SIDESCROLLER KILLER. You'll be no-missing Metal Slug 3 next week guaranteed!

Is this the corridor before the Death boss? The cross boomerang will kill the knight before he does anything and the medusa heads are easy by themselves. I honestly never had problems with that part.

[BIL]

Indeed, it's easy when you have a strategy. Boomerang being the most apparent, but any subweapon (or none at all) is perfectly doable, as long as you're staying outside of the medusas' flight paths and within whipping distance of the knights to destroy them + their axes.

I was being just a tad facetious in that post. Still, it's a fine piece of strategic sidescrolling action.

[EmperorIng]

Wonderboy is a cute, fun series. Monster's Lair, while it's one I haven't played, looks to be a fun little shmup/platformer hybrid.

The only thing is that the series is so chronologically/name-changin' confused I don't even know the order of the games or which ones are part of the series etc.

Like when you have games named Wonder Boy V: Monster World III.

[Moniker]

Well, I'm inspired. Decided to do a Metroid Marathon, although in no particular order. Played through MZM & Fusion the last few days. MZM has been my favorite Metroid to date, but damn, Fusion has some great bosses. Found an awesome UI hack for Super Metroid that makes it control like MZM, so I expect to enjoy it quite a lot (haven't played it in awhile either). Hopefully hackers have figured out how to automap Metroid 1 & 2 so I don't have to have gamefaqs up and running constantly.

[EmperorIng]

check out the hack of Metroid 1, MDBtroid (I'm a member over there ha ha):
http://www.metroid-database.com/fanapps/
-improved graphics
-compatible with LUA script that gives you automap
-weapon toggling a la Super Metroid
-starting game with 99 energy instead of 30
-on-screen timer for speed-running

It's an awesome way to play an already awesome game.

Don't know about M2 though. The game's map is confusing, but since the game is pretty "linear" you shouldn't have too much a problem if you're thorough.

[undamned]

Well, if you have any Megaman appetite left in you, you could hit Megaman Legends 1, 2, and Missadventures of Tron Bonne. All playable on PS1/2/3.
-ud

[CloudyMusic]

check out the hack of Metroid 1, MDBtroid (I'm a member over there ha ha):
http://www.metroid-database.com/fanapps/
-improved graphics
-compatible with LUA script that gives you automap
-weapon toggling a la Super Metroid
-starting game with 99 energy instead of 30
-on-screen timer for speed-running

It's an awesome way to play an already awesome game.

Don't know about M2 though. The game's map is confusing, but since the game is pretty "linear" you shouldn't have too much a problem if you're thorough.

Interesting. I'll definitely have to check this out myself.