Edit: of the scenes cut there was one in Jedi where Vader chokes an imperial officer - this was in keeping with the previous two films, and a brief scene before he visits the Emperor where he uses the old jedi mind trick to get past the red guards - seems odd he'd have to do that, guess that's why it was cut. I'm also looking forward to seeing the sand storm sequence that was cut from Jedi, as I know that's included... but it's not like I'll be buying them.
Yeah, this is what I was wondering. I'm sure they will be SVHS quality though.
RegalSin wrote:New PowerPuff Girls. They all have evil pornstart eyelashes.
dan76 wrote:It's weird because in the (excellent) Star Wars to Jedi doc Lucas says that film makers spend to much time showing off their special effects and that you don't need to. A couple of shots is all that's needed to convince an audience. This from an interview in 1984... Seems like between then and now he completely reversed this opinion (or was the new trilogy just an ad for what ILM could do).
Wow. Very interesting. I think he became so enamored with technology that he lost all sorts of respect for the subtlety of other filmmakers, such as Kurosawa, that first inspired him to make movies.
dan76 wrote:a brief scene before he visits the Emperor where he uses the old jedi mind trick to get past the red guards - seems odd he'd have to do that, guess that's why it was cut.
I believe this happens in the novelization of ROTJ. I read it as a child, so I can't remember why this happens. All I remember from reading the book in the 3rd grade or so was that there was a lengthy flashback in Luke's mind when he was in the pit with the rancor monster.
Undamned is the leading English-speaking expert on the consolized UD-CPS2 because he's the one who made it.
PC Engine Fan X! wrote:After watching all three original SW films again in their entirety, some pressing questions still come up:
So how old is Anakin Skywalker and son when he fights with his son in the final climatic lightsaber duel scene in ROTJ? I've noticed that the ages between Anakin and his children Luke and Leia, are never disclosed in any of the SW films. And how many months/years lapse from the events that take place in TESB and ROTJ with Luke and Yoda finally meeting again for the second and final time? Of course, Yoda is much older in the ROTJ film indeed.
If Lucas originally envisioned his SW films to be a nine film series, what happens in Episodes 7, 8 and 9? What becomes of the last remainants of the Galactic Empire now that the Emperor & Vader are dead? Would it be safe to have them assimilated into the general multi-species population and help create a "New Republic" order? The climatic battle at Endor shown in ROTJ was considered a multi-species war against the Empire if you stop and ponder a bit.
And are the Dark Jedi Sith still around to clash with the upcoming Jedi after the events shown in ROTJ? It would seem that there are no more Sith lords aside from Darth Vader and the Emperor. Considering that Luke is the very last remaining Jedi after the death of Yoda, it would make sense to create a Jedi training school and teach his sister (and others) the same arts of the Jedi. The new Jedis that graduate from said new Jedi academy can make their decision to fight for good or for evil, giving rise to a new batch of Sith Lords to persue/destroy.
The Emperor could've easily cloned himself with easy access to the Spaarti cloning technology if he wanted to do so (the same technology to clone them Stormtroopers).
PC Engine Fan X! ^_~
didn't they cover that in the various dark forces: Jedi Knight series of games? because by the time of jedi academy Luke's convinced Kyle Katarn to join him as an instructor after the events of Jedi Outcast.
It's about "realizing their actuality." And judging by the look on Jane's face, she's realized it a couple of times already.
Ugh....I thought it was already an unanimous fact the "NOOOOOOooo" was one of the cheesiest, embarrassing lines in Revenge of the Sith. Why on EARTH repeat it??!! I hope it's a joke...
I think something you people complaining about the changes should realize is that this is hardly a recent thing. Lucas was doing changes to the sound mixes while the first movie was still in theaters and later with some of the first home video releases. At this point you should either learn to live with new changes every few years and like it or find something else to watch.
oh, get real, what Lucas is doing is incredibly irritating. If people shelling out $90 for this collection aren't expecting the changes, it's infuriating.
Gus wrote:I think something you people complaining about the changes should realize is that this is hardly a recent thing. Lucas was doing changes to the sound mixes while the first movie was still in theaters and later with some of the first home video releases. At this point you should either learn to live with new changes every few years and like it or find something else to watch.
Yeah, ok, we'll all do that... or maybe we can discuss it in a forum with other people who might be interested.
This isn't about some nerd crying because George Lucas ruined our childhood - it's more about the mentality of someone who can't leave something alone, that almost everything he changes makes the original films that bit worse. It's just funny - it's the definition of irony. He really doesn't get it, and he won't be told.
I met Anthony Daniels a few years ago (he came into the shop where I was working, stayed chatting for half an hour - nice bloke) and he confirmed this, that people just don't say no to him, it's the unwritten rule. Lucas feels completely justified in his opinion of what is right as he's the man who made Star Wars, a film everyone thought was going to be awful. I asked him to compare filming the original trilogy to the new one (after letting him know I was no fan of the prequels, which he accepted) and he said that the old films were fairly conventional in that you would film scenes, that they would flow and they would try different things out. The new trilogy was just filming shots. Not scenes, just angles against a green screen. He said that last shot he did in Revenge of the Sith was him sitting on a green chair, holding a green stick against a green background - and he didn't know what or where it would be used in the film.
I could rabbit on for hours about Star Wars but this is more about how digital technology has killed film making as an art form. Here you have one of the pioneers of digital technology messing up the classic films, that yes, have some technical floors but really who gives a shit, at least they have some life to them (and tie fighters).
Last edited by dan76 on Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Wow, that's interesting about Anthony Daniels, and it confirms what many people have been saying all along: the time between Star Wars movies, Lucas had surrounded himself with a bunch of "yes man"s who will do anything he wanted to. No more Lawrence Kadsdan, who was around for the first two SW movies and kept Lucas in check. His absence in ROTJ can be noticed, and ROTJ is the weakest of the original trilogy.
The green screens were certainly annoying. The one good thing about the Phantom Menace is that they at least shot scenes in Tunisia, Italy, and such. Thus, the visuals were great. The Naboo city was actual architecture that they were interacting with, and the hangar was an actual set with actual starfighters lined up. LOTR's Gollum looked way more convincing than Jar Jar, who looked, moved, and was animated too cartoony. Then with Attack of the Clones, it was all greens screens and CG. You know when the Jedi are in that arena at the end? Some of the worst green screen crap can be seen there with the extras. In more than one shot, you can see some dumb idiot kid standing there barely swinging a lightsaber around, and it's supposed to be a big battle. And they got to say, "Duh, yay, I was in a Star Wars movie." Again, LOTR mops up SW in this aspect. For AOTC, there were no more sets; forget it. The Chancellor's chambers was all apparently CG. They couldn't even bother to put up a wall for them to stand in front, and it really looks fake. Some of the CG really shines, like the car chase and such. But so much of it was really bad. For a movie that is supposed to be a vehicle for special effects, that's real bad.
Then they introduce goofy technology too. The original films were straight and to the point. The prequels had stuff like exploding missiles that release tiny droids that use welders to try to rip apart a ship. How practical is that? Sure, they're made by the Techno Federation or whatever, but how cost-effective is that? Just make them release exploding balls or something. They were so in-love with going over-the-top goofy with special effects that it detracted from what could have been a really awesome, epic fleet battle in the beginning of Revenge of the Sith. And would it have killed them to make the holograms, technology and such look worse than the original movies? Phantom Menace was supposed to be 40-50 years in the past. Couldn't they have made the interiors of their space ship look a bit more primitive?
I did enjoy the prequels, for what they were worth. The dialogue in AOTC was pretty cringeworthy, but overall the story was kinda nice (except for midichlorians, the virgin birth, dumb romance scenes, "you're softer than sand," "younglings," etc). It's just sad because it could've been so much better, if only Lucas would have surrounded himself with people who could flat out tell him, "that's not a good idea, George. People won't like this." Instead, he was surrounded with guys who fawned all over him and seemed to do whatever he asked them to do without offering alternative suggestions.
Undamned is the leading English-speaking expert on the consolized UD-CPS2 because he's the one who made it.
dan76 wrote:...that almost everything he changes makes the original films that bit worse.
And makes me care that much less. There was a point (I'm 39 now) where I felt like recapturing part of my childhood with these films, but despite nostalgia, I can't get past the fact that only the first two films are actually good, and Empire isn't even by Lucas. At a certain point it just became too much of a pain to pursue two films that Lucas was actively fucking up.
When an author writes a book, it becomes a shared property between the author and readers. This is true of films as well, but Lucas won't have it.
I could rabbit on for hours about Star Wars but this is more about how digital technology has killed film making as an art form. Here you have one of the pioneers of digital technology messing up the classic films, that yes, have some technical floors but really who gives a shit, at least they have some life to them (and tie fighters).
I'd rather discuss that than Lucas (though it would be another thread I imagine.) I think there is some validity to digital technology, but trading in one for the other is a mistake. Practical effects still carry a weight that the new effects can't quite manage.
Randorama wrote:ban CMoon for being a closet Jerry Falwell cockmonster/Ann Coulter fan, Nijska a bronie (ack! The horror!), and Ed Oscuro being unable to post 100-word arguments without writing 3-pages posts.
Eugenics: you know it's right!
CMoon wrote: I think there is some validity to digital technology, but trading in one for the other is a mistake. Practical effects still carry a weight that the new effects can't quite manage.
Tis a tool like any other. Can be used for good, evil, or as a crutch for incompetence. District 9 + The (original) Matrix -> Michael Bay -> Prequel Trilogy.
As for Lucas, I still can't find it in my heart to hate him. I pity him, rather. He was once a visionary filmmaker who held the respect of the likes of Francis Ford Coppola (he was originally slated to direct Apocalypse Now, until it hit budget problems). According to the impregnable authority of South Park, he once led the charge against the colorization of films. He was central to of the greatest pop film phenomena of all time (SW & Indiana Jones). And now everything he touches turns to shit. RIP, my poor dead king.
BTW: The fan edits of the prequel trilogy are worth checking out. One good thing to come out of this thread.
Moniker wrote:
As for Lucas, I still can't find it in my heart to hate him. I pity him, rather. He was once a visionary filmmaker who held the respect of the likes of Francis Ford Coppola
And now, has the the respect of post-Apocalypse Now/Godfather Francis Ford Coppola. Fitting, no?
RegalSin wrote:New PowerPuff Girls. They all have evil pornstart eyelashes.
Moniker wrote:
As for Lucas, I still can't find it in my heart to hate him. I pity him, rather. He was once a visionary filmmaker who held the respect of the likes of Francis Ford Coppola
And now, has the the respect of post-Apocalypse Now/Godfather Francis Ford Coppola. Fitting, no?
I can't speak for popular conception, but in my opinion, some of his best work is post 1979. Some clunkers, surely, but Rumble Fish (1983) rivals AN as his masterpiece, Tucker: The Man and his Dream (1988) is one of the best biopics ever, Peggy Sue Got Married (1986) and Bram Stoker's Dracula (1992) are both extremely well-crafted, if not typical Coppola fare, and his recent Youth without Youth (2007) and Tetro (2009) show immense promise and a return to form, respectively.
Cf. George Lucas who, post Indiana 3, did... the prequel trilogy and Indiana 4.
Moniker wrote:George Lucas who, post Indiana 3, did... the prequel trilogy and Indiana 4.
Recant. Recant, I say!
I'm really not comfortable crediting any of the Indiana Jones movies to Lucas. He didn't direct any of them, and in the case of 3, he was only one of several writers involved. The problem is, Lucas puts his name on anything he is involved in, and then it is HIS movie. This is precisely the scenario with Empire--and it leads me to wonder about the extent of his creative control on this and other 'Lucasfilms'.
Was Lucas truly behind the wheel on these films, or was he just handing off a loose story idea (as I heard was the case with Raiders), and then funding his crew to make the film for him?
Randorama wrote:ban CMoon for being a closet Jerry Falwell cockmonster/Ann Coulter fan, Nijska a bronie (ack! The horror!), and Ed Oscuro being unable to post 100-word arguments without writing 3-pages posts.
Eugenics: you know it's right!
Moniker wrote:
I can't speak for popular conception, but in my opinion, some of his best work is post 1979. Some clunkers, surely, but Rumble Fish (1983) rivals AN as his masterpiece, Tucker: The Man and his Dream (1988) is one of the best biopics ever, Peggy Sue Got Married (1986) and Bram Stoker's Dracula (1992) are both extremely well-crafted, if not typical Coppola fare, and his recent Youth without Youth (2007) and Tetro (2009) show immense promise and a return to form, respectively.
I guess none of those are bad other than Dracula. I thought it was the biggest hunk of shit, in-studio developed movie I'd ever seen. Bad casting choice w/ Keanu... bad choice to not take any of the cameras outside. That's probably why I think he's a shit director now. I'll admit nobody's going to top Apocalypse Now, even himself, but most of his stuff in the 80's & 90's just seemed drab to me.
RegalSin wrote:New PowerPuff Girls. They all have evil pornstart eyelashes.
Does make me wonder when the original unaltered theatrical versions will be on Blu-Ray format...certainly not with this upcoming 2011 Blu-Ray set indeed.
Interesting to learn that when the 1977 Star Wars film was brought back to the silver screen for it's re-release in 1981, it did get the proper Star Wars: Episode IV billing in the intial epilogue roll.
Yeah, it certainly would've been a very different ROTJ if Lawrence Kasdan directed it indeed (with Lando and crew not surviving the Death Star II supernova blast). Sometimes, the good guys die as well, just like with the bad guys.
PC Engine Fan X! wrote:Yeah, it certainly would've been a very different ROTJ if Lawrence Kasdan directed it indeed (with Lando and crew not surviving the Death Star II supernova blast). Sometimes, the good guys die as well, just like with the bad guys.
It would've been cool, but they'd also have the "Reverend" Jesse Jackson on their ass, too. Hey Jackson, how many people have you led to Christ? None? Well stop calling yourself a reverend then, you politicizing, polarizing race baiter! The same goes for Al Sharpton.
Undamned is the leading English-speaking expert on the consolized UD-CPS2 because he's the one who made it.
for me star wars is: the 3 movies with harrison ford in it... even my gf likes them
but i will never buy them... same goes for lord of the rings... they fucking rip you off by releasing every movie seperately then releasing a box, then releasing every movie with an extended version... then a super duper derpy derpy edition comes out and THEN they release everything again on blu-ray.. adn what the fuck? they still find new material and deleted scens they can put in so basically you never get a DEFINITE last edition... fucking hate this...oh and is lotr on blu ray out yet? doubt that... sry i hate this industry... it's even worse than music business...
...maybe there will be a time when i own a movie... actually fuck it ... i'm happy with pirating movies and spending my money on other stupid shit that does the same...buying a CAVE game only to buy the black label version too only to find out that there is a Limited edition with a DLC card... of course buying that too... and then even buying the platinum because there are game modes on it i NEVER play... but wanna have it...
i am an idiot
(Note that for cave games it's a bit different since you know from the start that a limited edition will come out so you can basically decide at the start which version you are getting.)
sry for this rant but i galnced at my 7 lotr dvds there ...and became furious...
I was talking about Return of the Jedi with a friend of mine (I disliked Jedi even as a middle school student when it first came out), and we were remarking on things that went wrong with that film. I'd forgotten that Boba Fett just fell in the big sand vagina.
Seriously, it would have been a little thing, but why not have Boba escape (as all good villians do), and return near the end on (on the goddamn planet of Ewoks) and there been a final show down between Han and Boba. C'Mon man, doesn't Lucas understand a thing about movies? It would have added just that much more, instead of Boba Fett's unceremonious ending. Throw me a bone Lucas!
Randorama wrote:ban CMoon for being a closet Jerry Falwell cockmonster/Ann Coulter fan, Nijska a bronie (ack! The horror!), and Ed Oscuro being unable to post 100-word arguments without writing 3-pages posts.
Eugenics: you know it's right!
Lol at the "big sand vagina" reference. A proper showdown/face-off between Fett & Solo...that'd be one for the ages indeed. You'd think with Fett's cool gadgets and exotic weaponry, they'd be more than ample enough for him to make his daring escape. But no, it's the loud belch coming from the Carkoon creature that gets the best of Fett and to have him suffer a thousand years of digestion indeed. What kind of worse fate/indignity than that?
Might as refer to them sand worms featured in the 1984 Dune flick as "big giant sand cocks" for that matter.
With Boba Fett I was really expecting him to fly out of the sarlaac pit in the special editions - maybe in the background of a scene, just to hint that he didn't meet his end down there.
Joe Johnston, who isn't all that as a director but was key in the making of the original trilogy has said he would love to make a Boba Fett film. I guess if that bitch Lucas allowed him we might get something decent, probably set before the original trilogy.
There must be thousands of well-preserved copies of the original trilogy scattered all over the world (mostly with printed subtitles, but still). I'm sure some high quality digitisation will appear in the wild sooner or later.
The rear gate is closed down
The way out is cut off
CMoon wrote:Seriously, it would have been a little thing, but why not have Boba escape (as all good villians do),
This exact thing happens in the Dark Empire comic books. I read those in high school. I wouldn't recommend reading them, though. With the 1997 Special Editions, the Sarlaac Pit has a worm-like mouth that chomps people. I guess that'd put an end to the whole "sit around and wait until you die" premise.
Also, if you've seen the Robot Chicken Star Wars Specials, Boba Fett does show up on Endor and starts blasting Ewoks left and right. Fun stuff.
Undamned is the leading English-speaking expert on the consolized UD-CPS2 because he's the one who made it.
