hzt wrote:Skykid wrote:Evangelion HD Remix?
Not sure I can be bothered.
Rebuild is way more than a retelling or and HD remix, and even if it was exactly the same but with better animation it would be worth watching because the animation is just so good. (N.B. I am a massive Evangelion fanboy. The animation really is brilliant though.)
As for your question Evangelion had a huge influence on the way that anime is made now, with merchandising and spinoffs and all that shit really being more important (in terms of making money) than the actual anime, and that is a big part of why anime has got worse. I'm no good at explaining it in depth but IMO it is far more to do with the this than to do with any influence it had on the actual content of anime. In terms of content though it was mostly Evangelion that sparked off Sekai-kei (google it) and a lot of people think that is shit and a pretty negative thing. I think it is interesting to see how a lot of the changes in Rebuild make it (sometimes subtly) really "anti Sekai-kei" and I assume it's deliberate.
You want to drag JDE in here, he'll probably write you an enlightening essay about all things Evangelion. Or post one he's already written.
Hmm I was under the impression that, based on something I think Randorama noted a while back, some of the key themes in Evangelion - particularly that of the helpless socially inept otaku - resonated so strongly with real-world (similarly socially inept) individuals that it germinated the continuing trend in anime thereafter, giving rise to the fads of today.
Apologies if this is completely off the mark, perhaps I read into the comments too much.
4. Tack on a "WTF? ending" and pass it off as brilliant storytelling. Shinji strangling Asuka and saying, "I think I'm gonna be sick." Dude, you aren't Stanley Kubrick, so don't even try to outdo 2001: A Space Odyssey.
Yo, if you were here right now I'd kiss you.
How I found the Evangelion experience, here goes:
It was a good show.
It struggled initially with budget, and some of the early episodes took a while to find a rhythm. That said, I was impressed by the way that there was an apocalyptic sensation present from the start. Even though it begins by treading staple anime territory, the environment and the emptiness of the city gave the show a difficult to pinpoint yet thoroughly effective bleakness.
To its credit, when the animation was good it was great, and even though the actual plotline (rather than exploration of human foibles) didn't find a way to emerge before the final 7 episodes, the character handling was fairly robust (if repetitive.)
Shinji is a whining fuck. I'm not sure if he was a central protagonist I really liked. He wasn't like Kaneda or Tenchi or Yu Yu Hakusho - he was pathetic. This of course was intentional: he was a motherless (and fatherless really) 14 year old kid who was painfully insecure. He was the embodiment of social retards everywhere who blame their parents for not loving them enough, who hate themselves for being useless at everything. That theme and the oedipal references were a bit trying after a while, although never to the point where it made you want to stop watching.
Above Shinji the ensemble cast was pretty robust, carrying him like the delicate leaf that he was. I enjoyed the development of certain characters, particularly Misato and Ritsuko. But where Rei was intriguing, Asuka's insanity became annoying and overdone. It was a bit like sitting in a nursery creche and watching kids blow off steam.
Of course I balked at episodes 25 and 26. I really like the four directors cut episodes prior because they opened up the backstory to such a great degree, but then the fact all questions went completely unanswered was one of the greatest faux pas in visual entertainment history. That Anno and staff tried to defend the 'artistic integrity' of what was a massive budget botch job was insane - there was just no ending. It was tragic and I felt for them, but don't try to lie your way out of it by telling everyone it was an existentialist philosophical 'possible' conclusion. That doesn't close all the doors you opened.
Neatly moving on:
Episodes 18 - 24 were what I would consider to be the best in terms of establishing Evangelion as a credible science fiction show, and I would say that the (admittedly complex) pseudo-religious, pseudo-scientific fiction was exemplified best here. The apocalyptic build up was looming and suddenly the fate of the characters was more of an issue for the viewer.
However, when End of Evangelion finished, I honestly wasn't sure if he's managed to salvage much at all. For me, Anno sold out with EOE almost as much as he did the first time around. Frankly, why is it that the Japanese always seem to ruin what start out as perfectly decent works of fiction with a desire to produce something absurdly profound?
Profundity isn't gained by producing something so contrived and rambling that you bamboozle the audience into a state of submission, yet sometimes I don't think the Japanese mentality is capable of executing a clear and reasoned philosophical plotline that any viewer can feel content that they've understood. It's not a flaw of their thinking, but a lost in translation issue that rears its head over and over.
End of Evangelion addressed some of the questions in the plot, but fucked itself royally by throwing up many more. Seele and Gendo's relationship was never explained. Why Gendo was treacherous makes no sense, and if both were working to bring on the Third Impact, why did Seele feel the need to destroy Nerv and execute the Eva pilots?
Likewise, Seele were clearly Nerv's retainers. They were never not in control, and if the Third Impact was always on the agenda, why encourage Gendo and Nerv to create Eva's to battle the Angels in the first place, and why not initiate the Third Impact when the opportunity was first made available (Lilith and Rei were around from day one, so what's the problem?)
The conflict made little sense, and therefore so did Gendo's objectives and Nerv's purpose.
The apocalypse, where little artificial clone girls somehow awaken sleeping gods and become bigger gods and, by the wishes of one insecure snivelling little bastard, reduce all human beings to a primordial soup state so that he no longer has to live in a world with pain and worry, is not without some value: unfortunately because the audience needs to research "wot the fuck I just watched" to have any comprehension of it is the kind of grandiose failure only the Japanese can orchestrate so perfectly.
The truth is, upon reading up on Anno and how he wants people to analyse and interpret Evangelion "for themselves", my fears were realised: There's just nothing to it. It's hollow. It's not 2001: A Space Odyssey, it doesn't have any true philosophical structure or point, it's just a haze of jargon, a mish-mash of influences, like a gaudy totem-pole covered with post-it notes and pages of the bible.
If Anno doesn't know what the fuck it all means, then it means nothing. It's engineered with the idea that, if it's large enough in scale and vision, all the stoners and no-brained twerps will step into the daylight thinking they just had some kind of an epiphany.
YOU DIDN'T HAVE AN EPIPHANY.
Some mental Japanese director decided to use symbolism, iconography and aspects of religious texts to try and give his work a higher value. The truth is, it doesn't have any higher value: it's a show about robots beating the shit out of each other, some conflicted children, and an end of the world scenario to tie in in a bow.
In summary: Just go along for the ride and enjoy the good stuff. Don't bother to analyse it, for god's sake (no pun intended), because that's exactly what they want you to do.
Done.
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