Xbox 360: Mushihimesama Futari 1.5 (November 2009)

[RNGmaster]

Oh, and if Futari is punishing you, don't play for score. If you score like mad the rank gets crazy and the bullets come at you at light speed.

I doubt this guy knows about scoring. If he was willing to spend his cash on a relatively obscure game and somehow didn't realize from looking at videos that the game was challenging and demanding, I doubt he's got the mental acuity to seriously play for score.

[Skykid]

Oh, and if Futari is punishing you, don't play for score. If you score like mad the rank gets crazy and the bullets come at you at light speed.

I doubt this guy knows about scoring. If he was willing to spend his cash on a relatively obscure game and somehow didn't realize from looking at videos that the game was challenging and demanding, I doubt he's got the mental acuity to seriously play for score.

I just noticed he said he reached stage 5 with 120mil, so yeah, he won't have to worry about rank too much with those kind of numbers.

As mentioned before though, challenging yes, but demanding not so much. Futari 1.5 is definitely an intermediate difficulty Cave shmup in terms of clearing, and if you're playing BL for clear only it's a walk in the park.

Personally, my game always hinges around the absolute bastard that is the latter half of stage 3. I'm a bit out of practice on Futari now, but going back to it recently for a few goes I remembered how crucial that stage is. My advice is after the mid-boss, just bomb if you need to!

[DrTrouserPlank]

Oh, and if Futari is punishing you, don't play for score. If you score like mad the rank gets crazy and the bullets come at you at light speed.

I doubt this guy knows about scoring. If he was willing to spend his cash on a relatively obscure game and somehow didn't realize from looking at videos that the game was challenging and demanding, I doubt he's got the mental acuity to seriously play for score.

That's a pretty condescending opinion. I'm going to assume you don't have the mental acuity to distinguish situations as being anything other than black or white based on your assessment of my complaints.

Getting back to the scoring which someone else mentioned, I know how it works. If I could turn rank off I would because I don't need the game screwing me even more if I dare to get my multiplier up. 120M is pretty much everything being hit with the correct shot up to stage 5 with 4 deaths killing the chain at various points.

[Never_Scurred]

That's a pretty condescending opinion. I'm going to assume you don't have the mental acuity to distinguish situations as being anything other than black or white based on your assessment of my complaints.

Yeah, but i'll bet can 1CC Mushi Futari, LOL.

[Skykid]

120M is pretty much everything being hit with the correct shot up to stage 5 with 4 deaths killing the chain at various points.

I assure you sir, it's most definitely not.

Even with losing the chain, if you hit everything with the correct shot, you'd be higher than 120m.
I think Icarus probably over doubles that on most goes.

That said, if you want the game to soften up a bit, don't attempt to create/suck gems off of everything. The difference in most cases between scoring and not scoring is fairly incremental - but the toughest rank is hardcore. 120m on stage 5 won't be full rank by a long shot, so you shouldn't be blaming that for the difficulty you're having.

[Icarus]

Even with losing the chain, if you hit everything with the correct shot, you'd be higher than 120m.
I think Icarus probably over doubles that on most goes.

I have this sudden urge to do an experiment now.

[RNGmaster]

If clearing the game basically boils down to having an instruction set of movements and timings memorised for every event in the entire game with no movement for deviation, then I can't see that ever happening; and then what if you can't play it every day? You'll forget the routine eventually and be right back at square one.

Mushi Original is about as far from a memorizer as CAVE games get. Unless you're working out a scoring route, you really don't need to have everything memorized. Unless you're playing on insane rank, the bullet speed is manageable enough that you can mostly use reflexes. If you don't feel like your reflexes are up to the task, there's only one way to improve them, and that's by playing the game. For the sake of practice, I highly suggest you try things that seem too difficult - for example, try to run the final boss and see if you can beat it in one life. It's far more fun than you'd think to practice a difficult section until you get it right.

If you want to give up on the STG genre, go right ahead, but I think you're losing hope too quickly. Look at Prometheus' Full Extent of the Jam guide. Read the entire damn thing. That guy knows what he's talking about.

Sorry for being a bit sharp; I just don't like people asserting that shmups are too hard for them. Given practice, you could easily surpass me (not that that's very hard) and become a top scorer. Just don't expect that you'll immediately become some sort of divine shmupping prodigy as soon as you start playing. We all suck, get used to it.

[NTSC-J]

I've played Futari 1.5 Original one time in the past year and I beat it on a credit. I'm the luckiest man alive!



My score was booty though.

[ptoing]

You have to understand that some shots are aimed at you while others have a fixed pattern. (and CAVE make these different shot types different colours for the hard of thinking)

I think this is actually not true. Yes there are aimed and fixed patterns but they not always have the same colour. At least not in Mushi Futari from what I have seen.

[moozooh]

and CAVE make these different shot types different colours for the hard of thinking

I think this is actually not true. Yes there are aimed and fixed patterns but they not always have the same colour.

Excuse me?..

[DrTrouserPlank]

He's saying that aimed shots aren't always the same colour; sometimes they're red, sometimes they're purple.

[Icarus]

Aside from the weirder attacks (st1 boss fireballs, st2 boss aimed lasers, st4 boss blobs) every bullet in this game is a shade of purple.
There is no (obvious) distinction between the colours for aimed and fixed attacks.

[ptoing]

That's what I meant. Sorry if it was unclear.

[Skykid]

Aside from the weirder attacks (st1 boss fireballs, st2 boss aimed lasers, st4 boss blobs) every bullet in this game is a shade of purple.
There is no (obvious) distinction between the colours for aimed and fixed attacks.

I bet you see those bullets when you close your eyes.

[burgerkingdiamond]

Oh, and if Futari is punishing you, don't play for score. If you score like mad the rank gets crazy and the bullets come at you at light speed.

I doubt this guy knows about scoring. If he was willing to spend his cash on a relatively obscure game and somehow didn't realize from looking at videos that the game was challenging and demanding, I doubt he's got the mental acuity to seriously play for score.

That's a pretty condescending opinion. I'm going to assume you don't have the mental acuity to distinguish situations as being anything other than black or white based on your assessment of my complaints.

Getting back to the scoring which someone else mentioned, I know how it works. If I could turn rank off I would because I don't need the game screwing me even more if I dare to get my multiplier up. 120M is pretty much everything being hit with the correct shot up to stage 5 with 4 deaths killing the chain at various points.

120M seems low for the 5th level if you're milking gems like you say. But dying and using bombs will seriously fuck up your score so it's hard to know for sure. I'm also working on the 1CC for this game and I know I'm close. I can get to the 5th stage on pretty much any given run, but I've yet to make it to Larsa with any spare lives in stock. If I made the time to practice I know it would come soon.

That's what it all boils down to man. It's a slow progression but if you keep playing you'll see the difference.

[ptoing]

I been playing this more again and am trying to 1CC original for starters. And I noticed something. In the title it says RANK 2(NORMAL) or something. Is there actually any option to change the difficulty? If so I have not found it.

[dunpeal2064]

Time to play some Mushi again when I get home. Took a pretty decent break. Still no 1cc, but I find it impossible to not play for score.

My best so far is 248m, died at Larsa. As Skykid stated before, my make or break is stage 3-2. I find the rest of the game to be intense, but I can usually make it through if I do well through stage 3.

This game is still my favorite shmup ever, and probably one of my favorite games ever. I love how differently you can play each time. Doesn't feel anything close to a memorizor to me.

[JOW]

and CAVE make these different shot types different colours for the hard of thinking

I think this is actually not true. Yes there are aimed and fixed patterns but they not always have the same colour.

Aside from the weirder attacks (st1 boss fireballs, st2 boss aimed lasers, st4 boss blobs) every bullet in this game is a shade of purple.
There is no (obvious) distinction between the colours for aimed and fixed attacks.

...I was referring to CAVE games in general. From my experience it seems to be a standard convention they use - although I never heard/seen this mentioned elsewhere so I could be wrong
I've not played Futari for a long time now but I vaguely recall the aimed bullets being a slightly redder purple. Not obvious as Icarus says, particularly compared to the likes of Ketsui and DFK.

[Elixir]

Just worked something out. If he's only scoring around 120m, he's dying at least once in the third stage. His counter doesn't surpass 25,000.

Some tips:

- always bomb the final pattern of the stage 3 boss, even top players do this
- same as above, fourth boss, second-to-last pattern
- don't worry about shot type for small enemies in stage 4
- practice stage 3 in training mode until you're consistently no-missing it
- shot type on boss break points isn't worth risking your life

But yeah, I'd recommend practising stage 3. If you die before the fourth stage, restart.

Or if you just want the clear, don't worry about shot types and just focus in surviving. If you're stuck against a wall, practice the part in training mode. Since score is irrelevant, bombing isn't an issue. I reached Larsa the first time I played 1.5 Original at the arcade because I didn't understand the scoring system.

[DrTrouserPlank]

Just worked something out. If he's only scoring around 120m, he's dying at least once in the third stage. His counter doesn't surpass 25,000.

Some tips:

- always bomb the final pattern of the stage 3 boss, even top players do this - yeah I'm going to have to do this from now on, I can avoid it, but not for long enough.
- same as above, fourth boss, second-to-last pattern - Not sure which pattern second-to-last is, but the only pattern I don't like is the pink lanterns at the end. Everything else I can dodge
- don't worry about shot type for small enemies in stage 4 - I'm pretty much using whatever gets the job done. I match shot-types when I'm in control, but otherwise I just use wide-shot to clear the screen
- practice stage 3 in training mode until you're consistently no-missing it- working on it
- shot type on boss break points isn't worth risking your life - Not worrying about it

But yeah, I'd recommend practising stage 3. If you die before the fourth stage, restart.

Or if you just want the clear, don't worry about shot types and just focus in surviving. If you're stuck against a wall, practice the part in training mode. Since score is irrelevant, bombing isn't an issue. I reached Larsa the first time I played 1.5 Original at the arcade because I didn't understand the scoring system.

[ptoing]

If you die before the fourth stage, restart.

I used to restart a lot, but I have taken Icarus' advice to never restart and just play the full credit to heart and I think it is very good advice. You stress yourself less and also you might make good progress after the death, even if you die in the first stage for whatever reason.

[burgerkingdiamond]

If you die before the fourth stage, restart.

I used to restart a lot, but I have taken Icarus' advice to never restart and just play the full credit to heart and I think it is very good advice. You stress yourself less and also you might make good progress after the death, even if you die in the first stage for whatever reason.

I agree. If you die on the first or second level due to some fluke or something you should definitely start over. But even on the third level I would keep going if you only have 1 miss. Some of my breakthrough score runs have been when I died unexpectedly early and was close to restarting but decided to just play out the credit.

And I also think the that last pattern of the 4th boss is a bitch. I pretty much always bomb that. However the rest of the boss I don't think is too bad.

[Skykid]

If you die before the fourth stage, restart.

I used to restart a lot, but I have taken Icarus' advice to never restart and just play the full credit to heart and I think it is very good advice. You stress yourself less and also you might make good progress after the death, even if you die in the first stage for whatever reason.

I agree. If you die on the first or second level due to some fluke or something you should definitely start over. But even on the third level I would keep going if you only have 1 miss. Some of my breakthrough score runs have been when I died unexpectedly early and was close to restarting but decided to just play out the credit.

And I also think the that last pattern of the 4th boss is a bitch. I pretty much always bomb that. However the rest of the boss I don't think is too bad.

I'm with this. I only do a restart if I die on the first stage by being stupid (usually experimenting for points.) The restart-itis on Akai Katana Shin is at a peak at the moment :facepalm:

[ptoing]

I think just playing like you would in an arcade is best. I mean would you just leave the cab or rage suicide if you die once early when playing in an arcade? I doubt it. Restartitis is pretty silly and does not help IMO. You do not get better faster that way.

[DrTrouserPlank]

I think I must have spent (although it's difficult to be precise) around 20-30 hours playing this game but it could easily be more. Now whilst some of that gained knowledge was lost when I took a break I obviously didn't go right back to scratch. I'm worse than before I stopped for sure, but that in itself is another matter.

I'm still nowhere near getting a 1cc. Absolutely nowhere near.

Stage 5 boss.. forget it
stage 5... 6 lives minimum at a guess
stage 4... played it hundreds of times. Still die here, still die there, could die anywhere. If it wasn't practice I'd have to bomb 3x as much because I couldn't take the risks I do in practice. Probably would take 4-5 lives average including boss.
Stage 3.... Played it hundreds of times. Clumsy deaths at random spots, bombs usually needed, would need more in a proper run for safety once again. 3-4 average I'd say including boss.

Cant really see me ever having time to finish this game, but it would surely take at least another 100 hours on top of what I've already put in for a survival clear because my rate of progress is absolutely zero from session to session, day on day.

[Dronevil]

It's really simple..
Do you enjoy playing the game? Keep playing, you will eventually improve.
Do you think the game is not fair and punishes you for no reason? Stop playing it, why should you spend your time with a game you don't even like?

But for god's sake.. Stop whining

[ptoing]

Listen to Dronevil, what he says is very true.
I started playing Original mode seriously 4 days ago after over a year of having the game lying around and I am making solid progress every session. Already managed to get to stage 5 couple of times and best score so far is 121mil before the 4th boss who kicked my ass in that run.

So yeah, if you do not enjoy it just stop playing and look at another shmup, and if you do not enjoy that one either maybe look at another genre altogether

[RNGmaster]

Stage 5 boss.. forget it

You're giving up because it's too hard? Losing is fun! Practice, and don't give the forum stupid excuses like that.

[moozooh]

A Simple Guide to 1.5 Original Larsa, by me.

1st phase/1st attack (1/1 for short): While Larsa is busy talking, move to the bottom-left corner and position yourself above the second bomb slot, not higher than a full character sprite's length away from it. Hold laser, and keep track of the darker bullets that are aimed at you. Slowly tap-dodge them towards the right side of the screen. If you're doing everything right, you should end up around the middle of the screen without ever having to switch directions or dodging the pea-shaped lighter-tone bullets. This works at any rank.

1/2: How much distance to cut back here is entirely up to your taste, but the pattern is solved in three steps: cut back the main stream, position yourself in front of an opening in the sweeping waves, and dodge the heavy streams while still moving away from the main stream. The key here is never to mix these steps together and leaving yourself at least half the screen distance for each cycle. Attempting to cutback the main stream when dodging the sweeps or the heavy streams will most likely get you killed. Otherwise the attack is very easy, but you do need a controller that doesn't confuse pure directions with diagonals to avoid stupid deaths here.

1/3: The background (darker tone) spread pattern is aimed at you and has a center bullet (i. e., mindless tap-dodging required). The foreground (lighter tone) pattern is also aimed at you but alternates between having a center bullet and not having it, and does so at irregular intervals (seems to always start with 2 with/1 without though). The main problem with this attack is that the foreground pattern is too dense to tap-dodge, so every once in a while you will have to move far enough to make dodging the background a concern. Thus, just bomb it.

2/1: Take note of the width of the "corridor" and start on the side. Now, you can either try moving back and forth around the center or gradually sweeping from one side to the other. Just try leaving as much breathing room as possible, and keep in mind that the corridor walls move away from you if you get too close. Your main concern here is cutting back the aimed stream (small bullets) so that it doesn't interfere with dodging the spreads, which are by themselves not hard (Battletoads was much, much worse). Fun pattern, requires practice.

2/2: Dodge the first two spreads (the less you move around, the wider its openings), then, to make things easier, dodge through one of the fan streams and bomb right before the second one corners you. While bomb is in effect, move in front of Larsa — if you've done the timing right, the "back side" of the fan streams will already be behind your back so you won't have to dodge them for another few seconds. Back off a bit. Now, Larsa will shoot a number of high-speed spreads at you. What makes it easy is that all of them have a center bullet, so as long as you gently tap to the side as you see a new wave of bullets appear, you're absolutely safe. It should be over by the time the fan streams reach you the third time.

3/1: The hardest pattern, hands down. I suggest concentrating on one side at a time (the left, since it has a wider range) and stream the other, but if you have bombs, spend two without a doubt.

3/2: Very easy with a bit of practice, but can be prone to stupid deaths if you're spacing out or using an imprecise controller. The pattern intersects with the bottom of the screen a number of times, so your best bet is mimicking the horizontal position of the tail in order to dodge it effectively. 1st time: there's a center bullet, tap to the side. 2nd time: two bullets in the center with no dead space between; tap twice. 3rd time: two bullets with an opening, dodge there if you feel precise (it pretty much always works if you just keep yourself in line with the tail, but YMMV). 4th time: the same with a larger opening, only dodge there. 5th time: even larger opening. 6th time: a center bullet with very small openings on the side. This is tricky because you either have to tap (if you've lined yourself up properly), or move around the clump of three bullets. Pick whichever you feel more confident with. After that Larsa will finish with a screen-covering spread attack followed up by an even faster spread, but they're both dodged by a single tap.

3/3: This attack is broken into two cycles, the first half of which is rather nasty, while the other is either piss-easy (if you stream it) or deadly (if it corners you somehow). Start in the center and dodge the random spread spam while gradually moving to the side, and immediately start moving to the other side when it changes. Bomb if not confident. There, Larsa dead.

[DrTrouserPlank]

Stage 5 boss.. forget it

You're giving up because it's too hard? Losing is fun! Practice, and don't give the forum stupid excuses like that.

Not as such, but playing this game is like trying to knock down a brick wall by blowing through a drinking straw.

I think I could easily spend the next year playing this game and still be no closer to clearing it. Frankly it feels like work because all you can do is play the same stage over and over and never seem to get consistently better. It wouldn't be so bad if you could break that up with some scoring runs here and there, but that's not really an option either.

When you look at the task (which is to clear the game in 3+2 lives) and avoid all the stitch-ups on the various stages so that you have many lives left for the last stage and boss.. it seems very unlikely.

Edit: I'll have a look at that guide and try it later