Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner - shmup or not?

[EinhanderZwei]

It may sound weird and stuff, but I do consider this game a shmup. Yeah, it's played from behind-the-back perspective. Yeah, it has the largest emphasis on story than on other components. Yeah, it's not quite easy to pick up and play. Yeah, it also features slasher and fighting elements. But still I find the scrolling shooter core behind all that. Multi-directional methodical 3D scrolling shooter, to be exact. Well, yeah, nothing there really scrolls by itself, but still. For example, the first firefight and the 'destroy 5 carriers' missions are way better suited for danmaku than any other genre. The combo attacks remind me a lot of Radiant Silvergun, as the homing lasers make me think of Ikaruga. The story is revealed at predictable points instead of being advanced in a more 'sudden' manner, like in other games by Kojima-sama. I think of ZoE 2 as upgrade to the classic formula with the influences from other genres and disguising it as an ordinary 3rd person action. As a bonus note, none other than Vic Viper makes cameo here

So, what do you think? Is ZoE 2 really a shmup or not?

[Zeether]

It's just you.

[EinhanderZwei]

I don't deny that. But I think of this game as the genre's evolution which is still way ahead of its time, so nobody follows it...

[Observer]

Did you play/check Omega Boost (1999)?

It already did that and I feel it did it better and was a possible 'evolution' thanks to the "scan" mechanic (which separates it from a rail shooter and turns it in what the authors called "full 3D sphere STG" or something like that) and incredibly nice controls (the mech is simply as badass as it gets, beating the shit out of everything with god mode lock-on guided laser missiles and infinite ammo machinegun), besides even including a first person mode.

In hard mode the bullets came in strange patterns (most notably the Zone 7/8/Last Zone bosses, the final boss is a living testimony of the awesome stuff one could do with the PSX), it was designed by Shoji Kawamori and... and Polyphony Digital now denies its existence despite being the ones who did it.

[EinhanderZwei]

Yeah, I saw mentions of Omega Boost here and there on the internets, but didn't check it out yet. But as you say that it's comparable to ZoE2, I'll definitely grab a copy

[Ghegs]

What? No. Thread moved to off-topic.

(The game's still pretty darn cool, tho)

[Mortificator]

ZoE is cool, but I never thought of it being similar to shooters. It's more like Devil May Cry in a mech.

Omega Boost is also cool, though I don't think it plays anything like ZoE. I can see the shooter elements here... it feels kind of like a 3D RayForce.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Mario has jumping and projectiles. Halo has jumping and projectiles in first person. Halo must be way ahead in the evolution of the platforming genre. It's just like Mario but you can aim wherever you want.

[EinhanderZwei]

Hmm... A first-person game consisting of boring corridors that connect the nicely designed rooms is an evolution of a third-person game consisting of boring platforms that connect the... um, some more boring platforms? Just wow

[handsome_rakshas]

"You shut up, I'm DINGO!"

Great game? Heck yeah!
Shmup, not really.

The minigame is the closest thing to a shmup this game has.

Go and do your homework at home!

[EinhanderZwei]

At least I was right when I said 'it may sound weird' in the opening post. Heh...

[ZOM]

One of PS2's best. But I wouldn't call it a shmup - also there's more hackin' n' slashin' going on than actually shooting... (or at least that's how I play it)

[Jon]

I will echo the others in saying that it's a great game that is most definitely not a shmup.