I know alot of you guys read Retrogamer also- but man...

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Fri May 01, 2009 9:33 pm

cools wrote:I've not read any of your other stuff

For my sheer love of shmups, I've submitted a shitload of unpaid copy right here on this very forum. For the love man, for the love!

I agree with you regarding today's games journalism - It's really sterile and uninspired. Edge has created a trend whereby the standard of writing has improved, but most mags don't have anyone on the editorial or contributors list with any spark or personality. I haven't bought a games related mag in about four years.

I love games (too much) and I made it my mission when I had the opportunity to write about them to take a personal approach and not follow mundane templates. Most of the shmups reviews here follow this practice, and it's only when you know the fanbase require it (like beat-em-uppers) that you'll need to offer a little more in terms of detailed play mechanics.
I stand by the writing quality of older games journalism being of a lesser standard, but I'm totally with you that it used to have a lot more guts. I really used to love Super Play when they'd totally destroy a game (Pit Fighter!) but also when Jonathan Davies and Zy Nichols would create really engrossing reviews that told you a story rather than divulge instruction booklets (Secret of Mana comes to mind.)

As for Stu, he does at least have personality - and I appreciate the need for a bit of anarchy in modern journalism. Fuck it, I'd advocate it in fact. But I say keep it in the writing, let that be your reputation. If some love you and some hate you, so be it - but I can't see how verbally assaulting your reader base and fellow colleagues is right.

Anarchy = yes, tell it how it is. Unprofessionalism = no, let your work speak for you instead.

(And when did I review KOF mate? Unless you read the Brighton Argus, which I doubt! Do you mean BlazBlue?)

Octopod · Post by **Octopod** » Fri May 01, 2009 10:42 pm

Retro Gamer and Edge are the only game magazine I read. Actually that is a lie. I subscribe to Nintendo Power. Cant help it...I love that damn magazine.

Etrian · Post by **Etrian** » Sat May 02, 2009 12:29 am

Reading that thread made my head spin

Maybe he'll learn to review things with a less condescending tone next time..

Udderdude · Post by **Udderdude** » Sat May 02, 2009 1:21 am

Octopod wrote:Man he has bad taste in music.

Yeah, I listened in on some of the tracks on the 100 songs thing .. god-awful. And this is with his "GOOD songs" seal of approval all over it. Terrible.

I had a sudden motivation to make a 100 track CD like this, except that motivation quickly dissapeared due to not giving a shit-itis.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sat May 02, 2009 1:48 am

freddiebamboo wrote:Good ol' RevStu:

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... t+campbell

Takes him till page 3 to wander in, but our Stu, never a man to shirk an intelligent debate, still manages to get the thread locked by page 4.

Heh, at least he greeted us with an "Hello viewers!" instead of "Hello Idiots!"

Octopod · Post by **Octopod** » Sat May 02, 2009 2:41 am

Udderdude wrote:
Octopod wrote:Man he has bad taste in music.
Yeah, I listened in on some of the tracks on the 100 songs thing .. god-awful. And this is with his "GOOD songs" seal of approval all over it. Terrible.

I had a sudden motivation to make a 100 track CD like this, except that motivation quickly dissapeared due to not giving a shit-itis.

Yeah. How can anyone prefer The Presidents of the USA ove the MC5? Especially covering the MC5...

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Sat May 02, 2009 9:54 am

Etrian wrote:Reading that thread made my head spin

Maybe he'll learn to review things with a less condescending tone next time..

Not holding out a massive amount of hope.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Sat May 02, 2009 10:38 am

Me neither. Weeds die in winter, but in summer they're once more stronger than ever.
I even doubt that *this kind* of weed dies in winter

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Sat May 02, 2009 1:57 pm

Icarus wrote:I'm surprised that the people in that thread don't realise that Sam Madeupname and RevStu are the same person.
Either that or they're just humoring him.

sam is the highlight of the thread - you're giving stuart far too much credit

N-G.com just got out-trolled

FIL · Post by **FIL** » Sun May 03, 2009 8:30 pm

Sam Madeupname wasn't RevStu but Edge of Heaven was.
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showpost. ... tcount=729

Jockel · Post by **Jockel** » Mon May 04, 2009 4:53 am

LMFAO
A 41-year old creates a double account on an internet forum to defend himself because he isn't able to do it alone. classic.

Etrian · Post by **Etrian** » Mon May 04, 2009 5:18 am

Awesome

E. Randy Dupre · Post by **E. Randy Dupre** » Mon May 04, 2009 10:09 am

What's annoying me about all of this is that that thread is effectively giving RG an out for the factual errors that appear every issue, by focusing on an article that didn't actually feature any.

Examples from the current issue? The NGPC has an analogue nub, apparently. I'm sure that's a surprise to those of us who own one with a microswitched, digital thumbstick. The same article is apparently unaware of the existence of the second rev of GBA SP hardware.

There are always three or four basic mistakes each month, demonstrative of a lack of proper research (or an over-reliance on Wikipedia). And that's without going into the numerous typos and grammatical errors (improving slowly, but still depresing to see in a print mag). Campbell's articles are generally the only ones that *aren't* sprinkled with these mistakes.

That doesn't stop him being the biggest troll around, obviously.

I've always found it kind of depressing that he was given any work with the magazine. The editor was a member of another games board a few years ago, long before he got the RG gig, when Campbell appeared from out of the blue to attack one of its amateur reviews. And when I say "attack", I mean "intiiate full-scale war against". Arrogant, foul-mouthed and completely lacking in any worthwhile human qualities. He was roundly beaten up and banned from the forum. RG's editor was a regular poster there and would have been aware of this, so to see him give regular work to somebody like that, knowing full-well what they're like and what the potential fallout could be...

You reap what you sow. I'd imagine that the majority of RG's readership is made up of gaming forum members - it's very much preaching to the converted - and having Campbell on board in those circumstances is a recipe for disaster. His childish behaviour on the internet is consistent and constant, and something like this was bound to happen sooner or later.

They're just extremely lucky that it wasn't on their official forum. Give it time.

I'm not entirely sure what the N-G.com people are so happy about, though. Their inability to recognise the difference between a genuine factual error and an 'error' made on purpose for comedic effect is hilarious. Neither side comes out of that thread with any sort of dignity intact.

kernow · Post by **kernow** » Mon May 04, 2009 10:34 am

but .. but he said MS1 had 5 levels. ..

E. Randy Dupre · Post by **E. Randy Dupre** » Mon May 04, 2009 11:14 am

Oh, did he? In that case, disregard what I said before about his pieces having fewer errors than others in the mag.

In my defense, I wasn't being paid a commission for researching and writing the above post

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Mon May 04, 2009 11:21 am

indeed kern

not trying to be a cock, but i spotted it too straight away. i tried logging in, but my password wasn't jjjpppjjj or similar, and i couldn't retrieve my password cuz it's registered to my lycos email address (and they don't exist anymore

)

it is indeed funny that bobak quoted that exact piece of text, but was instead complaining about the structure of the sentence

it's obvious that bobak just approached the article with a certain expectation. he was thinking it was gonna be a super-dry encyclopedia article on all the boring shit he already knew. in fact he was probably reading it to see if they knew as much useless trivia on the series that he did. very common nerd practice. and an ommission cannot really be called an error, unless a wrong conclusion is reached because of it. he ripped into the article for being poorly researched and incorrect in many places, which was shown to be wrong. and then after it becomes clear that the errors bobak pointed at weren't really errors, he concludes that the piece must have been badly written. i don't agree with a lot of what stuart says, but i think he can very clearly articulate himself; and the error is more with bobak not understanding british humour, the point of the article (and therefore it's writing style), and approaching it with a pre-conceived idea of what to expect

metal slug 1 has six stages, and he said zombie instead of mummy.

is that really worth 30+ pages and counting? no, not really

by contrast, you should read darran jones's (or DazTM) bible of shmups in gamestm from a couple years back. that was one of the most boring, dry, uninspiring pieces of text i've read. i mean there wasn't anything wrong with it per se, but it was just a 2-page chronology of everything that happened in the genre (when were bombs introduced, when were bosses introduced, etc etc), and what game brought that about, and in what year. i could actually barely finish reading it, and i'm not just saying that. sorry daz

what really surprises me is that people buy stuff like retrogamer. fair enough, it's good for the odd bit of nostalgia and stuff. but it's £5. as someone else in that thread said, i wouldn't pay £5 for a magazine unless it had naked women in it

charlie chong · Post by **charlie chong** » Tue May 05, 2009 12:45 pm

seriously who cares

retrogamer written for boring games collectors by a bunch of boring games collectors tm

Mortificator · Post by **Mortificator** » Tue May 05, 2009 8:08 pm

I feel like slapping people with my cock when they say Metal Slug 3 is a good game too.

sven666 · Post by **sven666** » Tue May 05, 2009 8:18 pm

jpj wrote: what really surprises me is that people buy stuff like retrogamer. fair enough, it's good for the odd bit of nostalgia and stuff. but it's £5. as someone else in that thread said, i wouldn't pay £5 for a magazine unless it had naked women in it

its £10 and some change over here.. dont even wanna think what you yanks have to pay

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Tue May 05, 2009 10:52 pm

Mortificator wrote:I feel like slapping people with my cock when they say Metal Slug 3 is a good game too.

You'll be speaking two octaves higher if you try that with me. Metal Slug 3 is a great game.

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Wed May 06, 2009 12:30 am

that thread on n-g just keeps on truckin'. i can't be fucked reading through all of that; did anything interesting happen since page 35?

edit: dear god, rot fucking scares me...

(page 40 something)

kernow · Post by **kernow** » Wed May 06, 2009 1:28 am

Depends if you like seeing rot naked or not .

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Wed May 06, 2009 1:30 am

his nudity is scary.

his dancing is traumatic.

BIL · Post by **BIL** » Wed May 06, 2009 1:32 am

What the hell?! XD

NG Forum wrote:And that right there is why I will never again buy second-hand games.

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Wed May 06, 2009 8:37 am

The press in general is a big joke. Right now they've got everyone scared shitless of a mild form of flu. Later this summer it'll be shark attacks or whatever else can be easily blown out of proportion

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Wed May 06, 2009 10:07 am

Neon wrote:The press in general is a big joke. Right now they've got everyone scared shitless of a mild form of flu. Later this summer it'll be shark attacks or whatever else can be easily blown out of proportion

Truesay.

cools · Post by **cools** » Wed May 06, 2009 11:05 am

jpj wrote:what really surprises me is that people buy stuff like retrogamer. fair enough, it's good for the odd bit of nostalgia and stuff. but it's £5. as someone else in that thread said, i wouldn't pay £5 for a magazine unless it had naked women in it

Been a long time since I've done the latter. Nor the former.

I wasn't aware that RG was a giant piss take. I plan on picking up the next issue, and if it entertains me, I'll subscribe.

Comedy + games = win, in my eyes.

Lordstar · Post by **Lordstar** » Wed May 06, 2009 12:36 pm

charlie chong wrote:seriously who cares
retrogamer written for boring games collectors by a bunch of boring games collectors tm

they are the ugly inbred cousin of sealed game collectors

Molloy · Post by **Molloy** » Wed May 06, 2009 5:09 pm

Yeesh, people don't have a sense of humour. The guys criticising him on the NGF are complete and utter idiots so he's treating them like idiots and being very funny in the process. As he says in the thread it's like a public service.

Are you talking about the ntsc-uk Outrun 2 review Randy? That was incredibly funny. Your man.. was his name Concept or something? He had to be the worst writer in the world ever. His writing made absolutely no sense, he'd make all sorts of ridiculous assumptions and misuse more language than Polonious. And when anybody criticised his review in the Feedback forum they were jumped on by a legion of loyal forumites. It was screaming out for criticism. And sure enough when he did get criticised they removed that section of the forum and deleted the topic. They wanted feedback only as long as it was positive.

This stuff always seems to stem from everybody on a forum thinking it gives them some sort of collective identity. I'm a member of several boards (for many years as you can see from my join date) and I still have an opinion of my own. People on the NGF (and to a lesser extent here) seem to love jumping on a hate bandwagon because they perceive that they've been snubbed somehow.

E. Randy Dupre · Post by **E. Randy Dupre** » Wed May 06, 2009 8:47 pm

Yeah, that was the review. The issue wasn't that Campbll thought it was a bad review - actually, there were a hell of a lot of people there who agreed on that point, me included - but the way in which he did it. Descend from upon high, act like you know what the fuck you're talking about (even though nobody'll employ you) and be exceptionally rude, all in the same post. Not just rude, actually. More like condescending, sneery, public schoolboy bullshit.

There's just no fucking need, especially when what you're shitting all over is acknowledged as being an amateur review site. You expect professional standards of journalism from something like that? Do me a favour. Show some - *any* - sign of professionalism yourself before you go demanding it of other people.

I don't recall NTSC-uk removing the feeback forum at the time, nor deleting the thread, but my memory may be failing me. Unfortunately, the site was being moderated by a couple of real power-trip idiots in those days, so it's entirely possible.