The WTF do you use for capturing videos thread

Post by **Icarus** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 12:25 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:Fucking DivX. Won't let me rotate it. I get a "source image isn't valid format" or some bullshit error like that. It's only when I rotate it, so it has to do w/ the size of the video, although it follows the rules (width divisible by 4, height by 2).

Your output video should have a height and width that is a multiple of 8, or else the video playback will have some very bad warping akin to a TV channel not being tuned correctly.

Rotating shouldn't cause an error as all your doing is spinning the picture around, not cropping or other.

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 4:53 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:zakk:

What h264 codec package are you using? I tried x264, and it just crashed Virtual Dub. I got iuVcr to capture though.

I'm using revision 517, downloaded from x264.nl.

Here's the link to their archives of old versions.

http://mirror01.x264.nl/x264/force.php? ... nstall.exe

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:56 pm

What settings do you use in iuVcr? Do you leave it totally uncompressed, and then do all your fidgeting in VirtualDub? I got some rather goofy results when doing that. Not sure who's fault it was.

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 11:08 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:What settings do you use in iuVcr? Do you leave it totally uncompressed, and then do all your fidgeting in VirtualDub? I got some rather goofy results when doing that. Not sure who's fault it was.

No, I use PicVideo M-JPEG compression in iuVCR. It isn't a free codec, however. I think there may be a free huffyuv codec that you can use? That will at least get you some compression, so stuff isn't so insanely huge.

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:02 am

(double post, awesome!)

So regarding that whole rgb vs s-video thing. I don't have an RGB->s-video converter, but I do have a scan converter that outputs s-video.

These two videos are VGA converted to 15khz s-video, and then captured that way.

http://bigcore.rsdio.com/zakk/stuff/svidtest.avi

And one at 60fps using the field separate method:

http://bigcore.rsdio.com/zakk/stuff/svidtest60.avi

Both encoded with h264 at 850kbps, 2 pass.

The 30fps video is deinterlaced with 'smart deinterlace' filter. 60fps uses 'deinterlace smooth'. Default settings for both. Only other filters are crop/resize/rotate.

So yeah. Really not going to matter much if you do s-video. These look fine.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:24 am

I'm going to have to contest that my capture device sucks cock. I've fucked around a lot and get some pretty dodgy results. With uiVcr, setting it to "no compression", I get the screen divided into... uh... squares at times. The sound also goes off synch in the video I did. Trying any other compressor results in dropped frames. I assume it tries to encode real time? No bueno. Drops a LOT of frames. Can't remember which Codec, but my best was only dropping 1 out of 10 frames (crappy).

Mushi Stage 2 (not a bad run, actually)

I installe Premiere and gave it a whirl. It will only capture raw, and then compress. Essentially the same. I did get the weird "squares" problem again, although the sound stays in synch. Very annoying.

Perhaps it's time I got a Canopus.

EDIT: Looks like Virtual Dub's deinterlace filter sucks ass. Am I setting it wrong? I chose the first (default) mode.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:42 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:Fucking DivX.

That's why everyone should be using XviD (mpg4 like DivX). But being open-source, XviD is free (as oposed to DivX, which costs MONEY).

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:33 pm

I'm not sure what the 'squares' thing is, i'd have to see it to offer any diagnosis. To capture raw, you need a disk that can keep up. Most modern disks/machine should be able to handle that I/O fine, tho. Most of the compressors in the iuVCR list won't handle realtime; it just grabs the list of all the directshow capable compressors installed on the system. Something like MJPEG or colorspace (huffyuv and the like) should be able to do realtime. Unless you don't have the CPU to do it, of course.

The virtualdub deinterlace filter shouldn't look like that. I assume the first choice for you was 'blend fields together'? I use field blending on my Ketsui videos and it doesn't have that interlaced look at all. Where in the filter chain did you do the deinterlace?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:14 pm

zakk wrote:I'm not sure what the 'squares' thing is, i'd have to see it to offer any diagnosis.

Did not you not it in the video? It's there.

To capture raw, you need a disk that can keep up. Most modern disks/machine should be able to handle that I/O fine, tho. Most of the compressors in the iuVCR list won't handle realtime; it just grabs the list of all the directshow capable compressors installed on the system. Something like MJPEG or colorspace (huffyuv and the like) should be able to do realtime. Unless you don't have the CPU to do it, of course.

I'm on a 3Ghz processor w/ a SATA drive. I figure it could handle raw, but I get some mixed results. The view compressors I tried had [DS] next to them, so I assume they were direct show. DV Compressor, MJPEG compressor, etc. What's the one you're using? Is there a trial version out there?

Where in the filter chain did you do the deinterlace?

Oops... just realized that I did it after rotating.

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:41 pm

GaijinPunch wrote: Did not you not it in the video? It's there.

Ohh yeah, now I see it. happens in areas of really fast+dense motion. Try seeing how properly deinterlacing it works first.

GaijinPunch wrote:I'm on a 3Ghz processor w/ a SATA drive. I figure it could handle raw, but I get some mixed results. The view compressors I tried had [DS] next to them, so I assume they were direct show. DV Compressor, MJPEG compressor, etc. What's the one you're using? Is there a trial version out there?

http://www.pegasusimaging.com/picvideo.htm The 'trial' version puts some text on the final video, I believe. Worth it for testing, at least. I use the M-JPEG Codec v3. Lossess jpeg would work also. You should have enough cpu and disk to handle this. I can't remember how good/bad the "stock" MJPEG encoder is. It may be fairly slow.

Post by **Icarus** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 12:46 am

GaijinPunch wrote:
zakk wrote:Where in the filter chain did you do the deinterlace?
Oops... just realized that I did it after rotating.

Heheh, thats an easy mistake to make. Best way to organise your filter chain is to think small first then big last - put the filters that do minor things like cropping and so on first, rotation and resizing second, brightness and contrast last.

Deinterlacing should be done early on, preferably before the rotate and resize part.

Ceph wrote:
GaijinPunch wrote:Fucking DivX.
That's why everyone should be using XviD (mpg4 like DivX). But being open-source, XviD is free (as oposed to DivX, which costs MONEY).

I use DivX 3.22beta occasionally, mainly out of habit. DivX is good for keeping the framerate in sub-60fps games if you are doing MJPEG (such as encoding a converted EK-MAME input at the PCB's native framerate) and for long videos to conserve filesize (if you aren't fussy about quality over the duration), while XviD is great for high quality shorter videos. At least, that's what I've found.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 12:47 am

Yeah, it's gotta be the device. I got the interlace shit fine now that I did it before any other filters, but the squares of doom are still there. I guess it could be the Firewire device... I was opposed to getting something other than PCI, but was impatiant.

booty

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 7:53 pm

From a conversation with Sikraiken:

http://iview-data.com/html/phynxrgb.html

The bundled 'PhynxVCR' app is just a rebranded iuVCR too.

Too bad the card is something near $1200

Post by **Icarus** » Thu Sep 14, 2006 11:15 pm

Quick question Zakk, or anyone else:

What's the difference between MPEG and H.263 quantization? I'm running some codec compression tests using DIVX3, DIVX5 and XVID and a fast-moving, high-detail section of a Blazing Star capture, and while I've determined that DIVX5 sucks ass (DIVX3 and XVID have excellent, almost identical quality while DIVX5 looks like it's being viewed through a stained-glass window), I can't tell the difference between the two XVID quantization types.

Also, with XVID, is it a good idea to enable Adaptive Quantization?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:00 pm

Okay, after spending way too much money and time over the years on capture hardware that eventually breaks, or gives substandard results (my latest being a Canopus device which gives me wind-tunnel like sound) I've gone the DVD Recorder approach.

Having said that, how about everyone throw in their two cents worth on ripping DVDs to Xvid or whatever at the best quality. I don't mind doing a few passes if it retains the quality.

Stefan_L · Post by **Stefan_L** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 12:04 pm

Zakk... i am using the same capturecard as you have (Sweetspot) and i'm wondering if you manage to get stable picture on all the arcade games you test?
Here is an example of how shaky CPS1 looks: KoD.AVI
The only way for me to get stable picture on CPS1 is to only recording at half framerate.

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 12:58 pm

Stefan_L wrote:Zakk... i am using the same capturecard as you have (Sweetspot) and i'm wondering if you manage to get stable picture on all the arcade games you test?
Here is an example of how shaky CPS1 looks: KoD.AVI
The only way for me to get stable picture on CPS1 is to only recording at half framerate.

Mine will do this with some games too. It'll go away if you capture at 320x240 (at least on some of the boards I have).

I actually fix this in post-processing. I use AVISynth to adjust positioning on certain frames/fields to fix the bouncing. I think yours is every other frame is shifted up or down by a few lines. Shouldn't be hard to adjust.

Stefan_L · Post by **Stefan_L** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:25 pm

Thanks i will try AVIsynth... altough it looks difficult to use.

Actually CPS1 picture is the least problem of the arcadegames i tried, check out this Kid Niki recording kidniki.avi i guess it's because it's 55hz.

The two frames of the CPS1 are not only at different posittions they are of different quality also, check those two pics the one at bottom is the good one:

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:03 pm

Avisynth isn't that bad; here's some examples!

Air Gallet via linux advancemame+ArcadeVGA

Some frames were off by 3 lines. Problem is sometimes it would be even frames; then suddenly switch to being odd frames. Really annoying.

This figures out if the bottom of the frame is 'black enough' and then shifts the frame down 3 lines if it is. Worked great.

Code: Select all

AviSource("v:\capture_20061106-044407.avi")
ConvertToRGB()
bttm = Crop(0,468,0,0)
black = BlankClip(bttm)
ScriptClip(" RGBDifference(black,bttm) < 1 ? Crop(0,0,0,-3).AddBorders(0,3,0,0) : Crop(0,3,0,0).AddBorders(0,3,0,0) ")

For a few of my boards the fields get moved around. This produces a rather ugly looking image. Just separate the fields and then move things around! It always seems to be 3 lines on my setup. It changes between Even and Odd; you have to step through a few frames and figure out which one is wrong.

Code: Select all

AviSource("v:\capture_20061216-102745.avi")
ConvertToRGB()
SeparateFields()
c1 = SelectEven().Crop(0,3,0,0).AddBorders(0,0,0,3)
c2 = SelectOdd()
Interleave(c1, c2)
Weave()

See? Easy

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 12:40 am

Well, glad someone got some use out of this thread.

For those that care, I'm using Fair Use 2 to backup the DVDs to Xvid. Does 2-pass for you, and is pretty neat. You can crop and cut off the start and end times (can't edit out the middle though). All in all, not bad. I even paid $20 for the full package.

bay · Post by **bay** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:03 pm

so if i want to capture the rgb off pcb boards with the best quality possible (uncompressed) should i go with getting a sweetspot?

i understand that it is a uk based company, im guessing it has a branch in the states or no? zakk, you're in VA, how did you go getting that board?

at the moment i'm looking for the best option to get the rgb signals into my computer to be recorded. the compression options and dealing with making downloadable content for replays, superplays, etc isn't yet my concern. i want to be able to make some clean screen captures and videos from the best possible source.

this is why i am avoiding the jamma/composite output options right now. i've got a pc, why not go for better quality?

mainly targeted at zakk here, but anyone else have hardware card (pci?) solutions for capturing RGB video?

cheers,
-bay

zakk · Post by **zakk** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:51 pm

I should probably actually remember to respond to my PM's eh?

They'll ship to the US. However, I bought from them long ago before I knew you could buy it direct from Pixelmagic

http://store.pixelmagicsystems.com/Sear ... tegoryID=6

Same card.

Overall it works fairly well. Some boards cause weird frame/field shifting when captured at resolutions higher than 320x240. All the data is there, but the picture looks nasty because often every other frame is shifted down (or the odd field is shifted down in every frame). Some clever AVISynth scripts can move things into the proper position. Some boards might have the top or bottom edge slightly cut off.

From my poking around I think it's entirely possible to fix these issues by modifying some of the registers on the capture card. There's even a utility that lets you do it; the only issue is that most of the capture programs reset the card to defaults when they start a capture. It's really quite a pain in the ass.

I remember Sikraiken found an RGB capture card that would do all the way up to 720p (or maybe 1080i?) @ 30fps. I could find it with some searching (I linked it here, too). it looked awesome. Too bad it was something like $1200

Stefan_L · Post by **Stefan_L** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:14 am

About the quality of Sweetspot here is an example recording wich i think show it's good quality, it's not so hard compressed so it's 100mb for 4 min.

(Carrier Air Wing) - cawing_odd.avi
It's recorded with only odd scanlines to eleminate shaking picture, so it's half framrate (about 30fps).

Post by **Dave_K.** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:37 am

GaijinPunch wrote:Okay, after spending way too much money and time over the years on capture hardware that eventually breaks, or gives substandard results (my latest being a Canopus device which gives me wind-tunnel like sound) I've gone the DVD Recorder approach

What model DVD Recorder did you get, and how did you interface to the RGB line? Also any samples of the quality?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 1:03 am

Dave_K. wrote:What model DVD Recorder did you get, and how did you interface to the RGB line? Also any samples of the quality?

I got a Sharp something rather. It has a 160GB hard disc, and handles DVD-R/-RW discs. No RGB input, at all. If I capture from games, I have to play the games in S-Video, and w/o a splitter, I can only run composite out of my TV. Need to get a splitter.

Right now, the only samples I have are rather large. They are both captured to the HD in composite, transferred to disc, then I use Fair Use 2 (double-pass Xvid) to encode.

Gakidou · Post by **Gakidou** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:30 pm

Bumping this because I recently got a DVD recorder and need some tips on how to get good quality on the video while at the same time not making the video files extremely large. Tried numerous different programs for getting the video from the DVD, rotating it and compressing it to a reasonable size. For me Fair Use 2 seems to be a good solution for getting the video from the DVD, and after that I rotate it and compress it in Xvid by using Virtualdub. The only problem is that the picture quality ends up being not so great. I've been experimenting with an Ibara video I made while trying to understand the jungle that is video extraction and compression, and the best result I've gotten is a file which is about 200 MB, 25 minutes long and of okay picture quality. My question is basically: Why in the world isn't the image quality better when the file is so big? An ordinary full lenght movie can look great as an 700 MB AVI-file, why is there so much pixelation and other crap in my video? Am I using the wrong methods for compression? The wrong programs? The wrong DVD recorder (a Philips with RGB In)?

I uploaded the abovementioned sample file here, if anyone wants to have a look:

http://www.megaupload.com/se/?d=0X42OMK1

It's a stage 1-5 replay with quite a lot of mistakes and a score of D,7 million after Lace.

Shion · Post by **Shion** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:58 pm

I'm surprised that no-one mentioned Fraps yet. I've recorded lots of videos with this software, and the results are great. I have a single-core processor, and can capture up to 30 fps in good quality. The games even keep running at 60 fps while I do so (usually).

You can get a free trial here: www.fraps.com

I used different software in the past, but Fraps really did a better job than other programs. The files you record get really big though. I use windows movie maker to reduce the size (and quality sometimes).

CRI · Post by **CRI** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:26 am

please help a noob at video capture so i can do a record of my ddp run.
after some failed attempts i ended up with this:

left pic is the original record.
on the right pic i try rotating it and ended with the top and bottom of the screen cut out.
guesse i use the wrong option for rotating.

so it would be really great if someone can help me how to rotate the screen with virtual dub mod.

even more great it would be if you can tell me how to cut out this black border, resize that to 320x240, rotate it and get the file down to -300mb.

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:07 pm

1. Load the video
2. Add Filter -> null transform
3. left click null transform -> click cropping (on the right)
4. cut away all you don't need
5. Add Filter -> rotate (left 90°)
6. Save as (choose codec etc)...

If your codec makes problem you might need to keep the width and heigth of your video after cropping divideable by 8 or 4.

You can of course add a resize filter to the chain as well. If you use the internal resize filter, choose Lanczos3 for resizing. Keeping a 240x320 video under 300mb should be easy. Use a 2-pass XVid encoding. It has a bitrate calculator included.