"DARIUS" series of games by TAITO

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Lyle
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Post by Lyle »

Dark Saibot wrote:
The graphics/design really do play a big part in it. I mean, the game is gorgeous. Not really just from a technical standpoint, but just the design of the backgrounds, the levels, just EVERYTHING is incredibly inspired in the way the earlier entries weren't. Like, you know, those dinosaurs? Or that monorail (??) tube underneath the water? Or the glowing lights in the snow level? The boss battles are awesome too, I mean, all of them. They tend to last a little long but jesus christ they're cool. It really has all of the great aspects that really make it stand out as a top-notch shooter.
Eye candy.
God, I didn't think I'd ever read such things. How can one possibly dismiss a shmup for being an eye candy !? It's not like we're talking about some football managing simulation. Jaw-dropping effects are part of the genre. On top of that, usually the "eye candy" criticism is always there to finally underline how shallow the rest of the game actually is. G Darius is by no means an impressive but shallow game like, say, Project X or X2 are. Many ships or pods amongs those you may capture are considerably useful and allow an exceptionally high number of strategies. With the Alpha beam, you have loads of chaining opportunities. The ranking result is determined by something like 7 or 8 elements.

What's more, all the things mentioned here are not just here not impress. They're ideas of situations, the type of things designers think of when they're ambitious. I like ideas and emphasis on little details just as I like intricate scoring systems, brilliant level design and gameplay mechanics (that could be an interesting debate by the way, has it been done yet on this board ?).

In what shmups do you have a whole planet or mothership blown up in the background, bosses lurking, waiting for a fight, a city dome slowly opening while the game progresses ? Almost each boss is blessed with a good idea, too. The dimension diver, the absolute defender or the queen fossil are among the greatest bosses ever made. All have at least 10-15 types of patterns, sometimes far more. Sometimes, the power of the Alpha beam is cleverly balanced thanks to bits of indestructible metal. This game has everything. I just find the arcade game too tough. I don't think I'll ever be able to 1cc it.

Oh, and I think HG101 is brilliant (I discovered it a few months ago). OK, all the games don't have a very detailed coverage and the point of view is sometimes harsh but I've never read a Goemon page with so much useful info (although I was disappointed to see that many games from that series are actually poor).
Skyknight
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Post by Skyknight »

One should also consider that the 3-D graphics used for G-Darius probably ALLOWED all those captures, and the bosses' attack strategies (I'm thinking in particular of the Fossils and Heavy Arms Shell), in the first place...

My only concern with G: it's a bit on the short side (five stages, in lieu of seven). That was probably on account of the in-stage paths, though.
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BrianC
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Post by BrianC »

Lyle wrote: Oh, and I think HG101 is brilliant (I discovered it a few months ago). OK, all the games don't have a very detailed coverage and the point of view is sometimes harsh but I've never read a Goemon page with so much useful info (although I was disappointed to see that many games from that series are actually poor).
That site helped me get into the Goemon series. I got Goemon KiraKira Dochuu for SNES becuase of that site. It's a killer game. Do keep in mind that I don't agree with the site on every game though. I found the first Famicom Goemon to be a great game. Definatly avoid the second GB Goemon (released in the US as Mystical Ninja starring Goemon). I agree about that one being poor.

I need to get Sagaia for the Genesis. I heard good things about that one. For portable Darius I want to get Sagaia for GB. How does the SMS Sagaia work with the Master Gear adapter? (BTW, despite me repeating Sagaia, I know the GB one is different from the others and more of a remix of the first two Darius games rather than a port of Darius 2)
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The Bullet Dodger
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Post by The Bullet Dodger »

Skyknight wrote:My only concern with G: it's a bit on the short side (five stages, in lieu of seven). That was probably on account of the in-stage paths, though.

Yeah. Every title in the Darius series does seem kinda short. But you can't forget all the different levels that allow you to choose different paths each time you play. This feature gives the Darius games a huge amount of replayability to this day, along with different endings, which make it one of the best shmup series ever, IMO. I can only think of two other shmups that had the same 'level select' feature; RayCrisis & Thunder Force series.

There's no doubt that the 3-D graphics in G. are awesome, but they're also not flawless. It has some really bad slowdown problems during gameplay. And this is the ONLY thing that hurts the game, IMO. It would've been nice to see G. Darius on the Dreamcast. I bet it would've blown the PSX port away in terms of graphics and gameplay, giving it even more respect from hardcore shmuppers.
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Accutron
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Post by Accutron »

The Bullet Dodger wrote:It would've been nice to see G. Darius on the Dreamcast. I bet it would've blown the PSX port away in terms of graphics and gameplay, giving it even more respect from hardcore shmuppers.
The arcade version of G Darius runs on Taito FX1 hardware (augmented ZN1 IIRC) which is a PSX-based architecture. Any benefit from the DC's superior capabilities might be offset by the game being taken to non-native hardware. Also, since we're talking about texture-mapped polygons, everything would have to be re-modeled and re-textured to really see any significant graphical enhancement.
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Post by Guest »

Maybe I'm mistaking here... but weren't the two SNES Darius games developped by a company other than Taito ? I recall someone mentionning that over here...

Also, that theory would explain the absence of Zuntata's feel & sound... And to me personally, a Darius game needs OGR on music duty... It's simply not the same without him =/

I've played both games, but I just don't really see them being as great as Gaiden or G, or even the other Arcade Darius games... Then again, it's probably just me.... I'm all about the music, and a game published by Taito(as these seem to be) not sporting Zuntata's creative music just doesn't cut it...
I'm pretty sure both SNES Darius games were done by Taito, no other company is credited in their development. The music in Darius Twin was done by Wiz-Master of Zuntata...you will see if you beat the game and watch the end credits. I'm not sure who did the music for Darius Force...though the instruments/style sound very similar to Twin so I imagine it was also done by Zuntata. And liking a game based on whether or not the music was done by Zuntata(when the music actually WAS done by Zuntata) is ridiculous, how about you actually listen to the music instead, and give your opinion on it based on that.
You're in the minority, among shmup fans and among Darius fans.
I'm in the minority opinion on many things. It doesn't bother me one bit. Besides, if a "Darius fan" is somebody that thinks every Darius game sucks except the last two, then you can exclude me from that group completely.
God, I didn't think I'd ever read such things. How can one possibly dismiss a shmup for being an eye candy !? It's not like we're talking about some football managing simulation. Jaw-dropping effects are part of the genre. On top of that, usually the "eye candy" criticism is always there to finally underline how shallow the rest of the game actually is. G Darius is by no means an impressive but shallow game like, say, Project X or X2 are. Many ships or pods amongs those you may capture are considerably useful and allow an exceptionally high number of strategies. With the Alpha beam, you have loads of chaining opportunities. The ranking result is determined by something like 7 or 8 elements.
The fact that I think G-Darius is a graphics showcase isn't even the main gripe I have about it, it's the fact that the music is terrible. In the first few Darius games, the music was upbeat and stylish, and made the game relaxing and enjoyable. In Darius Force, they made the music more creepy and atmospheric, making the game more intense. In G-Darius, the music is just awful, it has no rhythm, no beat, no direction, its like just a bunch of notes banged out. I can't listen to that nervewracking crap and enjoy the gameplay. Every last member of Zuntate must have been high on pot the day that they made that soundtrack. They've made much better before, G was disappointing.

Now, if G had a great music soundtrack and was unchanged otherwise, would I still not like it as much? Probably, as I also was displeased how they took an entirely 2D game series and tried to make it 3D. I hate it when they do that. While the levels look great, at the same time, I have to urge that the graphics argument is overrated. Some of the best games ever made don't have that great of graphics, and a game can have the best graphics in the world and still be a piece of shit.
One should also consider that the 3-D graphics used for G-Darius probably ALLOWED all those captures, and the bosses' attack strategies (I'm thinking in particular of the Fossils and Heavy Arms Shell), in the first place...
How does the capture orb rely on 3D polygons? I'm pretty sure they could have done it with 2D graphics. Darius Gaiden was 2D and had something half similar, so I really don't see how they couldn't have done it 2D.
My only concern with G: it's a bit on the short side (five stages, in lieu of seven). That was probably on account of the in-stage paths, though.
I believe you just answered your own question right there. The game doesn't have 5 stages, the game has 15 stages(divided into 30 sub-stages) played 5 at a time.
I need to get Sagaia for the Genesis. I heard good things about that one. For portable Darius I want to get Sagaia for GB. How does the SMS Sagaia work with the Master Gear adapter? (BTW, despite me repeating Sagaia, I know the GB one is different from the others and more of a remix of the first two Darius games rather than a port of Darius 2)
I have Sagaia for the Genesis. Overall, it's a pretty good port of the arcade game. The bosses are a bit smaller, and the sound isn't quite AS good as the arcade version, but then again what else is to be expected of the Genesis.

I also have Sagaia on Game Boy. It's a neat little game, kind of funny. You're probably looking at around $20-$30 for a loose copy though, so make sure you really want it first.

And finally, I also have the SMS Sagaia. It's also a decent port, suprisingly good for SMS, the graphics are almost on par with the parent Genesis version! I never had a Master Gear converter, so I don't know much about them, but as far as I know, it has no problem playing European SMS games, since they're all universally compatible to my knowledge.
Yeah. Every title in the Darius series does seem kinda short. But you can't forget all the different levels that allow you to choose different paths each time you play. This feature gives the Darius games a huge amount of replayability to this day, along with different endings, which make it one of the best shmup series ever
That's part of the reason why I think the Darius games are so great. Having the ability to choose your own path in the game is a very innovative gameplay feature, which keeps you coming back to it.

Ah well...what can I say, I think the two SNES Darius games were golden masterpieces, not only due to their creativity and ingenuity, style and personality, but also their killer music soundtracks that set the pace of gameplay. I don't really know why everybody thinks they're both pieces of crap, but I don't really care, I will always enjoy them and think of them as vastly superior games in their genre.
Lyle
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Post by Lyle »

I like that electro-undergroung style in GD soundtrack. Granted, I wouldn't listen to it outside the game but I think it contirbutes a lot to the atmosphere. I really love the track "network".
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zinger
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Post by zinger »

Yeah, G-Darius has one hell of a soundtrack. Captures that special Darius feeling very well without repeating itself or being too similar to the older Darius arcades. Darius to me has always been a lot about the music and sound (or overall atmosphere), and I feel this is how it's supposed to sound.
Whoever made Darius Force and Darius Twin missed the point, bigtime ;)
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The Bullet Dodger
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Post by The Bullet Dodger »

Accutron wrote:
The Bullet Dodger wrote:It would've been nice to see G. Darius on the Dreamcast. I bet it would've blown the PSX port away in terms of graphics and gameplay, giving it even more respect from hardcore shmuppers.
The arcade version of G Darius runs on Taito FX1 hardware (augmented ZN1 IIRC) which is a PSX-based architecture. Any benefit from the DC's superior capabilities might be offset by the game being taken to non-native hardware. Also, since we're talking about texture-mapped polygons, everything would have to be re-modeled and re-textured to really see any significant graphical enhancement.

Yeah. Good point there Accutron. But I think the re-modeling and re-texturing would've been well worth it.

And about G. Darius being on the DC, I was just day dreaming a bit. 8)
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The Bullet Dodger
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Post by The Bullet Dodger »

Dark Saibot wrote:I don't really know why everybody thinks they're both pieces of crap

not everyone. :)

I'll sometimes bring out the SNES, slap in Twin or Force, and have a go. I still haven't beating either one yet. I have gotten as far as the last (or 2nd to last) levels, but have never been able to reach the final bosses. Both Twin and Force are much harder than Gaiden and G., IMO.
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Dragon God
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Post by Dragon God »

Dark Saibot wrote:I'm pretty sure both SNES Darius games were done by Taito, no other company is credited in their development. The music in Darius Twin was done by Wiz-Master of Zuntata...you will see if you beat the game and watch the end credits. I'm not sure who did the music for Darius Force...though the instruments/style sound very similar to Twin so I imagine it was also done by Zuntata. And liking a game based on whether or not the music was done by Zuntata(when the music actually WAS done by Zuntata) is ridiculous, how about you actually listen to the music instead, and give your opinion on it based on that.
Wiz-Master ? Right. And why haven't we heard of this guy elsewhere and no SNES games got a soundtrack release, even less a performance on the Game Music Festivals ?

I've heard both SPC sets, they're just standard shmup music *in my opinion*, and even then, Wiz-Master has NOTHING on OGR, less even on the other *noteworthy* Zuntata members like Yack, Tamayo, Karu, Shu, etc... I'm sorry, but I can't see Darius Twin and/or Darius Force being better than I, II, Gaiden and G, as far as music goes. OGR brings a unique feel/sound to the series. No other composer can do this, in my opinion.

And if you can't stand the experimental approach of G-Darius... well hey, you just can't. Personally, it's my favorite Darius soundtrack. Where else can you find the combination of eerie choirs, power tools and chaotic electronic melodies ? I haven't seen/heard anything else like this. I happen to applaud creativity over "tried and true" styles of music.

Again, it's my opinion, you don't have to agree with me, but this is what I think.
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BrianC
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Post by BrianC »

The SNES games may not have the best music of the Darius series, but IMO, the music is by no means poor either. It definatly fits the games and is not innappropiate or annoying. I personally think Darius Force has the better music of the two SNES games with more unique instrument sets being used. The main thing is how much you like the music. I couldn't care less about how many soundtracks the game is on, how popular the music is, or how much better the soundtracks in other games are (IMO, a game having a better soundtrack doesn't make another soundtrack lame).

That said, I definatly plan to try and get G. Darius. I almost got it at an EB Games, but the place only had the case and not the game (lame!). It sounds like a very well done game. The PSX version sounds like a good port despite the slowdown. I plan to get Darius Gaiden when I get a Saturn too.
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The Bullet Dodger
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Post by The Bullet Dodger »

BrianC wrote:That said, I definatly plan to try and get G. Darius. I almost got it at an EB Games, but the place only had the case and not the game (lame!).

I have an extra copy of G. Darius sitting on my shelf. It's complete and in pretty good condition. I'm willing to sell it to you or maybe trade it for something you have.

PM me if you're interested.
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Post by Guest »

Wiz-Master ? Right. And why haven't we heard of this guy elsewhere and no SNES games got a soundtrack release, even less a performance on the Game Music Festivals ?

I've heard both SPC sets, they're just standard shmup music *in my opinion*, and even then, Wiz-Master has NOTHING on OGR, less even on the other *noteworthy* Zuntata members like Yack, Tamayo, Karu, Shu, etc... I'm sorry, but I can't see Darius Twin and/or Darius Force being better than I, II, Gaiden and G, as far as music goes. OGR brings a unique feel/sound to the series. No other composer can do this, in my opinion.
How many people have actually "heard of" G-Darius, let alone have "heard of" Zuntata. That type of logic defeats the purpose of this entire conversation. Let's get real here.
And if you can't stand the experimental approach of G-Darius... well hey, you just can't. Personally, it's my favorite Darius soundtrack. Where else can you find the combination of eerie choirs, power tools and chaotic electronic melodies ? I haven't seen/heard anything else like this. I happen to applaud creativity over "tried and true" styles of music.
Experimental approach? That's all good, except the stuff in G-Darius is so far off that I wouldn't even call it music.
Again, it's my opinion, you don't have to agree with me, but this is what I think.
Yeah, that's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. It is also my opinion that I think everything you just said is complete 100% Grade A hog shite, but oh, that's just my opinion. :)

It all comes down to what type of person you are. I'm not the type of person that plays a game with good graphics and says, wow, this is a good game. I also am not the type of person that listens to moody, atmospheric music like in the two SNES Darius games, and then listens to the rhythm-less, melody-less "music" in G-Darius and enjoys it. Sue me.
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sethsez
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Post by sethsez »

Dark Saibot wrote:It all comes down to what type of person you are. I'm not the type of person that plays a game with good graphics and says, wow, this is a good game. I also am not the type of person that listens to moody, atmospheric music like in the two SNES Darius games, and then listens to the rhythm-less, melody-less "music" in G-Darius and enjoys it. Sue me.
I'm sorry, could you repeat that? It's hard to hear you when you're speaking from the top of that abnormally high horse.
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gameoverDude
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Post by gameoverDude »

Wiz-Master is another name used by Norihiro Furukawa (Joutohei Nakayama) whose soundtracks also include Grid Seeker and Space Gun. I think the Darius Twin soundtrack is pretty good- one of the tracks sounds like a hard-rock version of Darius II's "Cynthia".

For the SNES, DT isn't a bad game in itself- though I'd have liked to see Taito go for 28 levels.

Darius R on the GBA is OK but mildly disappointing. This has only 15 stages. Considering it came out in 2002, developer Rideon should have been able to go for a complete port of the original Darius considering the GBA carts can hold more than 8 Megabits.

Darius+ on the Amiga is dogawful.
Kinect? KIN NOT.
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Dragon God
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Post by Dragon God »

gameoverDude wrote:Wiz-Master is another name used by Norihiro Furukawa (Joutohei Nakayama) whose soundtracks also include Grid Seeker and Space Gun. I think the Darius Twin soundtrack is pretty good- one of the tracks sounds like a hard-rock version of Darius II's "Cynthia".
Norihiro Furukawa ?! HOLY SHIT !! That changes everything then... I absolutely LOVE his works on Grid Seeker, Light Bringer, and Arabian Magic. Guess I'll have to really let Darius Twin grow on me. Any clue if he was involved in Darius Force too ?
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Post by Guest »

Here are the 3 names that are credited for the soundtrack to Darius Force/Super Nova:

Kiyoshi Kusatsu
Yoshio Watanabe
Yukihiko Tanabe

I'm not sure what their relation to Zuntata is/was, perhaps somebody else can eleborate on this.

I never knew Darius Plus was ported to the Amiga...hmmm...

Ah well, I don't hate G-Darius, I just don't like it as much as the other Darius games, and I have my reasons.
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Smraedis
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Post by Smraedis »

its hard to tell that Darius+ on the Amiga is a Darius game at all.
Also, is anyone actually good at these games, or do you just complain about them? :D
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The Bullet Dodger
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Post by The Bullet Dodger »

Smraedis wrote:is anyone actually good at these games

Why sure. Gaiden and G. are pretty easy for me. And I was able to get through Super Nova just recently, which was a real challenge. I still haven't been able to beat Twin yet, or Darius II for my Saturn. Those are pretty tough. Although I have been able to reach the last levels in both of them.
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Darius series

Post by PepsimanVsJoe »

G Darius has a very um..unique soundtrack.

Personally I adore it. Of course I also listen to NIN so I tend to be more open to this sort of thing. The final boss theme is amazing(and it actually has a beat to it..sort of a "thump thump thump thumpa thump". It's very slight but a system with a good base will catch it). And yeah I listen to this in the car(Along with Gaiden and the Darius II PC-Engine CD soundtrack). Afterall I deliver pizza, I need something to listen to for 8 hours a day.

Darius II is madness. I usually die somewhere in the 6th or 7th stage on the Saturn version and it's all over...sort of like Gradius 1 only with instant respawn.

Gaiden I've 1CCed countless times on the Saturn but I just can't do it on the Arcade rev. Must be the lack of a second fire button (I love the double firepower)

The original Darius on the other hand is one of the few arcade games I've ever one-lifed.
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Post by FRO »

Dark Saibot wrote:About the only thing I like about the game is the capture orb/laser duel thing, but that wasn't even new, it just sort of combined elements of Darius Gaiden and Metal Black. Speaking of Darius Gaiden, what happened to the Smart Bombs from Gaiden? That was one of the best innovations of the game, and they removed them from G for whatever reason.
I've read this elsewhere that the "capture" feature of G Darius was based on the ability to capture mini bosses in Gaiden - there's no mention of this in the US Saturn release manual, so can anyone confirm this or tell me how to do it? That would make life SO much easier in Gaiden.
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Post by Zach Keene »

If you look carefully you'll see an orb attached to the minibosses; aim for this and not the miniboss itself. Upon destroying it the miniboss will follow you around for a while blasting away until it takes too much damage and dies.
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