My double-play attempts (DDP, Strikers Plus). Tips, maybe?

[-Bridget-]

So, being easily amused, having LOTS of free time on my hands, and so on, I've recently gotten into playing many shmups in "double play" form.

You know, one player, one controller, 2 ships, lots of cursing


I've actually progressed fairly well..... didnt think I could do this at all when I started (Raiden 3's DP mode initially scared me, lol). Now it's not AS tough. I've nearly got Giga Wing beaten doing this, just need some better methods of getting past the boss at 6, and I need Vista to stop flipping out......


I wonder, does anyone else here do this sort of thing much?

I'd kinda like to see if anyone can give me some pointers on doing this, particularly for DoDonPachi (trying to beat 1st loop), and Strikers Plus (trying not to die horribly, haha....).


I have 1 replay for each, that shows sorta where my current level of ability is. Though the DDP one is a bit old, I can do better now. Somewhat.

The DDP one is better, the Strikers one is me trying not to blow up, haha....


DoDonPachi replay, JAPAN version:
http://rapidshare.com/files/75797740/DDPDouble.inp.html

Strikers Plus: http://rapidshare.com/files/75799012/St ... e.inp.html


If anyone downloads either to have a look, I think you need to delete (or move) the "cfg" and "nvram" files for both games before running the replay, or it wont work right (you'll see my ships explode before they actually would during the replay, due to randomness I think?).

If the DDP one is working right, I dont lose a ship till the 3rd boss (and boy is that a stupid death), and I reach the middle of 5 before going down. Strikers, I THINK I dont lose a ship till 2, and I make it to 3 (barely).



Anyway, if anyone can give me some tips on those..... like point out stuff I might do to make things a bit easier, or point out mistakes I might be making.... That'd be a big help.

Normally, I like to look at super-play vids for various games to get tips on beating them. But DP vids are so hard to come by.....


Soooo, I thought it couldnt hurt to ask!! We've got so many great players here, afterall.



Or just lemme know what you think, whichever.


Im told that the stuff I do in stage 5 (after I run outta bombs...) in DDP is rather neat. I think I mighta been completely jacked up on caffiene (yay Mountain Dew) when I pulled THAT maneuver.

[Shatterhand]

I don't have any tips, but I really find the idea great. I don't have much incentive to play any double-play other than Raiden 3, as this gives me only one score. But Raiden 3 double mode is really Aweosme, is like the game was done around this mode, it gets 30 times more enjoyable

How are you plaing? 2 arcade sticks? Or did you just configure a dual-shock alike pad to work like it works with Raiden 3 ?

[-Bridget-]

I don't have any tips, but I really find the idea great. I don't have much incentive to play any double-play other than Raiden 3, as this gives me only one score. But Raiden 3 double mode is really Aweosme, is like the game was done around this mode, it gets 30 times more enjoyable

How are you plaing? 2 arcade sticks? Or did you just configure a dual-shock alike pad to work like it works with Raiden 3 ?

2 arcade sticks is something I'd like to try..... like on the Giga Wing arcade unit near here..... but I dunno how to hold them properly with one hand each. Looks like it'd be rather awkward and uncomfortable.


For now, Im using my 360 controller for this.

I actually have the left ship set on the d-pad, and the right ship set on the right stick. Left bumper controls auto-fire for both ships, right trigger fires the laser in DDP.

For Strikers, left bumper still is normal fire, but each trigger is seperate for each plane's special attack.

And then 2 of the face buttons for each ship/plane's bombs.




I still actually havent played Raiden as much as I should.... probably because I find DDP in particular to be oddly enjoyable while in this mode.

As soon as I figure out where my copy of Dai-ou-jou went, gonna try that one too, including Death Label.

That should be a short attempt, haha.....

[shoe-sama]

DDP- spam bombs

strikers- onoz 2 ships both messing with aiming mechanics don't bother lol
or just put them in the same spot
oh and bombs again

[elfhentaifan]

i once tried to doubleplay ikaruga with 2 gamecube controllers.
I almost reached VTF-INO, but then a meteor hit my gamecube.

[Dave_K.]

Here are a couple past threads on this topic:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?t=11081
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=195786

I also find dual play a fun way to spice up some games that get too boring for me. Playing on keyboard or two console pads doesn't have the same vibe as real arcade panel (or console sticks I guess). Nothing like sitting down in front of a real cab, and pown'ing a game in front of your buddies with both players at the same time! Playing with arcade sticks and buttons requires a lot of hand/finger dexterity and coordination.

DDP- spam bombs

strikers- onoz 2 ships both messing with aiming mechanics don't bother lol
or just put them in the same spot
oh and bombs again

Most DP runs are for the 1CC not score, so spam bombing is fine. Look at the Ketsui and Mushihemesama DP superplays and thats what you'll see on all the bosses.

[-Bridget-]

Here are a couple past threads on this topic:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?t=11081
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=195786

I also find dual play a fun way to spice up some games that get too boring for me. Playing on keyboard or two console pads doesn't have the same vibe as real arcade panel (or console sticks I guess). Nothing like sitting down in front of a real cab, and pown'ing a game in front of your buddies with both players at the same time! Playing with arcade sticks and buttons requires a lot of hand/finger dexterity and coordination.

DDP- spam bombs

strikers- onoz 2 ships both messing with aiming mechanics don't bother lol
or just put them in the same spot
oh and bombs again

Most DP runs are for the 1CC not score, so spam bombing is fine. Look at the Ketsui and Mushihemesama DP superplays and thats what you'll see on all the bosses.

That never strikes me as very impressive or interesting, though.


I treat these the way I do any shmup, and only bomb when I have to, and I refuse to overlap the ships (if I do so, it's generally accidental, only really happens if the sides get switched and I get confused).


And I dont actually have any trouble controlling the side weapons for the ships in Strikers Plus, it was moreso just the irritation of finding a control scheme that worked for it. Mame has a little "issue" with the triggers on the 360 controller. Eventually got it working, though.

[PROMETHEUS]

Which emulator did you use to record DDP ?

I tried progear in double play in milano with 2 joysticks but I couldn't do anything at all :p
Makes the Ikaruga double play that I've seen even more impressive.

[-Bridget-]

Which emulator did you use to record DDP ?

I tried progear in double play in milano with 2 joysticks but I couldn't do anything at all :p
Makes the Ikaruga double play that I've seen even more impressive.

I used Mame32 for this, which is my preferred emulator to use for any of these.

[Dave_K.]

I used Mame32 for this, which is my preferred emulator to use for any of these.

Which version of Mame32? We need the exact version number to run the INP replay.

[PROMETHEUS]

I thought mame32 fucked up inp recording most of the time :O

[-Bridget-]

I used Mame32 for this, which is my preferred emulator to use for any of these.

Which version of Mame32? We need the exact version number to run the INP replay.

Oh, right.

Im using 0.90u1, is what it says. There's a higher version, but I find it actually works WORSE.....

I thought mame32 fucked up inp recording most of the time :O

Not true.

The problem is in certain files that must be deleted before recording, or running a replay.

To run either of those replays up there,

go into the "cfg" folder, and delete or move the .cfg file for the game in question (make sure it's the right version, too, Japan for DDP).

Then go into the "nvram" folder and do the same.


This will prevent the replay from randomly screwing up in the middle of it.


If it works, the DDP replay should reach the middle of stage 5 before I go down (and stage 3 before I lose a ship at all), and the StrikersPlus one will get to stage 3, barely, haha....

[-Bridget-]

One more replay file:

http://rapidshare.com/files/76235104/RaDeT2.inp.html

This one's for ESPRaDe.


Same as the others, the "cfg" and "NVram" files need to be moved/deleted first.

This is the Japan version of the game (the one with the later date, specifically).

I get to the third boss before dying at all (boy was THAT thing hard).


And Im not familiar with 4 at all.........

[Dave_K.]

So I watched your replays. Very nice. Although it looks like you mapped both ships to a single player's button, which isn't really possible in an arcade, so not exactly authentic double play. Also this version of mameplus has some slowdown framerate issues. I was getting 85% framerate with your replays. You should switch to more recent version to play at full speed.

[j^aws]

I'll echo Shatterhands sentiments... Raiden 3's Double Mode and its integrated scoring system is awesome; and I can't get the same incentive to play anything else in this mode... I just get this 'dis-jointed' feeling...

Haven't seen the videos yet, but as for tips, I can't offer anything but just plain ol' practice!

I've reached a stage now where I can swap ships and sides without much trouble, aka 'crossing the streams' (Gostbusters FTW!)... i.e. playing the left ship on the right side and vice-versa... it was kinda like learning to ride a bike...

[-Bridget-]

So I watched your replays. Very nice. Although it looks like you mapped both ships to a single player's button, which isn't really possible in an arcade, so not exactly authentic double play. Also this version of mameplus has some slowdown framerate issues. I was getting 85% framerate with your replays. You should switch to more recent version to play at full speed.

While I was using the 360 controller, I didnt really have a choice but to map the buttons that way.... both MAME and the other program I was using for control have a bit of a problem with the thing's triggers.... they treat it sorta like half of an analog! AKA, both pressed down at the same time, equal zero input.

My ORIGINAL intent was to have each forward shoulder button be for continuous fire, one for each ship, and the back ones be for "held" fire.


I got the PS3's Sixaxis controller to work with it, though, now, so I can map the buttons AS I WANTED TO instead of just "settling" for the other config. Which'll help for stuff like Giga Wing, where having the "hold" buttons be SEPERATE could be really important for survival.



Oh, and Im surprised you had slowdown..... Usually MAME takes little processing power?

I have zero slowdown on my own machine (it's a very high-end dual core with an 8800GTS card).... if I DID have slowdown, I probably wouldnt be playing on Mame whatsoever. These games moving slower than they should, would simply drive me up the wall.


So, just keep that in mind when watching these, they were recorded at full speed.

[Shatterhand]

I'll echo Shatterhands sentiments... Raiden 3's Double Mode and its integrated scoring system is awesome; and I can't get the same incentive to play anything else in this mode... I just get this 'dis-jointed' feeling...

Haven't seen the videos yet, but as for tips, I can't offer anything but just plain ol' practice!

I've reached a stage now where I can swap ships and sides without much trouble, aka 'crossing the streams' (Gostbusters FTW!)... i.e. playing the left ship on the right side and vice-versa... it was kinda like learning to ride a bike...

The day I manage to do that is the day I'll master the whole thing. If I cross the ships, I have to get them back to their correct poisitions in the NEXT second or the credit is over... it's really annoying, heh

People alread looked weird on me when they saw me playing shmups with a Tated TV... you need to see the face of one of my friends when I was playing Raiden 3 Double mode with a Tated TV.... you can't get more hardcore than that (Well, actually you can, but whatever )