Lair's low scores...

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 4:47 pm

I don't know if anyone has this game yet, but it's gotten pretty lousy reviews-actually, that's putting it mildly! Some folks at SCEA must be pretty ticked at Factor 5 about how this game (apparently) turned out, since almost every PS3 ad they put out had that game in it.

Honestly, I don't understand why SCE even decided to add motion control to the PS3 controller; I tried playing Tony Hawk's Project 8 with it, at Circuit City, and it was a total mess. Dual Analog control was great for the game, on the other hand.

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 5:23 pm

Do you mean Lair?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 5:27 pm

Well, looking at the rest of the PS3 library, I would say by default it probably does suck.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 7:40 pm

I hope the next Gran Turismo comes out before the ps3 completely tanks. I want to pick that up on the cheap.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Sun Sep 02, 2007 7:48 pm

Warhawk turned out good...

Ord · Post by **Ord** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 8:02 pm

Indeed. I'm enjoying the hell out of Warhawk and the sixaxis controls.

EOJ · Post by **EOJ** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:10 pm

Liars should get low scores. They deserve no better!

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:20 pm

EOJ wrote:Liars should get low scores. They deserve no better!

LOL, nice one. Yes, I mean Lair-major typo. Any impressions from people on this site? Some people seem to like the controls.

BTW, I have yet to try either of the Drakengard games, are they any good? I do get bored with Dynasty Warriors games, and that's what I'm afraid of with this series.

Drakan : The Ancients' Gates is awesome; it's pretty fun frying enemies w/your dragon in that game.

Andi · Post by **Andi** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:26 pm

Ord wrote:Indeed. I'm enjoying the hell out of Warhawk and the sixaxis controls.

Yeah, definitely. Capping flags is dope as hell too.

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 2:03 am

Geez, about everything on this console is a deception :(

even Heavenly Sword got a bad review compared to what was expected. I'm sad !

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:14 am

You can play this game on PSP!

And... Well, that's the news. (check Kotaku)

Doesn't make it a better game I'm afraid.

jp · Post by jp » Mon Sep 03, 2007 3:38 pm

I actually feel bad whenever I sell a PS3 at work.

Thankfully I use my "antichrist of hardcore gaming" skills and convince about 2/3rds of 'em to get a 360 instead.

Granted... they typically come back very thankful. Especially since ole' Bioshock came out.

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 4:04 pm

The problem with the PS3 is that alot of the time in development goes into creating the 3D engine and not alot into the game design.

If you look at the team behind God of War 2, they decided to put that game on ps2 simply because they didn't want to deal with technicalities.

This is what is happening on PS3. A game studio builds this game in their head, but when putting it on PS3 they are constantly challenged and the game needs to come out half assed because they need the revenue like yesterday.

After Killzone 2 and GT5, things will change. Libraries will be shared, optimizations will be 100%. More time will be putting pen to paper, than making the pen work in the first place. I expect Capcom will make the first truly memorable PS3 game since they have the sense not to release anything yet.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:19 pm

neorichieb1971 wrote:The problem with the PS3 is that alot of the time in development goes into creating the 3D engine and not alot into the game design.

If you look at the team behind God of War 2, they decided to put that game on ps2 simply because they didn't want to deal with technicalities.

This is what is happening on PS3. A game studio builds this game in their head, but when putting it on PS3 they are constantly challenged and the game needs to come out half assed because they need the revenue like yesterday.

After Killzone 2 and GT5, things will change. Libraries will be shared, optimizations will be 100%. More time will be putting pen to paper, than making the pen work in the first place. I expect Capcom will make the first truly memorable PS3 game since they have the sense not to release anything yet.

I agree, but how many more exclusives can the PS3 afford to loose? They lost Devil May Cry, they lost Ace Combat, (which they had since 1995), among others. Certainly there are always going be companies like Insomniac that will always develop exclusively for the PS3, and SCE's own development teams are great, but will all that be enough to sustain this system for the 10 year-lifespan that SCE wants out of it?

Even once the technical issues get ironed out, with regards to developers, the PS3 simply has to have a high enough install base for developers to want to make exclusives.

In terms of variety of games, Sony's consoles used to be the place to go, but the 360 has game; there's just no two ways about it. And once the more durable Falcon unit comes out (supposedly some time this fall), even more so.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:23 pm

the 360 doesn't seem to have this problem as bad as sony... granted a year start ahead.

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:40 pm

Well tbh Sony's future is either very bright or very dark. Time is going against them now.

In my opinion PS3 is much more powerful than XB360 (just my opinion). Its not apparent yet because of all these technicalities. What has to happen and very soon is that developers can throw games out there just as quick and easily as XB360 games. If this happens Sony have a rosy future with ps3. If Sony goes another year without 1 game each quarter getting all round 90% + reviews its doomed.

The only reason why XB360 hasn't taken more of the pie is because for some strange reason all the games have to be 3D FPS or sports games. You get more variety on Xbox live than you do on the full priced disc games

jp · Post by jp » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:55 pm

neorichieb1971 wrote: In my opinion PS3 is much more powerful than XB360 (just my opinion).

Not really. They both have their advantages over the other. Sony's biggest advantage is more space on their discs, but even then games with multiple discs on the 360 cost the same regardless.

But in so far as graphics, there will never be a noticable difference between the two.

The only reason why XB360 hasn't taken more of the pie is because for some strange reason all the games have to be 3D FPS or sports games. You get more variety on Xbox live than you do on the full priced disc games

Blue Dragon, Senko no Ronde, Eternal Sonata, Kameo, Enchanted Arms, Overlord, Two Worlds, Crackdown, Earth Defense Force 2017, Viva Pinata, Phantasy Star Universe, Lost Planet, Dead Rising, and Project Sylpheed would all like to have a word with you.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:04 pm

neorichieb1971 wrote:Well tbh Sony's future is either very bright or very dark. Time is going against them now.

In my opinion PS3 is much more powerful than XB360 (just my opinion). Its not apparent yet because of all these technicalities. What has to happen and very soon is that developers can throw games out there just as quick and easily as XB360 games. If this happens Sony have a rosy future with ps3. If Sony goes another year without 1 game each quarter getting all round 90% + reviews its doomed.

The only reason why XB360 hasn't taken more of the pie is because for some strange reason all the games have to be 3D FPS or sports games. You get more variety on Xbox live than you do on the full priced disc games

I think it is more powerful-I played PS3 Genji at Circuit City about a month ago, and it blew me away.

I agree with you, though, in that time is definitely against Sony, however, I concur with JP-there are plenty of 3rd person shooters, and non-sports titles on the 360. The PS3 has some great games, just no enough of them.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:36 pm

jp wrote:I actually feel bad whenever I sell a PS3 at work.

Thankfully I use my "antichrist of hardcore gaming" skills and convince about 2/3rds of 'em to get a 360 instead.

Granted... they typically come back very thankful. Especially since ole' Bioshock came out.

Let's see how thankful 30% of them will be when they see this...

This generation kinda sucks:

X360 - unreliable hardware.
PS3 - lacks good games, controller sucks.
Wii - underpowered (but lots of fun).

jp · Post by jp » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:42 pm

Stormwatch wrote:
jp wrote:I actually feel bad whenever I sell a PS3 at work.

Thankfully I use my "antichrist of hardcore gaming" skills and convince about 2/3rds of 'em to get a 360 instead.

Granted... they typically come back very thankful. Especially since ole' Bioshock came out.
Let's see how thankful 30% of them will be when they see this...

This generation kinda sucks:

X360 - unreliable hardware.
PS3 - lacks good games, controller sucks.
Wii - underpowered (but lots of fun).

They send it in and get a fixed one since they have a 3 year warranty? And are still happy? Hell, most of 'em just go and buy an Elite when that happens.

No_not_like_Quake · Post by **No_not_like_Quake** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:09 pm

The PS3 has more horse power than the 360 but it's architecture is a clusterfuck of overly complex design with shit web intergration and an underwhelming GPU.

I see little value in the PS3. I see much desperation in many PS3 owners who post on online forums, looking for reasons to comfort themselves and justify their choice to buy a 600$ console. "Oh, it will get better" they exclaim. "Once developers learn how to harness the power, it will become the envy of consoles I was brainwashed to believe it would be!". Thing is, by then it will possibly be irrelevant... in a fairly distant third place.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:15 pm

I bet Sony will only be kept afloat by the PSP.

OMG THRED DERAIL!!!111ONE!11One

UnscathedFlyingObject · Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:24 pm

All consoles suck in their first year.

Shinichi Chiba · Post by **Shinichi Chiba** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:35 pm

Dreamcast did great its first year then lost support . I think the PS3 will recover but it will not over take the 360 . I don't care because I am not wasting my money on either of those consoles .

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:18 pm

Sony have a habit of making their hardware longevity prolonged due to some absolutely brilliant coding.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:20 pm

Stormwatch wrote:
jp wrote:I actually feel bad whenever I sell a PS3 at work.

Thankfully I use my "antichrist of hardcore gaming" skills and convince about 2/3rds of 'em to get a 360 instead.

Granted... they typically come back very thankful. Especially since ole' Bioshock came out.
Let's see how thankful 30% of them will be when they see this...

This generation kinda sucks:

X360 - unreliable hardware.
PS3 - lacks good games, controller sucks.
Wii - underpowered (but lots of fun).

Ehh, things will get better-remember that 2 out of those 3 consoles have been out for less then one year.

Which is just fine with me since I don't have the money to even get a Wii, right now. (Much less an HDTV for the 360 or the PS3.) When I do, I'll get a Wii first-I have played, and love, a lot of the games on it, and have heard that Metroid Prime 3 plays incredibly well; the Wii control setup has been said to be the closest console gamers have ever gotten to the keyboard and mouse setup.

splitblkribbon · Post by **splitblkribbon** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:23 pm

UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:All consoles suck in their first year.

except for nes, snes, and a few other older systems, man this generation is lame.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:01 am

splitblkribbon wrote:
UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:All consoles suck in their first year.
except for nes, snes, and a few other older systems, man this generation is lame.

Good examples, but the NES and SNES had mega-hit games (Super Mario, and Super Mario World) their first years out. Most consoles really don't-the PS2 didn't, and neither did the Cube or XBOX.

Zebra Airforce · Post by **Zebra Airforce** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:14 am

Most consoles really don't-the PS2 didn't

Dude, don't dis fantavision.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 2:05 am

Zebra Airforce wrote:
Most consoles really don't-the PS2 didn't
Dude, don't dis fantavision.

That game is still really fun to play-as long as you shut off the awful music.

Part of what's missing here is marketing; which Sony has done a crappy job with. Really, for $600, you're getting the cheapest Blu-Ray DVD player, AND a video game console, with increasing numbers of great games; Lair's aside. But Sony isn't marketing the PS3 like that at all; instead, it's all this "PlayB3yond" elitist-style crap.

Nintendo did a piss poor job marketing Metroid Prime 3 to FPS fans, or anyone else, for that matter-something that IGN's Matt C. took them to task for, in an editorial, and I don't blame him. Granted, the Wii kind of sells itself, but Nintendo is riding too much on that.

Microsoft, IMO, is sending the message that they need to be sending, which is "Jump In, 'cause we've got lots of great games and more on the way". They've also been trumping the fact that, while you may not be able to find a Wii, and the PS3 is more expensive, the 360's are out there. IMO, Microsoft is doing a great job making the 360 look like any gamers best option.