Great animated movies?

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:50 am

So what is CMoon going off on this time...?
No secret that I am something of an animation fan. Let me tell you what I'm looking for this time 'round. Anyone can spew off some anime or whatever that they really like, but I mean, across genre, across story type, best damn animated movies of all time rated on:
*quality of animation (meaning you're going to have to accept a little disney into your heart.) ***this can include computer animation, I'm pretty impressed by pixar...***

*quality of story (meaning a lot of boos and hisses directed toward disney)

*quality of music.

*quality of execution (this one is hard to explain, but this is where good direction comes into play!)

*bonus points for obscurity, not that that will make the film win any prizes, but just to encourage people to list shit I haven't seen.

Here are some of my favorites (in no particular order):

-Plague Dogs (gets high points from me in all catagories. Frame rate is clearly lower than a high budget disney film, but the actual animation is far among some of the best since the 40's. I put this a few steps higher than Watership Down (and subsequently haven't listed it) since the level of animation and story telling just seem overall a bit more 'on' than in WD.

-Bambi (my one Disney film I'll put on this list. Coming out on DVD a month ago doesn't hurt. Points off for a story that hasn't aged well and doesn't completely make sense, but it is very well executed and some of the best animation ever, hands down.)

-Chirin no suzu (aka Ringing Bell) (Super obscure anime where cute fluffy animals fill in the roles for samurai tragedy--lambs mother is killed by wolf, so lamb sets out on road of betrayal, etc. etc. Very strange with surprisingly great and stylized animation. Was shown on a double billing with Mouse and his Child...this could not have made for a more surreal childhood experience!!!!)

-Night on the Galactic Railroad (This one is based on the story by legendary Kenji Miyazawa, but for some reason the main characters are all cats! The music is great, but the backgrounds are even better. Watch out, this one will put you to sleep!)

-The Last Unicorn (I have a soft spot for these rankin bass tv specials animated by topcraft (the soon-to-be studio Ghibli). There are parts where the characters just talk and talk and talk in a very literate way that no one does in cartoons today. Splendid, but will probably repulse many.)

-Nausicaa / Totoro/ Princess Mononoke (the three films by Miyazaki that immediately come to mind. Could easily be exchanged with Laputa, Porco Rosso, Spirited Away, etc. etc. I need say no more.)

There is so VERY much more. There used to be an animation forum on IGN (when the boards were free), and there were so many great films discussed. I certainly started looking at animation a different way and understanding what makes animation good. There are of course films I could list here with great stories but animation that is nothing special, or just the opposite. Even some of these I have mentioned are nothing particularly special (last unicorn is just OK, but I still love it)....

Please discuss animation, make me happy!

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:08 am

On the Pixar front, the original Toy Story and The Incredibles are my two favorites: the graphical work in both, of course, is great, but I was more entertained by and interested in those two films than any of the other stuff Pixar has put out. The former was chock full of cleverness and character which its sequel could never match, while the latter has a more daring motivation at its core than anything Disney has put out in a long time.

On the anime front I like Miyazaki's stuff a lot, of course, though for pure visual spectacle I might also recommend The End of Evangelion...beware though, as the thing is quite disturbing for starters, and highly confusing, even if you've seen the TV series. The Cowboy Bebop movie ("Knockin on heaven's Door," I think it was called) is good too.

On the more "traditional" front, the Disney films that have most stuck with me are Peter Pan (for its devotion to just having a good time without worrying about much else), Alice in Wonderland (for its visuals), and Hunchback of Notre Dame (for its slightly more "mature" presentation). I might also mention, offhand, The Animatrix ("Kid Story" and "Detective Story" are my favorite segments), though it's not exactly "traditional."

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:09 am

Well, I only know anime. My picks would be:

Appleseed by Shirow Masamune. Lots of people complain how it boringly selects just 1 story from the Appleseed manga. However, I find the atmosphere and simple story of disatisfaction with society leading to an earnest betrayal amazingly well executed. The movie simply feels dreamlike and there's a lot I could discuss on the social implications of what the movie brings out. A lot more mind-provoking than the "do machines think?" question that Ghost in the Shell asked.

Robot Carnival: 7 different and very stylized, distinct stories with excellent art direction. Each was designed by a different director, most don't have dialogue, and all have an interesting point to make. Cloud is a personal favorite of mine with obvious and subtle images illustrating innocence among darkness drifting towards light and the revitalization of humanity. Simply beautiful.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:22 am

OOOOOOMMMMMMMGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!

Ringing Bell!!!! I watched that like 15 years ago or something, but I lost the tape and I REALLY REALLY want to see it again.!!! >_______________<
*cries*

Damn it! Now I wish I had money in Paypal... I want this video damn it...!

it290 · Post by **it290** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:33 am

I would have to say that many of Max Fleischer Studios's cartoons had some of the best animation ever made, to this day. They did Betty Boop, (some) Popeye, the first Superman cartoons, and Gulliver's Travels, amongst others. They also pioneered techniques such as rotoscoping.

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:50 am

Ganelon wrote:Robot Carnival: 7 different and very stylized, distinct stories with excellent art direction.

Holy moly, how did I ever forget that one...I own the dang thing, and I'm the only person I know who does. I think that the artwork quality in "Presence" is very impressive, though I like the more abstract "Cloud" as well. Of course, for pure stupidity, nothing beats "Foreign Invasion."

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:08 am

Wow, I suddenly remember a lot of old stuff I watched during childhood... Sea Prince and the Fire Child, Last Unicorn, Unico...

Can anyone here hook me up with Ringing Bell PLEASE??? I desperately need to watch this again...

MadSteelDarkness · Post by **MadSteelDarkness** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:16 am

Grave of the Fireflies

I felt sad for like, a week, after seeing that one.

Tar-Palantir · Post by **Tar-Palantir** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:17 am

Nice thread here. I haven't seen enough animated films (bar Don Bluth and Disney, and anime bar Animax is hard to come by in India) to be a real authority on the subject, but these are my picks:

-Bambi
-Shrek (though some of the in-jokes may age badly)
-Watership Down (a bit rushed, but still remarkable. I haven't seen the Plague Dogs to compare the two)
-Les Maitres du Temps (a French-Hungarian sci-fi movie, good animation, design, and a very good sci-fi-y story)- don't know what it was called in English
-Arcadia Of My Youth (I'm a Harlock worshipper, so sue me)
-The Incredibles
-Transformers: The Movie (seeing Optimus Prime die is one of the most touching moments in animation history

)

Honorable mention:
Aladdin (Robin Williams can only go so far)
The Lion King
The Great Mouse Detective
Pinocchio (great animation but they pissed on the original story from a great height)
An American Tail
All Dogs Go to Heaven
Lilo and Stitch (evil koalas! YES!)

All the Disney fairy-tale adaptations were visually very good, but they didn't really appeal to me. My favourite of the lot probably is Snow-White and the Seven Dwarves.

On a side-note: CMoon, is your avatar a Moomintroll?

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:23 am

Did anyone ever watch The Secret of NIMH ?

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:28 am

Yeah, that was the mice movie I remember. Never resounded anything with me but I can hardly remember the plot now.

IlMrm · Post by **IlMrm** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:36 am

Movies from childhood:

Beauty and the Beast
The GI JOE movie
Fieval Goes West
Thumbelina
All Dogs Go to Heaven
Charlotte's Web

MovingTarget · Post by **MovingTarget** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 7:16 am

Well, Akira is my favourite movie of all time so I suppose I should recommend that film

aurang · Post by **aurang** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 7:41 am

-SDF Macross DYRL (beautiful)
-Secret of Nimh (really dark for an american anime)
-Area 88 (the ultimate in moody, it's about, uhh "contractors"... in the middle east)
-Porco Rosso (is both light hearted and somewhat dark at the same time)

Fost · Post by **Fost** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:06 am

aurang wrote:-Secret of Nimh (really dark for an american anime)

-probably because it's based on a British newspaper comic strip? Originally called 'Mrs Frisby and the Rats of Nimh'. Yeah, I love that one too

I think 'The Iron Giant' is really underrated (also based on a British book

) it's one of those films that the trailer puts you off, but is actually great.

Also - The Rescuers Down Under is a fantastic movie - has a truly mean bad guy (for Disney at least), and some fantastic comedy and action set pieces. Makes me a little sad though, because it features the voice of the late John Candy.

Currently, on the anime front, I'm addicted to Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex - ok, I know this is a tv series and not a movie, but I'd go as far as saying I like it more than both the Ghost In The Shell movies put together.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 10:15 am

My top 3 would be...
Heavy Metal
Vampire Hunter D (old and new version)
Ninja Scroll

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:06 am

Mine

Are

Blood the last vampire
Ninja Scroll
Metropolis
Transformers the movie, I still function dammit!

QUESTION CAN ANYONE TELL ME THIS MANGA??????

Okay,
It was a japanese series, had a robot bit like a washing machine, a hardened crimal called Goolgo, a guy with long white hair who used a fibre wire to take heads off and some girl.

One episode they fight a robot cyborg called MULCOSS had big extending limbs, it fought golgo in a construction site at request of the military, think a truck fell into sea over a bridge, robot guy broadcast a soundwave to affect mulcoss.

Erm... Another the white haired guy is in a giant elevator leads from earth through the clouds to a space station in orbit, he ends up on a ship full of vampire like people in cryostasis.

Its been 10 years can't remember the series but I want to see it again, anyone know? was it 2000AD police?????

Sly Cherry Chunks · Post by **Sly Cherry Chunks** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:10 am

^ Cybercity OEDO 808?

MovingTarget · Post by **MovingTarget** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:44 am

That oedo 808 is great, been a couple years since I seen it but its good stuff

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:15 pm

iatneH wrote:Wow, I suddenly remember a lot of old stuff I watched during childhood... Sea Prince and the Fire Child, Last Unicorn, Unico...

Can anyone here hook me up with Ringing Bell PLEASE??? I desperately need to watch this again...

PM sent. I'd love to see Unico or any of the other Tezuka films (I know they did some Pheonix and the comics are amazing).

fost wrote:-probably because [secret of nimh is] based on a British newspaper comic strip? Originally called 'Mrs Frisby and the Rats of Nimh'. Yeah, I love that one too

*blink* They did a comic strip of it? I'd love to see it. Actually it is based off O'Brien's childrens' book by the same name ('Mrs. Frisby' not 'Secret of NIMH'). I never list the film because I do NOT like the last 20 minutes or so where they toss the plot out window and turn it into a fantasy movie. The animation is good (bluth's best?) but I'm just not a fan of bluth. For some reason he has that big obsession with people/animal's tongues always hanging out of their mouths.

I wish to hell someone would have done the book (or comic!?) straight up with the super-downer ending. Oh well.

MadSteelDarkness wrote:Grave of the Fireflies

I felt sad for like, a week, after seeing that one.

I thought about mentioning it since it is NOT a Miyazaki film, and it is a terribly important movie. I remember them showing it at our campus (back in the college days) theatre and everyone leaving in tears. It is amazing because it asks this question how we can, as adults, allow something as irresponsible as war to even happen. A great, great movie.

Tar-Palantir wrote:-Watership Down (a bit rushed, but still remarkable. I haven't seen the Plague Dogs to compare the two)
-Arcadia Of My Youth (I'm a Harlock worshipper, so sue me)
...
On a side-note: CMoon, is your avatar a Moomintroll?

You simply must see Plague Dogs. Do whatever you must. Download it, get a modded system, move the UK, whatever. It is one of the very best animated movies...well...ever. I hate to be so absolute on this, but it is a film where for once all restrictions were thrown to the side (perhaps a bit like Grave of Fireflies actually) and the focuse was completely on making a good (albeit very sad) film. Apparently it is MUCH better than the book (which I haven't read).

Arcadia of my youth is GREAT, but maybe not in the way I meant it in this thread. This is really a big 'man movie' where the men are real men, the women are real men(!), etc. Perhaps the best drink-along ever.

And yes, the avatar is Moominpappa at sea.

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:20 pm

I remember the moomins...... Had scary music for a kids show.

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:40 pm

Diabollokus wrote:I remember the moomins...... Had scary music for a kids show.

I've never seen any moomin movies (I guess I just suck), I took the avatar from the book of the same name. The books are FANTASTIC!

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:54 pm

it290 wrote:I would have to say that many of Max Fleischer Studios's cartoons had some of the best animation ever made, to this day. They did Betty Boop, (some) Popeye, the first Superman cartoons, and Gulliver's Travels, amongst others. They also pioneered techniques such as rotoscoping.

Since I started this thread I will POST as much as I want!

Man, I remember the really old Popeye cartoons, and you are quite right. They were strange stuff with pretty abnormal plots as I recall and what seemed like really cool animation (certainly better than the contemporary cartoons they were running side by side with the stuff.) Of course, then it must have passed hands to someone else. The ones in color were pretty poor and no doubt brough a quick end to what started as an incredible series of animated films. They have some popeye sets out now but I'm terrified by them--will you get the old, good popeye or the new terrible popeye? And of course, will they stand the test of time or was this just my childhood perception of them?

A few other odds and ends:

Rikki Tikki Tavi has finally made it to DVD. The animation is nothing special, but the style is good, and Orson Welles narrates the thing sticking pretty much word to word from Kipling. Well this is one I grew up with and will always be a little too forgiving for its faults (the other films in this series are not very good.)

I mentioned Mouse and his Child before, which seems to have suffered exactly the same fate as 'Ringing Bell' (IE never to be released again, so I guess I better throw it on a DVD-R before my VHS copy turns to trash.) I like it, but not sure I can recommend it. Really, really strange but good adaptation of Hoban's book by the same name (which is to say it is only sort of for kids.) Like Ringing Bell, I have friends who swore they just imagined this movie until I made them watch it. The animation is also strange and has an over-all ugly look to it which actually matches up with the feel of the story.

Just recently picked up a hungarian animated film called Vuk (aka 'the little fox'). The dub was pretty terrible I think and the movie not much to speak of except for a few parts, but I'm really happy to see something that isn't disney and isn't your typical anime. This one IS on DVD, but not in any English speaking countries. So yeah, the OK ones get DVD releases, and the weird ass ones get buried. But I like the weird-ass ones!

sffan · Post by **sffan** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:16 pm

I've gotta mention "The Missing Link" (Le Chainon Manquant), a Belgian animated movie from 1980. As far as I know, you can only get a European or Australian DVD of it. They both include the original English dub, but the European one is a better copy of the film. Both have some scenes cut out though.

And Bill Murray does the voice of a dragon that blows fire out his ass!

Tar-Palantir · Post by **Tar-Palantir** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:17 pm

CMoon wrote: I hate to be so absolute on this, but it is a film where for once all restrictions were thrown to the side (perhaps a bit like Grave of Fireflies actually) and the focuse was completely on making a good (albeit very sad) film. Apparently it is MUCH better than the book (which I haven't read).

If I'm lucky, they might air Plague Dogs on cable (that's how I saw Watership Down). But what you say is encouraging, since the book is much worse than Watership Down (too many humans and a bit too much animal experimenting polemic- Richard Adams was in the RSPCA).

Soulo · Post by **Soulo** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:16 pm

Metropolis

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:42 pm

Thanks CMoon, ARE YOU GREAT?!?!

I will go digging in my basement (again) because I used to have Ringing Bell, Unico, Last Unicorn, and Sea Prince on tape somewhere.... but I've looked before so I'm fairly certain they got lost in my last move :*(

Now that you've made me happy, I can think about some newer stuff I've watched.
I really liked Jin-roh. The plot just threw me back and forth and I didn't notice the details of the ending until the second time through (maybe I'm just slow).

I ought to check out Watership Down sometime since I remember the DVD being quite cheap..

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:17 pm

The Demented Cartoon Movie!

mannerbot · Post by **mannerbot** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:21 pm

Am I the only one that didn't like Grave of the Fireflies?

Anyway, top three for me would have to be Laputa (Castle in the Sky), Totoro, and Bambi.

Ord · Post by **Ord** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:23 pm

The Wings Of Honneamise was one of the finest anime movies I've ever seen. I'm a HUGE fan of Samurai Jack as well.