I was at the local Tigerdirect where I saw a 20" Sharp 480p nonwidescreen EDTV. I was wondering if anyone has ever used this for old consoles, and how games look on it - it really would make it easy for consoles like the DC and Saturn, as I can easily mount it and rotate easily to my heart's content. My guess is PS2/xbox games will look alright, since they support 480p in many instances; the big question is for stuff older than that.
Hopefully someone will have had some experience; if it looks good, I may have found a good old console TV that doesn't take up as much space as a regular tube.
Anyone have experience using EDTVs for old consoles?
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ahnslaught
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If it's local, and you can see the television in action (or even if you can't), my suggestion would be to trot down their with your game systems in hand and ask to try them with the set. It's a fair investment, so if they say "no," ask you speak with their superior, and keep going until someone lets you. They shouldn't mind it as long as you're careful though; Someone at CompUSA let me bring a Linux live CD to check the apparent compatibility of one of their laptops (that I couldn't afford, but wanted to try anyway).
This way, you'll have a very good idea of what consoles will look like on the TV, since you'll be seeing it yourself (although not in your target environment).
I'll note that the DC might also be generally lumped in with the PS2 and XB since you could get one of those VGA to component transcoders that we've been talking about in the Dreamcast VGA topic in Hardware. I've been curious about the devices, for the day that I need my DC to output a 480p signal... but I plan on making sure that whichever television I get, has VGA input.
Side-story; I had a daydream about playing Ikaruga on one of those big TVs at Best Buy, so after I saw them with Mario Kart on GameCube hooked up in one of the "simulated home theater" showcases, I asked an employee about it, and he said that it would probably be fine (and that some of the TVs do have VGA input). He added that Thursdays are probably the best days to come in, since it's less busy... so, as soon as I have Ikaruga (or decide to actually go down there now that I have a VGA box), it's going to be interesting.
Anyway, someone here also probably has first-hand experience. In any case, good luck!
This way, you'll have a very good idea of what consoles will look like on the TV, since you'll be seeing it yourself (although not in your target environment).
I'll note that the DC might also be generally lumped in with the PS2 and XB since you could get one of those VGA to component transcoders that we've been talking about in the Dreamcast VGA topic in Hardware. I've been curious about the devices, for the day that I need my DC to output a 480p signal... but I plan on making sure that whichever television I get, has VGA input.
Side-story; I had a daydream about playing Ikaruga on one of those big TVs at Best Buy, so after I saw them with Mario Kart on GameCube hooked up in one of the "simulated home theater" showcases, I asked an employee about it, and he said that it would probably be fine (and that some of the TVs do have VGA input). He added that Thursdays are probably the best days to come in, since it's less busy... so, as soon as I have Ikaruga (or decide to actually go down there now that I have a VGA box), it's going to be interesting.
Anyway, someone here also probably has first-hand experience. In any case, good luck!
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Franz the Stampede
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ahnslaught
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- Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:48 pm
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Also, did the TV have a "game mode" or "no effects/filters" option in the menu somewhere, and if it did, was it a decent improvement latency-wise?Vokatse wrote:Well, maybe it was just that TV...maybe you should try others?
I've never seen the "game mode" that people talk about, but I've seen only a few of these TV sets in the first place.
In a way, kind of disappointing... but if that's the way it is, then, ah well. CRTs are still good!ahnslaught wrote:Oh well, back to CRTs I guess.
Two technologies I'm looking forward to: A new display technology that is better than CRT in every way (not just size/power consumption), and "viewscreens" where the screen is integrated with a camera and looking directly at the screen will produce the output that you're looking directly at a camera.
(I've thought about the latter a lot, and I know that "Galaxy-class" viewscreens are basically not possible the way that they're depicted in Star Trek. On a smaller scale they could work, though.)
Anyway, I'm inspired to try some EDTV sets out at Circuit City or something. I'll write back here when I have results!
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This is what currently keeps me from upgrading my TV - too many new ones have a whole stack of picture processing, and I've seen a couple now where this introduced game lag. Sony the worst still with a nearly full second delay.
System11's random blog, with things - and stuff!
http://blog.system11.org
http://blog.system11.org
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ahnslaught
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I tried out a modded PC Engine which worked fine on my old TV. The images would also leave trails and other remnants when sprites moved around, which also made it pretty nasty, apart from the lag I mentioned before.
It sucks, too, because I was hoping things could work out to have an easy solution.
I didn't notice any game mode, but I admit I really wasn't looking. It was a 20" EDTV by Sharp, with no VGA (I really haven't seen many EDTVs, and of the ones I've seen descriptions of, they haven't come with VGA).
Hey, if anyone finds a good one, let us know!
It sucks, too, because I was hoping things could work out to have an easy solution.
I didn't notice any game mode, but I admit I really wasn't looking. It was a 20" EDTV by Sharp, with no VGA (I really haven't seen many EDTVs, and of the ones I've seen descriptions of, they haven't come with VGA).
Hey, if anyone finds a good one, let us know!
Scaling, motion blur and lag; there's a winning combination.
I know what you mean; It'd be nice if going to get a new set was as simple as picking the one that you liked the best in your budget. We'll figure some good ones out, though!
I just realized something that others have probaby known for a while. Unless a company specializes in it, chances are good that the TV technology that I imagine will never exist. I was going to say that with these EDTVs, perhaps using a digital connector (like DVI or HDMI) would result in less lag... and then it dawned on me. Displays these days are driven with digital technology, and consumer devices (DVD players, recent game systems) are as well. That means, to get the "best possible picture," the "native signal," one must use digital signals: Digital is the new RGB.
What incentive do display manufacturers and designers have, to support "old" display methods like analog RGB/S-video/composite? Television broadcasts are going to digital, as are audio receivers and PCs. My uncle looks for these weird old audio components that use vacuum tubes, because he says that they are better-built and produce higher-quality audio than the digital technology these days. I listened, and liked it, but I would have no idea. Likewise, the next generation of consumers will probably have no idea that analog RGB can produce such a high-quality display.
Perhaps the vacuum-tube audio technology is simply "better" for the media of the time, as surround-sound receivers and HDTVs are the best for the media today... and maybe the same goes for display technology. The problem is that ED/HDTVs still look like poopie face fart in a lot of situations, even with content designed for the format. I know, it's all been said before, but it would be kind of nice if a new display technology surfaced. LCD manufacturing, for example, could be improved to the point where dead pixels hardly ever happen, response time is practically nonexistent, and viewing angle is an after thought... but any resolution other than native will exhibit a huge step down in quality.
I'm going to check some manufacturers out, and see if I can come up with anything. It looks like most Samsung EDTVs feature a game mode, but reviews that I've seen on some of the sets seem to note only cosmetic differences (and "3D audio"?) and not check for or notice differences in latency. I like Samsung displays and heard that their LCD PC monitors were of fairly high quality (response time/contrast ratio) and value, so they'll probably be my first stop when I go testing!
I know what you mean; It'd be nice if going to get a new set was as simple as picking the one that you liked the best in your budget. We'll figure some good ones out, though!
I just realized something that others have probaby known for a while. Unless a company specializes in it, chances are good that the TV technology that I imagine will never exist. I was going to say that with these EDTVs, perhaps using a digital connector (like DVI or HDMI) would result in less lag... and then it dawned on me. Displays these days are driven with digital technology, and consumer devices (DVD players, recent game systems) are as well. That means, to get the "best possible picture," the "native signal," one must use digital signals: Digital is the new RGB.
What incentive do display manufacturers and designers have, to support "old" display methods like analog RGB/S-video/composite? Television broadcasts are going to digital, as are audio receivers and PCs. My uncle looks for these weird old audio components that use vacuum tubes, because he says that they are better-built and produce higher-quality audio than the digital technology these days. I listened, and liked it, but I would have no idea. Likewise, the next generation of consumers will probably have no idea that analog RGB can produce such a high-quality display.
Perhaps the vacuum-tube audio technology is simply "better" for the media of the time, as surround-sound receivers and HDTVs are the best for the media today... and maybe the same goes for display technology. The problem is that ED/HDTVs still look like poopie face fart in a lot of situations, even with content designed for the format. I know, it's all been said before, but it would be kind of nice if a new display technology surfaced. LCD manufacturing, for example, could be improved to the point where dead pixels hardly ever happen, response time is practically nonexistent, and viewing angle is an after thought... but any resolution other than native will exhibit a huge step down in quality.
I'm going to check some manufacturers out, and see if I can come up with anything. It looks like most Samsung EDTVs feature a game mode, but reviews that I've seen on some of the sets seem to note only cosmetic differences (and "3D audio"?) and not check for or notice differences in latency. I like Samsung displays and heard that their LCD PC monitors were of fairly high quality (response time/contrast ratio) and value, so they'll probably be my first stop when I go testing!
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