Thoughts on Metal Slug 3D?....

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:26 pm

Supposedly this game is coming out for the PS2 this fall. I don't mind the departure from 2D, but I sure hope SNK does this one right!

There are screens of the game on this site:

http://www.the-magicbox.com/0409/game092404a.shtml

UnscathedFlyingObject · Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:39 pm

Where is my Metal Slug 6?

SNK has to leave the 3D for companies with more budget and service their own niche of gamers.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:43 pm

True, but this could end up being a good 3D shooter if done right, and if that happens, I'm not complaining.

Besides, I've read a lot of complaints about 5; maybe that's why SNK decided to take this series into 3D.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:51 pm

oh no.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:57 pm

Crap I hope this doesn't turn out worse than KoF: maximum impact. I'm still wondering why they are porting that to xbox and not Tekken 5 or VF4.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 7:11 pm

They should have used 3D the same way Treasure did with Ikaruga... this is going to flop big time!

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 8:42 pm

UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:Where is my Metal Slug 6?

Rumor has it that it's going to be an Atomiswave game

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 8:55 pm

If that's the case then I doubt we'll see any home port of this game. Sammy has not, after all, given ANY of the current systems a port of Dolphin Blue; which is very similar to the Metal Slug series.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Fri Mar 25, 2005 10:15 pm

LoneSage wrote:
UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:Where is my Metal Slug 6?
Rumor has it that it's going to be an Atomiswave game

That's interesting. I wish they released some images to see if they are going to use new graphs; MS needs a huge reinvigoration.

dave4shmups wrote: If that's the case then I doubt we'll see any home port of this game. Sammy has not, after all, given ANY of the current systems a port of Dolphin Blue; which is very similar to the Metal Slug series.

D00d Metal Slug is a SNK game (no relation to Sammy). Besides, SNK is porting Metal Slug games as of late, which are very similar to Metal Slug games. Why would Atomiswave MS6 mean no port? If SNK didn't know how to port, they wouldn't be porting KoF Neowave.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 10:28 pm

I saw a video of it at the TGS. It looks like shit.

99pence · Post by **99pence** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 10:43 pm

Metal Slug 3D that's a joke, Shirley.

The clue's in the name.

It'll be on the shelves. Next to the vegetarian meat (don't start but it's an oxymoron, Shirley) and the inflatable dart boards.

landshark · Post by **landshark** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 11:15 pm

I don't like the way the main character looks.

I hope it doesn't fook up. There are very few 2d -> 3d conversions that I've ever really liked.

Metroid turned out well.
Zelda turned out well.

I'm not a fan of any of the 3d Castlevanias. I bought the PS2 one 3 weeks ago and want my $16 back.

Ghosts n Goblins (maximo) turned out excellent.
Mario turned out well.

But for some reason I just can't see this feeling like metal slug.

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 11:44 pm

landshark wrote:I'm not a fan of any of the 3d Castlevanias. I bought the PS2 one 3 weeks ago and want my $16 back.

Many CV fans would agree with you, esp. in retrospect. The new CV game sounds almost more like Deception than a CV game...

Anyway, when a game is canned, you can rest assured that it sucked. Companies, esp. SNK who even tends to cater to niche markets, won't trash potential unless they really feel it's crap.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 12:41 am

"D00d Metal Slug is a SNK game (no relation to Sammy). Besides, SNK is porting Metal Slug games as of late, which are very similar to Metal Slug games. Why would Atomiswave MS6 mean no port? If SNK didn't know how to port, they wouldn't be porting KoF Neowave."

Yeah, but doesn't Sammy own the Atomiswave hardware??

And folks, keep in mind that any videos you've seen of MS 3D probably come from last year's TGS when the game was hardly finished. The screens I've seen of it look great, and if it turns out well in 3D, then I'll get it.

I actually LOVE Castlevania LOI. Hell, I even love Mega Man X7! And I love all the Sonic 3D games, including Heroes, which I got a chance to try out at my local Gamecrazy last week.

However, I want my money back for PS2 Spy Hunter! The turbo function is severely effed up; you're supposed to push the accelerator button twice for it to take effect, but this rarely works, especially in boat form.

jp · Post by jp » Sat Mar 26, 2005 12:45 am

*sigh*

Despite having known about this for half a year now, I still think its fucking retarded. But whatever.

BUHA · Post by **BUHA** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:43 am

Yeah, I agree

LoneSage · Post by **LoneSage** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:53 am

dave4shmups wrote:
Yeah, but doesn't Sammy own the Atomiswave hardware??

http://www.snkplaymoreusa.com/mb/viewfo ... 6a4cd2e266

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 3:56 am

Well, at least we're getting an arcade perfect port of the original Metal Slug for the GBA this winter.

dementia · Post by **dementia** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 4:21 am

dave4shmups wrote:Well, at least we're getting an arcade perfect port of the original Metal Slug for the GBA this winter.

GBA cannot reproduce MVS-quality visuals. For one, the resolution is smaller, and if you've ever plaed MSAdvance of the GBA KOF games, you'll notice about 2/3 of the frames of animation are cut.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 5:00 am

dementia wrote:
dave4shmups wrote:Well, at least we're getting an arcade perfect port of the original Metal Slug for the GBA this winter.
GBA cannot reproduce MVS-quality visuals. For one, the resolution is smaller, and if you've ever plaed MSAdvance of the GBA KOF games, you'll notice about 2/3 of the frames of animation are cut.

Don't lump the GBA KoF games in togeather as if they were the same! The second has more animation frames than the original KoF EX and plays very close to the originals with the combos intact. MSAdvance actually has more frames of animation than the PSX Metal Slug X, though the enemy death animation was changed. The missing frames don't hurt gameplay for the GBA games either, except for KoF EX 1, from what I heard. The GBA can handle a very close port of Metal Slug 1. KoF EX 2 used a small cart size IIRC.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 5:12 am

"The GBA can handle a very close port of Metal Slug 1."

I agree with BrianC here, I would have a very hard time believing that any GBA port of Metal Slug 1 would not be a very close port.

dboeren · Post by **dboeren** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 5:19 am

I looked at the screenshots, and all I can say is:

"Dude! That is *NOT* Metal Slug!"

Looks like a fiasco in the making, this was a baaaad idea.

A GBA version of MS1 should be fine. Sounds like the PSP could handle an excellent port of MS3 if they wanted to do it.

Valgar · Post by **Valgar** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:56 pm

An MVS Metal Slug 1 arcade perfect port on GBA? Not possible.

E. Randy Dupre · Post by **E. Randy Dupre** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 2:21 pm

Probably not, but there's no reason why it couldn't be very close, like a couple of others have said.

Valgar · Post by **Valgar** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 3:54 am

How?

The resolution on the GBA is much smaller and Metal Slug Advance is "zoomed in" much closer than any of the MVS games. Throw in all the animation/sprites, and the game will destroy the GBA. Not only that, but is it really possible to fit all that data on the GBA cartridges ( I don't know the answer to this )?

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 4:15 am

If Saturn and psx couldn't handle it, I don't think GBA has much chance...

but like everyone said, it should still be somewhat playable...and it is portable, which is an advantage.

And of course there's the standard complaint about the GBA dpad (when will they fix this?

) No GBA player excuses allowed, that isn't portable.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:38 am

Valgar wrote:How?

The resolution on the GBA is much smaller and Metal Slug Advance is "zoomed in" much closer than any of the MVS games. Throw in all the animation/sprites, and the game will destroy the GBA. Not only that, but is it really possible to fit all that data on the GBA cartridges ( I don't know the answer to this )?

Please look up the specs of the GBA at somewhere like gamefaqs. The GBA is a 32 bit system and it is more powerful than the SNES, except in the area of sound. It's not the most powerful hardware around, but it doesn't have the same flaws as the SNES either. Final Fight and Double Dragon Advance have 7 characters on screen at once with on slowdown. Most SNES games couldn't pull that off. The GBA SFA3 has more frames intact than the PSX version, more characters, and a good amount of modes (no world tour, though) and this was only a 96 meg cartridge. The biggest GBA cartridge is 512 megs, which is more than enough for many Neo Geo games, especially since the NeoGeo has poor compression. However, I heard that Metal Slug Advance may have only used a 32 or 64 meg cartridge (not sure on this).

straight · Post by **straight** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:31 am

I'd love to see someone try a 3D game where the gameplay is inspired by Metal Slug. I'm thinking of a 3D run&gun where:

1. Enemies are constantly coming at you. You have to keep moving toward your goal, because if you just sit there, you'll keep getting attacked. You have to fire constantly, except for occasional dodging or throwing grenades.

2. You only have 3 lives. A single enemy bullet or touch takes one of your lives. Bullets are big enough to see and often slow enough to dodge (jump over, duck under, sidestep).

3. The levels are short, but there are multiple paths to your goal. Here's where 3D could be used to make the game more interesting. Instead of just a High Path/Low Path, there could be lots and lots of ways to get through a level. But it should be designed so that it feels like you're picking a particular route rather than trying to do a complete sweep of everything in the level. A timer would be one good way to do it.

It would be tough to do well, and might not be very popular, but it sure would be different from all the other 3D run&gun games.

dpful · Post by **dpful** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 5:10 pm

I will bet 1,000 dollars that this game will suck.
Check the radar.

incognoscente · Post by **incognoscente** » Sun Mar 27, 2005 7:44 pm

BrianC wrote:Please look up the specs of the GBA at somewhere like gamefaqs. The GBA is a 32 bit system and it is more powerful than the SNES, except in the area of sound. It's not the most powerful hardware around, but it doesn't have the same flaws as the SNES either. Final Fight and Double Dragon Advance have 7 characters on screen at once with on slowdown. Most SNES games couldn't pull that off. The GBA SFA3 has more frames intact than the PSX version, more characters, and a good amount of modes (no world tour, though) and this was only a 96 meg cartridge. The biggest GBA cartridge is 512 megs, which is more than enough for many Neo Geo games, especially since the NeoGeo has poor compression. However, I heard that Metal Slug Advance may have only used a 32 or 64 meg cartridge (not sure on this).

Please look up the specs of the NeoGeo at somewhere like gamefaqs.

The sticking point is the invocation of the phrase "arcade perfect", which the GBA cannot hope to achieve in the case of Metal Slug: Super Vehicle-001. This doesn't mean that the game won't play well, look good, etc. It simply means it will not be arcade perfect.

Metal Slug's resolution is 304 X 224. GBA's resolution is 240x160. Metal Slug can already not be arcade perfect on the GBA.
Neo Geo can draw 4,096 simultaneous colors from a 65,536 color palette. GBA can show 32,768 simultaneous colors in bitmap mode from 32,768 possible colors. Depending on the colors used on the Neo Geo, certain shades may not show up within the GBA's possible palette. That the GBA can display more simultaneous colors has no bearing on the status of "arcade perfect". The original colors (chosen from 65,536 shades) have to appear within the 32,768 on the secondary hardware to be perfect.
GBA supports 128 simultaneous sprites of up to 64x64 pixels. Neo Geo hardware can render 380 simultaneous sprites. Neo Geo sprites can be in sizes of up to 16x512 pixels. If we want to expand some math, to achieve a 64x512 pixel image as sprite we'd need 4 sprites on the Neo Geo, allowing us to do only 95 of these (64x512) images. If we attempt to render a 64x512 image as sprite on the GBA, we can only do 16 of these. To be honest, I do not know all of the resolutions for all of the graphics within Metal Slug: Super Vehicle-001. The issue is that there is a lot of room for the GBA to need shortcuts to attempt to keep up. Shortcuts are not "arcade perfect".

But, as I mentioned before, a game can be good without being arcade perfect. Why hope for arcade perfection? Why not hope for simply good?
Fire Shark is not arcade perfect on the Genesis but it still plays fine.