Why the lack of love for Gradius IV??....

[landshark]

The question for me is: "Is Gradius IV hard or simply awkward?"
The Japanese have managed to do 14 Loops on it.


Gradius III is not too bad really, its just a learning game. Once you've learnt the 'behind the Boss' method for ST3 and the top left corner method for the Ice Cubes at the end of ST9, all you have to do is practice and learn the route through ST10. The final escape chute is tight though
Tviks has a Gradius III replay somewhere.

Definitely hard. I still have never made it past level 2 on a JP board. I just can't keep the bubble population down.

And what's this "behind the boss" strategy for the level 3 boss (which is a problem on the US board for me).

I use the bottom left for the cubes. What is your top-left strategy?

[Super Laydock]

Average? Gradius 2 is still tops in the series, IMHO.

If by that you mean MSX Gradius 2 (Gradius '90) I can't agree more, igf you mean Gradius: Gofer blah blah I can't disagree more...

Ganelon wrote

I for one don't see how it's any worse than the original Gradius, which is far more bland IMO.

That (again IMHO) is just plain blasphemy! Certainly taking into account the times at which they were made!

[DEL]

Landshark - Slightly off topic ie. Gradius III - The behind the Boss strategy on the G III ST3 Boss is simply a way of lasting the Boss out until is disappears off the screen. I can't remember the pattern, but you've got to go behind it (top & bottom right) at certain times.

Bottom left for the cubes is fine also . We just used to do top left that's all.

Back to on Topic - The bubbles in Gradius IV are nasty but negotiable. I particularly don't like finding a path through the Moai later on, even when they die, they spin out a laser blast.

[dave4shmups]

Wouldn't it be something to see a Gradius III (arcade) Superplay!

Where's Ben Shinobi?

[Zach Keene]

There was one on JigsawMan's FTP when it was up a while back.

[dave4shmups]

What?! Aw crap, does any one have it?

[landshark]

dave4shmups - go to marp (search MARP on google) and look for gradius 3. There's a replay that works on there and the guy gets to like 3-6 or something. It's crazy.

There are replays out there for Gradius 2 where people max out the score, but they always desync on my during the 3rd or 4th loop. (They are using Emerald Mame)

(it appears marp is down for now)

[dave4shmups]

MARP is a pain in arse to use, IMO; that's why I'd like to know if anyone has the replay from Jigsawman's old FTP site.

Someone...anyone...?

[captain ahar]

II is my most wanted Gradius now. i can't find the Saturn Pack for a reasonable amount though. also i have no money as i have to pay for my first car. at 20!

[MSZ]

The question for me is: "Is Gradius IV hard or simply awkward?"
The Japanese have managed to do 14 Loops on it.


Gradius III is not too bad really, its just a learning game. Once you've learnt the 'behind the Boss' method for ST3 and the top left corner method for the Ice Cubes at the end of ST9, all you have to do is practice and learn the route through ST10. The final escape chute is tight though
Tviks has a Gradius III replay somewhere.

Yea you are talking about some Japanese nuts and Tviks. They are not normal people as you know...

BGR-44 had some loop 7+ GIV videos before. But he removed them like few months ago...

[Ganelon]

That (again IMHO) is just plain blasphemy! Certainly taking into account the times at which they were made!

Nah, I'd prefer to judge them absolutely when I decide which games I enjoy. After all, I can play both games only in the here and now. A game's historical significance doesn't make it any more fun.

[Super Laydock]

That (again IMHO) is just plain blasphemy! Certainly taking into account the times at which they were made!

Nah, I'd prefer to judge them absolutely when I decide which games I enjoy. After all, I can play both games only in the here and now. A game's historical significance doesn't make it any more fun.

Gradius 1 is ultimately better then part IV (which I actually kinda like as well...) IMO. I just meant to emphasize that considering the time at which the games where made Gradius 1 was even better compared to GIV.

Let it not be graphically, but certain;y in the music department and the level design...

[gameoverDude]

Because Konami should have gone with sprite-based graphics.

I remember a fellow at the old forums once said something along the lines of this: I like its artistic style, but the graphical engine doesn't do it justice.

I like Gradius IV, and am I the only one that really likes its Kenny G-esque music? It's like playing Gradius IV at a dentist's office, but 78% more cooler.

Gradius IV's music isn't bad but I have to say Gradius III wins soundtrackwise. Maybe they should've gone with sprites- especially after Gradius Gaiden turned out looking so hot. I'm surprised GG wasn't released as GIV in arcades.

Those bubbles are easier to take care of with the laser if you hold down the button for a full blast.

[landshark]

MARP is a pain in arse to use, IMO; that's why I'd like to know if anyone has the replay from Jigsawman's old FTP site.

Someone...anyone...?

How is it a pain? I've watched hundereds of replays from there. Best source as they are microscopic in size compared to videos.

You download mame.
You download the replay.
You copy the rom to the roms dir.

mame -playback replay
OK
Enter
Sit back and watch.

[tviks]

I personally like Gradius IV pretty much. And about the difficulty, this game becomes much harder than Gradius III at max difficulty. Gradius III's first loop might be harder than the first loop in IV, but loop 10 in IV is far different story than loop 4 in III.

I'd really like to see some japanese superplayer videos of this game. I was pretty convinced that it is impossible to beat the organic stage around loop 7, even on easiest and with konami code. And you say they've got 10+ loopers?! You know, 10+ looping in Gradius IV is about 10 times better achievement than in Gradius V. If it is indeed possible.

The real question is: why the lack of love for Gradius in general? :<

[dboeren]

I think Gradius gets overlooked these days due to all the newer stuff. Perhaps there are a lot of younger players who didn't play the old Gradius games too.

I still think Gradius II and Salamander are fantastic games, and I'm hoping to eventually get PCBs for both of them. Plus you've got the Parodius spinoffs, which are cool games in their own right.

I haven't played Gradius V yet, although I will probably break down and buy it sometime since everyone seems to think it's so good.

[Tony Gradius]

The real question is: why the lack of love for Gradius in general? :<

Yes!

But i think it`s the most beloved horizontal shmup anyway.

[Turrican]

Nah, I'd prefer to judge them absolutely when I decide which games I enjoy. After all, I can play both games only in the here and now. A game's historical significance doesn't make it any more fun.

Can't really understand your line of thinking. The fact that they are fun pretty much the same by now doesn't change that one was visionary masterwork, the other tired rehash.

Still, even going with that logic, all the gradiuses near IV (Gaiden, Galaxies, V) do offer a better gameplay session in any way.

[Ganelon]

Can't really understand your line of thinking. The fact that they are fun pretty much the same by now doesn't change that one was visionary masterwork, the other tired rehash.

Again, I'm not arguing that point at all. So what if it's rehashed? For example, I find Mega Man VI the best game of the original NES MM series. Yeah, it offers practically nothing new since MMIV. However, it's just more fun for me. When I play a game, I judge it independently. As I explained, Gradius I's revolutionary genre-shaking pedigree doesn't make it that fun a game now. To bring another comparison, I remember when I loved Super Mario Bros. 1 and thought it had fantastic graphics and gameplay. Over 15 years later, I don't see the magic and much prefer Super Mario 3 or World, which are more interesting to me.

Still, even going with that logic, all the gradiuses near IV (Gaiden, Galaxies, V) do offer a better gameplay session in any way.

Yes, which is why you don't see me declaring Gradius IV as one of my favorite Gradius games...

So as you can see, I uttered no hypocritical remarks, just brute frankness that games are judged on one hand by its innovation and significance to gaming and on the other simply for the fun it provides.

[Galaxius]

While I think Gradius 4 is definitely a good game, though it offers nothing really new, and is tough and nails, my question-

Why no love for Gradius 2 MSX/Nemesis 90 Kai? That game was a really unique and innovative title, with one of the best soundtracks in the series. The x68K version is just stunning, to me at least. The game deserves more attention, methinks.

[BrianC]

While I think Gradius 4 is definitely a good game, though it offers nothing really new, and is tough and nails, my question-

Why no love for Gradius 2 MSX/Nemesis 90 Kai? That game was a really unique and innovative title, with one of the best soundtracks in the series. The x68K version is just stunning, to me at least. The game deserves more attention, methinks.

It might be the fact that both Gradius 2 MSX and Nemesis 90 Kai were on computers never released in the US. They are great games from what I tried, though. Gofer no Yabou Episode II/Nemesis 3 MSX is extremely good too. Don't forget about the MSX Salamander that is different from any other version.

[Galaxius]

Yes, that must be one of the causes for their obscurity.

And all the MSX Gradius games are especially good. They all have extra features not found in the originals. I still need to find someone with some gaming skills to play Salamander MSX with, so that I can see the two player cooperative weapons first hand.

I think the greatest thing, would be an update of the Salamander MSX title, along the lines of Nemesis 90 Kai.

[landshark]

I personally like Gradius IV pretty much. And about the difficulty, this game becomes much harder than Gradius III at max difficulty. Gradius III's first loop might be harder than the first loop in IV, but loop 10 in IV is far different story than loop 4 in III.

Good lord. I've never seen past like 2-2 or 2-3 in gradius 4. It's just frustrating. I can't imagine being able to get to loop 4 or 5.

[MSZ]

I personally like Gradius IV pretty much. And about the difficulty, this game becomes much harder than Gradius III at max difficulty. Gradius III's first loop might be harder than the first loop in IV, but loop 10 in IV is far different story than loop 4 in III.

Good lord. I've never seen past like 2-2 or 2-3 in gradius 4. It's just frustrating. I can't imagine being able to get to loop 4 or 5.

I got to 4-4 before(with multiple credits of course). The bullets are like 10 times faster than the ones you see in GV.

[Super Laydock]

Why no love for Gradius 2 MSX/Nemesis 90 Kai? That game was a really unique and innovative title, with one of the best soundtracks in the series. The x68K version is just stunning, to me at least. The game deserves more attention, methinks.

Which is why I mentioned it before and which is the reason it's in my toplist in the top 25 shmups list of alltime (see Nullstar's stickied thread).

It is BY FAR my favourite Gradius game (yes I dislike Gaiden a bit...) and the only game from the same stable equaling it for me is Salamander MSX.

Not just plain nostalgia, but utter brilliance in level design/music and gameplay. I'd love to try out the X68000 version of Gradius 2 one time and it might even be the reason of me buying one at a time in the future (especially after reading Blue Landers' excellent first hand impressions on the system! )