Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

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ASDR
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Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

I want to move my PS5 into my main AV setup and would have to move something out for space and switching related reasons. Obvious candidate is the PS4 Pro. Is there any reason not to put that thing into storage when having a PS5? Backwards compatibility bugs? Additional lag when playing PS4 games? Certain peripherals or software features in PS4 games not working on PS5?

Thanks!
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by bobrocks95 »

I know for lag that a shmup youtuber (electronic underground maybe?) did lag testing and there didn't seem to be any added latency for PS4 games.

For incompatibilities, there are a handful of titles I've read about having issues, but it was such a small list that I think storage is a perfectly reasonable option. Sony has an official list and then the ResetEra thread on PS4 games upgraded by PS5 has a few scattered bugs listed that users have found.

EDIT: bit worse than I remembered, here's the thread I was talking about: https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-ba ... ts.322747/

I'm concerned about HDR being unavailable in The Last Guardian since I haven't played it yet :/
Then again I could downpatch for 60fps...
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

Thanks, haven't seen that list, it's actually worse than I expected. I have quite a few games that are listed as having issues. Haven't played several of them yet, including Last Guardian like you. I also play a lot of very niche stuff from the JRPG/SRPG/VN/Bullet Hell genre, so much of that hasn't been tested anyway.

Probably good to keep the PS4 around. I have a decent library since used game prices are so cheap, for the most part.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by fernan1234 »

Is it easy to transfer save files across PS4/5 just copying them on a USB file or something? My plan for backlogged PS4 games is to start playing them on a PS5 and if an issue pops up just move over to a PS4.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by Steven »

The only advantages that I can think of aside from the very few games that are incompatible are that thing with the circle button not being confirm anymore in Japan and that PS4 lets you back up your saves locally whereas the only way to do it on PS5 is to pay for Sony's online scam. That shit should be fucking free.

Taking lossless screenshots of PS4 games on PS5 also automatically upscales them quite poorly to 3840x2160, but it's just screenshots.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

that thing with the circle button not being confirm anymore in Japan
Only when you've been using japanese consoles I think. I don't remember if it was the PS3 or the PS4 that did this, but many japanese games running on a western consoles suddenly started running on the western scheme all of a sudden. Their policy on the confirm button was strange in general. There was a short time where you could remap it in the system menu too I think, but they took that out not long after. It's a fucking mess.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

fernan1234 wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:01 am Is it easy to transfer save files across PS4/5 just copying them on a USB file or something? My plan for backlogged PS4 games is to start playing them on a PS5 and if an issue pops up just move over to a PS4.
PS4 saves are easy in my experience, PS5 saves are a mess. I think I'll also follow that plan of yours.
Steven wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 4:18 am pay for Sony's online scam. That shit should be fucking free
Same with Nintendo, there's good money to be made offering a solution to problems you created...
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ZellSF »

My PS4 at least isn't connected, I use the PS5 for playing PS4 games. Haven't run into any problems yet, though I haven't played that many PS4 games.

The two things I could have mentioned (no SDR mode, Shadow of the Colossus texture loading) have been patched for a while.
bobrocks95 wrote: Sun Feb 11, 2024 7:20 pm I'm concerned about HDR being unavailable in The Last Guardian since I haven't played it yet :/
Then again I could downpatch for 60fps...
HDR is as available as it is on the PS4 Pro. With the 1.1 patch. The note about HDR being unavailable is if you chose to downgrade for 60 FPS.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by bobrocks95 »

Ah, re-reading, yes, that's right and same as on the Pro, the earlier unpatched version caps at 60 with no HDR, update is 30 with HDR. So nothing for games I own, but enough potential incompatibilities that I may not sell my PS4 Pro. If they've been maybe patching the backwards compatibility as things go it may not be a big deal though (unless the SotC fix was a game patch?)
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

bobrocks95 wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:55 pm If they've been maybe patching the backwards compatibility as things go it may not be a big deal though (unless the SotC fix was a game patch?)
That's what I've been thinking, who knows if this list is still accurate. On a side note, a list of images posted to a forum thread has to be one of the dumbest ways of maintaining a database about anything ("there's got to be a better way!").

I'll make sure to keep my Pro hooked up somewhere, if something doesn't work right on the PS5 I'll just go back.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by Steven »

ryu wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 7:38 am
that thing with the circle button not being confirm anymore in Japan
Only when you've been using japanese consoles I think. I don't remember if it was the PS3 or the PS4 that did this, but many japanese games running on a western consoles suddenly started running on the western scheme all of a sudden. Their policy on the confirm button was strange in general. There was a short time where you could remap it in the system menu too I think, but they took that out not long after. It's a fucking mess.
I've been using Japanese Playstations almost exclusively since 2009. A decade and a half of muscle memory is now completely backwards, and what makes it worse is related to what you mention here: on PS3, PS4, PSP, and Vita, the system itself has a pre-determined default confirm button that is based on if the system is Japanese or not, but it's up to the developers to choose if they want to use the system default or set a specific confirm button.

I want to say that most PS3 games and some PS4 games, especially later PS4 games, will go with the system default. Other games have specific confirm buttons and will force X or circle. Stuff like early M2 ShotTriggers games force use of circle, ACA is all over the place, and newer M2 ShotTriggers games use system default.

This gets really messy when you have a bunch of Japanese PS4 games and a PS5, and now about 1/3 of my games use circle and the rest, which used to use circle, now use X. It's really disorienting, especially when some games' button prompts or tutorials or whatever don't even align with the actual controls anymore, although this doesn't happen that much. On Vita, Muramasa does this on the title screen, but it's not especially common from what I have seen.
ASDR wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 8:57 am
Steven wrote: Mon Feb 12, 2024 4:18 am pay for Sony's online scam. That shit should be fucking free
Same with Nintendo, there's good money to be made offering a solution to problems you created...
I've seen people defend it, too. At least PC is largely unaffected outside of MMOs and stuff... for now.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

but it's up to the developers to choose if they want to use the system default or set a specific confirm button.
Ah yeah, I remember Sekiro suddenly forcing me to confirm with X when Dark Souls III was still O. Fucking annoying, what were they thinking?
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by fernan1234 »

ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 8:17 am Ah yeah, I remember Sekiro suddenly forcing me to confirm with X when Dark Souls III was still O. Fucking annoying, what were they thinking?
They weren't.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

Sony moving their HQ to California, getting an European CEO and closing their Japanese studios was a clear sign to me that things are going downhill :D Bring back Kutaragi, Riiiiiiiidge Racer, O-to-confirm and Patapon / Gravity Rush / Vib Ribbon / Loco Roco!
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by PC Engine Fan X! »

It'd be great if BandaiNamco were to do a proper 4K Ridge Racer 8 arcade racing game sequel (with the usual 120hz, VVR & HDR support from the get-go). Weren't there plans to release RR8 on the Switch back in 2019?

Is there a way to disable the automatic gameclip recording feature on the PS5?

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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

I just started playing Rockman 8 on the PS4 Legacy Collection. First game I've touched in years that still respects the original japanese button mapping. Such a small thing that feels so good and right.
PC Engine Fan X! wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:36 pmIs there a way to disable the automatic gameclip recording feature on the PS5?
The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ASDR »

Huh, I didn't even know this was a thing, I just disabled all trophy notifications anyway, couldn't care less about that stuff. Would love to turn it all off.

Everything about the PS5 just sucks so much. Like, you want to back up your save games. You can't just copy them individually it seems, you have to do a full system back up. Everything about this process takes forever. Selecting what to back up. Then the system warns me every time that trophy information isn't synced and points me to some menu where I can do so. Just do it yourself!? After doing so the system warns me again that trophy information isn't synced. Apparently it didn't work. Ok. I don't care about trophies and I don't understand what they have to do with backing stuff up. First the system has to 'prepare' something for a while, then it to reboot for some reason to copy some savegames to a USB stick. It takes forever to start copying. It then takes forever copying at like <10MB/s.

Why is everything on this console such a buggy, slow, overcomplicated mess even after years of firmware updates...
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ZellSF »

ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:52 pm The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
SSD write limits aren't worth your time to think about. I don't see why people seemingly are so much more concerned with that than they were of the limited lifespans of HDDs.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 10:25 am
ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:52 pm The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
SSD write limits aren't worth your time to think about. I don't see why people seemingly are so much more concerned with that than they were of the limited lifespans of HDDs.
Because SSDs used to have incredibly short life times if you wrote gigabytes of data to them. If your PS5 had one of those it would be guaranteed to brick in your life time. I haven't written half a TB to my laptop's internal SSD and it's already accumulated > 30% of wear.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by Konsolkongen »

ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:52 pm The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
You can disable that in settings.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ZellSF »

ryu wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:40 am
ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 10:25 am
ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:52 pm The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
SSD write limits aren't worth your time to think about. I don't see why people seemingly are so much more concerned with that than they were of the limited lifespans of HDDs.
Because SSDs used to have incredibly short life times if you wrote gigabytes of data to them. If your PS5 had one of those it would be guaranteed to brick in your life time. I haven't written half a TB to my laptop's internal SSD and it's already accumulated > 30% of wear.
Maybe if you're talking about SSDs that predate any sort of mainstream usage. The X25-M (2008) promised 100 GB writes a day for 5 years. If your SSD claims it's worn out 30% of its write cycles after writing 0.5 TB, it is defective. More to the point, even if you reduced the writes to it, compare the time you spend fiddling with that to the money you'll save by extending the drive's life span a few months.

There's a reason I contrasted it to HDDs. You think a HDD in constant use will last a lifetime? There's a reason they have MTBF failure ratings. There's lots of things you can do to baby HDDs too, to extend their lives by a few months, but almost no one does it. With SSDs however it's suddenly a thing and I cannot see why. Are we that much poorer or and our time that much more worthless?

Hell even if we are, are there not more sensible ways to use your time to save money?
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

Konsolkongen wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:06 pm
ryu wrote: Tue Feb 13, 2024 6:52 pm The one that saves clips when you obtain trophies? I was asking myself the same and didn't find a setting for it, so probably not. We can only hope they didn't assemble outdated SSDs that still heavily wear down from writes into their consoles. And that the rumors of recent ones being much more durable are actually true...
You can disable that in settings.
You're right, it's under settings -> captures and broadcasts. Thanks!
ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:31 pm Hell even if we are, are there not more sensible ways to use your time to save money?
I don't follow hardware news. All I know is SSDs were recommended for operation system storage only for years. From my perspective they were getting pushed left and right all of a sudden a few years back and I had no way of telling if designs had improved on the limited writes problem or if big tech was only pushing them because they expected big revenue from rolling out their latest buzzword. Why wouldn't I be worried that my $600 console could brick itself in 4 to 5 years from repeatedly downloading and installing terabytes of games on it?
ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:31 pm The X25-M (2008) promised 100 GB writes a day for 5 years.
Was that a model just anyone could afford? I bought my first SSD in 2016 and at the time people still recommended not to use them for storage.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ZellSF »

ryu wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:58 pm I don't follow hardware news. All I know is SSDs were recommended for operation system storage only for years. From my perspective they were getting pushed left and right all of a sudden a few years back and I had no way of telling if designs had improved on the limited writes problem or if big tech was only pushing them because they expected big revenue from rolling out their latest buzzword.
You're thinking about "big tech" propaganda, but aren't even considering that the whole SSD write panic was heavily manufactured by big tech that didn't want their lucrative HDD business threatened?
ryu wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:58 pmWhy wouldn't I be worried that my $600 console could brick itself in 4 to 5 years from repeatedly downloading and installing terabytes of games on it?
You won't hit the write limits of the PS5 SSD by doing that. It's just not realistic.
ryu wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:58 pm
ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:31 pm The X25-M (2008) promised 100 GB writes a day for 5 years.
Was that a model just anyone could afford? I bought my first SSD in 2016 and at the time people still recommended not to use them for storage.
It was a consumer drive, and modern drives offer similar numbers for consumer SSDs.

Most people definitely didn't tell you to avoid SSDs for storage because of reliability issues in 2016, but pricing.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ryu »

ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 3:23 pm
ryu wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:58 pm I don't follow hardware news. All I know is SSDs were recommended for operation system storage only for years. From my perspective they were getting pushed left and right all of a sudden a few years back and I had no way of telling if designs had improved on the limited writes problem or if big tech was only pushing them because they expected big revenue from rolling out their latest buzzword.
You're thinking about "big tech" propaganda, but aren't even considering that the whole SSD write panic was heavily manufactured by big tech that didn't want their lucrative HDD business threatened?
No, I never considered that. Good point actually.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by fernan1234 »

ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 3:23 pm Most people definitely didn't tell you to avoid SSDs for storage because of reliability issues in 2016, but pricing.
Even now SSDs are advised against for long term storage, as in stuff that you may not touch for 2 or more years.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by PC Engine Fan X! »

What's a good recommended PS5 SSD in the 1tb or 2tb range? And are the 3tb and 4tb PS5 SSDs good as well?

The internal SSD memory of a stock 3rd revision PS5 console with it's 825gb of internal memory is quite paltry these days.

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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by ZellSF »

fernan1234 wrote: Thu Feb 15, 2024 1:47 am
ZellSF wrote: Wed Feb 14, 2024 3:23 pm Most people definitely didn't tell you to avoid SSDs for storage because of reliability issues in 2016, but pricing.
Even now SSDs are advised against for long term storage, as in stuff that you may not touch for 2 or more years.
I have had lots of things that are stored on SSDs that are entirely offline for years that are fine. I wouldn't be surprised if this was another made up problem.

Regardless, any sane recommendation for storage should include backups to different media types. I wouldn't store any data I care about on any single HDD or SSD.

Also the (likely over-exaggerated) issue you're talking about only applies to cold storage, which is not all storage. And really, who uses SSDs for cold storage? It's not really an application where speed, low noise and shock resistance matters much. It's an application where SSDs will be avoided for the reason I said; price, not reliability.
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

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PC Engine Fan X! wrote: Thu Feb 15, 2024 3:58 am What's a good recommended PS5 SSD in the 1tb or 2tb range? And are the 3tb and 4tb PS5 SSDs good as well?

The internal SSD memory of a stock 3rd revision PS5 console with it's 825gb of internal memory is quite paltry these days.

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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by digitron »

Funny, I'm actually contemplating selling my PS5 all together as all I use it for is M2 PS4 shmups. Should I hunt down a PS4 Pro or a Slim? Maybe it doesn't matter..
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Re: Any reason to keep a PS4 Pro around?

Post by Konsolkongen »

PS4 Pro can do 4K output so you get a larger integer scaled image using that. Otherwise I don’t know of any differences between the two for M2 releases.
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