SCART to BNC

[Rock Man]

I'm thinking about retiring my SCART cables. Save for my Framemiester/XRGB-3/Retrotink on my HD set I don't need them anymore. I'm becoming more and more enthralled by my CRT. So much so that I'm considering replacing all cables for my console sources to BNC! I also tire of these SCART switchers, so I'll be replacing those too. I'll separate my inquiries one at a time.

The latter item I remember hearing something about an Extron and how it takes a ridiculous number of video connections at depending on whether you order one that takes mass inputs.

1. ) Are BNC switches still easy to find?

2.) Are BNC switchers nothing more than signal passthroughs or do they come with other features as well? For instance, adjusting the calibration on your TV screen and saving them as presets. (i.e. anytime I play my 3DO it's shifted far to the right. Annoying to have to enter service mode to adjust that one system)

3.) About those BNC cables, which RGB signals do they output? Are they sync over composite video, CSYNC or all of the above? Furthermore, just general curiosity could it carry CVBS? (I like options even the shittier ones) Lastly, I mentioned the 2 bangers for RGBs but what about RGBHV will it give me the 5 channel VGA input? Not that I have A TON of uses for the latter I'm just curious.

4.) Price! What is the price range for such cables? Are the good ones just as expensive as high quality SCART cables?

5.) My 2 setups - one is a PVM CRT the other is a flat screen plasma TV! Not counting the 2K Monitor I'm typing on (used for PC games). I generally do my retro gaming on the PVM. The way it's connected now is all RGB SCART using a SCART to BNC plug with a cool AF built-in sync stripper! The latter branches out to my daisy-chained Otaku and Shinybow switchers. If I go full BNC and connecting to my TV RAW with some kind of switcher do I still need a sync stripper or will these BNC plugs take care of that for me? I ask because I red somewhere that BNC is exclusively CSYNC.

If that's true how would it effect the Playstation which the best you can get is sync over chroma, N64 mod and other non-CSYNC sources?

Appreciated, all the wisdom you guys have bestowed upon me for almost 2 decades! This will be no different. I look forward to hearing back!

[fernan1234]

Congrats on your decision to move away from SHART! I made the same transition about 5 years ago and it was one of my best retro moves.

Except I went to D-Sub15 instead of BNC.

In either case, you'll want to look for Extron switches, in most of the world they're relatively cheap and easy to find, high quality and durable as expected of professional-grade gear. Pretty much all of them don't work with CVBS/composite video sync, which is why when you buy custom D-Sub or BNC cables they'll pretty much always be either c-sync for systems/mods that support it, or sync from luma (plus a sync stripper built into the cable) for those that don't.

In terms of cost, BNC > D-Sub > SCART in general. BNC can get pretty expensive if you're not making them yourself. For a 6' coax BNC cable you'll be spending over $50 most likely, vs. ~$40 for a D-Sub coax cable or ~$35 for a SCART coax cable.

You may be set on BNC by this point, but I'd recommend at least considering D-Sub as an alternative. IMO it has all of the advantages of a BNC setup but with a much more convenient, space-saving connector. An Extron VGA Ars switch is considerably smaller than an Extron Crosspoint with the equivalent number of inputs/outputs, but with the added advantage of optional auto-switching and regular 3.55mm audio jacks for inputs (if you want to route your audio through the same switch) as opposed to the phoenix connectors on the Crosspoints (you do have to use one of those for the audio output, but at least it's just one). And of course both an Extron VGA and a Crosspoint will let you use RGBHV, as well as YPbPR. Pins are pins, regardless of connector type. As a bonus, these Extron switch boxes all output TTL sync that works very well with various problematic sync-picky monitors.

[Rock Man]

Congrats on your decision to move away from SHART! I made the same transition about 5 years ago and it was one of my best retro moves.

Except I went to D-Sub15 instead of BNC.

In either case, you'll want to look for Extron switches, in most of the world they're relatively cheap and easy to find, high quality and durable as expected of professional-grade gear. Pretty much all of them don't work with CVBS/composite video sync, which is why when you buy custom D-Sub or BNC cables they'll pretty much always be either c-sync for systems/mods that support it, or sync from luma (plus a sync stripper built into the cable) for those that don't.

In terms of cost, BNC > D-Sub > SCART in general. BNC can get pretty expensive if you're not making them yourself. For a 6' coax BNC cable you'll be spending over $50 most likely, vs. ~$40 for a D-Sub coax cable or ~$35 for a SCART coax cable.

You may be set on BNC by this point, but I'd recommend at least considering D-Sub as an alternative. IMO it has all of the advantages of a BNC setup but with a much more convenient, space-saving connector. An Extron VGA Ars switch is considerably smaller than an Extron Crosspoint with the equivalent number of inputs/outputs, but with the added advantage of optional auto-switching and regular 3.55mm audio jacks for inputs (if you want to route your audio through the same switch) as opposed to the phoenix connectors on the Crosspoints (you do have to use one of those for the audio output, but at least it's just one). And of course both an Extron VGA and a Crosspoint will let you use RGBHV, as well as YPbPR. Pins are pins, regardless of connector type. As a bonus, these Extron switch boxes all output TTL sync that works very well with various problematic sync-picky monitors.

I'll have to think on the VGA switch-up. I'm trying to go full on traditional setup since this TV asked for BNC with its default connections, still the D-Sub15 thing I hadn't even considered an option. For the money it's at least worth a 2nd look! Believe last time I used one of those is with my Dreamcast on the XRGB-3!

[fernan1234]

I'll have to think on the VGA switch-up. I'm trying to go full on traditional setup since this TV asked for BNC with its default connections, still the D-Sub15 thing I hadn't even considered an option. For the money it's at least worth a 2nd look! Believe last time I used one of those is with my Dreamcast on the XRGB-3!

Regardless of which option you end up going with, something to keep in mind is you can always use a VGA-to-5BNC cable to go back and forth between the two connector types, they can go both ways (unlike SCART which is unidirectional). Even though they're 5 BNC, you can also pass RGBS through them (S goes through the H lead), so no need to hunt for a less common VGA-to-4BNC cable.

[Rock Man]

I'll have to think on the VGA switch-up. I'm trying to go full on traditional setup since this TV asked for BNC with its default connections, still the D-Sub15 thing I hadn't even considered an option. For the money it's at least worth a 2nd look! Believe last time I used one of those is with my Dreamcast on the XRGB-3!

Regardless of which option you end up going with, something to keep in mind is you can always use a VGA-to-5BNC cable to go back and forth between the two connector types, they can go both ways (unlike SCART which is unidirectional). Even though they're 5 BNC, you can also pass RGBS through them (S goes through the H lead), so no need to hunt for a less common VGA-to-4BNC cable.

Appreciate the advice, I forgot to mention my PVM can't support RGBHV anyway. It will do RGBs in all forms but not the former. I'd have to use VGA for my bigger set which is already equipped for SCART thanks to my upscalers. I think I'm only buying 1 more SCART cable for Dreamcast then calling it a day on overall SCART leads.

Still I'll sleep on VGA and let you know far as that goes. Also for my methods, let me give you a hypothetical... right now if I were to keep going with SCART I don't need anymore CSYNC leads save for the DC 15kHz signal which goes to my flatscreen. I just use a SCART-to-BNC cable with built-in sync stripper (LM1881?) and then buy all my SCART cables sync on composite video (SOCV), since I have a sync stripper I have no need for CSYNC. Can't I just recycle the same strategy for BNC? In other words get a strictly BNC cable with a sync stripper (assuming that goes inside the cable?), then buy all my BNC cables regular SOCV.

Also fuck CVBS!

[jd213]

I have DE-15 solutions for most of my systems now, some from Retro-Access and a couple others like the SyncBaby (also have the PlayBaby but it doesn't work with my 20L5 for some reason, just my OEV143), then a female VGA to BNC adapter into my PVMs. Makes changing out systems pretty easy as I don't have to disconnect each BNC cable.

Definitely nicer than my previous setups with JP21 cables (some of which I've had for more than 15 years when I lived in Japan), especially since VGA to BNC adapters are easily found and cheap in comparison to JP21 adapters.

[fernan1234]

then buy all my BNC cables regular SOCV.

Probably not. Maybe you could buy them as special requests from retro-access, but otherwise I'm pretty sure the BNC cable they and RGC sell are all C-sync and/or have sync strippers, since they assume you're going to be using Extron gear or monitors that don't work with SOCV.

I actually think I remember retro-access commenting on not making SOCV BNC cables because of all the potential problems, and once you're going BNC you're dealing with professional gear/video standards so it really doesn't make sense to stick with a consumer approach which SOCV is.

So you won't need to worry about having a sync stripper on the last cable going from your switch box to the monitor/display. Each cable will have to carry clean sync if you want to be able to use a BNC (or D-Sub) switch.

BTW if you want to keep any SCART equipment in your setup after your BNC transition (but why?), you'd need a way to go from BNC to SCART with the sync level attenuated back to video level. It would be easier to use a BNC to VGA going (or a simple VGA cable in a D-Sub setup) going into something like the VGA2SCART adapter.

[Rock Man]

then buy all my BNC cables regular SOCV.

Probably not. Maybe you could buy them as special requests from retro-access, but otherwise I'm pretty sure the BNC cable they and RGC sell are all C-sync and/or have sync strippers, since they assume you're going to be using Extron gear or monitors that don't work with SOCV.

I actually think I remember retro-access commenting on not making SOCV BNC cables because of all the potential problems, and once you're going BNC you're dealing with professional gear/video standards so it really doesn't make sense to stick with a consumer approach which SOCV is.

So you won't need to worry about having a sync stripper on the last cable going from your switch box to the monitor/display. Each cable will have to carry clean sync if you want to be able to use a BNC (or D-Sub) switch.

BTW if you want to keep any SCART equipment in your setup after your BNC transition (but why?), you'd need a way to go from BNC to SCART with the sync level attenuated back to video level. It would be easier to use a BNC to VGA going (or a simple VGA cable in a D-Sub setup) going into something like the VGA2SCART adapter.

The 2 SCART solutions are controlled for my Keene Commander Scart Blaster, Plasma VIZIO HDTV and the Retrotink 5 only. That TV only goes VGA and HDMI, unless you're saying I should D-Sub15 that thing? The regular VGA input is trash unless I use my XRGB-3 to clean the signal. The Tink cleans up the signal through SCART already. Let me know if I'm missing something there.

I've decided to use D-Sub15 those things are too damn cheap to skimp on! Does this mean I simply go PVM > CSYNC D-Sub15-to-BNC > Extron Switcher > CSYNC cables + console(s)

Or would having CSYNC going into the TV plus all of my consoles be redundant? Or perhaps the D-Sub15-to-BNC doesn't use CSYNC?

[fernan1234]

Or would having CSYNC going into the TV plus all of my consoles be redundant? Or perhaps the D-Sub15-to-BNC doesn't use CSYNC?

VGA-to-BNC cables don't use any specific kind of sync. They'll simply pass through whatever you put through them. What matters is what kind (and level) of sync the devices you use expect or are compatible with. You want CSYNC from the consoles/console cables only because that's what the Extron switches want.

So you'll just need a cable like this

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=566

I've decided to use D-Sub15 those things are too damn cheap to skimp on! Does this mean I simply go PVM > CSYNC D-Sub15-to-BNC > Extron Switcher > CSYNC cables + console(s)

Yep cost can be another advantage of going the D-Sub (aka VGA) route. And yep that's the chain you'd be working with. Now, your CSYNC console cables may or may not be outputting TTL sync instead of video level sync, which is fine either way as far as Extron switches are concerned for their inputs, but if you plan to use the output of the Extron switch to go into any SCART like your 5X you'll have to keep in mind that the Extron sync raises any video level sync to TTL (which your PVM is totally happy accepting), while all SCART equipment expects video level sync, so you'll need an appropriate adapter (such as a VGA2SCART or Tim Worthington's VGA to SCART adapter) if you want the Extron's output going into a SCART device.

[Rock Man]

Or would having CSYNC going into the TV plus all of my consoles be redundant? Or perhaps the D-Sub15-to-BNC doesn't use CSYNC?

So you'll just need a cable like this

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=566

I've decided to use D-Sub15 those things are too damn cheap to skimp on! Does this mean I simply go PVM > CSYNC D-Sub15-to-BNC > Extron Switcher > CSYNC cables + console(s)

Yep cost can be another advantage of going the D-Sub (aka VGA) route. And yep that's the chain you'd be working with. Now, your CSYNC console cables may or may not be outputting TTL sync instead of video level sync, which is fine either way as far as Extron switches are concerned for their inputs, but if you plan to use the output of the Extron switch to go into any SCART like your 5X you'll have to keep in mind that the Extron sync raises any video level sync to TTL (which your PVM is totally happy accepting), while all SCART equipment expects video level sync, so you'll need an appropriate adapter (such as a VGA2SCART or Tim Worthington's VGA to SCART adapter) if you want the Extron's output going into a SCART device.

Nice! This plenty answers me. I'll grab the cable in the link above. Then make damn sure all my consoles use vga dsub cables with CSYNC aaaand done! The Extron Switcher would exclusively be used for the PVM. I don't think I need it for the HDTV in the second room because it's for HD stuff my PVM can't handle.

I'm only sticking with SCART on 1-3 systems so I can use the 15/31khz stuff on the Dreamcast for said HDTV. Again the Extron is only for the PVM and I am ordering a DC SCART soon. I wanna run my Genesis and Saturn mods on the TINK so im using 2 of each console. I can just use my keene switcher for the HD set there. Extron do something with HD sets I don't know about? It's just a passthrough switcher correct?