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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2021 1:16 am 


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kitty666cats wrote:
Harrumph wrote:
If you simply want to run 240p and 480i on your PVM, you don’t need an OSSC Pro.


I think they specifically want to run Nintendo Switch at 240p (not exactly the best idea, save for retro-styled games). So, the OSSC Pro would be a valid option. But, so would GBS Control or RetroTink 5x :o


Exactly. And yes especially on the indi, and metrovania games. So, basically you are saying OSSC Pro will do just that? 240p? all i keep seeing is that they are upscalers.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 3:49 am 


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Jose1980 wrote:
kitty666cats wrote:
Harrumph wrote:
If you simply want to run 240p and 480i on your PVM, you don’t need an OSSC Pro.


I think they specifically want to run Nintendo Switch at 240p (not exactly the best idea, save for retro-styled games). So, the OSSC Pro would be a valid option. But, so would GBS Control or RetroTink 5x :o


Exactly. And yes especially on the indi, and metrovania games. So, basically you are saying OSSC Pro will do just that? 240p? all i keep seeing is that they are upscalers.


Getting an OSSC Pro just for downscaling would be overkill and silly... read this:

https://medium.com/rgb-inside/gbs-8200- ... 5d3b6907be

Or watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcqskbCWPCs



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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 7:29 pm 


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marqs wrote:
Hao wrote:
incrediblehark wrote:
After testing out my retrotink 5x pro for a couple of months, I have gone back to my original OSSC with my HDCRT. For the most part the 5x works very well, but still has sync issues with the Neo Geo AES and it doesn't play well with the RGC Dreamcast scart cable with 480p/480i switch, which works flawlessly with the OSSC. I haven't completely given up on the 5x yet, hoping that future firmware updates will fix these issues. Basically what I'm saying is I'm back on board with the OSSC and hoping to get the Pro when it is released soon, especially if it retains the original's compatibility.



This. Will the Pro retain the originals compatibility?
I wouldn't consider original's compatibility very good considering the number of hacks required to work around its video frontend's limitations. Pro uses a difference video ADC and sync detection is moved to FPGA so things should be much better. So far everything I've tested has synced well aside from an old VCR.

GK6475 wrote:
I wonder if a Dolby Pro Logic I and II Decoder (for all inputs) could be implemented. Some newer surround sound systems do not decode this kind of signal, like mine.
It's technically possible, but due to pin count limitations only 2 I2S channels are connected between FPGA and HDMI TX (remaining 6 are directly hooked from HDMI RX). For analog sources 4ch/6ch stereo expansion is still possible by duplicating sources within HDMI TX, but true 7.1 LPCM can be used only with HDMI sources.



Thanks for this information. I thought OSSC was pretty good compatibility wise so for you to say the Pro is even better is very reassuring!


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2021 1:53 am 


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@kitty666cats thank you so much for replying and info, appreciate it.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 4:18 pm 


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I am totally getting the OSSC Pro mainly for the 240p. I kinda don't like GBS Control simply for the fact that it was not specifically made for this, so it's a more complicated DIY project. It's also a bit awkward to use because it requires Wi fi... I am only gonna end up suffering wishing that a device just like the GBS Control was made, except with 240p in mind from the start so that it doesn't need Wifi, no custom firmwares, no modificiations, and a nice case/shell. The OSSC Pro is justified given everything else it can do, I wanted to get into Mister, but it can't even output 240p on its own... I'd probably end up spending almost as much as on an OSSC Pro, and still not have the ability to play PC games in 240p :(


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 5:19 pm 



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jay_are wrote:
I wanted to get into Mister, but it can't even output 240p on its own...


It can, you'll just need a $15-$20 DAC along with it.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:07 pm 



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Holiday Bump!

Any news or updates? Do you think we'll be able to get our hands on this in 2021?


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:14 pm 



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It would be nice to have a color banding reduction/removal feature, as well as a YPBPR and/or YCBCR422 processing feature to smooth out the half-resolution colors. Just some suggestions.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 9:57 pm 


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XtraSmiley wrote:
Holiday Bump!

Any news or updates? Do you think we'll be able to get our hands on this in 2021?

We have a handful of finalized PCBs made, but setting up larger production during current component shortage is a painful process. We expect a proper launch in Q1 2022, but no guarantees are given.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:27 pm 



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marqs wrote:
We have a handful of finalized PCBs made, but setting up larger production during current component shortage is a painful process. We expect a proper launch in Q1 2022, but no guarantees are given.


Thank you for the update! Does this also apply to the DExx-vd_isl? The OSSC pro is obviously the main event but this has me the most excited.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sat Dec 11, 2021 11:26 am 


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overscan wrote:
Thank you for the update! Does this also apply to the DExx-vd_isl? The OSSC pro is obviously the main event but this has me the most excited.
We'll try make a small batch of DExx-vd_isl at around the same time as long as it doesn't cannibalize OSSC pro batches (both use some same key components). Updates of that will be posted in its dedicated thread.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 8:46 pm 


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Just picked up a VRROOM that is able to upscale 1080p up to 8k/60 provided they are FRL. The OSSC doesn't work since it's Tmds, which leaves it at 4k/60 for upscaling. I was wondering if the OSSC Pro could have an option for FRL0?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
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SONY 32XBR250,Samsung UBJ590(LED),Panasonic P50VT20(Plasma),JVC RS400(LCoS),Optoma27HDR(DLP)


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 8:52 pm 


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incrediblehark wrote:
After testing out my retrotink 5x pro for a couple of months, I have gone back to my original OSSC with my HDCRT. For the most part the 5x works very well, but still has sync issues with the Neo Geo AES and it doesn't play well with the RGC Dreamcast scart cable with 480p/480i switch, which works flawlessly with the OSSC. I haven't completely given up on the 5x yet, hoping that future firmware updates will fix these issues. Basically what I'm saying is I'm back on board with the OSSC and hoping to get the Pro when it is released soon, especially if it retains the original's compatibility.
Which hd crt do you have?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
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SONY 32XBR250,Samsung UBJ590(LED),Panasonic P50VT20(Plasma),JVC RS400(LCoS),Optoma27HDR(DLP)


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2021 12:38 am 


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Bahn Yuki wrote:
I was wondering if the OSSC Pro could have an option for FRL0?

"FRL0" seems to be a not-really-standard term for "classic TMDS instead of FRL", so technically even the classic OSSC "supports" it. If you mean an actual FRL mode, that appears to be a completely different signalling system compared to the classic TMDS, so it requires explicit support by the transmitter chip.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2021 2:40 am 


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Unseen wrote:
Bahn Yuki wrote:
I was wondering if the OSSC Pro could have an option for FRL0?

"FRL0" seems to be a not-really-standard term for "classic TMDS instead of FRL", so technically even the classic OSSC "supports" it. If you mean an actual FRL mode, that appears to be a completely different signalling system compared to the classic TMDS, so it requires explicit support by the transmitter chip.
According to the vrroom, the OSSC and retrotink 5x pro are TMDS. The VRROOM can only upscale to 4k/60 in that case. 8k/60 upscaling needs FRL.

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SONY 32XBR250,Samsung UBJ590(LED),Panasonic P50VT20(Plasma),JVC RS400(LCoS),Optoma27HDR(DLP)


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2021 8:56 am 


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FRL is quite new feature in HDMI (v2.1) and not supported by the selected v1.4 transmitter chip (SiI1136). Big companies nowadays implement HDMI functionality integrated straight into ASIC / FPGA, I'm not even aware of any publicly available dedicated HDMI 2.0 transmitter chips.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2021 2:36 pm 


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Bahn Yuki wrote:
incrediblehark wrote:
After testing out my retrotink 5x pro for a couple of months, I have gone back to my original OSSC with my HDCRT. For the most part the 5x works very well, but still has sync issues with the Neo Geo AES and it doesn't play well with the RGC Dreamcast scart cable with 480p/480i switch, which works flawlessly with the OSSC. I haven't completely given up on the 5x yet, hoping that future firmware updates will fix these issues. Basically what I'm saying is I'm back on board with the OSSC and hoping to get the Pro when it is released soon, especially if it retains the original's compatibility.
Which hd crt do you have?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


He was using a KV-40XBR800 as we discussed in the 240 to 540p for SONY Trinitron KV-32HS510 HDCRT Dump Find thread, but iirc his set displayed 540p as 1080i and I think it did not have the 0 lag HDPT circuitry.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2021 9:28 pm 


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marqs wrote:
FRL is quite new feature in HDMI (v2.1) and not supported by the selected v1.4 transmitter chip (SiI1136). Big companies nowadays implement HDMI functionality integrated straight into ASIC / FPGA, I'm not even aware of any publicly available dedicated HDMI 2.0 transmitter chips.


you can check this: https://www.ite.com.tw/en/product/view?mid=155

and the rest of the ICs there.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:43 pm 


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VEGETA wrote:
marqs wrote:
FRL is quite new feature in HDMI (v2.1) and not supported by the selected v1.4 transmitter chip (SiI1136). Big companies nowadays implement HDMI functionality integrated straight into ASIC / FPGA, I'm not even aware of any publicly available dedicated HDMI 2.0 transmitter chips.


you can check this: https://www.ite.com.tw/en/product/view?mid=155

and the rest of the ICs there.
IT6615 looks interesting, but its "4k60" seems to be limited to YCbCr 4:2:0 unless listed 6Gbps is for single TMDS channel (i.e. 18Gbps total). I'm also not sure if it could be considered publicly available, at least no datasheet is given.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:14 pm 


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marqs wrote:
VEGETA wrote:
marqs wrote:
FRL is quite new feature in HDMI (v2.1) and not supported by the selected v1.4 transmitter chip (SiI1136). Big companies nowadays implement HDMI functionality integrated straight into ASIC / FPGA, I'm not even aware of any publicly available dedicated HDMI 2.0 transmitter chips.


you can check this: https://www.ite.com.tw/en/product/view?mid=155

and the rest of the ICs there.
IT6615 looks interesting, but its "4k60" seems to be limited to YCbCr 4:2:0 unless listed 6Gbps is for single TMDS channel (i.e. 18Gbps total). I'm also not sure if it could be considered publicly available, at least no datasheet is given.


I have got details for a similar one which uses a different input digital video, but this one should be identical. it supports up to 8bpp 4k60 8-bit RGB signal. if you go 10 bit then it will be internally converted to either 420 ypbpr or 8-bit rgb. since you are using 8-bit rgb then no problem at all. their chips has hdcp and non-hdcp versions.

all you need is to sign an NDA to get everything.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:51 pm 


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VEGETA wrote:
all you need is to sign an NDA to get everything.

I suspect that NDA would conflict with the OS part of the OSSC.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:55 pm 


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Unseen wrote:
VEGETA wrote:
all you need is to sign an NDA to get everything.

I suspect that NDA would conflict with the OS part of the OSSC.


well, if he doesn't distribute datasheets and support material then it doesn't collide with open source.

if he made his own code (which he does), then it is not a violation. he can put the schematics online + code and no one will ever need to know what is inside the datasheets or app notes anyway.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 7:09 pm 


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VEGETA wrote:
Unseen wrote:
VEGETA wrote:
all you need is to sign an NDA to get everything.

I suspect that NDA would conflict with the OS part of the OSSC.


well, if he doesn't distribute datasheets and support material then it doesn't collide with open source.

if he made his own code (which he does), then it is not a violation. he can put the schematics online + code and no one will ever need to know what is inside the datasheets or app notes anyway.
It goes into the grey area as NDA limits the amount of information you are able to disclose (possibly in form of headers, code and documentation/comments too). Not worth taking the risk of getting sued - in projects like this you'd have to use whatever information is available online and reverse engineer the rest.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 8:30 pm 


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but didn't you use Intel scaler IP while being an "IP" which is not free? how is that possible to fit in this project?

do you know any open source fpga project code for simple video scaler application as an example? or is all of it commercial IPs?

I do understand your choice and since you don't need 4k60 then your ICs and the one from analog devices are enough.
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:28 pm 


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VEGETA wrote:
but didn't you use Intel scaler IP while being an "IP" which is not free? how is that possible to fit in this project?
It's not about being free or not. Purchasing Intel video IP license does not give you any extra information (such as source code) nor it requires signing a NDA. Effectively it just enables to use the IP (already included with the tools) without restrictions and grants access to support forum. In practice most FPGA projects end up using some non-open vendor IP (e.g. PLL, memory controllers), only some Lattice FPGAs can be developed fully without vendor tools/IP and that's mostly thanks to reverse engineering.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 7:58 pm 


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Some good news, some bad news.

Good news is that we have got everything ready for production, case design being the last item (pictures below) that got finalized early December. Prototype runs with final/near-final PCB have been made with two different manufacturers during 2021, and we've got a handful of boards that could be shared with people willing to help developing the firmware further.

Image


The bad news is that component shortage forces us postpone launch until the situation takes a step towards normal. Things have got progressively worse lately and there are a bunch of key parts that now cost anything between 3-30x of their normal price on spot market, making it infeasible to kick off a large production run. I've recently spent quite a bit of time with the manufacturer trying to find these parts at more reasonable prices to cover at least a limited run, but without much luck. Focus is now switched on to manufacturing DExx-vd_isl boards (not as badly affected by shortages) which can act as more afforable yet limited substitute until times get better.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:08 pm 



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marqs wrote:
Some good news, some bad news.

Good news is that we have got everything ready for production, case design being the last item (pictures below) that got finalized early December. Prototype runs with final/near-final PCB have been made with two different manufacturers during 2021, and we've got a handful of boards that could be shared with people willing to help developing the firmware further.


Picture link isn't displaying for me, here it is linked to Imgur:

And Marqs, I'm SO HAPPY you got (nearly) all the ports off the back (like every mass produced, industrial designed, electronics device in the past ~80 years has had, rightfully so!!!).

Couple quick questions: can you bypass the SCART port on the side and simply use a VGA (or SCART to VGA adapter, or VGA to BNC adapter cable) and run everything (RGBS, RGsB, RGBHV, Component, --maybe even Composite and S-Video like Extron/TVOne/Crestron/Kramer/etc do through their DB15 ports as well) through the DB15/VGA port on the back? That would be ideal and keep the look of this beautiful device with ALL the cables running off the back aesthetically.

The LPF is available on the DB15, right? I thought this was updated on a later OSSC firmware, but I know at first the DB15 port lacked the Low Pass Filter the SCART port had, and that LPF is a must for these older consoles IMO.

The SCART port (IF people use it of course), points out the rear of the device, correct? Not like other a certain other scaler which for some reason made it point forward (a common complaint... so much so people have built converters to switch it back to the 'proper' direction, i.e. out the rear).

The OSSC Pro is supposed to do things like downscale, too, correct? That's one of the things I'm most excited about, making this an all-in-one scaling device (both UP and DOWNscaling). I assume the downscaling would be for CRT use mostly (downscaling to 240p for SD/Standard Definition CRT's, + perhaps scaling to 540p so HDCRT's can be nearly lagless). Where is the (2nd?) analog port for output of the scaled image though? I see Component, DB15, and SCART - I assume those are for inputs as those are common console connection types and many people would be using all 3x of those at once, but how would one hook up to it for analog output of the downscaled image?
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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:37 pm 



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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 10:13 pm 


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Dochartaigh wrote:
The LPF is available on the DB15, right? I thought this was updated on a later OSSC firmware, but I know at first the DB15 port lacked the Low Pass Filter the SCART port had, and that LPF is a must for these older consoles IMO.


It was never added to the original, it was something along the lines of the chip the port ran through didn't support it or it had a bug disabling it. Regardless I believe marqs said before that wouldn't be a problem on the Pro. I would be curious what variety of input signals it accepts though, I'd hope at least RGBHV and RGBS.


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 Post subject: Re: OSSC Pro
PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 10:45 pm 



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bobrocks95 wrote:
It was never added to the original, it was something along the lines of the chip the port ran through didn't support it or it had a bug disabling it. Regardless I believe marqs said before that wouldn't be a problem on the Pro. I would be curious what variety of input signals it accepts though, I'd hope at least RGBHV and RGBS.


I'm hoping the DB15 port will have pro features like my other 'pro' video devices have. Industry standard/large companies like Extron, Kramer, Crestron, TVOne (on select units of each capable of using these types) can take a HUGE assortment of inputs over a DB15 cable (commonly using the standard DB15 to 5x BNC cable or adapter dongle).

On certain units, switchers, converters, transcoders, up/down scalers I can input everything from Composite to S-Video, to RGBS, RGsB, Component, and RGBHV over the same DB15 input. AND they have the same exact pin-out between all these companies (i.e. my 'industry standard' statement above). (Sidenote: please don't do like Analog did on their NES console and use the PC format for CV/YC... those cables are NOT industry standard pinouts).

I think the original OSSC does similar over DB15 for higher-end signals (quoting their wiki) "RGBHV, RGBS, RGsB and YPbPr format", so adding in some lower signal types (which correct me if I'm wrong but I think the OSSC Pro can take too, perhaps at a later date with a firmware update I think they said) should be a piece of cake and give an all-in-one connection type. A super flexible connection type like this would make setup a breeze for peoples larger setups (using switchers) since you would need ONE SINGLE OUTPUT CABLE, instead of running separate cables for composite, s-video, RGBS, component, VGA/RGBHV, etc. (which would be crazy to have to run all those multiple cables when they could be run over a single DB15 cable).
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