GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

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fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

ulfrinn wrote:So, when I attempted to use the frame lock to eliminate tearing, it worked to eliminate tearing, but then on occasion the screen would go black for a few moments before coming back on. Any idea why?

Also, is there an easier way to get a correct 4:3 aspect ratio? What I did was set the settings in GBS, then take a screenshot of it through a capture card on my PC and actually measure the width and height of the pixels, and adjust accordingly. I was hoping there was a simpler method to get a proper 4:3 without having to do that.
What video output mode are you using? 1280x960 should give you proper 4:3 for NTSC content, and 1280x1024 for PAL. I'd also try these modes to see if it makes a difference regarding the black out problem, though that's probably related to something else.
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Blackouts are often caused by too hot/high of an input (or output) video or sync signal.
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Robertcop84
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Robertcop84 »

webhdx wrote:I don't think many people use ESP-01 modules for the build so here is mine:

Image

The module is powered from internal 3.3V power rail and I didn't notice any issues running it like this. As you can see I did Clock Generator mod, removed RGB pots, put 22uF electrolytic cap on C11 and hooked up 100 Ohms resistor between Sync and GND.

ESP-01 has 4 GPIO pins exposed so it's quite difficult to make everything work. It requires some changes in the code to use different pins for SDA/SCL signals. Also I had to disable Serial output to gain another 2 GPIOs. One is used for DEBUG signal, the other is free and maybe it could be used in the future. The updates are not straightforward since I'd have to apply my changes every time but I will probably fork main repository and keep it in sync with all changes needed for ESP-01. Also the OTA won't work because the module have only 1MB of flash memory. This is why I used breadboard adapter so I can quickly remove the module and put it into the programmer.

Now my thoughts on GBS-8200. This thing is sensitive to noise as hell. I'm not sure where my issues came from but first the WiFi was breaking up constantly, I had to move the module outside of the board. Then I was having serious issues with noise, the picture was jumping like crazy. I rewired my mods completely and came into conclusion that you should keep the connections as short as possible. I was able to place ESP-01 directly on the board as you can see. Even though it's close to the RAM it doesn't introduce any interference now because the wires are kept short.

I believe my VGA-HDMI adapter is crappy because I still get diagonal lines in 480p output but I noticed this could be fixed by fine tuning HTotal value. I could replace the adapter but I would rather work on utilizing that digital output from the image processor instead and have direct HDMI connection.

The last modification I'd like to add is OLED screen which is totally possible with my setup since it works over I2C. Also having IR receiver would be cool and it would take that last available GPIO pin but I don't think anyone tried that yet?
Do you connect from a Android phone with the default Browser? I could not even see the interface correctly, it would not show the wifi network list to make it connect to the Router.
I used a Chrome based browser in the end to do that.

Are you shure that replacing C11 is even good practice? I built my GBS with clock in 3 Stages.
First I just built it with replacing c47, which was no good. The Sync dropped for like half a frame at a time. It would just budge up and down one time every few minutes.
Then I did the other caps around the video processor, which made it real good.
Now I thought oh well replacing c11 will be fine, too. A total disaster, I had a full sync drop for about 4 frames every 4 seconds. I am glad the 22uf ceramics come in 100 on a strip and I could revert that with a fresh cap.

I think I'll leave it at that at the moment.
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EmKIronFist
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by EmKIronFist »

ulfrinn wrote:So, when I attempted to use the frame lock to eliminate tearing, it worked to eliminate tearing, but then on occasion the screen would go black for a few moments before coming back on. Any idea why?
Same reasons OSSC can have trouble on displays sometimes; the output is following the input signal and always adjusting to match it, and a lot of displays will experience dropouts in that situation.
I've had the same problems with the active frame lock; I got much better results using the clock generator. I strongly recommend installing the clock gen board instead if you don't mind the little extra bit of work. It's way easier than soldering to the debug pin in my personal opinion.
ulfrinn wrote:Also, is there an easier way to get a correct 4:3 aspect ratio? What I did was set the settings in GBS, then take a screenshot of it through a capture card on my PC and actually measure the width and height of the pixels, and adjust accordingly. I was hoping there was a simpler method to get a proper 4:3 without having to do that.
In 1080p mode it's already supposed to be a 4:3 image with the rest of the 16:9 space filled by black pixels. In 1280x960 mode it's a true 4:3 image, just scaled up. (4x240p or 2x480i/480p)
1280x720p mode is one of the few that stretches the image to 16:9.

What mode are you using where you're not seeing a 4:3 image?
webhdx
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by webhdx »

Robertcop84 wrote: Are you shure that replacing C11 is even good practice? I built my GBS with clock in 3 Stages.
First I just built it with replacing c47, which was no good. The Sync dropped for like half a frame at a time. It would just budge up and down one time every few minutes.
Then I did the other caps around the video processor, which made it real good.
Now I thought oh well replacing c11 will be fine, too. A total disaster, I had a full sync drop for about 4 frames every 4 seconds. I am glad the 22uf ceramics come in 100 on a strip and I could revert that with a fresh cap.
The wiki mentioned removing the cap or better replacing it with electrolytic one (ref. https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... 50-or-2017). I haven't noticed any issues on my setup, in worst case I will just remove the cap completely :) GBS boards are designed terribly and there are many issues. I also noticed you can get different results from board to board. As mentioned I had serious noise problems which turned out to be caused by long wires. This is quite surprising since most sources recommend wiring ESP board outside of the main board which forces you to use longer wires...
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Robertcop84
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Robertcop84 »

webhdx wrote:The wiki mentioned removing the cap or better replacing it with electrolytic one (ref. https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... 50-or-2017). I haven't noticed any issues on my setup, in worst case I will just remove the cap completely :) GBS boards are designed terribly and there are many issues. I also noticed you can get different results from board to board. As mentioned I had very noise problems which turned out to be caused by long wires. This is quite surprising since most sources recommend wiring ESP board outside of the main board which forces you to use longer wires...
I just got me a new 4.0 board because it is documented so well, I did everything mod wise to my old one and it just died one day.
I only can recommend someone come up with a good cheap power delivery bypass for the people who already did the whole diy thing to have a baseline for them.
Or on the other hand respin the entire pcb to fix everything that is wrong with it. AIOs and mods will not fix it completely, we can not fix up the messed up pcb.


Btw I just noticed that the V5.1 board you got looks like a V3.0 board with the power stage just re-arranged. In that case you should re-confirm where the negative actually is.
It looks like it is the same on first glance but from staring at the pictures side by side for 10 minutes I noticed that the c11 is connected to the collector of the npn transistor now, where it was clearly separated before.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

I actually may have broken my GBS-C setup. Hard to say. It's stuck with a red circle on it and I cannot do anything to get rid of it. I think I may try updating the software on it to reset it, and because there were some big updates I have yet to update to. I'll see if that works. If not, I may find myself build a new one soon. If I have to, I'm probably going to go for one of the models with a built in HDMI output so that I can 3D print a shell to contain everything and not have to run a USB cable to it just to power a VGA to HDMI adapter. I just wish they could use YPbPr. But I guess an unmodified GBS-C does YPbPr. I may just g Retrotink for YPbPr, composite, and S Video and just use the GBS-C for VGA and RGB.
Last edited by ulfrinn on Mon May 24, 2021 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

Robertcop84 wrote:
webhdx wrote:The wiki mentioned removing the cap or better replacing it with electrolytic one (ref. https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... 50-or-2017). I haven't noticed any issues on my setup, in worst case I will just remove the cap completely :) GBS boards are designed terribly and there are many issues. I also noticed you can get different results from board to board. As mentioned I had very noise problems which turned out to be caused by long wires. This is quite surprising since most sources recommend wiring ESP board outside of the main board which forces you to use longer wires...
I just got me a new 4.0 board because it is documented so well, I did everything mod wise to my old one and it just died one day.
I only can recommend someone come up with a good cheap power delivery bypass for the people who already did the whole diy thing to have a baseline for them.
Or on the other hand respin the entire pcb to fix everything that is wrong with it. AIOs and mods will not fix it completely, we can not fix up the messed up pcb.


Btw I just noticed that the V5.1 board you got looks like a V3.0 board with the power stage just re-arranged. In that case you should re-confirm where the negative actually is.
It looks like it is the same on first glance but from staring at the pictures side by side for 10 minutes I noticed that the c11 is connected to the collector of the npn transistor now, where it was clearly separated before.
C11 is always continuous with the npn. I always solder the repalcement's leg directly to it. Easier landing than the original pad. :)

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Last edited by NoAffinity on Tue May 25, 2021 3:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

I got my device working again. It turns out the issue was with the VGA to HDMI adapter. As cheap as the HDMI board and another D1 Mini would be, unless there's a good reason to avoid either of the two HDMI boards available, I'm probably going to pick one up for the convenience.

Of the other issue with the scaling of the output of the GBS, the 1280x960 option, like most of the others, results in an almost 16:9 image, with a boarder around it. It's definitely not 4:3.
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

ulfrinn wrote:Of the other issue with the scaling of the output of the GBS, the 1280x960 option, like most of the others, results in an almost 16:9 image, with a boarder around it. It's definitely not 4:3.
The signal output may be 16:9, but the displayed game picture will be the correct 4:3 AR.
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Robertcop84
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Robertcop84 »

NoAffinity wrote:
Robertcop84 wrote:
webhdx wrote:The wiki mentioned removing the cap or better replacing it with electrolytic one (ref. https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... 50-or-2017). I haven't noticed any issues on my setup, in worst case I will just remove the cap completely :) GBS boards are designed terribly and there are many issues. I also noticed you can get different results from board to board. As mentioned I had very noise problems which turned out to be caused by long wires. This is quite surprising since most sources recommend wiring ESP board outside of the main board which forces you to use longer wires...
I just got me a new 4.0 board because it is documented so well, I did everything mod wise to my old one and it just died one day.
I only can recommend someone come up with a good cheap power delivery bypass for the people who already did the whole diy thing to have a baseline for them.
Or on the other hand respin the entire pcb to fix everything that is wrong with it. AIOs and mods will not fix it completely, we can not fix up the messed up pcb.


Btw I just noticed that the V5.1 board you got looks like a V3.0 board with the power stage just re-arranged. In that case you should re-confirm where the negative actually is.
It looks like it is the same on first glance but from staring at the pictures side by side for 10 minutes I noticed that the c11 is connected to the collector of the npn transistor now, where it was clearly separated before.
C11 is always continuous with the non. I always solder the repalcement's leg directly to it. Easier landing than the original pad. :)

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You are correct about that, I just measured that part on the V4 pcb. I just wish someone would take the time and kind of update the wiki or a pinned post in this thread with these findings.
Most of the mods are unpractical how they are described. Nobody should solder anything to the legs of the controller chip for example. Or In that case try to solder a through hole capacitor onto these tiny pads.

But my point still stands, I question that lowering the esr with a electrolytic is actually helpful. Dry capacitors are first choice for high frequency circuits as far as I know, since they are less prone to become self resonating (please correct me if I'm wrong here. I just had a apprenticeship).
I am quite sure that It was chosen because It's a easy and cheap swap this way. The capacitance limit on dry capacitors that fit there might have inspired the choice. The parts on the board are trash, there is no question about it, so it might have helped in some circumstances.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

fernan1234 wrote:
ulfrinn wrote:Of the other issue with the scaling of the output of the GBS, the 1280x960 option, like most of the others, results in an almost 16:9 image, with a boarder around it. It's definitely not 4:3.
The signal output may be 16:9, but the displayed game picture will be the correct 4:3 AR.
That's irrelevant. The fact is I am receiving a 16:9 image. I wish there was an easy way to receive a 4:3 image with black bars without having to manually adjust the size of the picture.
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

ulfrinn wrote:That's irrelevant. The fact is I am receiving a 16:9 image. I wish there was an easy way to receive a 4:3 image with black bars without having to manually adjust the size of the picture.
I'm not sure what you mean, because what you are saying that you want is exactly what you are supposed to get on your display without needing to adjust it, unless your display is doing some incorrect stretching or scaling. Maybe you can post a photo of what you are seeing on your display.
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

^seconding this. The 960p profile is 4:3. The 720p profile is 16:9. The 1080p is a 4:3 image on a 16:9 canvas. Not completely sure about the 480p profile, but I believe it is also 4:3. The 960p and 480p profiles work flawlessly on my vga crt. 1080p and 720p profiles work but the monitor is obviously reconciling them and they require a good amount of adjustment via the monitors osd, to get a good fit.

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ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

fernan1234 wrote:
ulfrinn wrote:That's irrelevant. The fact is I am receiving a 16:9 image. I wish there was an easy way to receive a 4:3 image with black bars without having to manually adjust the size of the picture.
I'm not sure what you mean, because what you are saying that you want is exactly what you are supposed to get on your display without needing to adjust it, unless your display is doing some incorrect stretching or scaling. Maybe you can post a photo of what you are seeing on your display.
There's no reason for a photo, everyone knows what stretched widescreen looks like. That is what I get through my monitor whether I use 1280x960 or 1280x720. Switching to 1080P seems to display a correct 4K integer upscaled image, but GBS-C becomes unresponsive in 1080P mode, and none of the settings can be adjusted.
Ryoandr
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Ryoandr »

ulfrinn wrote: There's no reason for a photo, everyone knows what stretched widescreen looks like. That is what I get through my monitor whether I use 1280x960 or 1280x720. Switching to 1080P seems to display a correct 4K integer upscaled image, but GBS-C becomes unresponsive in 1080P mode, and none of the settings can be adjusted.
1280x960 getting stretched is on your monitor then. Maybe you have an aspect ratio setting to correct it.
Also, if the GBS is not responsive try changing the Wifi Channel to the highest (13), has to be done before compiling and uploading.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

Ryoandr wrote:
ulfrinn wrote: There's no reason for a photo, everyone knows what stretched widescreen looks like. That is what I get through my monitor whether I use 1280x960 or 1280x720. Switching to 1080P seems to display a correct 4K integer upscaled image, but GBS-C becomes unresponsive in 1080P mode, and none of the settings can be adjusted.
1280x960 getting stretched is on your monitor then. Maybe you have an aspect ratio setting to correct it.
Also, if the GBS is not responsive try changing the Wifi Channel to the highest (13), has to be done before compiling and uploading.
Odd though, I switched to the 960 preset and it was stretched as normal, but went to the development tab and clicked "invert sync" and it resized it to what appears to be a perfect 4:3. If I screenshot this and measured it it'd be very close to 1440x1080, so not doing an integer scale but at least maintaining aspect.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

Here's what it looks like just normally clicking the preset on the bottom, and if I click "invert sync" shown at the top. This is with the 960 setting. Nothing I click can fix the 720P option. All that stops the top image from being perfect now is it's slightly off-center, not a big deal.

Edit: I just spent about an hour testing Yoshi's Island using the frame lock setting, and wasn't losing the signal like I was before. And the issue I had yesterday where I spent an hour trying to get a picture through was almost certainly due to the VGA to HDMI adapter. It seems like all my issues with the GBS-C are fixed, I may get a different VGA to HDMI adapter, but for $25, I may just get the HDMI board. Most the YPbPr consoles I have could probably output RGB or VGA instead anyway.

Image
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Cant you just use the GBS-C controls to move the image that is off center to the center?
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

^Yeah that should be possible. I'm guessing that centering is also affected by the ADC used. With the OSSC as my ADC, I've always gotten a centered picture by default across multiple sources.

And as said before, 720p is always 16:9, it can't be changed by any setting. I suppose it's good to have for 16:9 games when adjustment is not available on the display.
ulfrinn
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by ulfrinn »

Josh128 wrote:Cant you just use the GBS-C controls to move the image that is off center to the center?
Yeah, I fed the image into OBS through my capture device, OBS has a 1920x1080 canvas so I trimmed 240 pixels off each side of the source and used the HS left/right on the development tab to get it perfectly centered. That was the very easy part.

I'm glad it all seems to be working now, I may need to get a new VGA to HDMI adapter, or just pick up the HDMI version of the board which may be better anyway.
Kaixe Rho
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Kaixe Rho »

Hey.

I was messing around with the retrotink mini, which I have to supplement that the GBS-C does not support S-Video or component, and I have run into the problem: I am spoiled by how the GBS-C's resolution switching is near instantaneous.

It's not all that often, but some N64 games (Resident Evil 2, Majoras' mask, etc) switch resolutions frequently. Buying expensive cables and RGB modding my N64 is not a solution I want.

Is there any transcoder that anyone has tried that will work? Other than the Koryuu transcoder, of course. This device would be perfect if I could just plug in S-Video into it...
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

Kaixe Rho wrote:It's not all that often, but some N64 games (Resident Evil 2, Majoras' mask, etc) switch resolutions frequently. Buying expensive cables and RGB modding my N64 is not a solution I want.
Does the 2X mini have a passthrough mode, or is that only on the 2X-Classic and 2X-Pro? I imagine that setting it to passthrough mode and putting a DAC in between the TINK and the GBS-C would likely work well to avoid this problem.
Kaixe Rho
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Kaixe Rho »

fernan1234 wrote:
Kaixe Rho wrote:It's not all that often, but some N64 games (Resident Evil 2, Majoras' mask, etc) switch resolutions frequently. Buying expensive cables and RGB modding my N64 is not a solution I want.
Does the 2X mini have a passthrough mode, or is that only on the 2X-Classic and 2X-Pro? I imagine that setting it to passthrough mode and putting a DAC in between the TINK and the GBS-C would likely work well to avoid this problem.
It turns out...it does. And by that I mean as a firmware update that was released right after I got mine, whoops. I *really* wish I had known that this whole time.

Anyway, about this. The tink mini now has a pass through mode, which, when using an HDMI->VGA cable, allows it to feed into the GBS control. Now, testing with the bombers notebook in Majora's mask, it's not playing that nicely. It works for the most part, but sometimes it loses signal. Sometimes it works immediately. There are any number of factors which could be causing interference, so we'll see how I feel after more experience with it.
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

Kaixe Rho wrote:Anyway, about this. The tink mini now has a pass through mode, which, when using an HDMI->VGA cable, allows it to feed into the GBS control. Now, testing with the bombers notebook in Majora's mask, it's not playing that nicely. It works for the most part, but sometimes it loses signal. Sometimes it works immediately. There are any number of factors which could be causing interference, so we'll see how I feel after more experience with it.
Something that may be worth trying is combining the sync from the RGBHV output of the HDMI->VGA cable into RGBS, since I've read that the GBS-C works better with the latter (though I haven't had issues with a Dreamcast outputting 15khz RGBHV).
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kitty666cats
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by kitty666cats »

fernan1234 wrote:
Kaixe Rho wrote:Anyway, about this. The tink mini now has a pass through mode, which, when using an HDMI->VGA cable, allows it to feed into the GBS control. Now, testing with the bombers notebook in Majora's mask, it's not playing that nicely. It works for the most part, but sometimes it loses signal. Sometimes it works immediately. There are any number of factors which could be causing interference, so we'll see how I feel after more experience with it.
Something that may be worth trying is combining the sync from the RGBHV output of the HDMI->VGA cable into RGBS, since I've read that the GBS-C works better with the latter (though I haven't had issues with a Dreamcast outputting 15khz RGBHV).
It works exponentially better with RGBS - as a matter of fact, I don’t recommend ever feeding it RGBHV whether upscaling or downscaling
Kaixe Rho
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Kaixe Rho »

fernan1234 wrote:combining the sync from the RGBHV output of the HDMI->VGA cable into RGBS
kitty666cats wrote:It works exponentially better with RGBS - as a matter of fact, I don’t recommend ever feeding it RGBHV whether upscaling or downscaling
I will be honest at expense of looking like an idiot: I have next to no idea what you all are talking about.
I know that RGBHV is either the same as or is often synonymous with the VGA format, and RGBS...has sync, I think. How do I input RGBS into this from the tink mini, which outputs a digital HDMI image?
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

Kaixe Rho wrote: I will be honest at expense of looking like an idiot: I have next to no idea what you all are talking about.
I know that RGBHV is either the same as or is often synonymous with the VGA format, and RGBS...has sync, I think. How do I input RGBS into this from the tink mini, which outputs a digital HDMI image?
We meant RGBS on the input to the GBS-C, not into the 2X. Your chain currently is:

console's analogue output -> 2X mini -> digital output (HDMI) -> DAC -> analogue RGBHV output -> GBS-C

You can try adding a sync combiner such as any cheap Extron RGB interface unit, to get RGBS from the RGBHV output of your DAC. So your chain would then be:

console's analogue output -> 2X mini -> digital output (HDMI) -> DAC -> analogue RGBHV output -> Sync combiner -> analogue RGBS output -> GBS-C

This is not guaranteed to fix your problem, but it is worth a try if other things fail to make a difference.
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

If the tink is tripping up on the resolution switching, then wouldnt it matter not what comes after it? The tink could still be tripping up on the switch, regardless if its passing through.

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Kaixe Rho
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Kaixe Rho »

fernan1234 wrote:You can try adding a sync combiner such as any cheap Extron RGB interface unit, to get RGBS from the RGBHV output of your DAC[...]

analogue RGBHV output -> Sync combiner -> analogue RGBS output -> GBS-C
Alright, thanks. I think I see now, but how in the world do I connect RGBS to the GBSC, actually? Doesn't RGBS usually take the form of either SCART or Bnc cables with R-G-B-Sync as four separate connectors? There's only the three Y Pb Pr RCA connectors on the GBS that I have.
NoAffinity wrote:The tink could still be tripping up on the switch
It's entirely possible, but I am getting entirely different results between pass through mode and line2x mode.
There is, universally, something like a 2 second gap of black screen with resolution switching through the line2x mode on the tink. On the other hand, in pass-through to the GBSC, I am getting one of three results:
1. (Most common) Instantaneous transition to correct image
2. Serious screen tear while it tries to load the 480i image for approximately 1 second then corrects itself
3. (rarely) complete lost signal, screen goes black, everything has to resync with each other.

If I exit in and out of 480i menus relatively rapidly I can force 2 and 3 to happen pretty much instantly. I don't know if it's one of my cables, the n64 itself, the VGA input, any number of factors. Maybe it's that I still don't have the clock gen board installed, who knows.

I should note, for example, with Majora's Mask - this hiccup only happens in transitioning TO the 480i menu (the bombers notebook). Transitioning back universally doesn't even have any slight screen errors like the case 1 above, just as fast but perfectly clean.
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