GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

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BMF54123
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by BMF54123 »

Josh128 wrote:What are you capturing the output of the GBS with? Are you coming out VGA or HDMI and if HDMI, what kind of vga to hdmi ADC are you using?
I used an OSSC to capture all three examples (the first two from the GBS 8200 via VGA, the last one directly from the OSSC's RGB SCART input).

I'm starting to think it might just be an issue with this fat PS2's RGB output, because I'm not seeing the same smearing from a Mega Drive. Kinda weird that it's so much less prominent when connected directly to the OSSC, though. I'll see if I can scrounge up a later model PS2 to test or something.
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TABYDACAT
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by TABYDACAT »

TABYDACAT wrote:
TABYDACAT wrote:
I'm terribly sorry for the long duration between replies for this. I have made a quick guide to get this up and running (there's probably typos lol). Even though its pretty simple to get everything connected, I wanted the guide to be somewhat detailed. If there's anything that needs to be addressed and that isn't in the guide already, please let me know. Can't wait to see this running in others setups!

Guide:
Spoiler
For those interested, I'm currently working on transferring and trimming this code to the new release of GBS-C. I've also been working on converting new fonts for the OLED to closely match the style of the new UI. Thanks for reading and hopefully some users can have some fun with customizing their GBS further. The link should still work in case anyone wants to test out that release beta which still has the original UI.
Just an update: fonts and new boot logo has been implemented. Transferred most of the old code while cleaning up what I had before. I've now been experimenting with the method of selection by replacing the push buttons with an encoder. This means nested menus and easier navigation for selection. However, anyone that has tinkered with encoders may know their inconsistent behavior. They require a bit more work to debounce and clean their signals compared to other input devices imo. All this is super introductory and in the "troubleshooting, but getting there" stage. Who knows, I may have to scrap this idea and go with the old method. I just think the encoder is awesome and fun to attempt so I hope I can figure it out. Photo shows sample code which emulates cycling and selecting your preset with the encoder just to give a rough idea.

Also, I completely forgot, if you are going to attempt an OLED setup currently with the old code (which is rough lol) install the SSD1306 library by ThingPulse. You can find it on their github and install manually or via the Arduino library manager (Tools > Manage Libraries > Search for "ESP8266 and ESP32 OLED Driver for SSD1306 display").

Thanks for reading, sorry for the long post, and hopefully my schedule calms soon so I can release this soon
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Really cool stuff man! Keep at it till you get it. The more development and interest in this project the better.
Kaixe Rho
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Kaixe Rho »

Josh128 wrote:Just set your monitors horizontal width control to its max
Embarassed to say I hadn't considered that, just adjusting on the GBS end. Well, now that works better than the other use case.
fernan1234 wrote:720x480 is 480p, i.e. the EDTV standard. 640x480 is a VESA/Computer display standard. Use cases for 480p include EDTV-compatible TVs/displays, as well as video processors and modern TVs
Thanks for the response, totally forgot to check back. The reason I'm curious is because, say, I have a 480p plasma EDTV that I use for my 6th gen consoles. Most of the time, there is no issue, but every once in a while I plug in my PS2 -> GBS-C -> EDTV.
Now, when most games are plugged directly into the TV,
They fill the whole image in 4:3 mode. When I use the 480p mode on the GBS-C, I get somewhat less horizontal space due to, well, the image has the black bars on the side.
Unlike the VGA monitor, I am not able to adjust screen size on my tv.

Now, this is not a problem in practice. I set the tv to stretch mode and then squeeze the image inward until it's standard 4:3 sizing, and then save that as a custom profile.

My question was just because it definitely didn't feel like I was using it the right way. For a TV that has a max resolution of 480p, I assumed the 480p output from the GBS-C would work without any modifications whatsoever, which brought me back here.

Next I'll have to collect evidence so I can ask about the "pass through color problems" I'll have to detail in another post I suppose
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Kaixe Rho wrote:
Josh128 wrote:Just set your monitors horizontal width control to its max
Embarassed to say I hadn't considered that, just adjusting on the GBS end. Well, now that works better than the other use case.
No problem man, after I posted it I thought "maybe this is not on VGA CRT". Good to see it was indeed and I reminded you about it!

Im currently looking to pop a 1/8" stereo audio output jack in my GBSC unit, and was looking to retrofit a VGA>HDMI converter to make use of the HDMI cut out on the 3d printed box I have as well, but I just dont think theres room for that. The converter will likely just have to be used externally.
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BMF54123
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by BMF54123 »

Has anyone else had the GBS Control web interface just stop working entirely after changing presets? I switched to 1280x960 to test a new VGA converter tonight, and from that point on I could no longer access any settings; it would either time out entirely or just show a white screen. It was still connected to the network, and I could still access the wifi settings page by manually entering http://[IP address]/wifi.htm, but nothing else worked until I erased and reflashed the firmware.

I'm slightly concerned because I also built one of these for a friend in another state, using identical parts, and they don't have the technical know-how to rebuild/reflash the firmware should the same thing happen to theirs...
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Ive never had that happen, though I did have the unit stop changing output response to web interface input commands. A simple power cycle brought it right back though.
kilauea
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by kilauea »

Been having lots of drop outs from wifi, bascially as soon as the source (ps2 via component) is turned on the wifi goes. From reading other threads the big heatsink'd asic is the culprint - I can reliably turn wifi on and off by placing a metal rasperry pi case ontop of the sink as a shield!

I'm going to make a case with a metal shield seperating the esp8266 and the gbs8200.
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Gollot
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gollot »

Can you hook up a PC with VGA to a Component CRT TV with GBS-Control? How would that work?
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

Gollot wrote:Can you hook up a PC with VGA to a Component CRT TV with GBS-Control? How would that work?
Yes. You need to add a resistor on the output, as detailed in post #1 (and I refined the math a bit further, a couple pages back). you then need to get a simple passive vga to component cable. Lastly, set gbsc to ypbpr output in the web ui.

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atohmdiy
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by atohmdiy »

Hello,
A quick question, i haven't time to dig it much and didn't found info.

In the next week i will probably buy a iiyama pro 454 vga crt for cheap. I remember the good old day of vga monitor and their 60 hz that made my eyes bleed. Funny thing i also owned a iiyama vision master crt back in the day, but not a high end like the pro 454.
I know i can run a pc at 120hz easily, so no problem.
For my Mister it's a little bit tricky as i use it in direct video mode, there is an option (forced_scandoubler=1) that is suppose to made it compatible with 31khz... it's silly but i don't know if it will convert the 240p source to 640x480x60hz or if it will do 320x240x120hz. I hope it's the second solution, i like scanline and i like to stay away from epilepsy.

Anyway, i also own a switch that i use with the 240p downscale function of the gbs (i own a bvm 20f1e), but i am not that found of it, it is working but many games have problem when downscaned, so if would prefer run them in 480p. Problem, even if i can use the switch directly through a dac, as i said the 60hz will be too hard for me. Can the gbs convert the 480p from the switch to 120 hz ?
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

atohmdiy wrote:Hello,
A quick question, i haven't time to dig it much and didn't found info.

In the next week i will probably buy a iiyama pro 454 vga crt for cheap. I remember the good old day of vga monitor and their 60 hz that made my eyes bleed. Funny thing i also owned a iiyama vision master crt back in the day, but not a high end like the pro 454.
I know i can run a pc at 120hz easily, so no problem.
For my Mister it's a little bit tricky as i use it in direct video mode, there is an option (forced_scandoubler=1) that is suppose to made it compatible with 31khz... it's silly but i don't know if it will convert the 240p source to 640x480x60hz or if it will do 320x240x120hz. I hope it's the second solution, i like scanline and i like to stay away from epilepsy.

Anyway, i also own a switch that i use with the 240p downscale function of the gbs (i own a bvm 20f1e), but i am not that found of it, it is working but many games have problem when downscaned, so if would prefer run them in 480p. Problem, even if i can use the switch directly through a dac, as i said the 60hz will be too hard for me. Can the gbs convert the 480p from the switch to 120 hz ?
You do realize that every single CRT that every console from Atari VCS to Gamecube was originally designed for and played on was either 50 or 60 Hz right? They had the same flicker as any and all VGA CRTs have at 60Hz. I'll admit, Windows, with its many bright and white screens, a CRT at 60Hz is definitely annoying-- but most games on consoles really dont have any issue. They look identical to the way they do on a Trinitron in that regard. There is no appreciable difference in phosphor luminance decay times in "modern" (mid 90's on up) CRT TVs and monitors.

In any case, no, the GBS is currently not capable of scan doubling to 240p120 31KHz. I contacted the main developer, Rama, on Twitter and this was his response:
might be doable, if I had a lot of time to research it!
Last edited by Josh128 on Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:16 am, edited 3 times in total.
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

atohmdiy wrote:For my Mister it's a little bit tricky as i use it in direct video mode, there is an option (forced_scandoubler=1) that is suppose to made it compatible with 31khz... it's silly but i don't know if it will convert the 240p source to 640x480x60hz or if it will do 320x240x120hz. I hope it's the second solution, i like scanline and i like to stay away from epilepsy.
It will be 640x480@60hz. But you can try using these custom video mode settings to get "240p" (well, 224p to be more precise) @120hz on your PC CRT:

forced_scandoubler=0
vga_scaler=1
vsync_adjust=0
video_mode=1280,32,128,160,224,1,3,13,46270
custom_aspect_ratio_1=1280:224
SuperSpongo
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by SuperSpongo »

fernan1234 wrote:
vsync_adjust=0
But one thing to consider, this will produce 2 frames of lag, if my info is still up-to-date.
atohmdiy
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by atohmdiy »

Josh128 wrote:
atohmdiy wrote:Hello,
A quick question, i haven't time to dig it much and didn't found info.

In the next week i will probably buy a iiyama pro 454 vga crt for cheap. I remember the good old day of vga monitor and their 60 hz that made my eyes bleed. Funny thing i also owned a iiyama vision master crt back in the day, but not a high end like the pro 454.
I know i can run a pc at 120hz easily, so no problem.
For my Mister it's a little bit tricky as i use it in direct video mode, there is an option (forced_scandoubler=1) that is suppose to made it compatible with 31khz... it's silly but i don't know if it will convert the 240p source to 640x480x60hz or if it will do 320x240x120hz. I hope it's the second solution, i like scanline and i like to stay away from epilepsy.

Anyway, i also own a switch that i use with the 240p downscale function of the gbs (i own a bvm 20f1e), but i am not that found of it, it is working but many games have problem when downscaned, so if would prefer run them in 480p. Problem, even if i can use the switch directly through a dac, as i said the 60hz will be too hard for me. Can the gbs convert the 480p from the switch to 120 hz ?
You do realize that every single CRT that every console from Atari VCS to Gamecube was originally designed for and played on was either 50 or 60 Hz right? They had the same flicker as any and all VGA CRTs have at 60Hz. I'll admit, Windows, with its many bright and white screens, a CRT at 60Hz is definitely annoying-- but most games on consoles really dont have any issue. They look identical to the way they do on a Trinitron in that regard. There is no appreciable difference in phosphor luminance decay times in "modern" (mid 90's on up) CRT TVs and monitors.

In any case, no, the GBS is currently not capable of scan doubling to 240p120 31KHz. I contacted the main developer, Rama, on Twitter and this was his response:
might be doable, if I had a lot of time to research it!
I don't agree at all. VGA crt have short phophorus, they are build this way to increase the refresh rate. 60hz on a vga crt and you will burn your eyes, period. During the day i saw a lot of vga crt and the first thing i did every time was going on windows graphics option to increase the refresh rate as the 60hz was horrible. BVM, PVM and so on have long phosphorus, they are built to stay at 60hz and only 60hz without horrible glitter. I own a 20f1e and even if they are 60 hz they don't burn my eyes, in vga crt equivalent you need to set it at at least 85hz to have the same image.
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

I have a Canon DSLR cam with a high shutter speed . I'll take some photos of the scanning beam @ 60fps on a 17" VGA, a circa 2000 20" Symphonic/Funai consumer shadow mask TV, and a 2003 36" Trinitron Wega. We will be able to put this to rest very easily by looking in detail at the length of the persistence.
fernan1234
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by fernan1234 »

atohmdiy wrote:I don't agree at all. VGA crt have short phophorus, they are build this way to increase the refresh rate. 60hz on a vga crt and you will burn your eyes, period. During the day i saw a lot of vga crt and the first thing i did every time was going on windows graphics option to increase the refresh rate as the 60hz was horrible. BVM, PVM and so on have long phosphorus, they are built to stay at 60hz and only 60hz without horrible glitter. I own a 20f1e and even if they are 60 hz they don't burn my eyes, in vga crt equivalent you need to set it at at least 85hz to have the same image.
Weren't the Sony pro monitors advertised as having the very best phosphors for both color accuracy and duration, resulting in the lowest amount of blooming? I also always thought that the bad reputation of 60Hz on PC CRTs was that the monitors were not being used to watch video, but often staring from a short distance at small text and other work tasks, also often in an office environment with fluorescent ambient light to make things worse.

Josh128 wrote:I have a Canon DSLR cam with a high shutter speed . I'll take some photos of the scanning beam @ 60fps on a 17" VGA, a circa 2000 20" Symphonic/Funai consumer shadow mask TV, and a 2003 36" Trinitron Wega. We will be able to put this to rest very easily by looking in detail at the length of the persistence.
It would be nice to see this slow-mo footage, even if only for the aesthetics of it.
atohmdiy
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by atohmdiy »

fernan1234 wrote:
atohmdiy wrote:For my Mister it's a little bit tricky as i use it in direct video mode, there is an option (forced_scandoubler=1) that is suppose to made it compatible with 31khz... it's silly but i don't know if it will convert the 240p source to 640x480x60hz or if it will do 320x240x120hz. I hope it's the second solution, i like scanline and i like to stay away from epilepsy.
It will be 640x480@60hz. But you can try using these custom video mode settings to get "240p" (well, 224p to be more precise) @120hz on your PC CRT:

forced_scandoubler=0
vga_scaler=1
vsync_adjust=0
video_mode=1280,32,128,160,224,1,3,13,46270
custom_aspect_ratio_1=1280:224
Thank you, that's what i thought. It's a little bit of a shame to have to use the scaler to double the frequency, i think i will open a discussion about this in the mister forum.
Josh128 wrote:I have a Canon DSLR cam with a high shutter speed . I'll take some photos of the scanning beam @ 60fps on a 17" VGA, a circa 2000 20" Symphonic/Funai consumer shadow mask TV, and a 2003 36" Trinitron Wega. We will be able to put this to rest very easily by looking in detail at the length of the persistence.
Well do it, but i know what i remember. My 20f1e really have no "shutter", i only see it in full white screen. With my old school iiyama vision master that i had back in the day and keep several years, and in all crt vga i saw back then, 60hz were horrible. I will compare it again when i get the pro 454.

I will of course try my switch on the 454, we will see if the 60hz make my eyes bleed.
atohmdiy
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by atohmdiy »

Another question.
Some times ago i ordered a second gbs 8200. I receive it and start moding it with the wifi controler and si 5351 board, plus the cap mods.
I made a stupid mistake and pull too hard on a pin of the big IC with heatsink. This pin is suppose to be connected to the middle solder pad of "CLK 0" pin, so i guess it's the IC clock input. The pin is cut very short, i cannot solder anything anymore to it, so i guess this board cannot be used with the si5351 board now. As i have to the reference of the Ic with the heatsink, i couldn't check if there is another input pin somewhere else to connect the si 5351 board.
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

I dont think the latest revs of the 8200 require the cap mods anymore. As far as the clock leg of the transcoder chip, you are not even supposed to lift the leg for the clock pin. You just solder right to it and go to the center pin of clock 0 on the Si5351 board. You are probably screwed unless you can maybe scratch or grind away a bit of the black phenolic coating on the chip to expose a bit more of the leg. If you can just solder tack a tiny wire to it, you may be able to salvage it.

Without the Transcoders PCLKIN leg connected to anything at all on the PCB, will it even function? If it does, consider yourself lucky. If not, you may have a brick.

Regarding the 60Hz CRT thing, hey, I could be wrong there, but I really dont think I am. Ive been playing with this GBS on a 17" CRT and with all the Genesis games Ive tested, the flicker is basically unnoticeable / no difference vs my Wega. However, I can easily discern the flicker differences between the different refresh rates (60, 75, or 85 Hz) when running Windows on it. I think this is mostly due to the bright white windows and solid colors present in OS's like Windows which are uncommon in most games. But if Im wrong, I have no problem admitting it-- Im truly curious and thats why Im going to do the test. Its fairly easy to set up.
Last edited by Josh128 on Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
3rdman
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by 3rdman »

I've been lurking this amazing forum for ages. So much so that I assumed that I had an account when I wanted to make a post!

In any case, first post...Greetings and salutations to all!

I recently bought a GBS Control unit with the hacked firmware and it seems to work fine but for the reason I bought it for which is to connect my X68K to my monitor. The GBS recognizes the horizontal and vertical sync but the blue led on the unit which illuminates on sync never comes on and the feedback from the unit simply states "reset". It then goes into a loop of finding sync - resetting - finding sync - etc...

I've read about "some" of these scalers not handling H and V sync well and I should combine the sync lines. I've seen schematics and devices that will do this but I would prefer a pre-built solution as I am not great at building circuits.

Any suggestion is great appreciated. Thanks again!
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

The gbs will function without that pin connected, but obviously not with the clock gen.

Use lots of flux and a steady hand. If theres even a microscopic bit of metal still exposed from the pin, it doesn take much for the metallurgic bond to occur and stay solid.



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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Did the VGA vs flat tube consumer CRT phosphor persistence test. Virtually identical. The consumer TV has a brighter scan due to it actually being a 15KHz set, while the Compaq is at 31KHz w/faux scanlines.
I'd say this is very strong evidence that the idea that VGA CRTs had less phosphor light persistence is wrong.

Full Size: https://imgur.com/EyB1JqG

Image
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maxtherabbit
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by maxtherabbit »

Josh128 wrote:Did the VGA vs flat tube consumer CRT phosphor persistence test. Virtually identical. The consumer TV has a brighter scan due to it actually being a 15KHz set, while the Compaq is at 31KHz w/faux scanlines.
I'd say this is very strong evidence that the idea that VGA CRTs had less phosphor light persistence is wrong.

Full Size: https://imgur.com/EyB1JqG

Image
thank you for dispelling that nonsense
edd247
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by edd247 »

Hello, I recently tried installing the clock generator and have not been able to get it working. I have double checked the wiring with a multimeter and everything seems correct. I have not replaced any capacitors on the board and I didn't think it was necessary for the clock generator, correct me if I'm wrong. When I go to settings and activate FTL I do not see the message about Active FrameTime Lock not necessary. I am powering from a 2a 5v power supply. Below are pictures of my install. Please let me know what else I can do to get it working. Thanks!
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Josh128
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Josh128 »

Looking at your pictures, I dont see any obvious wiring issues. Are you sure you are getting the proper DC voltage where its needed? Check with a DMM with it powered up to make sure you are.

I didnt remove anything on my unit except for the RGB adjustment pots, just like you. Are you seeing tearing on screen when gaming? Also, are you using the new software just released a couple weeks ago or the original. Im on the original.
edd247
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by edd247 »

Josh128 wrote:Looking at your pictures, I dont see any obvious wiring issues. Are you sure you are getting the proper DC voltage where its needed? Check with a DMM with it powered up to make sure you are.

I didnt remove anything on my unit except for the RGB adjustment pots, just like you. Are you seeing tearing on screen when gaming? Also, are you using the new software just released a couple weeks ago or the original. Im on the original.
I checked and I'm getting proper voltage. Checked the clock gen board and it's getting 3.3v. I see tearing once and a while, nothing too bad. I am using the newest software version. I'll try the original and see if that makes a difference
twotone8
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by twotone8 »

I've been toying with the GBS-C AIO for the past several weeks and I'm really enjoying it.

Is there any way to get it to accept Component input through the VGA input port?

I'm using the passthrough from my PVM to feed directly to the GBS-C by way of a BNC to VGA cable, and it works great for streaming RGBs sources. Every once in a while I'd like to hook up the Wii as well over component without having to switch too many cables around.

I'm sure I could scrounge up some sort of VGA to Component cable and connect it to the Component inputs of the GBS-C, but as it's the same signals, I'm wondering if there's any sort of command I could feed the GBS-C over the web interface to interpret the incoming signal from the VGA port as Component so the picture doesn't come out all Green.

Current setup:
Console-->
SCART to BNC cable-->
PVM w/ passthrough-->
BNC to VGA cable-->
GBS-C to HDMI-->
Capture device.

With this setup, I can just swap out the Console at the 'SCART to BNC' cable level and everything works dandy for playing/streaming.
For Wii, I use a simple cheap Component to SCART adapter and configure the PVM to accept component. It works just fine and passes the signals through the passthrough ports. If I swapped the output from BNC to VGA to just regular old Component cables and fed it through the Component input on the GBS-C it would work fine as well, but If there's a simple way to tell the GBS-C to treat the incoming signal for what it is, that might be nice.

Thanks.
edd247
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by edd247 »

twotone8 wrote:Is there any way to get it to accept Component input through the VGA input port?
Yes, look for the option in the settings menu that says:
"RGBHV/Component Toggle"
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by twotone8 »

edd247 wrote:
twotone8 wrote:Is there any way to get it to accept Component input through the VGA input port?
Yes, look for the option in the settings menu that says:
"RGBHV/Component Toggle"
Thanks! I just tried that. It looks like that option is only for output, so clicking it just breaks the HDMI output entirely (as opposed to it just looking like a green tinted version of the Wii output).

I'm hoping there's a similar option for the VGA input port to be able to accept a component signal over those VGA pins.
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