E3 Discussion Thread

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Tue May 09, 2006 8:09 pm

600 euros, 400 uk pounds and the controller dosen't have diagonals............. why not?

I would actually like ps2 controllers if they had diagonal direction parts in the dpad. Hmmm VF5 on ps3 only, looks Like I'll wait until it drops in price.

jp · Post by jp » Tue May 09, 2006 8:48 pm

My thoughts on the shindig:

Nintendo rocked the house. The Wii was interesting, but the DS completely stole the show. So many crazy DS announcements... wow!

I guess Microsoft still isn't finished? Still, having GTA4 as a time-exclusive (I know IGN is reporting it'll be coming to both at the same time, but how? The PS3 comes out a month later) is pretty big for MS. Halo 3... meh... its nice, but 07? OK, whatever.

I'm hoping MS has some more big guns. Come on Killer Instinct 3!!!!!

And Sony... God bless them. It has never been a better time to be a Sony hater. Not only is the PS3 a console built on stolen ideas, it also costs about as much as the 360 + a Wii.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:02 pm

jp wrote:My thoughts on the shindig:

Nintendo rocked the house. The Wii was interesting, but the DS completely stole the show. So many crazy DS announcements... wow!

I guess Microsoft still isn't finished? Still, having GTA4 as a time-exclusive (I know IGN is reporting it'll be coming to both at the same time, but how? The PS3 comes out a month later) is pretty big for MS. Halo 3... meh... its nice, but 07? OK, whatever.

I'm hoping MS has some more big guns. Come on Killer Instinct 3!!!!!

And Sony... God bless them. It has never been a better time to be a Sony hater. Not only is the PS3 a console built on stolen ideas, it also costs about as much as the 360 + a Wii.

Nintendo did well, but they still haven't given us a price for the Wii...it's E3, how much longer do they really need to wait?!

Also, no more information on old school downloads; thanks again Nintendo!

Microsoft's Press Conference is finished, but you can't watch it yet on Gamespot, unless you're a paid subscriber, which is dumb, considering that they let anyone watch the Sony and Nintendo Press Conferences.

And why did IGN strip all the gameplay footage out Square Enix's Press Conference?

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:23 pm

And a few thoughts on the MS presentation (note: I couldn't watch this one, I'm going off photos and liveblogs:)

As expected, there wasn't really anything earth-shattering to see here, but seeing as how they're nearly six months from release, that can be expected. There were some nice announcements for existing 360 owners though (Forza 2 and a first party wireless steering wheel, Lumines, Scramble and Time Pilot coming to XBLA, Halo 3) and from what I've been hearing Lost Planet should be a lot of fun too (I'll download and try out the demo tonight.) I'm also intrigued by the talk of X360/Windows Vista/Windows Mobile integration, especially the Windows Mobile part. I've felt the PPC has a lot of potential as a gaming platform if they could just get some major publishers on board, and this may be just what they need to do so. GTA4 I could personally care less about though (I have very few M-rated games in my collection, and generally don't care for overly violent games.)

After all three press events, here's how I'd grade them:

Sony: C (they really should have a whole lot more to show than they do for a platform being launched in six months, and their platform is far more reactionary than revolutionary. Not only that, but if Blu-Ray doesn't catch on, it could sink the whole thing with disastrous results. As I said earlier, this sounds suspiciously like it could turn into the New Coke of the console wars.)

Nintendo: A- (Very solid showing, but they glossed over the Virtual Console functionality, which has for some time been one of my main reasons for being interested in the platform. The Wii controllers really needed to be seen in action to understand how they work, and what they can do.)

Microsoft: B (Again, they had nothing earth-shattering to show, but they had plenty to keep the existing customer base interested. They leave a lot of questions though...)

Eps · Post by **Eps** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:45 pm

I think Nintendo definitely came out on top this time: they brought the cool games to go with the innovative hardware. Fantastic tennis game, that really cool looking FPS that I forget the name of, Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess Wii version, Pilotwings for the Wii, and of course -- the new flagship Super Mario game, which looks to be the long-awaited Mario 128, albeit with a different name. The speaker in the Wiimote is a very cool addition too -- and they managed to retain rumble

And there's a slew of excellent DS games coming out, such as a US version of Ouendan, Yoshi's Island 2, Star Fox DS (

) and a new DS Diddy Kong Racing. Plus, all their Wii games shown are playable during the course of E3, which earns major points from me. Slight loss of points for no Virtual Console or firm price, but they've stated a definite Q4 2006 as the launch time now, which is an improvement on previous information (or lack of). Overall, a very good showing indeed.

Microsoft didn't quite match Nintendo, mainly as they didn't really have much in the way of hardware. But their presentation was about as good as you could have possibly expected with it being mainly software -- there was a lot of really interesting looking game footage being shown - Halo 3 looks absolutely fantastic, and next-gen Shadowrun is looking EXTREMELY cool! Also, their use of Xbox Live so that people could actually download the game-engine trailers to their Xboxes and watch them at the same time E3 saw them was a fantastic addition. Unfortunately I didn't get to see as much of Microsoft's stuff as I wanted, but the 'unwanted intruder' into the console business might just be going the way of Microsoft mice instead of the way of Microsoft Windows 98.

Sony could have dropped the bomb, but instead they just dropped the ball. Stupidly overpriced hardware, target renders passing off as gameplay footage AGAIN, uninspiring upcoming games (what the hell happened to Tekken 6?!), crippleware if you don't get the expensive package, blatantly stealing ideas from both of their competitors... Sony could face problems after this showing. They go for two main markets, and if they're not careful, Microsoft are going to sew one of them up and Nintendo are going to dominate the other, leaving Sony as yet another games company that was a leader, became arrogant and then fell from grace.

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:56 pm

BTW, You can watch and download the Halo 3 Trailer here:

http://www.gamespot.com/e3/e3story.html ... ay=6149764

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Tue May 09, 2006 10:19 pm

ahnslaught wrote:This is some of the weirdest damage control I've ever heard of - Ken Kutaragi (the white suited Penguin lookalike in the press conference) saying $600 is probably too cheap a price:

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/706/706133p1.html

The world, according to Kutaragi.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue May 09, 2006 11:02 pm

Kutaragi is a moron.
Anyone remember this?

Similarly, I want my games machine to do one thing, and one thing only. Play games. I don't even buy CDs b/c there's nothing worth buying on CD, so that whole music thing is worthless to me. If it could download and make vinyl, that'd be another thing, but I doubt it will.

sethsez · Post by **sethsez** » Tue May 09, 2006 11:08 pm

By the way, I don't know if it's been mentioned but Nintendo is making Super Paper Mario, which looks to be a 2D (in gameplay, anyway) platformer for the Gamecube.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue May 09, 2006 11:19 pm

It's got it's own thread. So far, it has gotten me the most wood thusfar.

Bingo · Post by **Bingo** » Tue May 09, 2006 11:55 pm

Who knows, the splits Ken is doing over the gaming market and the home theater market might just cost him his manhood. And judging by his verbosity said tool must be of massive proportions. Instead they make a crippled package without HDMI, which makes the cheaper console non-futureproof wrt the use of the Blu-Ray drive you just paid for for protected movie content. I hear Ken's panties aching from overextension.

Glad to see Nintendo's rocking the house. Not because I'm a fan, because they impress with content in soft- and hardware, they're like the damn anti-thesis to empty promises. Only what people want, and then some, no bullshit, all real. For 200 dallah (or whatever), wii make you happy longtime. They make everyone else look like a bunch of self-important windbags.

There is still no game that makes me want to buy a 360 or PS3. The PS3 announcement feel depressingly same-old. 360 looks like they're trying at least. What does Sony envision the appeal of their machine to be? I'm not bashing, I'm serious. Status symbol? 5kg Penis extension (which is nice, but the gf won't like the shape)? Toy for the juvenile CEO of tomorrow? All I see is the cheapest BD player to market, but that's not relevant for this forum. Shit they can't be banking on that to win the gaming war, can they?

Alske · Post by **Alske** » Wed May 10, 2006 1:34 am

I thought the Nintendo conference was odd. Yes, the DS had a whole ton of great announcements (be sure to check out the gameplay videos on their Japanese website). But, we learned nothing important about Wii: no price, no release date, no virtual console information, no region compatibility information, no information about what kind of network it's going to be supporting. We got one good demo (Red Steel), one alright demo (tennis), and one terrible demo in which it looked like the presenter spent the whole time fighting with the controls (Zelda).

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Wed May 10, 2006 1:54 am

In Sony's defense, the PS2 launch was shit, at best. High price (at least in Japan), defective, and crappy games. Look what happened.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Wed May 10, 2006 2:00 am

Alske wrote:I thought the Nintendo conference was odd. Yes, the DS had a whole ton of great announcements (be sure to check out the gameplay videos on their Japanese website). But, we learned nothing important about Wii: no price, no release date, no virtual console information, no region compatibility information, no information about what kind of network it's going to be supporting. We got one good demo (Red Steel), one alright demo (tennis), and one terrible demo in which it looked like the presenter spent the whole time fighting with the controls (Zelda).

...and yet some call big N's presentation A material. Honestly, I was only amused by the DS stuff and Miyamoto's antics.

ahnslaught · Post by **ahnslaught** » Wed May 10, 2006 2:30 am

GaijinPunch wrote: Similarly, I want my games machine to do one thing, and one thing only. Play games. I don't even buy CDs b/c there's nothing worth buying on CD, so that whole music thing is worthless to me. If it could download and make vinyl, that'd be another thing, but I doubt it will.

Not to mention dvd playback, which I have never used in the ps2 or xbox. If I want to watch dvds, I'll buy a dvd player that doesn't have a wind tunnel working in the back, thank you very much.

Kinda changing the subject, but what are you guys' thoughts on online purchases ('microtransactions' - though I see nothing micro about it) of stuff for your games? MS and Sony seem to be pushing this thing pretty hard, while we don't know about Nintendo's strategy. I miss the old days where you bought a standalone game that works, period. The only exception where I would favor add on purchases is for stuff like that singing game they showed during the ps3 demo in order to keep the library of songs fresh, but for everything else, it's just another way to screw you out of additional dollars here and there. I just keep seeing the crazy complicated menu of warhawk where you can buy individual guns and missiles in my head.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Wed May 10, 2006 3:00 am

ahnslaught wrote:
Not to mention dvd playback, which I have never used in the ps2 or xbox. If I want to watch dvds, I'll buy a dvd player that doesn't have a wind tunnel working in the back, thank you very much.

Kinda changing the subject, but what are you guys' thoughts on online purchases ('microtransactions' - though I see nothing micro about it) of stuff for your games?

Greed. If publishers had it their way, you'd need to pay 50 cents for every red mushroom Mario needed to grow up on SMB.

VNAF Ace · Post by **VNAF Ace** » Wed May 10, 2006 5:33 am

That oughta give you another reason not to die...

icycalm · Post by **icycalm** » Wed May 10, 2006 7:46 am

GTAIV is not 360 exclusive. It will come out on PS3/360 on the same day. The 360 will just have exclusive downloadable episodic episodes or some shit.

Post by **system11** » Wed May 10, 2006 7:54 am

I'm not sold on the Revolution. If the games over-use the motion technology, that's going to be a machine for party games, and not gamers who sit down to play a game for an evening. Graphics ranged from good GC to horrendous crap (Tony Hawk) - I'm hoping for top tier GC style without frame loss, that shouldn't be much to ask.

However, what I really did like was that the Nintendo people appeared to care about trying to make a good product. There wasn't a ripe stench of marketing bullshit as present all the way through the Sony presentation. I can respect that, even if I don't buy their console.

Haven't seen the Microsoft bit - can't understand why gamespot weren't allowed to stream it. Come on Microsoft, you were doing so well with your approach to the Xbox, don't start acting like asses now.

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Wed May 10, 2006 8:20 am

Here's a huge list of upcoming DS releases, with (approximate) dates for most. A lot of these are who-cares titles, but some of the big ones are there as well with dates.

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/05/10/ds-me ... ht-2-more/

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Wed May 10, 2006 8:40 am

And some impressions on the new stuff I downloaded that showed up on XBL today (reposted from another board I frequent:)

With much patience (and other things to do while the stuff downloaded, I was able to grab a few of the new items from XBL tonight. Here's a few impressions:

-Lost Planet: The demo was quite enjoyable. I played through the first scenario up to the boss, and the second scenario until I couldn't figure out what to do and motion discomfort began to set in,. This is one I'll definitely watch for, but probably best played in small doses (YMMV, of course.)

-Uno (XBLA): Not bad, and the flexibility with the rules is nice (although I can't quite make the game my family usually plays when they get together, which is admittedly fairly complex. We do things like have skips and reverses being able to counteract Wild Draw Fours and Draw Twos if they're of the appropriate color, and swapping hands when a 0 is played.) It looks like rulesets can be added as part of DLC for the game, so this might be possible in the future. At first, I found the lack of local multiplayer disappointing, but realized that there really wouldn't be a good way to do such a thing on the hardware. The achievements are a bit on the easy side too (and most will be picked up in the course of normal play.) Not bad for a casual game.

Forza 2 trailer: Not bad, but pretty much useless as any sort of indication of what the game will look like.

Shadowrun trailer: Not so sure about this one. I'm not familiar with the IP though.

Things seem to have settled down a bit now, but for the most part the XBL content servers have been absolutely hammered. Normally I can grab 100MB off XBL in about 5 minutes (I'm on a 3Mbit connection), but it took close to an hour tonight.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Wed May 10, 2006 9:19 am

Those microtransactions are bullshit. Unlockables should be unlocked with nothing but skill or in some cases, time. Anyone can pay money.

BIG · Post by **BIG** » Wed May 10, 2006 4:23 pm

I don't know man,but the 'wii' still has yet to convince 'mii'

Red Steel looked and played like shit (I had high expectations for this one...shame). Twilight Princess is way overdone as far as the use of the wii controller goes (I'll be getting the GC version). Mario Galaxy seems kinda cool,but is it really necessary to implement the motion sensor control just for the sake of gimmick?

As far as downloadable service goes,$3 for NES,$5 for SNES,and $10 for N64? No thanks.

B-

dave4shmups · Post by **dave4shmups** » Wed May 10, 2006 4:52 pm

BIG wrote:I don't know man,but the 'wii' still has yet to convince 'mii'

Red Steel looked and played like shit (I had high expectations for this one...shame). Twilight Princess is way overdone as far as the use of the wii controller goes (I'll be getting the GC version). Mario Galaxy seems kinda cool,but is it really necessary to implement the motion sensor control just for the sake of gimmick?

As far as downloadable service goes,$3 for NES,$5 for SNES,and $10 for N64? No thanks.

B-

Where did you get those prices from?

At any rate, Sega's doing yet another remake of Golden Axe:

http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/706/706968p1.html

And, unlike the Sega Ages remake, this one actually sounds like it'll be worth playing. The Metal Slug Collection is also coming out on the Wii, it seems.

I watched the Microsoft Press Conference last night, and all I have to say is that both Microsoft and Nintendo are giving developers a whole lot more to work with, in terms of creativity, then Sony. The Wii has the controllers, and Microsoft has XBLA for new developers who are just starting out, plus XNA as a creative tool.

The only games that excite me on the PS3 are Warhawk, Resistance Fall of Man, and Fatal Intertia, none of which look any better then 360 games, despite the PS3's supposedly greater power. Sony's gonna have to do a LOT better then that for $600.00

icycalm · Post by **icycalm** » Wed May 10, 2006 5:15 pm

The new Golden Axe is being developed by Americans. If they get Japanese artists, it might just be worth playing for a few hours (ala Maximo).

If not, well.

jp · Post by jp » Wed May 10, 2006 6:23 pm

Finally got around the downloading the Lost Planet demo.

That game is fucking amazing. If it doesn't push even more 360s... then... something is wrong with this world. That game... is just... wow.

VNAF Ace · Post by **VNAF Ace** » Wed May 10, 2006 6:24 pm

icycalm wrote:The new Golden Axe is being developed by Americans. If they get Japanese artists, it might just be worth playing for a few hours (ala Maximo).

If not, well.

What difference does it make? A good developer is a good developer no matter where they come from. Case in point... Look at how well Retro Studios (an American developer) handled the Metroid Prime series.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Wed May 10, 2006 6:25 pm

VNAF Ace wrote:What difference does it make? A good developer is a good developer no matter where they come from. Case in point... Look at how well Retro Studios (an American developer) handled the Metroid Prime series.

Such wise words.

Kiken · Post by **Kiken** » Wed May 10, 2006 6:42 pm

VNAF Ace wrote:
icycalm wrote:The new Golden Axe is being developed by Americans. If they get Japanese artists, it might just be worth playing for a few hours (ala Maximo).

If not, well.
What difference does it make? A good developer is a good developer no matter where they come from. Case in point... Look at how well Retro Studios (an American developer) handled the Metroid Prime series.

The counter to your optimism being, of course, Final Fight Revenge.

Hopefully, Sega will include Revenge of Death Adder as an unlockable.

Vexorg · Post by **Vexorg** » Wed May 10, 2006 6:58 pm

jp wrote:Finally got around the downloading the Lost Planet demo.

That game is fucking amazing. If it doesn't push even more 360s... then... something is wrong with this world. That game... is just... wow.

Lost Planet looks very good. I still occasionally found myself fighting the controls, but the gameplay was quite enjoyable (some of the weapons seem a tad underpowered though.)

Test Drive Unlimited looks like it has potential too (freeform racers seem to be something of an underserved genre) although the demo is buggy and prone to crashing.