Video System Shmups: What stands out? [edit: fixed poll]

[EmperorIng]

Video System / V-Sys can be seen as a somewhat interesting footnote in shmup development due to the fact that Psikyo's genesis can be traced from Shin Nakamura's work on Rabio Lepus and Sonic Wings. But are they worth more than a cursory glance? If so what games from them really stand out?

I myself haven't played SW2 or 3, but Sonic Wings/Aero Fighters is a pretty decent ur-Psikyo, and there is a certain enjoyment from the 'everything and the kitchen sink' approach of Limited (and Special, to a lesser extent).

I wish I enjoyed Sonic Wings Special more, but its levels can be a little dull compared to Limited. I probably should have split the two, but ehhh. Just mention which one you meant if you post.

Let me hear your thoughts!

EDIT: Had to change the poll and separate Sonic Wings Special and Limited, even though it killed me a bit to wipe the previous votes. Please re-vote!
Old results

Spoiler

[Austin]

The Aero Fighters/Sonic Wings series was a favorite in my younger years. I still enjoy going back to them. Always preferred Part 2, but lately I'm finding 3 to be the superior game. More interesting level flow and things actually change up pretty significantly on Loop 2. I didn't realize until recently that the arcade version of Special is different from the console versions. It seems better than those in various ways. I need to put more time into that.

[Mortificator]

Special and Limited are really two different games. While they both use the let's-revisit-old-stages concept, that doesn't make them versions of each other any more than it does Sonic Generations and Sonic Mania. Even things that sound the same, like, say, flying through the Another Dimension stage with Hien. Doing that in Special and in Limited means a new primary shot, new secondary shot, new charge shot, new enemy placement, new boss patterns, new scoring system. Those things define a shooting game much more so than surface aesthetics.

Anyway, for the topic question I want to say Limited's the most refined and exciting. Every plane has a charge shot or special function there. Of the original trilogy, I also like Sonic Wings 3 best. And Turbo Force is one of those shmups that's basic and uneven and somehow fun.

[EmperorIng]

You're making me really regret sticking the two together in haste. Changing the poll now means wiping all the votes; who knows when people will come to this topic again?? Should I still risk it?

Sonic Wings 1 has a pretty good flow to it, although uneven. I think it has a rough charm; a sign of things to come. I find Limited to be exciting myself, and if I spend more time with it I might consider it my favorite. I don't know if I find much use for the charge shot but I haven't tried out enough characters (Mao Mao's for example I find to be pretty worthless unless I'm missing something).

Good to hear some thoughts about the neo geo games; I don't hear a lot of conversation about them.

[Arcatech]

I usually play Aero Fighters 1 because its tate. More viewing area. Kohful is my main because he's way op. He's just a bit slow. The power up fade is kind of lame but If you can get used to the flow it can be sort of fun to pick up powerups for score and what not. Turbo Force is fun as well. If you can get 2 friends to play its one of the only 3p shmups I know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IZwgY9Cgx0


Nice Dr. Strangelove reference:

[Jeneki]

Sonic Wings 1 is my go-to for them, yes that's likely do to tate bias. I need to spend more time with Limited.

Oddly enough a local arcade had Rabbit Punch in the 90s. I thought it was cool back then, but gave it a try more recently and it didn't live up to nostalgia.

[EmperorIng]

I like Rabio Lepus quite a bit! It's definitely rough around the edges though. On Normal (not Expert) it is a pretty approachable game. I love the art aesthetic - my favorite cute-em-up style is "cute player, grotesque enemies" which it has in spades. As a short, 12-14 minute game, I can forgive its faults (even though random item carriers IS a big fault!!).

The PCE port has quite a boost in the audio department, having actually listenable music. The port is worth trying out even though its second loop (a new addition) is pretty superfluous. The biggest change in the port (and one that I think is for the worse) is that you can no longer collide harmlessly against walls like you could in the arcade.

Even with that it's not a huge deal and I was able to 1all it. It's one of my favorite shmups on the PC Engine!

[EmperorIng]

The previous poll results had a vote for Turbo Force, since disappeared. Where are you, Turbo Force fan?

I've been playing this game in preparation for its possible inclusion in Calice Cup 3. It's... definitely rough. Not without its charm (has a lot of Nakamura / V-Sys sense of humor to it in the animations and overall style). But the way the shot is constantly powered down and how you have to conserve ammo like a survival-horror game can really get grating. The bullet movement for enemies can feel a little unrefined, like someone's first game (how they can speed-up mid trajectory and fuck you over). You can easily lose lives in quick succession in this game. A short credit with the customary "one extend" (at 200,000) they throw at you for a laugh.

You really gotta save those random capsule special weapons for when a larger enemy is on-screen, so you can get rid of them quickly.

[Arcatech]

But the way the shot is constantly powered down and how you have to conserve ammo like a survival-horror game can really get grating.

AFAIK its just a time out, no weapon conservation needed. Still fun but ya, those homing shots from the mechs are annoying.

[CIT]

Funny to see this poll pop up right when I've been playing Sonic Wings 2 and 3.

I actually tend to prefer this series over the early Psikyo output. Stages are a bit more interesting and I like the quirky/absurd characters.

I cleared Special a few years back on Saturn and would've said it's the best in the series because of sheer content, however, I recently find myself coming around to Sonic Wings 3 more. The gameplay seems more refined to me, and presentation-wise it's a noticeable step up.

[Limbrooke]

It's gotta be Turbo Force for sheer difficulty.

Although for me, I love Aero Fighters 3. Its a decent game and gets better in the 2nd loop. Its not as tough as AF2, but its more flexible and that makes it the more enjoyable experience.

[EmperorIng]

Now that a lot of people are playing Turbo Force, or will be, or will allegedly be, I'll bump the topic.

It's time to jointly discover the joys of the game. Rob seemed to really enjoy the game back when he made his arcade countdown, years ago.

Also a funny screengrab from the past:

AFAIK its just a time out, no weapon conservation needed. Still fun but ya, those homing shots from the mechs are annoying.

This is incorrect as I've found. The game really -does- have an ammo count of some sort. The more you hold fire the more you deplete it. Fun fact, if you set the game to 2P mode (as the game is touted as a 3P game, potentially!), you'll actually see your current power level... but it won't tell you how much ammo you have before dropping.

[EmperorIng]

Playing more Turbo Force for Calice Cup 3, and when you really, truly dive deep into the world of Turbo Force... well, you find it's the shmup that keeps on giving. Or more accurately, the shmup that keeps on not giving a shit.

Glitches. Bugs out the ass. Randomly destroying the color pallet of a level because you either accidentally destroyed an invisible sprite, or (as I suspect) you caused two code scripts to run at the same time, override each other, and fuck up the programming (if that makes sense).

(look at the screenshot above to see the normal palette!)

Weird bugs happen almost all the time if you play long enough. The most damning and horrific is when you pick up a random lightning-bolt item while you are killing a larger mech enemy. Sometimes, the bomb damage from the lightning item and your shot will "kill" the enemy at the same time, which I suspect causes its health to go into negative and thus into an overflow. What's the result? Invincible enemies! Unkillable giant enemies that will continuously harass you as you helplessly are drawn into an embrace of death as the screen slowly scrolls you into it.

As most Calice players have discovered, you can skip 1/3rd of stage 3 by clipping into the wall of the stage and skipping two midbosses. This is actually the preferred strategy, in order to conserve like and ammo for the boss! And said boss can do some pretty lol-tastic stuff too.

The rank in this game is utterly ridiculous. 1 extend at 200,000k. But if you want to 1all the game, you have to tactically suicide to lower the rank. This is most crucial for the insanely stupid stage 6 opener, with mech enemies (that can possibly become unkillable if you have an unlucky item spawn?), smaller enemies with way too much health, and tons of insanely fast bullets. Even crazier? If you don't kill everything in time, suicide/time-out missiles start flooding the screen. The epitome of utter assholish design.

That stage 6 intro (INTRO!) is as far as my journey has gotten. I don't know if I've got the willpower to continue from there in the wild and probably shitty world of Turbo Force!

Amazing that Video System could rebound and release Sonic Wings a year later. The gulf between the two is vast indeed.

[copy-paster]

Turbo Force really broke my farce hahaha

Don't think I could get a clear until Calice is over, this game's RNG is one of the worst IMO. If you are unlucky the first sword pattern on stage 6 boss will atack you with lighting speed even at low rank! I did get better at tackling stage 6 opener too during practice session.

It might be just me, but Game Tengoku has nod of Video System in terms of stage design and some of bosses/enemies attacks.