OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
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hugo19941994
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Nice! Both of them worked just fine Thanks so much!
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
The build I made has a Seed of 4 with which I got better results at N64 256x240 LineX5 which has a very high pixel clock of 182Mhz. Everything else already worked fine.
It's strange because Seed 10 has no timing violations but Seed 4 has a few small violations though it works better.
It's strange because Seed 10 has no timing violations but Seed 4 has a few small violations though it works better.
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bobrocks95
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Just out of curiosity, why is there a 1440i option, but no 960i option? I don't know if compatibility would fare any better, but I haven't seen anyone talk about 1440i being supported by a display. Maybe 1440i is actually a standard of some sort and 960i isn't?
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I've been wondering this myself; I think those of us with secondary video processors (I have an Extron DSC 301 HD) would get more use out of a 480i line2x laced mode that gives us 960i. No need to get rid of line2x (bob), just add line2x (laced).bobrocks95 wrote:Just out of curiosity, why is there a 1440i option, but no 960i option? I don't know if compatibility would fare any better, but I haven't seen anyone talk about 1440i being supported by a display. Maybe 1440i is actually a standard of some sort and 960i isn't?
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I personally don't see any use in 960i or 1440i. After all, due to the move from 1:1 (odd to even lines) to 2:2 you cannot run a secondary processor for deinterlacing. It might be an enjoyable look for some, but it's not for me
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
My assumption with 960i has been that it would simply be a 2x integer scale of 480i that would take about as long to deinterlace as 1080i, and the resulting 960p image would end up a little less blurry than 480p scaled to 1080p. Is that not what would happen?Fudoh wrote:I personally don't see any use in 960i or 1440i. After all, due to the move from 1:1 (odd to even lines) to 2:2 you cannot run a secondary processor for deinterlacing. It might be an enjoyable look for some, but it's not for me
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
yes, but the proper algorithms are missing, which often lets the deinterlacer default to weaving (if you even can find a machine to accept the signal). In my eyes these are experimental modes for use on a CRT.My assumption with 960i has been that it would simply be a 2x integer scale of 480i that would take about as long to deinterlace as 1080i
possibly a tad less blurry, yes, but with various other kinds of problems.and the resulting 960p image would end up a little less blurry than 480p scaled to 1080p. Is that not what would happen?
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Historically, interlacing is signalled in the video signal by a line that is just half as long as a normal one and the position of the sync signals relative to this line determine if it's an even or odd field.bobrocks95 wrote:Just out of curiosity, why is there a 1440i option, but no 960i option? I don't know if compatibility would fare any better, but I haven't seen anyone talk about 1440i being supported by a display. Maybe 1440i is actually a standard of some sort and 960i isn't?
The OSSC works mostly synchronous to the input signal, so it can't just delete or insert lines (or half-lines) itself - unless I'm misremembering the architecture. If you double 480i to 960i, your half-line interlace indicator gets multiplied into a full line and thus your interlace indicator vanishes. In 1440i the half-line gets multiplied into 1.5 lines, part of which can be used as interlace indicator again.
I guess that with digital video and non-CRT displays there could also be other means to tell the display that the signal should be treated as interlaced, but IIRC there is no explicit bit for this in the HDMI infoframe and there is no extra signalling at all in DVI.
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Sorry in advance as I’m sure this has been asked before,but I recently got my ossc and ain’t got a clue what all the settings do and which setting does what even after reading the sources online,in general the default setting seem ok but don’t look sharp and a little fuzzy,I’m trying to get my shumps on the Saturn looking awsome!tryed firebrand x setting but don’t seem great on my tv,it would help if I knew what to tweak!is there a idiots guide to setting up?
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I've always been curious if the ossc were capable of sending out fake signal information as a method to fool most tv's into not scaling an image? (such as 1080p in place of 960p)
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I wonder if there's any device that you can put between your source and your TV that can do this. It would be pretty useful. I wouldn't mind having black borders around my picture in order to have a non-scaled or less-scaled picture.headlesshobbs wrote:I've always been curious if the ossc were capable of sending out fake signal information as a method to fool most tv's into not scaling an image? (such as 1080p in place of 960p)
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Which build should I use?
Release, Paul's, or the second Marqs build?
Release, Paul's, or the second Marqs build?
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maxtherabbit
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
releaseJademalo wrote:Which build should I use?
Release, Paul's, or the second Marqs build?
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Alright, ty!maxtherabbit wrote:release
Just planning on advising a few people to update, would rather not cause them issues.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
The release firmware might have some artifacts with some OSSC's on LineX5 as shown in the posted videos. So use an alternate firmware if that happens.Jademalo wrote:Which build should I use?
Release, Paul's, or the second Marqs build?
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I can confirm I get some artifacts at line5x on my Super Famicom. I didn't spot them at first because of my scanline setup. Definitely going to try the alternate firmware.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Just update to 0.83. Setting the new "H. s.rate adj" to 1 or 3 seems to help compatibility with my TV, so thanks to Marqs for adding that.
I'm still struggling, though, to find a perfect "256x240 optim" profile in Line4x for my NES. I spent today going through all the sampling phase degrees, and I can never seem to entirely get rid of ghosting. I keep going around in circles and am just not finding the sweet spot.
Can anyone recommend a methodical order in which I should be approach these settings, to most successfully narrow down the perfect results?
H. s.rate adj
Sampling Phase
Analog Sync LPF
I'm still struggling, though, to find a perfect "256x240 optim" profile in Line4x for my NES. I spent today going through all the sampling phase degrees, and I can never seem to entirely get rid of ghosting. I keep going around in circles and am just not finding the sweet spot.
Can anyone recommend a methodical order in which I should be approach these settings, to most successfully narrow down the perfect results?
H. s.rate adj
Sampling Phase
Analog Sync LPF
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I’m color calibrating my OSSC with a colorimeter/spectrometer. Should I be targeting the 601 spec, as that’s the source? Or should I target 709 as an HD signal?
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
709, iirc.
Any HD resolution should be in the 709 colour space, and since the OSSC's outputs in the higher linemult modes is HD, it's 709.
Technically you should be calibrating it to sRGB since the output of the OSSC is in RGB rather than YCbCr by default, but obviously it's the same thing =p
Any HD resolution should be in the 709 colour space, and since the OSSC's outputs in the higher linemult modes is HD, it's 709.
Technically you should be calibrating it to sRGB since the output of the OSSC is in RGB rather than YCbCr by default, but obviously it's the same thing =p
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Is this true if outputting 480p from the OSSC, too? Doesn’t EDTV fall under 601?Jademalo wrote:709, iirc.
Any HD resolution should be in the 709 colour space, and since the OSSC's outputs in the higher linemult modes is HD, it's 709.
Good call.Technically you should be calibrating it to sRGB since the output of the OSSC is in RGB rather than YCbCr by default, but obviously it's the same thing =p
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
You know, I'm not totally sure.SavagePencil wrote:Is this true if outputting 480p from the OSSC, too? Doesn’t EDTV fall under 601?Jademalo wrote:709, iirc.
Any HD resolution should be in the 709 colour space, and since the OSSC's outputs in the higher linemult modes is HD, it's 709.
After a quick bit of searching, I believe EDTV should be encoded with 601.
However, all of this is irrelevant since the OSSC's output is RGB anyway, and 601/709 are only really relevant for YCbCr encoding.
My advice, honestly, would be to set the OSSC to sRGB output, and calibrate to sRGB. There's no point in dealing with component encoding if it's not neccesary.
My personal calibration is pretty rough and ready, but I've been getting great results. I essentially just capture 4:4:4 RGB with my Vision E1S, and then manipulate the gains until black is 0,0,0 and white is 255,255,255 without clipping or crushing, and each colour maxes out at 255. I figure since I'm removing the monitor from the chain in terms of the testing, I can get a relatively accurate result.
I do have one question if you see it marqs - Am I right in thinking that the OSSC does all internal processing in the RGB colour space anyway? I'd assume so considering the option in video in proc to choose the input colour space for component, but I don't know.
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maxtherabbit
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
480p is rec601, yes
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
This should be correct. Unless you've specifically configured the OSSC for YCbCr output, it's RGB.Jademalo wrote:After a quick bit of searching, I believe EDTV should be encoded with 601.
However, all of this is irrelevant since the OSSC's output is RGB anyway, and 601/709 are only really relevant for YCbCr encoding.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
That setting is in Video in proc, the one that affects output is TX mode in output options.nmalinoski wrote:Isn't the 601/709 setting for YPbPr input, not output?
Actually this could use some clarification - does YCbCr444 output always encode in 601 regardless of actual output resolution? The wiki seems to imply such.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
That is incorrect. BT 601 and 709 specify different coordinates for the primary colors so even for RGB there is a difference - actually there is even a difference for PAL and NTSC in BT601. The difference is pretty small though.Jademalo wrote:However, all of this is irrelevant since the OSSC's output is RGB anyway, and 601/709 are only really relevant for YCbCr encoding.
From the standards point of view, sRGB is almost the same as BT 709 except for the gamma curve.My advice, honestly, would be to set the OSSC to sRGB output, and calibrate to sRGB.
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
So if I have my OSSC set to 480p out, is it getting converted to 601? Or are *all* modes being output as 709?Unseen wrote:That is incorrect. BT 601 and 709 specify different coordinates for the primary colors so even for RGB there is a difference - actually there is even a difference for PAL and NTSC in BT601. The difference is pretty small though.Jademalo wrote:However, all of this is irrelevant since the OSSC's output is RGB anyway, and 601/709 are only really relevant for YCbCr encoding.
From the standards point of view, sRGB is almost the same as BT 709 except for the gamma curve.My advice, honestly, would be to set the OSSC to sRGB output, and calibrate to sRGB.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
The OSSC doesn't perform color gamut mapping, so it's dependent on content. I suggest not worrying about it too much and calibrate against ITU-R BT.709 + BT.1886.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
Finally got the chance to install the new firmware, and WOW, I dig the new h+v/custom scanlines!
Unfortunately, I couldn't replicate naz's results (page 222) on my 1080p monitor - plus I like to use optimal timings, instead of generic 4:3... Did anyone have better luck, and mind to share their settings? - so I went the same route of Xyga, with the pseudo-dot matrix effect, and I'm so impressed! I can't really tell why, but I definitely prefer that 'mask' to standard, horizontal scanlines. It kinda reminds me of my old Commodore Amiga monitor...
Marqs and everyone else involved, HUGE thumbs up, and thanks for keeping the OSSC alive, adding great new features every time.
Unfortunately, I couldn't replicate naz's results (page 222) on my 1080p monitor - plus I like to use optimal timings, instead of generic 4:3... Did anyone have better luck, and mind to share their settings? - so I went the same route of Xyga, with the pseudo-dot matrix effect, and I'm so impressed! I can't really tell why, but I definitely prefer that 'mask' to standard, horizontal scanlines. It kinda reminds me of my old Commodore Amiga monitor...
Marqs and everyone else involved, HUGE thumbs up, and thanks for keeping the OSSC alive, adding great new features every time.
Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
It's lightweight / less taxing on brightness and motion clarity than full straight lines = easier on the eyes on LCDs which are limited in both.Galdelico wrote:I can't really tell why
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Re: OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)
I would definitely like to see a little guide or something for making use of the scanlines here. Something similar to the videos out there showing how to tune in the OSSC for the SNES.