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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2019 4:50 am 


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Joined: 30 Jan 2016
Posts: 430
Syntax wrote:
Swiss looks like a pain to run via wii.

It's ok with Wii Swiss Booter. I used a Wii for development until I got the GameCube component video cable.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:51 am 


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Location: Australia
The only thing stopping me from trying it out is the need to install a mIOS.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2019 2:00 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1732
Syntax wrote:
Swiss looks like a pain to run via wii.

Cant wait for someone to port all these fixes extrems has made to the Revolution SDK and update homebrew ect.

I wasn't able to get Swiss to run on my Wii at all; every method I tried just resulted in the console rebooting back to its main menu. :/


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:47 pm 



Joined: 30 Mar 2019
Posts: 33
Somebody made a cheat code for Mario Kart Wii to implement the 480p fix. Haven't tried it myself yet, but apparently it works:

https://www.mkwii.org/showthread.php?ti ... 94#pid1994


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:54 pm 



Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Posts: 1348
shroom2k wrote:
Somebody made a cheat code for Mario Kart Wii to implement the 480p fix. Haven't tried it myself yet, but apparently it works:

https://www.mkwii.org/showthread.php?ti ... 94#pid1994

Wow, really cool! I'll have to join that forum.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 9:39 pm 



Joined: 22 Sep 2017
Posts: 70
Can someone clarify (in laymen's terms) what the issue is with stock 480p output on the Wii? Am I to understand that progressive scan on a stock Wii is broken? Would I be better off using 480i S-video if I'm playing on a CRT? And does this affect GameCube games output at 480p as well? Sorry for the barrage of questions.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 9:50 pm 


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Joined: 30 Jan 2016
Posts: 430
GojiFan90 wrote:
Am I to understand that progressive scan on a stock Wii is broken?

No.
GojiFan90 wrote:
Would I be better off using 480i S-video if I'm playing on a CRT?

No.
GojiFan90 wrote:
And does this affect GameCube games output at 480p as well?

Yes.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:19 pm 



Joined: 11 Apr 2019
Posts: 2
Here are some photos (fixed/original) of my 640x480p LCD displaying Mario Kart Wii both with and without the 480p fix. This is great because the 1:1 pixel output allows you to see the differences at a sub-pixel resolution.

It's best if you download full size photos and compare them in an image viewer rather than your web browser.

Places to look for differences
1. e of Channel
2. inside the a of Back
3. glasses frame on my Mii
4. Ms of Main Menu

How it appears to the user
- fixed: graphics are pixel aligned horizontally
- original: graphics are not pixel aligned horizontally

cropped photo album
https://imgur.com/a/Ef02mmz

full size photo album
https://imgur.com/a/R0k3igo

fixed: single pixel wide glasses frame
Image

original: double pixel wide glasses frame
Image

fixed: m starts on pixel boundary
Image

original: m starts half way through a pixel
Image


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 1:21 am 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1341
@Extrems:
Is the fix just a single I2C write by chance?


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:34 am 


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Joined: 21 May 2013
Posts: 281
Extrems wrote:
Deflickering (digital, vertical low-pass filter) in 480i isn't incorrect, is completely intentional, and applies to 99% of GC/Wii software.

A SDTV (analog, horizontal) low-pass filter applied to EDTV is incorrect, and the later Wii revisions fix this (allegedly).

A SDTV LPF applied to EDTV roughly halves the horizontal resolution.

Has anyone actually confirmed that the later Wii DAC's fix this issue? Has anyone tested each of the four DAC revisions with and without Extrems software fix?

I mean if Nintendo did fix this issue in hardware with the later DAC revisions, then Extrems fix shouldn't make any difference to the picture quality, yet ths comparison image shows that the GameCube component cable is still better than even the later RVL-101 revision Wii:-
Image

Extrems wrote:
It's analog bandwidth. There's a SDTV LPF inappropriately applied to EDTV.

So between the incorrectly applied low-pass filter on 480p output (That requires all homebrew to be recompiled) and the deflicker filter (Which is pretty much useless and detrimental on modern TV's/Scaler's which have to deinterlace anyway) would it not be a worthwhile mod to use a microcontroller (Attiny/PIC) to intercept the I2C bus for the AVE-RVL DAC and write our own configuration values that fix the 480p LPF and can optionally disable the deflicker filter and perhaps even offer the option to force RGBHV? (Would need to connect the unused HSYNC and VSYNC pins to the AV out port) It would just seem to make more sense to me if we fixed this in hardware, rather than have to force the video mode in software. You could perhaps even have the microcontroller connect to one of the GameCube ports for a rudimentry 'blind' confirguration option using buttons.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 1:40 pm 


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Posts: 430
Deflickering is applied during the EFB to XFB copy by the GPU. You can't intercept it.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:05 pm 



Joined: 19 Apr 2018
Posts: 3
GeneraLight wrote:
hurda wrote:
What is the deciding factor regarding better picture-quality?
Is it just the gpu-die-shrink and/or board-redesign of the 40s and newer, or is depending on the AVE-chip, or both?

I'm not quite sure on that.

Quote:
After spending a few hours searching for infos and pictures on which AVE-chips are used on which Wii-revisions, the situation looks like this:

Code:
AVE   | RVL-CPU- (How many reports)
------|-----------------------------
BU90  | 01 (9) - 10 (1) - 20 (1)
C8391 | 01 (1) -        - 20 (3) - 30 (1) - 40 (4) - 50 (1)
C4991 |        -        -        -        - 40 (1) - 50 (1)
BU99  |        -        -        - 30 (1) - 40 (5) -        - 60 (2) - K01(5) - K02(5)


"If it's just the AVE-chip, and if BU99 is the one to look out for, buying the "best" model is a lottery.
60s are kind of rare, 50s are even rarer and might not even have BU99, and 40s can have three different AVEs.

"You're right. Not all CPU-40 Wiis use the newest BU99 AVE-chip, but most of them appear to based on that sample. So perhaps not all CPU-40 Wiis have the better picture quality after all. Regardless of whether the CPU-40 Wii uses the older C8391/C4991 AVE-chips or the newest BU99 AVE-chip, every CPU-40 Wii should be moddable with the WiiDual mod from what I've heard."

------

It appears that not all RVL-CPU-60 boards have the AVE BU99 after all... I know this is kind of moot with the software patch but it is still interesting regardless. I just found this GitHub link (https://github.com/ikorb/gcvideo/blob/m ... DME-Wii.md) where someone tried installing GCVideo on their RVL-60 (they had provided images as well) and theirs had a AVE C4991. I'm assuming that Nintendo had leftover stock when they first started producing the 60.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:32 pm 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 948
Interesting that there's a video quality lottery with any Wii model. Now I'm not sure if the identical PQ I was seeing from an early and late model on SDTV modes (using either composite or component) was due to this or due to it, as I still suspect, the different chips only make a difference for the EDTV mode. I got rid of other models and only kept one with a WiiDual. Hopefully the WiiDual project will keep being supported as it's the best solution right now to avoid the lottery.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:50 pm 


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Posts: 2382
Location: Kentucky
applefan wrote:
I know this is kind of moot with the software patch but it is still interesting regardless.


What software patch?


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:10 am 



Joined: 19 Apr 2018
Posts: 3
The 480p fix patch that was made by Extrems.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 8:13 am 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 754
I use official cables for Component on the Wii (early model but perhaps not launch) and it looks great on a 4k tv imo. Resident Evil 4 for instance despite knowing the game by heart I'd still be hard pressed to see much difference with the Gamecube game also on the official component cable (Japanese cable) in 480p.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:19 pm 


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I just got a like new Wii U hooked up last night and I can honestly say that running Wii games with the output set to 720p is quite a bit sharper than running my original Wii with component cables at 480p on my Samsung plasma. There is a marked difference, I was very pleased with what I saw.

I didnt set the Wii U output to 480p to compare yet. Now, my set has to use its internal scaling for almost every resolution and that may skew the results Im seeing somewhat, but the Wii U I have is definitely sharper displaying Wii @ 720p than the Wii itself displaying at 480p.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:29 pm 


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Joined: 20 Jul 2017
Posts: 528
Josh128 wrote:
I just got a like new Wii U hooked up last night and I can honestly say that running Wii games with the output set to 720p is quite a bit sharper than running my original Wii with component cables at 480p on my Samsung plasma. There is a marked difference, I was very pleased with what I saw.

I didnt set the Wii U output to 480p to compare yet. Now, my set has to use its internal scaling for almost every resolution and that may skew the results Im seeing somewhat, but the Wii U I have is definitely sharper displaying Wii @ 720p than the Wii itself displaying at 480p.


It sounds like your TV just has sub-par 480p scaling, as Wii U's Wii output is pretty bad even in 720p. There is more to it than sharpness, however.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:58 pm 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 948
Some scalers whether in the TV or external also apply different algorithms, or outright use different chips, to handle analogue vs. digital inputs, so that could be a factor as well. There's going to be a lot of variables at play, so a good comparison has to hold as many factors constant as possible.

In any case it's pretty well established that the Wii U cannot match the best results that a Wii can for Wii and GC games, but there are definitely scenarios where due to limitations in hardware used (like Josh128's plasma), the Wii U can end up producing better results with its own scaler and digital output (though I'd bet on Wii+OSSC looking better even on this same plasma).


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:39 pm 


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I have yet to do side by side photocomparisons, but at a glance it certainly looked sharper-- and being as my set allows me to select 0-255 or 16-235 black levels, I also have no problem with the washed out color issue on Wii U's HDMI color output.

As far as analog vs digital on the set, I can say for certain that GC HDMI vs GC with official component cables at 480p appear identical to each other, so I dont think its that. I think its the Wii U's scaling of Wii 480p to 720p vs my Wii's soft output at 480p. I say this because my GC appears about as sharp as what Im seeing with the Wii U, so it shouldnt be due to the sets handling of native 480p. I'd have to do some photo comparisons, I suppose.


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:57 pm 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 948
Josh128 wrote:
my Wii's soft output at 480p.


It certainly could be because of this. You should try feeding the plasma the Wii's 480i output, which ironically would end up looking sharper (your plasma hopefully has good deinterlacing).


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 Post subject: Re: component wii question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 8:44 pm 


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lol I wish it were that easy. The Samsung plasmas have notoriously soft 480i scaling. 480i on both Wii and GC look far softer than 480p, respectively. Its funny that the Panasonic Viera I had had fabulous 480i scaling, very CRT-esque, but lost out to the Samsung in literally every other mode and visual metric.


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