shmups.system11.org

If you are buying a brand new one. This will not matter. If you were buying a v2/3, it is possible to see the RGB noise on a PVM. It is considerably less likely on a consumer grade CRT. I have a Sony PVM-1954q and I could still see the diagonal lines plain as day. Others I spoke with however said they didn't see it. So it could vary from screen to screen.

As much as I like your work and I am really happy with my Revision 2 SSS3 but please stop acting like you are working in a chinese sweatshop together with your entire family, on the deck of an alaskan fishing boat or oil rig somewhere in nowhere. Every task/job that can be done in his underwear on the couch is absolutely no suffering! Especially when it is for your own company and not for someone else.

Starting a business is infinitely more difficult than working for someone, regardless of whether you can do so in your underwear. Not taking a salary for 18 months is tough, both financially and mentally.

As someone who has started businesses and and who was one of the very first customers of the SSDS3, I am glad that you all keep pushing forward. This community is better because of your presence. I'm glad that you've learned from your mistakes (having your own forum, bringing Todd into the mix, etc.) and I can't wait to see what else you have in store for us. Just my 2 cents to counter some of the needless negativity.

That pretty much sums up the last few pages.

Start your own company, come back and tell me again

There are many of us who are giving encouragement to Alex, trying to assure him we appreciate his efforts, and we're never intending on rushing him on product releases throughout the entire history of Terra Onion. However, it always comes back to Alex insisting we are assholes who are never satisfied and demand instanteous product and satisfaction. True, I don't have access into Alex's inbox so he may in fact be dealing with an influx of assholes, and I can also appreciate the stress he's under, to put himself financially and mentally on the the line. But I fundamentally disagree with the silent redesign of the SSDS3 (V3), and the continual tirades Alex goes on against the customer base. It pains me to be fairly confident I may never place an order with Terra Onion again because I think the Neo SD and SSDS3(once it is modded to fix RGB and audio) are fantastic products, and I'm very intrigued with what the next product launches are going to be.

Just to clarify-- I am very happy that there is a third version of the SSDS3 to resolve issues, and I do not think anything is owed to V1 and V2 owners. I just think if this decision was made three months ago, the transparency would have been nice so that the customers could have made the decision to either mod their V2, or hold off and wait, or if they didn't own the SSDS3, to not place an order with Stone Age Gamer (I can't remember when the TO store went out of stock on the SSDS3) However, just my opinion and clearly TO can manage their product lines how they see fit.

This decision was never premeditated, it just happened cause we run out of pcbs, so i asked Todd if he could contact Voultar, FBX and Mobius to see if we could integrate the design.

It was never on the schelude for this year, i wasn´t mean to happen ever at all. It just happened cause the planets lined up.

This is like being on a infinite loop, i know some people will understand our/my decisions and others dont. Fortunally i learnt to live with that. I know i can´t have everyone happy, i just try to do what i think is better for the company and for the userbase, like it or not.

About the assholes/dicks : its always the same story, world is full of people, some are more patience, others are dicks. I am not saying all our customers are dicks. I would say a small minority took this RGB issue the hard way and they pushed us so hard to the limits. I hope this would never happened but its another stone on the road, nothing else, its time to move on.

You only have to come back to this thread and see how i was literally insulted here. I don´t think anyone deserves that at all.

Fact is we have improved a lot of things and we will continue improving others, having resources helps a lot on that

Alex,

Below are scope plots taken from the original Rev2 SSDS3. Also a plot from the FU-RGB board output. Lastly a plot from the newest revision SSDS3 which has the FU-RGB and FBX circuits on board.

If you don't understand what these show. Look at the amount of fluctuations in the signal. The other part you can look at is the Amplitude value on the bottom of the window. The correct value for RGB signals on 75ohm impedance NTSC signals is going to be ~700mV Peak to Peak.

The important part to take away from these plots is that the newest revision of the SSDS3 produces what is essentially the equivalent signal. The variance between the FU-RGB and latest revision is all well within spec and reasonable in it's fluctuations. These captures were taken using all of the same hardware while displaying a white screen under load using the 240p test suite. The only difference was the SSDS3 unit from the first 2 plots to the last for obvious reasons. The test unit is a bone stock white PC Engine that is the noisiest internally that I own.

Original Red channel


FU-RGB board installed Red channel


Latest revision SSDS3 with built in FU-RGB and FBX circuits

I assume that the same caveat would apply for those who have RGB-modded consoles? Which is to say that we would want to remove the mod or cut the traces in the SSDS3, right? I am wondering if it wouldn't be a huge hassle to build in a switch that enables/disables the SSDS3 RGB, essentially a reversible "cut" of the RGB lines. I realize this only affects a small number of people in the grand scheme of things and I'm still not sure I'd even bother getting an SSDS3, at least until my disc drive starts deteriorating, but I'm just curious. Honestly, I just wish someone would make an ODE that plugs into the IFU so that I can have the cool briefcase look but with SSDS3 levels of awesomeness...

Yes the same caveat applies. Any internal RGB mod will negatively impact the video signal once the SSDS3 is connected. This was also something I tested. Along with the general testing of various cable/console/power supply configurations.

The nice thing this time around was I had already moved my office so testing was considerably less of a hassle on my end. Also I knew what I was ultimately looking for and wasn't trying to reinvent the wheel.

A switch to disconnect the RGBS lines would be the ideal way to maintain both circuits. Obviously this would require modifications to either the console or the SSDS3.

Yeah, I was just thinking if that was something that could be included from the factory on the new ones. Again, I know it's kind of a niche requirement and might be a lot more hassle than it's worth, but it would be a nice option to have.

@Alex
What I dont understand is you are employing more and more electrical engineers but ask Mobius FBX and Voultar for free work?

Why cant your EEs design an analog video circuit that works?
It's got to be one of the easiest things to do, same with audio.. both are heavily documented and simple to test.
I mean both those circuits your using now were designed by amateur enthusiasts and they are better then anything your team of "professionals" could put together.
Really gives me confidence in your future products lol.

And now I'm reading on twitter that your new secret device has a major issue and probably requires modding or another revision...
(I'd link it but the posts were deleted like your screaming match with Voultar)

You've pissed off Voultar who will never work with you again, treat Bob like shit, 2 of the most respected members here, and paid FBX and Mobius an SSDS3 for their hard work (150usd to your pocket woop woop)
Your a tight ass that's burnt most of his bridges here.

It's just gone 11PM here in UK and I've just about finished with everything for today. I feel your pain working long days to keep things going.



Yes I think this is correct now you mention it. I offered the OSSC free,you refused initially but said you'd part exchange for a NEOSD but then never got back to me. In the end I just bought the NEOSD myself as I really wanted one anyway. Apologies, I'd forgotten about that.



I do not know who told you that but we have had them in stock for most of 2018 without many issues. They went out of stock for a few weeks this year but are now back in again. Accessories sometimes go out of stock if we underestimate how many we need.



At least you're not in the UK Have you looked at online book keeping systems like Xero? Switching to that was the best decision I made, everything is so much easier I don't even want to think what a mess I'd be in without it.

FBX got offered to get payed, he said no. This is the second time i mention it here in 2 days. Is that hard to read back before flame ?

A device is not secret anymore once you show it outside of the company. Not a big deal if it gets leaked, it just ruins a nice surprise video where we will explain how we did it and how it works, in a deeply tech way.


We are not hiring analog engineers cause we do digital stuff, so we hire vhdl coders and we also hired a layout desined that did neosd pro pcbs and 3 more devices that will hit the market sooner or latter

If you want to piss me you need to try harder.

About Voultar i wish him the best on any life aspect, me and him are like water and fire but i can recognize i could have done it better with him and that he is a skilled engineer.

Alex,

Alex,

I realize English is not your primary language. So maybe there is something lost in your writing. But your posts make you seem arrogant and entitled. All your "apologies" sound insincere. I'm not saying this to attack you or to be mean. I'm trying to give you a view of how you appear to some people here.

To be clear I do like your products overall. I plan to eventually get a NeoSD Pro MVS. I look forward to hearing about future product announcements.

Please continue working on TerraOnion's customer relations and product support. I think the vast majority of your problems with your customers could be solved with better communication from TerraOnion.

Not my intention at all,

English is not my primary language and i dont actually master it. I would say that i am more a visceral guy ratter than an arrogant guy. At least i see myself this way. If i don´t like you i will not tell you that i like you. If i don´t feel i did wrong i will not tell i did wrong. I am not a political correct guy for sure.

Just came here to give some light about whats happening inside TO and why we took the decisions we took and what our goals are.
Usually i tend to give out so many information and i think i should not be giving any information at all. From a PR point of view what i am doing here now is terrible and i know it.

I know pretty well we screwed SSDS3 analog design, you will see me here admiting it but you will not see me telling it was not me. We all screwed it and did a terrible release. Leasons to learnt

BTW thanks for the coment, one never learns from compliments but from the constructive criticism






0:54 here and i am going to sleep also, i am pretty happy today cause got about 60 packets out and that means that there are 60 guys that will not ask when his order will be shipped.

Will order an OSSC tomorrow or monday, i heard its better than Framemeister and i really want one.

BTW you are lucky to be in UK, it can´t be worst than spain, this is a resume of our taxes :

21% VAT to europe
25% anual company tax over earnings
35% personal tax after paying 25% company taxes.

This is one of the reasons why we preffer to invest back ratter than have a salary, cause you end destroying more money. if you dont have earnings you save 60% in taxes from the earnings.

I hesitate to begin a new thread, and I've tried wading my way through this one for the answer, but no dice so far...

I own a TurboDuo; I had plans to RGB-mod it, but have come to terms with the fact I can't mod it on my own. That means I'd have to pay for an install, and at that point I'd have the caps changed out and the jailbar fix performed too. Combine the labour with shipping, and no guarantee that my CD platter will keep spinning has me eyeing this unit instead (drama aside).


1. Would I be crazy to sell off my TurboDuo to fund the purchase of this instead?
2. What would I be losing, if anything? (other than that sexy chassis)
3. Which unit would best be paired with it (I'm in Canada)? A Core Grafx II?
4. Will the new revision avoid jailbars on any compatible unit?

I've tuned in and out of this thread over its life. Lost interest with all the quality issues. Re-considering now that they appear resolved...

Opinions welcomed. The price a TurboDuo commands now is surprising to me.

For 1 & 2, it depends on how you want to use your game system. Do you just want to play the games and don't care about owning/using original copies? Or do you want to play original copies of games you own? The SSDS3 prevents you from using real CD's.

I think any good condition Turbografx, PC Engine, or Core Grafx I or II are basically equal. Pairing the SSDS3 with a SuperGrafx gives you access to five games unique to that system.

Time will tell.

I'm biased since I work for Terraonion, so take that for what it is.

However, with that said, you can use a regular white PCE, either Core Grafx models or a SuperGrafx.

IMO the darker plastic of the Core Grafx I and SuperGrafx looks the nicest when paired with the dark transparent shell of the SSDS3. The White PCE also looks nice with the contrast of it's white case to the SSDS3. The Core Grafx II has a lighter gray that doesn't match up aesthetically as well in my opinion.


However a good deal on a Core II shouldn't be ignored since it will function the exact same.

Jail bars are a part of the PCE/TG16 hardware and no RGB solution fixes that. However there is an easy jailbar fix for all the NEC consoles that usually amounts to replacing or adding a couple caps on their motherboards.

More info:
https://etim.net.au/av-driver/pcebars/

Like Todd said, jailbars are internal to the console. They are generated by the HuC6260 power rails. Adding the caps will fix this.

Personal opinion here, I would never sell a turboduo if I had one. It's highly collectible and as long as a competent person works on it, very worth repairing/saving. All that being said, it's your console and you get to decide what you ultimately want.

The opinion I would give to anyone on this device at this point is there is no better solution and it's really great to have. It has been a long road but with the fixes in place, whether a v2/3 with the add-on boards or a new v4, you are getting access to everything in one package.

In terms of which console, I have tested more SSDS3 than I can even say at this point and with many many consoles. Realistically any of the compatible consoles will perform well. If you want the best possible experience, a CoreGrafx or SuperGrafx is your answer.

Why I recommend one of those 3 consoles is simple. They have the necessary heatsinks to handle dissipating the heat from the 7805. The power rails and ground pours are better laid out, especially on the SuperGrafx. There is considerably less noise to be found on these 3, SuperGrafx least of all. Obviously the downside to any of these is cost. SuperGrafx is quite pricey regardless. The SSDS3 has caused the CoreGrafx prices to rise as well. If you like the styling of the white PC Engine or TurboGrafx 16, that still a good option. It won't be bad it's just more likely to have visible noise than the others.

Thanks for all the feedback! I don't have that large a disc collection, and I'd be open to parting with a good portion of them--I really only have about 5 I play with any regularity. Playing them off disc or off SD isn't much of a factor to me.

Interesting to learn all models have the jail-bar issue.



Thanks for the tech-info! I *am* torn thinking about parting with the Duo. I messaged Voultar ages ago about an RGB mod but I never heard back--heard that he's not doing Turbo re-caps anymore, maybe that's why.

With a recap--any idea on how long I could expect a TurboDuo to last? Does the disc portion ever just up and fail? Can it be repaired if it does? Hate to pass on the SSDS3 only to have my unit die and end up getting it anyway.

Any recommendations for modders who could quote on an RGB/recap/jail bar fix a TurboDuo and either a) reside in Canada or b) are willing to put up with the insanity that is Canada Post? Would make the decision between the Duo and a SSDS3 easier to make.

In Canada the only person I would recommend is LeonK. He is a member on here. He would be able to do all of the work and provide you with photos. In the US, I am willing to do the work as well.

In regards to life of the recap, it depends on how good of a job the person does cleaning everything along with the type/quality of the new capacitors. I will say if you haven't done it yet, you need to. I guarantee they are already leaking. Assuming good cleaning, good quality parts, and someone competent, you should be set for 15-20 years or longer.

In regards to the CD side failing. The lasers do go bad. Replacement lasers are readily available currently. At some point this will change. The sled motors go bad, also replaceable. The driver's sometimes go bad. These can be harder to source but are generally available.

yep, Supergrafx is the way to go. On top of that you can also play Daimakamura on it then.

Hi everyone, first post here.

I'm glad to hear Super SD3 will now be shipping with fixed PCBs. For the amount of money TO is asking for this product this needed to be done.

I'm sure this was a serious learning experience for TerraOnion and I hope they take what they have learned and do whatever they can to avoid another issue like this.

At the end of the day it sounds like this product is finally truly worth its cost and I'm very much interested in it.

Then again maybe their next big announcement in March will be for a Pro version with 720p HDMI out. I mean we all know its possible given the UberGrafx, but perhaps TO can do it better.

We WERE definitely lucky to be in UK, until Brexit lol. 20% VAT in UK was very good compared to lots of places (Greece and Ireland it's 23%). Postage/couriers are also competitive here helping keep prices low.

Of course post brexit destroys all that, member state VAT rate plus handling fee plus duties on any packages sent in from outside EU. That is if any packages can even get out the country considering how backlogged everything is set to get.

ROI VAT is higher but I'll put prices down to compensate as we won't be paying as much business tax anyway so swings and roundabouts.

Am I missing a console here? You reference 3--I must be blind. Or is the Core Grafx II included in "CoreGrafx"? Thanks!

Yea, there are two types of CoreGrafx consoles.

Sorry. Yes the CoreGrafx 1 and 2 are basically the same. So I didn't reference them individually.

Hi Mobiusstriptech,

First of all thank you for providing the FU-RGB board. I have installed it yesterday and hooked it to the Coregrafx 2 and I can clearly see improvement when tested on my BVM.

I can also notice some really faint jailbars on solid black screens, and faint diagonal noise I didn't see before, probably because I didn't focus on it before. I've read somewhere diagonal noise is PSU related. My PSU isn't original I got it from retrogamingsupply but I can still test it later with the MD one.

Anyway overall happy.

I have a question to Neodev.

Since you are integrating FBX, Voultar's and Mobiusstriptech work on your next revision, I don't see any problem staying with V2 because I'm happy with the product and the way things are developing now. That being said would you officially support their upgrades like you did with the Capacitor fix and still warranty our V2 upgraded devices with FBX and Voultar's/Mobiusstriptech work ?

I feel it's a good way to make the transition between V2 and V4 and give credit to their work at the same time.

I'm glad you are happy with it overall. My immediate question goes to whether you have done the jailbar fix on the CoreGrafx? I would be interested in knowing if the OEM Genesis/MegaDrive PSU performs better. I hear many different reviewed of the retrogamesupply PSUs and it makes me wonder if it's the setups or the units themselves.