XRGB-mini Framemeister

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iceman_0
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by iceman_0 »

@Kez Thanks again for the advice.

Scart Ports are rare on modern TVS indeed but I have a Sony 43 8305 and this TV has a Scart Port. I was using this port for a long time before I decided to buy the Framemeister. All my cables were working properly.

Checking the pins is a good idea. I will do do it.

I have also checked always If the remote is set on the RGB mode. It was all the time as well.
jd213
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by jd213 »

Has anyone tried adding RCA inputs for RGBS, like this Japanese blogger?
http://www.mieow.jp/stripe/blog/2013/05 ... %E9%80%A0/

Seems fairly easy solder-wise, and I already have a power drill and step bit for making the holes.

I'm just not sure what kind of RCA sockets to get, or where to get them from. About the only RGB colored ones (not required, but would be nice) I see are from uxcell, and some of their products get pretty bad reviews on Amazon.
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FBX
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

jd213 wrote:Has anyone tried adding RCA inputs for RGBS, like this Japanese blogger?
http://www.mieow.jp/stripe/blog/2013/05 ... %E9%80%A0/

Seems fairly easy solder-wise, and I already have a power drill and step bit for making the holes.

I'm just not sure what kind of RCA sockets to get, or where to get them from. About the only RGB colored ones (not required, but would be nice) I see are from uxcell, and some of their products get pretty bad reviews on Amazon.
If he's going to cut up the top of the shell like that, I'd just install a female SCART socket instead. I'm pretty sure it would fit if he can fit those RCA jacks in it like that.
jd213
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by jd213 »

I live in Japan and don't have any SCART cables, so that wouldn't be of any use to me.

I mainly wanted to use RCA for RGB over a PS2 component cable (plus composite from a SCPH-1160 PS1 AV adapter for sync) to replace the official Sony JP21 PS1 cable I have, which I assume has capacitors in it already, making it not as good for PS2 use.

I also have an DB Grafx Booster style RGB amp for PC Engine that I got off Yahoo Auctions, and that uses RGBS over RCA, but I probably won't be using it with the Framemeister very often.
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Danexmurder
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Danexmurder »

Just curious if anyone on here has picked up one of these or has any experience with something similar.

https://hdfury.com/product/linker-4k60- ... hz-scaler/

I'm running a Framemeister into my LGB6 Oled and I was curious if something like this might upscale better than the TVs internal upscaler.
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rtw
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by rtw »

Kez wrote:The Toro by Beharbros is specifically designed for this purpose, and outputs RGBS over SCART. This is the simplest option but also the most expensive.
Does anyone know the voltage level the Toro outputs for CSYNC on the SCART and the VGA ?

SCART level should be: 0.3V
VGA level should be TTL: 5V

However the FrameMeister does not want more than: 0.3V peak to peak.

The FrameMeister RGB input specification is actually the same as the SCART specification.

From the official MicomSoft site:

Code: Select all

RGB端子(8ピン miniDIN):NTSC 21ピンRGBマルチ
アナログRGB信号:0.7Vp-p(75Ω)
同期信号:複合同期(C sync)0.3Vp-p負極性
水平同期周波数:15kHz(NTSC相当)
垂直同期周波数:60Hz
音声:アナログ音声(ステレオ2ch)
※TTLデジタルRGBの入力には対応いたしません。
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JamieS
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by JamieS »

Received my XRGB Mini today and have a small issue. I don't get any video when trying to output though my AV receiver. The receiver i have just passes signals though to the output, with no processing at all, so shouldn't be stopping anything. If i plug it straight into my TV then that works no probs, but as there's no external audio out on the Mini I'm plugging the XRGB Mini into my DVDO Edge and then sending that through the amp which works fine. This isn't really an issue, but just curious if anyone else has had any problems with receivers?
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Fudoh
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Fudoh »

You can try to toggle the FM between HDMI and DVI output modes. Might be a colorspace issue with your receiver and one of the two output modes....
JamieS
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by JamieS »

Thanks, just tried but unfortunately it's the same.
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FBX
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

JamieS wrote:Received my XRGB Mini today and have a small issue. I don't get any video when trying to output though my AV receiver. The receiver i have just passes signals though to the output, with no processing at all, so shouldn't be stopping anything. If i plug it straight into my TV then that works no probs, but as there's no external audio out on the Mini I'm plugging the XRGB Mini into my DVDO Edge and then sending that through the amp which works fine. This isn't really an issue, but just curious if anyone else has had any problems with receivers?
Did you try turning deep color mode off? After that, try changing the output mode from "Auto" to "RGB".
leonk
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by leonk »

I have a dream .. a dream where Micomsoft open sources the XRG firmware and it becomes the best scalar ever made.

I have a lesser dream - a dream where Micomsoft gives users the ability to control the LPF level similar to an OSSC.

Anyone have similar dreams??
Jameson Rook
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Jameson Rook »

leonk wrote:I have a dream .. a dream where Micomsoft open sources the XRG firmware and it becomes the best scalar ever made.

I have a lesser dream - a dream where Micomsoft gives users the ability to control the LPF level similar to an OSSC.

Anyone have similar dreams??
I had a dream where my Framemeister didn't die after just under a year of light use. :(
Jameson Rook
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Jameson Rook »

What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister? I noticed that Asian LG tv's displays SD content remarkably well, so much so that I'm inclined not to use the XRGB anymore. Am I just lucky that I have a TV that compares to the XRGB favorably or are there benefits of the XRGB upscaling that I might overlook?
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Kez
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Kez »

The FM is not great at 480p so there aren't any real advantages to using it if your TV does a good job.

Its interlacing is very good, though. Motion and input lag is normally where deinterlacers will suffer, so those are the things to look out for when comparing it against a TV directly.
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Fudoh
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Fudoh »

What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister?
480p directly into the TV is certainly the better choice over the FM. Eventually the TV's 480p handling differes from manufacturer to manufacturer. 480p upscaling on the LGs is OK'ish, but far from great. Sonys have the best 480p handling.

480i is a different matter though. The deinterlacing on most TVs is really good these days, but the whole algorithm is optimized for video, not graphics, so you're definitely losing the clear pixels you get from 480i content on the FM. 480i deinterlaced by a TV will always look softer than native 480p from a console. The FM on the other hand makes static 480i look as good as true 480p.
Jameson Rook
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Jameson Rook »

Kez wrote:The FM is not great at 480p so there aren't any real advantages to using it if your TV does a good job.

Its interlacing is very good, though. Motion and input lag is normally where deinterlacers will suffer, so those are the things to look out for when comparing it against a TV directly.
Fudoh wrote:
What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister?
480p directly into the TV is certainly the better choice over the FM. Eventually the TV's 480p handling differes from manufacturer to manufacturer. 480p upscaling on the LGs is OK'ish, but far from great. Sonys have the best 480p handling.

480i is a different matter though. The deinterlacing on most TVs is really good these days, but the whole algorithm is optimized for video, not graphics, so you're definitely losing the clear pixels you get from 480i content on the FM. 480i deinterlaced by a TV will always look softer than native 480p from a console. The FM on the other hand makes static 480i look as good as true 480p.
Thanks for the reply guys. I do have the Framemeister, or rather, I did until it decided to die on me a few weeks back after just under a year. I searched high and low on how to fixe it until Solaris offered to repair it for a fee (although it's been a month since they contacted me). I primarily use the XRGB for 480i content (PS2, GC and Wii) with FireBrandX's profiles.

Subjectively, I found that all 3 of my LG TV's compared favorably to the image quality of the XRGB sans integer scaling and it kinda baffles me considering I've also tried on my SHARP TV and it looked as bad as I expected. The image quality on my LGs are sharp and they all pass the "interactive tests" of the 240p test suite. I also found out that TV's in sold South East Asia are different than American or UK models, and perhaps that might explain it.

Are there tests I could run on my TV that will confirm that it's doing a good deinterlacing job? I consider myself a novice video/audiophile so my TVs are properly calibrated.
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Smile_Kaiser
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Smile_Kaiser »

Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.
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BuckoA51
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by BuckoA51 »

Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.

have you tried something like one of these? https://www.futureshop.co.uk/tacima-cs9 ... 2cQAvD_BwE
OSSC Forums - http://www.videogameperfection.com/forums
Please check the Wiki before posting about Morph, OSSC, XRGB Mini or XRGB3 - http://junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php/Main_Page
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Smile_Kaiser
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Smile_Kaiser »

BuckoA51 wrote:
Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.

have you tried something like one of these? https://www.futureshop.co.uk/tacima-cs9 ... 2cQAvD_BwE
No, and come to think of it, my power supply is just some rando cheap thing I found in my garage, so I guess that's worth trying. Went ahead and ordered it, can't hurt. Thanks.

Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?
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BuckoA51
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by BuckoA51 »

Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?
Not necessarily, if they're using HDMI that's an entirely digital, packet based transmission so isn't really susceptible to things like analogue video interference.
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fandangos
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by fandangos »

BuckoA51 wrote:
Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?
Not necessarily, if they're using HDMI that's an entirely digital, packet based transmission so isn't really susceptible to things like analogue video interference.
This is isn't entirely true. I agree that a PSU can't cause his problems, also not like analogue signals interference I agree but from personal experience:
I have a pc on my office that I hook it with a 15 meters HDMI cable to my receiver and this into my tv.

I had to return the first cable and get another one because I was getting green artifacts on the screen.
I know 15 meters is beyond hdmi specification but it works, and I'm not using a active cable, just a plain passive one.
It also works with hdmi 2.0 to display 4k at 60hz 4:4:4 without chroma subsampling and even HDR is possible together with dolby atmos.

So this theory that hdmi is image on or off isn't true. You can get artifacts or some weird grain.
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

Smile_Kaiser wrote:Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.
You need to be able to isolate the cause. Lets try a few things:

1. Do you get this same noise on D-Terminal input?

2. Do you get this same noise using the HDMI inputs on the Framemeister? (try both passthrough mode and active processing mode).

3. If 1 and 2 turn out to also have the same noise, can you try on a different monitor?

4. If a different monitor shows the same noise, then we're left with it being something wrong with your FM or 'possibly' a power issue.
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Smile_Kaiser
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Smile_Kaiser »

Okay, so, I'm a gigantic idiot.

Turns out I was going from the console to the gscart to the framemeister and then back through the gscart and then to the TV. No, I'm not sure why I was doing this.

But! The good news is, cutting out the gscartsw-lite entirely makes all the noise go away completely. The picture looks BEAUTIFUL. I'm so happy.

However, that raises the question of what's wrong with my gscartsw-lite. Faulty hardware? It's not the end of the world, but I paid a lot of money for it, and having a switcher is a massive convenience.
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Fudoh
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Fudoh »

What do you use to connect the gscartSW to FM ? A dedicated Scart to MiniDin8 cable ? Or a EU-EU Scart cable with a EU-Scart to MiniDin8 adapter or a EU-JP Scart cable with the original MiniDin8 adapter that came with the FM ?

What I'm saying: I would probably first blame the connection and not the switch. You could have a grounding issue somewhere in your cable or adapter(s).
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BuckoA51
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by BuckoA51 »

So this theory that hdmi is image on or off isn't true. You can get artifacts or some weird grain.
Sure if you push the cables to the limit then there's a point where error correction/compensation starts to fail, and you might get image drop outs, or snow on the image, or other weird things, but that's quite different from analogue interference.
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FBX
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

Smile_Kaiser wrote: The good news is, cutting out the gscartsw-lite entirely makes all the noise go away completely. The picture looks BEAUTIFUL. I'm so happy.

However, that raises the question of what's wrong with my gscartsw-lite. Faulty hardware? It's not the end of the world, but I paid a lot of money for it, and having a switcher is a massive convenience.
See what happens when you start isolating the cause? It's like the old Sherlock Holmes saying of eliminating everything else to get to the core of the problem, however improbable it may be.

At any rate, are you using the same adapter from the FM to your console directly that you used with your gscart-sw? If it's the same adapter (and you know of course it's euro and not JP21), then this further isolates the gscart-sw and/or its power supply as the culprit.
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Smile_Kaiser
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Smile_Kaiser »

FBX wrote:
Smile_Kaiser wrote: The good news is, cutting out the gscartsw-lite entirely makes all the noise go away completely. The picture looks BEAUTIFUL. I'm so happy.

However, that raises the question of what's wrong with my gscartsw-lite. Faulty hardware? It's not the end of the world, but I paid a lot of money for it, and having a switcher is a massive convenience.
See what happens when you start isolating the cause? It's like the old Sherlock Holmes saying of eliminating everything else to get to the core of the problem, however improbable it may be.

At any rate, are you using the same adapter from the FM to your console directly that you used with your gscart-sw? If it's the same adapter (and you know of course it's euro and not JP21), then this further isolates the gscart-sw and/or its power supply as the culprit.
I'm using the same power supply for both the Framemeister and the gscartsw-lite, if that's what you mean, yeah. Hopefully it's a power supply issue; I've got a lot hooked up to it at once and it's nothing special.
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FBX
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

Smile_Kaiser wrote:
I'm using the same power supply for both the Framemeister and the gscartsw-lite, if that's what you mean, yeah. Hopefully it's a power supply issue; I've got a lot hooked up to it at once and it's nothing special.
Actually I meant the mini-din to SCART adapter cable. Is is the same one you used to hook the gscartsw-lite up to?
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Smile_Kaiser
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by Smile_Kaiser »

FBX wrote:
Smile_Kaiser wrote:
I'm using the same power supply for both the Framemeister and the gscartsw-lite, if that's what you mean, yeah. Hopefully it's a power supply issue; I've got a lot hooked up to it at once and it's nothing special.
Actually I meant the mini-din to SCART adapter cable. Is is the same one you used to hook the gscartsw-lite up to?
Oh! Yes.
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Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister

Post by FBX »

Smile_Kaiser wrote:
FBX wrote:

Actually I meant the mini-din to SCART adapter cable. Is is the same one you used to hook the gscartsw-lite up to?
Oh! Yes.
Okay so the root of the issue you now know has to be something with the gscartsw-lite and/or the power supplied to it.
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