Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

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Shin
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Shin »

Chocograph wrote:
FBX wrote:New firmware released:

https://support.analogue.co/hc/en-us/ar ... pdate-v4-4



My everdrive worked fine yesterday but when I boot up the cartridge now it says "Supe EverDrive bootloader v1 ERROR: 40 SD card not found." That's new to me. I fucked it up when I updated the console with the everdrive in it, didn't I? Do I need to buy a new everdrive now? This IS an everdrive v2.

The manual says it's a test suit so I put in the SD card after boot and pressed select + start. The RAM test says "ERROR 1" so...the everdrive itself is fucked? It worked like a charm yesterday and after updating the NT with the cart in it..it's done?

I have tried four different SD cards and reformatted them a couple of times. I also came across http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=7313.0 on the everdrive forums. Maybe I'll just use a hacked firmware because WHY not? I can only say I hope there's something to this so that it can be fixed but it doesn't seem like anyone else is reporting on it yet.


So...my everdrive works on the jailbreak firmware. Interesting. Awaiting internet response.
enable the cart timing toggle thing in the menu
Chocograph
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Chocograph »

Shin wrote:
Chocograph wrote:
FBX wrote:New firmware released:

https://support.analogue.co/hc/en-us/ar ... pdate-v4-4



My everdrive worked fine yesterday but when I boot up the cartridge now it says "Supe EverDrive bootloader v1 ERROR: 40 SD card not found." That's new to me. I fucked it up when I updated the console with the everdrive in it, didn't I? Do I need to buy a new everdrive now? This IS an everdrive v2.

The manual says it's a test suit so I put in the SD card after boot and pressed select + start. The RAM test says "ERROR 1" so...the everdrive itself is fucked? It worked like a charm yesterday and after updating the NT with the cart in it..it's done?

I have tried four different SD cards and reformatted them a couple of times. I also came across http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=7313.0 on the everdrive forums. Maybe I'll just use a hacked firmware because WHY not? I can only say I hope there's something to this so that it can be fixed but it doesn't seem like anyone else is reporting on it yet.


So...my everdrive works on the jailbreak firmware. Interesting. Awaiting internet response.
enable the cart timing toggle thing in the menu
After some searching it's quickly become apparent to me that the jailbreak fw has too many bugs. I went back to official. Not sure if it's comfirmed anywhere but it's also pretty apparent Kevtris himself is working on or contributing to the jailbreak. When the times is right I may switch back again, I don't care too much about it.
Seraphic
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Seraphic »

Chocograph wrote:After some searching it's quickly become apparent to me that the jailbreak fw has too many bugs.
Looks like the JB firmware will be updated soon. :wink:
https://twitter.com/SmokeMonsterTWI/sta ... 7931437056

Edit:

Actually, the new JB firmware is already live:
https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Super-NT-Jailbreak

JB6.5 2018-03-04:

adds a new "Save?" dialog box,
fixes DMA-related bugs, which should solve most random crashes,
fixes both SRAM bugs (firmware 6.4 only saved once and had a nasty corruption bug). Please test it again so we can be sure the save functionality works as expected. Any save games made on the jailbreak firmware 6.4 should be considered as potentially corrupted and must be discarded,
fixes glitch with some games disabling the "return to menu" shortcut,
Chocograph
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Chocograph »

Seraphic wrote:
Chocograph wrote:After some searching it's quickly become apparent to me that the jailbreak fw has too many bugs.
Looks like the JB firmware will be updated soon. :wink:
https://twitter.com/SmokeMonsterTWI/sta ... 7931437056

Edit:

Actually, the new JB firmware is already live:
https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Super-NT-Jailbreak

JB6.5 2018-03-04:

adds a new "Save?" dialog box,
fixes DMA-related bugs, which should solve most random crashes,
fixes both SRAM bugs (firmware 6.4 only saved once and had a nasty corruption bug). Please test it again so we can be sure the save functionality works as expected. Any save games made on the jailbreak firmware 6.4 should be considered as potentially corrupted and must be discarded,
fixes glitch with some games disabling the "return to menu" shortcut,
https://github.com/SmokeMonsterPacks/Su ... /issues/48

We'll have to wait for a fix.
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FBX
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by FBX »

Shin wrote:
Chocograph wrote:
My everdrive worked fine yesterday but when I boot up the cartridge now it says "Supe EverDrive bootloader v1 ERROR: 40 SD card not found." That's new to me. I fucked it up when I updated the console with the everdrive in it, didn't I? Do I need to buy a new everdrive now? This IS an everdrive v2.

The manual says it's a test suit so I put in the SD card after boot and pressed select + start. The RAM test says "ERROR 1" so...the everdrive itself is fucked? It worked like a charm yesterday and after updating the NT with the cart in it..it's done?

I have tried four different SD cards and reformatted them a couple of times. I also came across http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=7313.0 on the everdrive forums. Maybe I'll just use a hacked firmware because WHY not? I can only say I hope there's something to this so that it can be fixed but it doesn't seem like anyone else is reporting on it yet.


So...my everdrive works on the jailbreak firmware. Interesting. Awaiting internet response.
enable the cart timing toggle thing in the menu
Fixed y'all's quote boxing. It made it look like I was the one with the Everdrive issues.
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BrianC
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by BrianC »

I just ordered the Black Super NT. I can't wait to play some SNES on the HD TV screen. Neat that it includes Super Turrican 1 and 2, though the additions to ST1 weren't exactly what I was hoping for (one "new" level was already in Mega Turrican and the game still ends at the alien boss). I'll probably not use the JB firmware for now since I have a SD2SNES.
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FBX
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by FBX »

BrianC wrote:I just ordered the Black Super NT. I can't wait to play some SNES on the HD TV screen. Neat that it includes Super Turrican 1 and 2, though the additions to ST1 weren't exactly what I was hoping for (one "new" level was already in Mega Turrican and the game still ends at the alien boss). I'll probably not use the JB firmware for now since I have a SD2SNES.
With the new 4.4 firmware, The Super Nt is in my opinion the best all around SNES experience for a modern display. It only has two downsides that I can really think of:

1. No analog output for CRT gaming.

2. No save-stating like the SNES Classic has.

I know Analogue has mentioned they will soon have an adapter for analog output, but it remains to be seen how this will function for CRT users. Will the Super Scope work on it? Will interlaced modes be properly sent to the CRT? etc.
Wolf_
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

FBX wrote:
BrianC wrote:I just ordered the Black Super NT. I can't wait to play some SNES on the HD TV screen. Neat that it includes Super Turrican 1 and 2, though the additions to ST1 weren't exactly what I was hoping for (one "new" level was already in Mega Turrican and the game still ends at the alien boss). I'll probably not use the JB firmware for now since I have a SD2SNES.
With the new 4.4 firmware, The Super Nt is in my opinion the best all around SNES experience for a modern display. It only has two downsides that I can really think of:

1. No analog output for CRT gaming.

2. No save-stating like the SNES Classic has.

I know Analogue has mentioned they will soon have an adapter for analog output, but it remains to be seen how this will function for CRT users. Will the Super Scope work on it? Will interlaced modes be properly sent to the CRT? etc.
To be entirely fair about con #2 if you use the snes classic you also have to accept that it doesn't have nearly the same compatibility and you need to jailbreak it to get the complete library on it. Also I feel con #1 should have an * because Analogue is working on a dac so that is only a temporary issue (and they said the superscope will be supported). The scanlines needing work would be my issue #3 (which is also temporary as Kevtris has said he is working on that, hopefully it will be in the next update).

As for the jb firmware I would like to see the save ram popup made automatic in the future because honestly 99 times out of 100 you are going to want to save the game you just played and it isn't like the save files are going to take up too much space on your sd card. Fingers crossed on cores and the possibility of enhancement chips in the future.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by FBX »

Wolf_ wrote:
To be entirely fair about con #2 if you use the snes classic you also have to accept that it doesn't have nearly the same compatibility and you need to jailbreak it to get the complete library on it.
Doesn't matter what the game count is on the SNES Classic. I was merely referring to its save-state function to make a point. Everything else about it is moot.
Also I feel con #1 should have an * because Analogue is working on a dac so that is only a temporary issue.
And I addressed that point:

I know Analogue has mentioned they will soon have an adapter for analog output, but it remains to be seen how this will function for CRT users. Will the Super Scope work on it? Will interlaced modes be properly sent to the CRT? etc.

-FBX
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by bigbadboaz »

BrianC wrote:..the additions to ST1 weren't exactly what I was hoping for (one "new" level was already in Mega Turrican and the game still ends at the alien boss).
What were you hoping for? Is there supposedly more content out there that they bitched out on somehow?
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

FBX wrote:Doesn't matter what the game count is on the SNES Classic. I was merely referring to its save-state function to make a point. Everything else about it is moot.
That isn't the case though because the save states can only be present if you accept those compatibility issues and the need for a jailbreak or an even more limited game count. You can't have the save states without dealing with those negatives. It isn't a one without the other kinda deal so if you are going to say one thing can offer something better it is only fair to point out the necessary tradeoff you would have to make.
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

Wolf_ wrote:
FBX wrote:With the new 4.4 firmware, The Super Nt is in my opinion the best all around SNES experience for a modern display. It only has two downsides that I can really think of:

1. No analog output for CRT gaming.

2. No save-stating like the SNES Classic has.

I know Analogue has mentioned they will soon have an adapter for analog output, but it remains to be seen how this will function for CRT users. Will the Super Scope work on it? Will interlaced modes be properly sent to the CRT? etc.
To be entirely fair about con #2 if you use the snes classic you also have to accept that it doesn't have nearly the same compatibility and you need to jailbreak it to get the complete library on it. Also I feel con #1 should have an * because Analogue is working on a dac so that is only a temporary issue (and they said the superscope will be supported). The scanlines needing work would be my issue #3 (which is also temporary as Kevtris has said he is working on that, hopefully it will be in the next update).
There are some more drawbacks in my point of view: some stuff which my SNES can do but the SuperNt not at the moment:
#4 exploit region checking with register $213F
#5 memory content viewer incl. input device checking
#6 starting satellaview games, even deleted ones
#7 satellaview modem emulation to play soundlink games

I have to admit, that #5-#7 are very special points, but these are features my SNES (limited Ultra16 mod from 2008) has but the SuperNt don't.

For me #4 is extremely important the the single reason why the SuperNt has not became part of my continuous setup at home. However, it not that difficult to implement - the region can be read from the cartridge / ROM header. Of course in case of an Everdrive it has to be updated once the Everdrive / sd2snes has load a new ROM.
Last edited by borti4938 on Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:03 am, edited 3 times in total.
Wolf_
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:
Wolf_ wrote:
FBX wrote:With the new 4.4 firmware, The Super Nt is in my opinion the best all around SNES experience for a modern display. It only has two downsides that I can really think of:

1. No analog output for CRT gaming.

2. No save-stating like the SNES Classic has.

I know Analogue has mentioned they will soon have an adapter for analog output, but it remains to be seen how this will function for CRT users. Will the Super Scope work on it? Will interlaced modes be properly sent to the CRT? etc.
To be entirely fair about con #2 if you use the snes classic you also have to accept that it doesn't have nearly the same compatibility and you need to jailbreak it to get the complete library on it. Also I feel con #1 should have an * because Analogue is working on a dac so that is only a temporary issue (and they said the superscope will be supported). The scanlines needing work would be my issue #3 (which is also temporary as Kevtris has said he is working on that, hopefully it will be in the next update).
There are some more drawbacks in my point of view: some stuff which my SNES can do but the SuperNt not at the moment:
#4 exploit region checking with register $213F
#5 memory content viewer incl. input device checking
#6 starting satellaview games, even deleted ones
#7 satellaview modem emulation to play soundlink games

I have to admit, that #5-#7 are very special points, but these are features my SNES (limited Ultra16 mod from 2008) has but the SuperNt don't.

For me #4 is extremely important the the single reason why the SuperNt has not became part of my continuous setup at home. However, it not that difficult to implement - the region can be read from the cartridge / ROM header. Of course in case of an Everdrive it has to be updated once the Everdrive / sd2snes has load a new ROM.
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by #4 but you can change the region in the settings menu and it doesn't even require a restart. As long as you keep your games in folders separated by region and prefer one region over the others (so you only have exclusives in one of the folders) then the number of times you need to manually switch regions should be hardly ever. While I understand it would be nice if it were automatic the slim number of pal exclusives really makes the few seconds it takes to change the region not a big deal for me.
Elrinth
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Elrinth »

I can't get Seiken 3 3-player multiplayer patch to work running thru the jailbreak. The game just keeps repeating the intro screens until it goes black.
If anyone has it working, could you please hook me up?

edit: found a different version on the net pre-patched which is working great
Last edited by Elrinth on Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

Wolf_ wrote: I'm not entirely sure what you mean by #4 but you can change the region in the settings menu and it doesn't even require a restart. As long as you keep your games in folders separated by region and prefer one region over the others (so you only have exclusives in one of the folders) then the number of times you need to manually switch regions should be hardly ever. While I understand it would be nice if it were automatic the slim number of pal exclusives really makes the few seconds it takes to change the region not a big deal for me.
I bought the SuperNt to play my cartridge games - most of them are PAL. Two of my favorite ones are a) not 50Hz adapted, i.e. they are too slow when playing them in 50Hz and b) checking region permanently during gameplay. Changing everytime from NTSC to PAL right before the check appears and back afterwards is really annoying and destroys the whole gameplay flow.
As everything is inside the FPGA - S-CPU who reads register 213F and S-PPU2 where this register is - there would be no problem to simply output the region bit which is expected by the game. Each game ROM contains the region in the header info.
Last edited by borti4938 on Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
Wolf_
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:
Wolf_ wrote: I'm not entirely sure what you mean by #4 but you can change the region in the settings menu and it doesn't even require a restart. As long as you keep your games in folders separated by region and prefer one region over the others (so you only have exclusives in one of the folders) then the number of times you need to manually switch regions should be hardly ever. While I understand it would be nice if it were automatic the slim number of pal exclusives really makes the few seconds it takes to change the region not a big deal for me.
I bought the SuperNt to play my cartridge games - most of them are PAL. Two of my favorite ones are a) not 50Hz adapted, i.e. they are too slow when playing them in 50Hz and b) checking region permanently during gameplay. Changing everytime from NTSC to PAL right before the check appears and back afterwards is really annoying and destroys the whole gameplay flow.
As everything is inside the FPGA - S-CPU who reads register 213F and S-PPU2 where this register is - there would be no problem to simply output the region bit which is expected by the game. Each game ROM contains the region in the header info.
Are you saying you have 60hz pal cartridge games?
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

No.
90%-95% of all PAL SNES games are never adapted for 50Hz. This means the software is meant to be played on 60Hz and in 50Hz it's to slow.
The onyl adaption made is the region check such that it allows only to be played in 50Hz although it's not meant to be played so.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:No.
90%-95% of all PAL SNES games are never adapted for 50Hz. This means the software is meant to be played on 60Hz and in 50Hz it's to slow.
The onyl adaption made is the region check such that it allows only to be played in 50Hz although it's not meant to be played so.
So what you are actually saying is, yes you have 60hz snes pal cartridge games. Interesting, I never knew most pal games were still intended to be run at 60hz even if they were able to be run at 50hz, or even that the pal versions still could be run at 60hz. Doesn't sound like a pal 60hz option would be difficult to implement though.
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

OK, didn't realized you got my point. But now we are on the same level ;).

Just if you want to test it and if you have a sd2snes: play MMX2 or MMX3 - one time as NTSC and the other time as PAL ROM. You will realize that both run at same speed. And even the PAL ROM feels incredibly slow in 50Hz.
However, both PAL games check region periodically: MMX2 after every boss fight and MMX3 at every door - and there are a lot of doors!
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:OK, didn't realized you got my point. But now we are on the same level ;).

Just if you want to test it and if you have a sd2snes: play MMX2 or MMX3 - one time as NTSC and the other time as PAL ROM. You will realize that both run at same speed. And even the PAL ROM feels incredibly slow in 50Hz.
However, both PAL games check region periodically: MMX2 after every boss fight and MMX3 at every door - and there are a lot of doors!
That's super strange because the smokemonster pack has a section of 60hz patched pal snes games. Makes me wonder if maybe that was designed based on emulators as I'm assuming most emulators would probably set pal games to play at 50hz by default.
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

These patches simply rewrites the ROM header info from a PAL region to a NTSC region, mostly US. Just that the emulator plays the game in 60Hz.
If there is a region check via 213F register, you need to apply an additional patch to circumvent the branch into the "This Gamepak is not designed for your SNES"-error message.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Blair »

FBX wrote:With the new 4.4 firmware, The Super Nt is in my opinion the best all around SNES experience for a modern display
I was thinking about upgrading my snes 1-chip with a few mods (RGB amp, digital audio, etc.) but considering the price of parts and labor, plus shipping for that project I'm wondering if it would just be better for me to buy a Super Nt (as I mostly use my 1chip with an OSSC anyway). FBX, probably a silly question but how does the sound output of the Super Nt compare to a digital audio-out mod for an original SNES in your opinion? (I'm assuming they sound pretty close quality wise)
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Larrs888 »

I was keeping an eye on the release of the Super NT since its announcement last year as was really excited at the time, sadly with expenses around the Christmas period it was far from an impulse buy to pre-order.

Now that it was released and real user reviews (not paid You Tuber promos) and feedback on this thread are available, I am a little less convinced with the device. I'm glad the RGB quality issues got resolved thanks to feedback from members here, however there still seems to be compatibility issues and Analogue still state "Total Accuracy" on their website. If they were a EU based company this is illegal. Word that the new jailbroken firmware has also introduced more issues is worrying not to mention reports of failing motherboards from some users.

I'm still quite happy with my RGB modded SNES Jnr and Framemeister setup, whilst still a little tempted by the Super NT the issues it has have made me a bit sceptical. Are you guys here happy with your purchases, still worth me biting the bullet particularly as I have yet to get an SD2SNES?
Last edited by Larrs888 on Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Fudoh »

What I noticed about the Super Nt's audio output is that it's quite load. I never considered if that's actually affecting dynamic range in any way, but you know those digital sources that are already too loud when you set your TV to 5 of 100, while it's usually sitting at 35 when my media player is running. I'm not a fan of those ultra load outputs as they don't allow proper volume tweaking on the display (or receiver).
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Chocograph »

Heh, I also noticed it was a little bit louder but not much! I only lowered the volume on my tv by a little bit and it was fine.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by FBX »

Blair wrote: FBX, probably a silly question but how does the sound output of the Super Nt compare to a digital audio-out mod for an original SNES in your opinion? (I'm assuming they sound pretty close quality wise)
I'd need to do some wav comparison analysis, which I actually meant to get started on, but my SNES digital audio mod boards went up for sale today, and I've been busy with handling the transactions and packing the shipping boxes. If you're interested (and live in the United States), I made a detailed ordering page with plenty of photos, music track examples, and links to installation guides with more photos:

http://www.firebrandx.com/snesdarwmod.html

I will say that the Super Nt obviously 'simulates' the audio hardware, but it also upsamples it to 48Khz. If you're a purist and want raw 32 Khz original hardware sound, you'd still want to get a mod board for an original SNES console. Aside from the purist point of view, the sound from the Super Nt at the very least sounds a lot better than analog output, so there's that advantage from the start.

One thing that I'm also trying to work on is analysis of cart audio from MSU1 hacks on the Super Nt. It seems to have a lot of filtering in the upper spectrum, and also there's some horrible buzzing sound when you hold in the reset button to reset the SD2SNES on the Super Nt. I don't recall hearing this noise on my original SNES consoles, but again, I've got to sit down and spend all day obsessively comparing everything.
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:These patches simply rewrites the ROM header info from a PAL region to a NTSC region, mostly US. Just that the emulator plays the game in 60Hz.
If there is a region check via 213F register, you need to apply an additional patch to circumvent the branch into the "This Gamepak is not designed for your SNES"-error message.
Actually now that I've looked into it I'm pretty sure you can set the Super Nt to pal mode and still set the resolution to 1080p 60hz.
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

But the gameplay will be too slow
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Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by Wolf_ »

borti4938 wrote:But the gameplay will be too slow
How would it be too slow if it is still 60hz in pal mode?
borti4938

Re: Analogue announces the Super Nt for $189 (SNES)

Post by borti4938 »

The S-PPU portions of the FPGA run at 50Hz mode. You can test it by your own - just look for a constant movement and you will see that it takes 1.2x longer to e.g. walk a certain way in PAL mode compared to NTSC mode. (Don‘t use an in-ame timer, use a stop watch)
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