Bow before the codpiece!
Why can't religious people lighten up a bit? A polite rant
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howmuchkeefe
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It's funny how I'm now on a holy conversion crusade after simply entering this topic to defend people with faiths. First it's me v. atheists, then it's me v. other faiths, and now I'm clearly just a God Soldier (which I take as a compliment). Perhaps the thing is, when someone is questioned, they are going to respond accordingly and if you spin that wildly out of context, that's your issue. Case and point, you asked me why you should choose Christianity over other religions, I never even tried to force my beliefs on you.And people know about God. If someone lives in America and is more than three weeks old, it's safe to assume they are aware of Christianity. And yet, for some unknown reason, God Soldiers still act like the religion is an underground cult in Rome that's being persecuted by the powers that be. You don't need to spread the word any more, because the word has already been spread, for quite a few centuries now. You're not trying to spread knowledge, you're trying to convert. Let's call a spade a spade. If you only cared about people "knowing the message" then you wouldn't need to say anything because it's already common knowledge.
The explains how, but not why, for instance how come for some people them stealing from others makes them happy as it clearly would make anyone's life better, yet for me that wouldn't make me feel happy?yes we do. its a question of conditioned response. happiness for instance is mostly dopamine and a couple other chemicals.
you do things that make your life (or what your head interprets as) better you feel happy, encouraging you to continue in that vein.
No, because they're not fully capable of understanding God and principles of good and evil.why? because they don't know about god?
Perhaps because I know the difference between right and wrong.who are you to decide what makes a faith righteous?
But clearly the complexity of our emotions far exceeds the simple poles of good and bad, and pursue or avoid. Your theory treats people as machines and reverts back to the idea of social darwinism. Take your example, "being chased by a predator feels bad", okay so people want to avoid this right, yet you have people that intentionally put themselves in danger because it makes them feel good.Positive and negative reinforcements have pretty obvious benefits. Positive emotions encourage us to actively pursue what causes them, negative emotions cause us to avoid them. The evolutionary benefit of "being chased by a predator feels bad, reproducing feels good" is pretty obvious. People who aren't capable of experiencing these emotions (including negative ones) tend to have many, many problems. Of course, these emotions developed for humans many thousands of years ago, so they tend to activate at very stupid things now.
Last edited by Nemo on Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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magnum opus
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theft/conscience goes back to social creatures. you steal from some one you harm them, harm to an individual is harm to a group which is harm to you. shits been hardwired. plus you've probably been told all your life that stealing is wrong, that kind of constant reinforcement has a way of affecting you.Nemo wrote: The explains how, but not why, for instance how come for some people them stealing from others makes them happy as it clearly would make anyone's life better, yet for me that wouldn't make me feel happy?
our emotions really aren't that complexBut clearly the complexity of our emotions far exceeds the simple poles of good and bad, and pursue or avoid.Positive and negative reinforcements have pretty obvious benefits. Positive emotions encourage us to actively pursue what causes them, negative emotions cause us to avoid them. The evolutionary benefit of "being chased by a predator feels bad, reproducing feels good" is pretty obvious. People who aren't capable of experiencing these emotions (including negative ones) tend to have many, many problems. Of course, these emotions developed for humans many thousands of years ago, so they tend to activate at very stupid things now.
1. this has nothing to do with social darwinism, just plain olf biological modern synthesis theory of evolutionYour theory treats people as machines and reverts back to the idea of social darwinism. Take your example, "being chased by a predator feels bad", okay so people want to avoid this right, yet you have people that intentionally put themselves in danger because it makes them feel good.
2. so what if people are machines, we're still far to complex and fallible to be distinguishable from free will, and it's still no more mechanistic or deterministic than believing in fate
3.adreneline releases all sorts of endorphines, if you can over come the whole fear thing generally associated with say sky diving, you can appreciate the rush of endorphines. obviously when being chase by a tiger it's a little more difficult to convince yourself that your perfectly safe. which is why thrill seekers jump out of planes instead of straping steak to their ass and going to africa.
also sometimes that danger is the only thing that can make them happy for both psychological (abused as a child and now can't function unless a victim) or physical (produces smaller amounts of happy chemicals thus isn't really happy unless they kick their system into overdrive)
also, and this goes back to the first one, many people are simply fucked in the head.
for instance if you look at the brain of a sociopath it actually functions differently from say a criminal or some one rasied with out ethics
so because they're too young basically.No, because they're not fully capable of understanding God and principles of good and evil.why? because they don't know about god?
yeah again i guess i missed that part in the bible.
and at what point do they become capable exaclty?
and would this be the christian concept of good and evil or the cannibal's concept of good and evil
hey remember that part in the bible when those two people who had absolutely no concept of right or wrong got banished and their decendents forever cursed for doing something wrong?
you know the difference between what YOU consider right and wrong.Perhaps because I know the difference between right and wrong.who are you to decide what makes a faith righteous?
but assuming that there is some sort of absolute right and wrong presupposes your specific concept of god.
not even just the christian god but your god specifically
Fred Phelps for instance feels it is absolutely god's will to go about preaching that god hates fags, which i would generally consider promoting hate, and yet he would probably claim that he is is far more righteous than you and that what he preaches is fully in line with what is "right"
unless of course you also believe god hates fags in which case i'd have to say you have no fucking clue what the difference between right and wrong is.
Why do you turn your statement around now ?Nemo wrote:Uh yeah, that's the point.So in the middleages when the church was huge in Europe and it did all these cruelties it had nothing to do with the imperfectness of humans.
You were talking about the humanists and humans being unperfect.
You made it seem like only believers are perfect.
That's why I said the above thing.
I was trying to explain that child molesters and murderers should spread the word about the thing they believe in because they believe in it.Nemo wrote:Huh? I'm not sure what you're trying to say, but I believe I already mentioned it early on that anyone's faith that promotes violence is not righteous.-Child molesters have the responsibility to inform others of the possibilities.
-Murderers have the responsibility to inform others of the possibilities.
-Muslims have the responsibilitity to question others and if needed even kill others because their koran says so, interpreted by some.
Ofcourse you'll have to imagine that they all worship their specific gods.
Which we can't question cause there's no proof.
It's what you said about christians only I've chosen an other group.
Oh noes! White Satanic Norvegian Heavy Metal Bands! I knew the interweb had some secret resources to twist my soul!1!1!
Seriously though, heavy metal is so white. I mean, where are the black metal bands???
And beside that, we always write with the plural our articles, speaking of big egoes (no, we're serious!).
Seriously though, heavy metal is so white. I mean, where are the black metal bands???
And beside that, we always write with the plural our articles, speaking of big egoes (no, we're serious!).
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
Obviously, the 'black' metal bands were all eaten by these guys...Randorama wrote: Seriously though, heavy metal is so white. I mean, where are the black metal bands???
Anyway, what's with this anti-white kick your on? Nothing wrong with being white (or pink as you pointed out earlier). Now on the other hand if your racial traditions make you prone to buying a battle axe and 'slaying' people, well then maybe there is a problem...
Edit: As pointed out by some of our black colleagues in college, white people are completely OK:
(reproduced from early 90's graphitti in the restroom)--
"Go suck big black cock!'
'Hey! You white guys have big dicks too!"
So clearly as this example shows, we should not feel uncomfortable with our own race. Phrases like 'that's so white' should be cleared from modern usage and replaced with 'That's so stupid!'
Nothing, its just that at the one gazillionth time that i hear from dutch people (who have serious problems with integration, thanks to right-wing policies of attrition-causing) : "ehi, you don't look Italian (i actually do, if you skip the gray eyes), i thought Italian were just whiter moroccans!" or politer versions of this, it gets stressing. Especially if coming from pink people, i hate pink!!1! (that's -1 on gayness scale, i suppose).
However, long shlongs are white too, so take that, black phallic imperialists!!1!
However, long shlongs are white too, so take that, black phallic imperialists!!1!
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
Hey, I see this thread's doing great! Love the suversive undercurrent championed by the advocates of Cannibalistic White Shlong Metal Imperialism, really underlines the practical importance of the rest of the discussion. I should've checked in sooner .
There's a telling dialogue on one of Body Count's albums where some white...err, pink dude gets to interview Ice T, telling him how he just couln't feel their black metal. Ice tries to reason with his white superiority but eventually a bullet is the only way into his head. Now that's a statement. I'm glad to see people are equally passionate about their 'cause'. Remember BC was eaten by a giant in the end. Probably white. Probably norvegian. Run while you can.
.There's a telling dialogue on one of Body Count's albums where some white...err, pink dude gets to interview Ice T, telling him how he just couln't feel their black metal. Ice tries to reason with his white superiority but eventually a bullet is the only way into his head. Now that's a statement. I'm glad to see people are equally passionate about their 'cause'. Remember BC was eaten by a giant in the end. Probably white. Probably norvegian. Run while you can.
BULLSHIT.sethsez wrote:Well, yeah, racists are assholes. But what you just mentioned is a cultural thing, not a racial thing. They're assholes because of the culture they're in, not because of how much melanin they have.
Assholes are assholes in any possible context, period. See? As a species we have something in common, Universality triumphs!
Beside that, Europe is awesome in this regard. You really are missing something, without some insane weirdos heading parties who pretend to be about:
a) Ethnic pride because they don't want to pay taxes (all populist parties who advocate the uniqueness of culture of some narrow region of their country);
b) Patchwork political projects: say, a bit of leftist "democracy from the bottom", i.e. more power to citizens by local involvement, everything public (but right-wing solution "less taxes") and fascist " no immigrant and junkies" with some gay marriage;
c) Referenda without a scope;
d) Jokes on everyone else ( i would like to have a cent per every joke against French, Belgian and German people i heard);
e) Infinite quarreling upon history ( i swear, people mentioning the war of 100 years when insulting each other = the win);
f) "we're the cradle of civilization!" pride (typical of some specific countries, though, you should ask any briton guy or to our local ST Dragon
);g) Champions league (whooops!);
(My colleague, in the meanwhile, is drinking his 10th cup of tea. I'll let you guess where he is from).
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
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Nuke
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Not by a scandinavian black-metal band but, supricingly, the awesome jazz-flude laden prog-folk group Jethro Tull! And they did it first! (1982)
...biblethumpers could learn a lot by reading some Nietzsche.
Trek trough the Galaxy on silver wings and play football online.
Haha... I sure can't speak for Ganson here but I have to imagine that Nemo's performance in this thread pretty much embodies whatever the hell it was that made the Professor start this thing in the first place.Specineff wrote:^Back on topic. Please stop being so hard on Nemo just for presenting his point of view.
This wasn't about all religious folks. Just the ones that "can't lighten up". Undamned is certainly a religous feller, why don't we see him in here hopelessly talking himself into a corner against the slathering dogs of reason and logic? Because his faith is for him and other folks that are interested in pursuing a similar faith. I'm pretty well atheist yet somehow, undamned and I have silently agreed to disagree. Seein's how we're both comfortable in our own existences, there was never even an argument in the first place.
You guys will be the first to know if anyone is injured through this blatant lack of concern.
Taking it light,
Pa
Last edited by PaCrappa on Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Pinkos don't have melanine, in fact 
( beside that, PASP has its own charm
).
Oh, and night i'm pretty sure my supervisor is gay and doesn't know it, btw. Pink shirts and purple jackets...uhm!
( beside that, PASP has its own charm
).Oh, and night i'm pretty sure my supervisor is gay and doesn't know it, btw. Pink shirts and purple jackets...uhm!
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
Well, but first, Undamned has sideburns, a clear proof that Heaven is there inside his soul (i may question again my faith because of this, actually 
).
Second, i'm beginning to develop an allergy to acronyms: i can't fucking see how they are supposed to save me processing load in my gerbil's mind. I mean, i admit that i use them a lot, everyone in my field does that ( TAM, DRT, FCS, PL, DPL, etc etc etc...), but they're just meant to save up to an awesome 1% of the typing time, damn
).Second, i'm beginning to develop an allergy to acronyms: i can't fucking see how they are supposed to save me processing load in my gerbil's mind. I mean, i admit that i use them a lot, everyone in my field does that ( TAM, DRT, FCS, PL, DPL, etc etc etc...), but they're just meant to save up to an awesome 1% of the typing time, damn
"The only desire the Culture could not satisfy from within itself was one common to both the descendants of its original human stock and the machines [...]: the urge not to feel useless."
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
I.M. Banks, "Consider Phlebas" (1988: 43).
For some odd reason... all these "death metal band" pictures and album covers are making me think of Dungeons and Dragons. I'm starting to formulate a theory that most of these folks are DnD nerds with musical talent. 
*Note: I play DnD too... so I'm not dissing anybody. Just covering my bases*
*Note: I play DnD too... so I'm not dissing anybody. Just covering my bases*
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!!!!!
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magnum opus
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not so much sad as disturbing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps is the guy that started it, total fuckbag
Wow. Now that's a fucker.magnum opus wrote: not so much sad as disturbing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps is the guy that started it, total fuckbag
You're a few decades late on this theory, but it still holds.jp wrote:For some odd reason... all these "death metal band" pictures and album covers are making me think of Dungeons and Dragons. I'm starting to formulate a theory that most of these folks are DnD nerds with musical talent.
Well... power metal is D&D. Black metal is the ones who look like Kiss on a bad day, and death metal doesn't really have a distinctive look. Generally white guys with long-ish hair, but that's about it.
You will never find a more ridiculous band than Rhapsody for D&D stuff, by the way. Their albums form a FANTASY EPIC (read: horribly generic Dragonlance schlock), and they got Christopher fucking Lee the narrate (and sing on) an album.
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professor ganson
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